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We are no longer the United States of America

What if...? said:
The rub is, there isn't a "left" or "right" anymore.

Those have just become the names of competing groups of monied interests.

And I just tend democrat becilause they have a better philosophy as the the care and feeding of their livestock.

Us. We are their livestock.

I think it would also be a good idea to re-examine the economic system that makes most of us commodities to be used by a few of us at the least cost and discarded when they are done with us.

That's the third world model. The old aristocrat/peasant model.

To quote Morty from Rick and Morty:

"That just sounds like slavery with extra steps."
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I have to say your post is an original one given that it this case the slaves are the ones that run the plantation.
 
Luckyone said:
So what do you suggest should be done. Be specific and with details. Explain your plan and the positives and negatives of it.
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Start by raising the payroll tax (piggy back the new tax onto FICA taxation) from its current 7.65% (15.3% with the employer match) to 15% (30% with the employer match) and see what that does for increasing federal revenue. While the congress critters argue over how to spend this new windfall (adding all manner of new entitlements, no doubt) use that added revenue to wipe out the federal deficit and pay down the national debt.
 
ttwtt78640 said:
Start by raising the payroll tax (piggy back the new tax onto FICA taxation) from its current 7.65% (15.3% with the employer match) to 15% (30% with the employer match) and see what that does for increasing federal revenue. While the congress critters argue over how to spend this new windfall (adding all manner of new entitlements, no doubt) use that added revenue to wipe out the federal deficit and pay down the national debt.
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"Raise the payroll tax from 7.65% to 15%" Meaning that someone earning the minimum wage (around $30,000 a year) would pay $4500 in taxes instead of $2080, meaning about $2420 more. The Tax cut, which so many Republicans are so happy about and are getting approximately $569 per year in benefits (for someone making $30,000), which by the way expires in 2026, means the total savings for the total of 8 years would be approximately $4500 and you are suggesting that your payroll tax would have the same person pay $19,300 more, meaning that the net result of all of this would be that a person making $30,000 a year would have about $15,000 less money at the end of 8 years than he would have if your plan is not instituted.

And of course, the additional 7.35% that the corporations would have to pay for this program would not affect them all that much because the Tax cut got their taxes down from 37% down to 22% (a saving of 15% versus the extra 7.35% they would have to pay if your program got instituted). To me, it seems just one more way to have the middle and lower class people pay more while the rich people get richer.

Great Idea!.............for a Republican.

Richpoor.jpg
 
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Luckyone said:
"Raise the payroll tax from 7.65% to 15%" Meaning that someone earning the minimum wage (around $30,000 a year) would pay $4500 in taxes instead of $2080, meaning about $2420 more. The Tax cut, which so many Republicans are so happy about and are getting approximately $569 per year in benefits (for someone making $30,000), which by the way expires in 2026, means the total savings for the total of 8 years would be approximately $4500 and you are suggesting that your payroll tax would have the same person pay $19,300 more, meaning that the net result of all of this would be that a person making $30,000 a year would have about $15,000 less money at the end of 8 years than he would have if your plan is not instituted.

And of course, the additional 7.35% that the corporations would have to pay for this program would not affect them all that much because the Tax cut got their taxes down from 37% down to 22% (a saving of 15% versus the extra 7.35% they would have to pay if your program got instituted). To me, it seems just one more way to have the middle and lower class people pay more while the rich people get richer.

Great Idea!.............for a Republican.

View attachment 67243875
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If folks want more goods/services provided by their government then they simply have to pay more in taxes. That is not a repubicant idea - that is simply reality. Do you honestly think that UHC would cost less than $200/month?
 
apdst said:
This proves Leftists have zero appreciation for freedom and liberty.
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Your idea of liberty is quite common in a jungle environment. In a civilization? Not so much.
 
Zalatix said:
Your idea of liberty is quite common in a jungle environment. In a civilization? Not so much.
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Live and let live doesn't exist in a civilized society?
 
apdst said:
Live and let live doesn't exist in a civilized society?
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"Let the poor starve and die" doesn't exist in a civilized society. And I hardly call right wing Islamophobia, immigrant-phobia, misogyny and racism "live and let live."

I'm all for splitting this country in half. Red states use more welfare than they give. It's time to cut the moocher states loose.
 
Luckyone said:
The past 2 years have certainly cemented the fact that we are no longer the United States of America. The Republican and Democratic Ideals are now so separate to each other that staying 1 nation does not make sense because we will not be able to go forward and accomplish anything of note for the still American public. As it is now, this will not change. Either one side wins or the other. Winning as a nation for all is not the desired result, it is winning for the party platform.

Caring for others is now called Socialism. Trying to spread the wealth the U.S. as a whole has built is now called Socialism. Wanting to protect the environment and protect the populace from greedy and unscrupulous people is now called Socialism. Wanting Health Care for everyone is now called Socialism.

The Republicans are all about me, me, me, and me. They are all about individuality and not a family. They are all about money and economic stability and not about emotional stability. They are about "the best shall win, no matter how it's done". It is no longer about Justice but about who is the strongest, the biggest bully.

I am sorry, but that is not the America that I was born to. The America I was born to was about equality for all, justice for all, helping others (nations and people) for a better future for all.

All is now Socialist and Me is now the way to go.
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Your post shows that you are part of the problem.

You can't have open borders and have a robust welfare system. You can't spread the wealth and expect to have a good economy and high employment.
 
Zalatix said:
"Let the poor starve and die" doesn't exist in a civilized society. And I hardly call right wing Islamophobia, immigrant-phobia, misogyny and racism "live and let live."

I'm all for splitting this country in half. Red states use more welfare than they give. It's time to cut the moocher states loose.
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Cut the "moocher" states off and they will almost immediately become the more prosperous, and the blue states will wither and die.
 
Here is one way to divide the country so each side gets 25 states. Not a perfect solution but maybe there could be a program to help those who want to swap jobs and homes with their opposites in the more ideologically friendly state. There would be two blue nations and one red one.


DivideUSAsm.jpg
 
Luckyone said:
Your post is funny because you think that I hold grudges. I don't. The fact I throw blame around is just a way to assign the changes that I believe need to be made but does not stop me personally working with the other side.

Perfect example of this is your own hero Trump that absolutely insulted and called Ted Cruz the worst of the worst and even insulted his family and then they became buddy-buddies.

Pointing the negatives and the blame should only be mapping out the problem. If both people are adults and are interested overall in going forward in finding a solution, you get past that and work together.

Its funny and perplexing that you think that way, given the example your own hero has given.

Last but not least, your comment about "I suggest you get some interpersonal skill first" is hilarious. You mean like Trump has?
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Your reply is funny because my point went right over your head.
...and you are using the same old and tired, " if only they....." language.
You said you DO NOT need to learn interpersonal skills because someone else does not have them.
Do you realize how weak and dumb that lame excuse is? Probably not.

...and I am glad you at least acknowledge you do not interpersonal skills.

By your logic, you do not have to do anything socially acceptable because other people are not doing it.
That is as dumb and lame an excuse as it gets.

It is the very same dumb and lame excuse all 30% in my POLL used.
The 30% who voted to continue to PERPETUATE the violence and rhetoric.
You have now joined their ranks.
But anyone reading your post already knew that.

You wish to continue the violence "because they....."
Therefore using that as a poor excuse to continue yours.
...and so it continues, just as you want it too.

When the war comes, look at your own posts as a reason why it did.
You did not have the courage or the balls to stop continuing it by your own personal example.
Hold your banner high. WAR = We Are Right
 
LowDown said:
Your post shows that you are part of the problem.

You can't have open borders and have a robust welfare system. You can't spread the wealth and expect to have a good economy and high employment.
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LowDown, as always you don't read things right. There is absolutely nothing in my post that says anything about open borders. In fact, I was asked that question directly in a post on this thread (you can look it up) and I specifically stated that I am against open borders, so right there you are off base. Secondly, Warren Buffet is super rich and continues to make money hands over fist and yet he spreads his wealth and guess what? his economic stature has not changed one iota.

I suggest you get informed before you say anything.
 
Zalatix said:
"Let the poor starve and die" doesn't exist in a civilized society. And I hardly call right wing Islamophobia, immigrant-phobia, misogyny and racism "live and let live."

I'm all for splitting this country in half. Red states use more welfare than they give. It's time to cut the moocher states loose.
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that's because people who pay tons of taxes in blue states retire to red states. Red states also have more military. I bet more net tax consumers vote democrat.
 
RobertU said:
Here is one way to divide the country so each side gets 25 states. Not a perfect solution but maybe there could be a program to help those who want to swap jobs and homes with their opposites in the more ideologically friendly state. There would be two blue nations and one red one.


View attachment 67243880
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Ohio's pretty red now, Kentucky even more so
 
PleasantValley said:
Your reply is funny because my point went right over your head.
...and you are using the same old and tired, " if only they....." language.
You said you DO NOT need to learn interpersonal skills because someone else does not have them.
Do you realize how weak and dumb that lame excuse is? Probably not.

...and I am glad you at least acknowledge you do not interpersonal skills.

By your logic, you do not have to do anything socially acceptable because other people are not doing it.
That is as dumb and lame an excuse as it gets.

It is the very same dumb and lame excuse all 30% in my POLL used.
The 30% who voted to continue to PERPETUATE the violence and rhetoric.
You have now joined their ranks.
But anyone reading your post already knew that.

You wish to continue the violence "because they....."
Therefore using that as a poor excuse to continue yours.
...and so it continues, just as you want it too.

When the war comes, look at your own posts as a reason why it did.
You did not have the courage or the balls to stop continuing it by your own personal example.
Hold your banner high. WAR = We Are Right
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I have no idea how your mind thinks but for sure it is skewed.

Let me begin by saying that you absolutely support Trump and yet he has the worst interpersonal skills ever. With him it's okay but with me its not? I would have thought you would support me for the same reasons that you support Trump, he says it as it is and pulls no punches, right? Why don't you give me the same support you give him?

By the way, this is a rhetorical question if you know what that means.

Secondly, you are totally wrong about my interpersonal skills given that I was extremely successful as a salesman for 40 years and interpersonal skills are an absolute must in that profession because if the person you are trying to sell to doesn't like you, he ain't going to buy. There was not one single year in the 40 years that I was a salesman that I wasn't either first or second in sales.

The height of hypocrisy is this statement of yours "By your logic, you do not have to do anything socially acceptable because other people are not doing it.
That is as dumb and lame an excuse as it gets" because this is exactly what I complain about Trump and that you support wholeheartedly. You can't have it both ways, you do know that don't you?

Last but not least, my post was not about perpetuating violence, in fact it was the exact opposite. I was trying to incite communication and compromise between the parties and I was saying that since it seems impossible for that to happen, that our nation is going to get divided in such a way that nothing will ever get done and our enemies will win without firing a bullet.

As such, your reading skills need to be honed because if you got out of my OP the idea that I was inciting anything negative, you are blind.

Anyhow, it does seem ridiculous to continue this conversation because we can't even agree on the words being said. You are looking at butterflies being attacking bees and I am looking at bees being as creatures that can make honey if given the chance.

Good bye
 
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Luckyone said:
So what you are saying is actually making my theme point. This is no longer a United States and we should split into 2 nations because you did, no I didn't, you did, no I didn't is not going to get us going forward. Meaning that even if you are 100% correct (which you aren't of course), you offer no solution and neither does the other side. So why don't we just go ahead and kill each other and see what is left in the end. Perhaps those left will find a solution for both sides because if they don't, both sides will be dead.
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No...its not. What I am saying is pointing out that we are a s a nation on damn near every major issue more united than divided...we just have people like...well...YOU...running around ****ting kittens and demonstrating your complete hypocrisy in your rhetoric. You ACCEPT Trumps positions...as long as they come from democrats.

Not divided...just suffering from an abundance of extremely shrill and vocal hypocrites.
 
VanceMack said:
No...its not. What I am saying is pointing out that we are a s a nation on damn near every major issue more united than divided...we just have people like...well...YOU...running around ****ting kittens and demonstrating your complete hypocrisy in your rhetoric. You ACCEPT Trumps positions...as long as they come from democrats.

Not divided...just suffering from an abundance of extremely shrill and vocal hypocrites.
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Not divided...........?

How you can say that with a straight face is beyond me. Show me examples that we, as a nation, are more united on damn near every major issue than ever.

It is so easy to write and say words that spring out of an uninformed mouth than to prove those words are true. C'mon if you can, prove your statement.

and by the way, your statement about "we just have people like...well...YOU...running around ****ting kittens and demonstrating your complete hypocrisy in your rhetoric" is an absolute fabrication that has no basis on fact. I too can accuse you with words of just about anything. I could say something as ridiculous as "your kind of talk only a pedophile would say". Would that make it true?

You really need to learn what a debate is and how it is done. A person makes a statement and you try to debunk it with fact (not opinion). For example, you say that Trump is not a liar and I show you proof that he is. Point stated and debunked by fact . That is how it works.

Like I said above, don't orate, prove your point that our nation is not divided.

Here is my proof that we are more divided than we have been in the last 25 years and I say 25 years because the study I am showing only goes back 25 years.

Political Polarization in the American Public

The Partisan Divide on Political Values Grows Even Wider | Pew Research Center
 
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Luckyone said:
The past 2 years have certainly cemented the fact that we are no longer the United States of America. The Republican and Democratic Ideals are now so separate to each other that staying 1 nation does not make sense because we will not be able to go forward and accomplish anything of note for the still American public. As it is now, this will not change. Either one side wins or the other. Winning as a nation for all is not the desired result, it is winning for the party platform.

Caring for others is now called Socialism. Trying to spread the wealth the U.S. as a whole has built is now called Socialism. Wanting to protect the environment and protect the populace from greedy and unscrupulous people is now called Socialism. Wanting Health Care for everyone is now called Socialism.

The Republicans are all about me, me, me, and me. They are all about individuality and not a family. They are all about money and economic stability and not about emotional stability. They are about "the best shall win, no matter how it's done". It is no longer about Justice but about who is the strongest, the biggest bully.

I am sorry, but that is not the America that I was born to. The America I was born to was about equality for all, justice for all, helping others (nations and people) for a better future for all.

All is now Socialist and Me is now the way to go.
Click to expand...

If you were born in America more than 20 years ago then you were not born into a socialist state.
 
Luckyone said:
Not divided...........?

How you can say that with a straight face is beyond me. Show me examples that we, as a nation, are more united on damn near every major issue than ever.

It is so easy to write and say words that spring out of an uninformed mouth than to prove those words are true. C'mon if you can, prove your statement.

and by the way, your statement about "we just have people like...well...YOU...running around ****ting kittens and demonstrating your complete hypocrisy in your rhetoric" is an absolute fabrication that has no basis on fact. I too can accuse you with words of just about anything. I could say something as ridiculous as "your kind of talk only a pedophile would say". Would that make it true?

You really need to learn what a debate is and how it is done. A person makes a statement and you try to debunk it with fact (not opinion). For example, you say that Trump is not a liar and I show you proof that he is. Point stated and debunked by fact . That is how it works.

Like I said above, don't orate, prove your point that our nation is not divided.

Here is my proof that we are more divided than we have been in the last 25 years and I say 25 years because the study I am showing only goes back 25 years.

Political Polarization in the American Public

The Partisan Divide on Political Values Grows Even Wider | Pew Research Center
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I explained completely why I can say that. Bill Clinton speaks out against illegal immigration. Obama speaks out against illegal immigration. Trump speaks out against illegal immigration.

YOU are the problem.
 
VanceMack said:
I explained completely why I can say that. Bill Clinton speaks out against illegal immigration. Obama speaks out against illegal immigration. Trump speaks out against illegal immigration.

YOU are the problem.
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I guess we have finally found the problem to the division of the parties and it is me.

I never knew that I had so much power in my hands. I alone have divided this country all by myself and caused 350 million people to fight among themselves. WOW, that is some power. You are the first that has ever seen me as a God. I have to think about what kind of a Greek name to name myself as I am now similar to Thor, Zeus and all those Gods that had so much power over the people.
 
Luckyone said:
I guess we have finally found the problem to the division of the parties and it is me.

I never knew that I had so much power in my hands. I alone have divided this country all by myself and caused 350 million people to fight among themselves. WOW, that is some power. You are the first that has ever seen me as a God. I have to think about what kind of a Greek name to name myself as I am now similar to Thor, Zeus and all those Gods that had so much power over the people.
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Indeed. You and every other individual that fawns over the political positions of candidates you support and shriek and howl at the identical positions of opposition party candidates.

You ARE the problem. If you truly seek to better thew country, you HAVE the answer and the beauty of it is, you have the capacity to be better. Or you can resign yourself to your opposition party hatred and your 'separation'. But if that is the choice you make stop pissing and whinig about the problem. Because...again..you ARE the problem and have NO investment in doing something about it.
 
VanceMack said:
Indeed. You and every other individual that fawns over the political positions of candidates you support and shriek and howl at the identical positions of opposition party candidates.

You ARE the problem. If you truly seek to better thew country, you HAVE the answer and the beauty of it is, you have the capacity to be better. Or you can resign yourself to your opposition party hatred and your 'separation'. But if that is the choice you make stop pissing and whinig about the problem. Because...again..you ARE the problem and have NO investment in doing something about it.
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I guess that puts you as someone incapable of doing anything, just opening your mouth to criticize others. A pet cat with claws, perhaps?
 
Luckyone said:
I guess that puts you as someone incapable of doing anything, just opening your mouth to criticize others. A pet cat with claws, perhaps?
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:lamo

Son...I gave you HOPE. I gave you a TREMENDOUS gift. You started this ridiculous thread wailing about the country. What you KN OW now is that YOU and people like you are the problem AND that you have the gift...the opportunity...to BE SOMEONE BETTER. or to continue to be the problem.

I have answered the thread. What you do with the answer...well...thats up to you, now, isnt it?
 
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