'Not only is impeachment dead on arrival, there's a risk that the Senate doesn't even take it up,' M

[Nalu]

The founders were slave owning rapists who had poopy buttholes.

:mrgreen:

 

[Jay59]

So, it doesn't matter that Ukraine either did not receive the money or did receive the money.
Do bank robbers who fail to rob a bank and get caught go to prison?
Do people who attempt to murder someone and get caught go to prison?
It MATTERS that Trump did not have the authority to freeze the money and did so anyway, that's ANOTHER act of wrongdoing on his part. There should not have been ANY delay on Trump's part.
Trump DID get a promise of an investigation from Ukraine PRIOR TO the funds being disbursed.
Can I ask you a question? Why are you so uninformed about what happened? Do you watch anything other than Hannity and Ingraham every night?

Why are you asking irrelevant questions that have no logical relation to the alleged actions?

To answer to your BS questions, usually they do some lesser crime or they commit no crime. For example, bank robbers break and enter which is burglary. An attempted murder may be a battery or no harm, no foul depending on the facts.

Do you get all you information from WP and CNN?

 

[Anthony60]

Trump literally said, "I would like you to do us a favor though...", immediately after Zelenskyy requested a sale of more javelin missiles.

This was very clearly a request for a QPQ.

See, you see something that’s not there, but you (the collective Trump haters) desperately want it to be there. First, “do me a favor “, is just a figure of speech, used all the time. Means nothing here. And besides that, he never says anything at all about, do this thing for me, then I’ll give you this thing. Completely missing. The quid and the quo. Can’t have a quid pro quo without those. Sorry.


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[Nalu]

I've come to the conclusion that those that go on defending Trump, despite the evidence of his self interest treachery against the United States especially today's testimony, are racists that are counting on legal (or worse) ethnic cleansing, and have reached the point of desperation because of this evidence against him. They are so desperate to be saved from the "brown horde" that they are willing to abandon all reason, and adherence to law to see it through.

Do you really think that's their primary motivation?

 

[Anthony60]

Yes, he literally asked them to do us a favor and investigate foreign interference into the 2016 election. Oh, the horror!

Can you imagine? A President asking another country to do something? I bet it’s never happened before! (Except for every other President on Earth.)


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[PIPEWRENCH]

See, you see something that’s not there, but you (the collective Trump haters) desperately want it to be there. First, “do me a favor “, is just a figure of speech, used all the time. Means nothing here. And besides that, he never says anything at all about, do this thing for me, then I’ll give you this thing. Completely missing. The quid and the quo. Can’t have a quid pro quo without those. Sorry.


Sent from my iPhone XX Turbo using Tapacrap

Hopefully the senate will end this witch hunt quicker than the last one. Then they can start another coup.

 

[W_Heisenberg]

See, you see something that’s not there, but you (the collective Trump haters) desperately want it to be there. First, “do me a favor “, is just a figure of speech, used all the time. Means nothing here.

A figure of speech still means something though, it still conveys meaning like a metaphor or a simile does, it's just not intended to be interpreted literally.

So if you think that the line is a figure of speech then what sort of meaning do you think Trump was trying to convey that wasn't literal?

Or, do are you suggesting Trump meant NOTHING at all when he said that line, either literally or figuratively, meaning that we should read that entire transcript as if the words, "I WOULD LIKE YOU TO DO US A FAVOR THOUGH...", do not exist?

And besides that, he never says anything at all about, do this thing for me, then I’ll give you this thing. Completely missing. The quid and the quo. Can’t have a quid pro quo without those. Sorry.

Now, if Zeleneskyy asked for javelin missiles and Trump literally said and meant, "I would like you to do me a favor though", that is LITERALLY a request for a quid pro quo.

The mental gymnastics you guys are willing to go to in order to avoid the most reasonable, plain-English, common-sense interpretation of the stuff Trump says is quite interesting.

 

[PIPEWRENCH]

Oh, so you would be good with the State presenting their case, those are the facts, and you don't get to cross examine the witnesses against you? Welcome to the old Soviet Union.

The dems are trying to make this into the Union of Socialist States of America. Big government ruling over everyone. Next thing you know we will have check points everywhere and you will need travel papers. Oh wait we already are there never mind. I don't want to end up in Guantanamo even if the weather is nice this time of year.

 

[CLAX1911]

The only way for the Dems to remove Trump from office is to do it by an election. So far the candidates they are running have little chance of defeating him.

They couldn't defeat Trump by being elected the last round. It's kind of funny to hear them talk about how much they want to protect our democracy while they're working to undermine it.

I don't know why they didn't put any of this energy into running candidates. Maybe it's because the party is fracturing. The far-left the socialists the Bernie Bros they're coming from the Democrats side. I would think that if the Democrats would throw the socialist crap under the bus they would probably win some convert from the right. Maybe just maybe they would get more electoral votes and win an election.

Most of the complaints I hear about Trump is personality. They think his personality sucks and he gives them the finger. I don't know why they keep harping on this personality the people who support Trump probably like that he gives them the finger. They probably voted for Trump to give them the finger. At least in part.

 

[prometeus]

Oh, so you would be good with the State presenting their case

The Senate has a case?

those are the facts, and you don't get to cross examine the witnesses against you?

Relevant witnesses of course, partisan diversion crap no.

Welcome to the old Soviet Union.

As usual you have no clue what you are talkong about.

 

[prometeus]

The dems are trying to make this into the Union of Socialist States of America.

Moronic crap.

 

[element94]

Do you really think that's their primary motivation?

Fear is a big motivator. What else would cause them to abandon all reason, and rule of law for a thing like Trump. What else does he offer them. That's his big pitch. He's certainly not going to make life better for them, just himself and his loyal to the end cronies. The thought of being on the receiving end of the way the blacks and browns have been treated is too horrible for them to contemplate. They are driven by this fear. I've talked to them. The deep seated racism always rises to the top.

 

[iguanaman]

My country is doing just great in spite of your do nothing but investigate House of Representatives, Strong economic growth, job creation, stock market, infrastructure building and you are trying to get rid of the person who generated those results showing again the power of the media and deep state

Your "country" has a Constitution and laws that you choose to ignore without thinking what the consequences will be for future Presidents. Do you want all Presidents to use their powers to seek foreign help in their election? Because that is what Trump is saying that he can endanger out national security in order to get political dirt on his opponents. Do you want all Presidents to take their orders from Putin and other dictators instead of our own interests? You need to think about that before you let your partisan BS think for you. Erdogan is coming to see Trump soon and the last time he talked to him he ordered our troops to stand down while Turkey invaded Syria and attacked out allies. What will he give up this time?

 

[MTAtech]

That makes him President. If you respect the Constitution as you say, respect the result and stop trying to undermine the office.

I was responding to a post that claimed Trump had a popular mandate. He doesn't if he didn't win the popular vote.

 

[Nalu]

Fear is a big motivator. What else would cause them to abandon all reason, and rule of law for a thing like Trump. What else does he offer them. That's his big pitch. He's certainly not going to make life better for them, just himself and his loyal to the end cronies. The thought of being on the receiving end of the way the blacks and browns have been treated is too horrible for them to contemplate. They are driven by this fear. I've talked to them. The deep seated racism always rises to the top.

Maybe it does come down to that. I'm mystified by the entire phenomenon. People will study the age of Trump for a generation.

I think almost everything you said is true. I think there's more, but I haven't been able to put my finger on it just yet. There's a particular flavor of pride amongst Trump supporters. It's smug. There's an attitude of "taking back our country", which relates to the racism you described. There's also an air of "sticking it to the liberals". It feels like accomplishment is less important to them than bothering liberals and defeating liberalism. To the extent they associate liberalism with Obama (and they do), that might be racism or it might not be. They're also obsessed with Bill and Hillary Clinton, so unless they dislike the Clintons more after Obama became associated with liberalism, then it's not racism. It's just anti-liberalism, which curiously, has become synonymous with what we used to call conservatism.

Where I don't fully agree with you is that white people don't want to be in the minority because they fear the treatment that non-white people receive. I don't think most white people have any realistic concept of the way non-white people are treated in most of the US. That's evidenced by the fact that so many white Americans claim that racism is gone or exaggerated or insignificant (in comparison to the racism of years past or not) and also by the fact that so many white people oppose civil rights for minorities. If they were scared about being in the minority for the right reasons, they would be passing as many anti-discrimination laws as they could write before they find themselves without the homefield advantage.

While I agree that fear is a motivator, I feel like something else is also at work. I know I'm going to send some people into apoplexy by saying this, but I think it's privilege. The benefits of the majority have always belonged to white Americans, so they feel a sense of ownership over them. They don't want to lose control of "their" country because it's no one's to take. Too bad it's inevitable and the Republican party has decided to go down in history kicking and screaming about the non-white invasion. This will be regarded as a very dark time in the party's history.

 

[Marine Electric]

Why do you support Marxist criminals?

I don't support Crooked Donald, but you do.

:2wave:

 

[PIPEWRENCH]

Moronic crap.

Just listen to the candidates and see if they support socialist programs and big government no longer protecting our rights but dolling them out as government granted privileges. The new American dream is dependence on government by the majority of the population. I wouldn't be so against all these socialist programs except they benefit those who outright refuse to contribute and penalize the truly hard working. Even their single payer has people still depending on insurance companies who provide nothing except syphon off the money needed for health care to keep billionaires flying around in private jets while the truly needy are still deciding between food and medicine. Just look at Medicare. The people on it still have to buy insurance to get health care. While the insurance companies taking their money are getting rich. I could go on all day but the moronic crap is what those candidates are trying to sell us.

 

[Jay59]

I was responding to a post that claimed Trump had a popular mandate. He doesn't if he didn't win the popular vote.

If by popular mandate you mean elected, then you are wrong. The will of the people made Donald Trump President.

It seems that you are complaining that your team had more yards, so that it should not matter that they did not score as many points. That's not the way the rules work. However, you are invited to tray again this season. The game is in 51 weeks.

 

[Anthony60]

The Senate has a case?

Relevant witnesses of course, partisan diversion crap no.

As usual you have no clue what you are talkong about.

As usual, your post is void of any points at all, and you have to resort to attacking me instead.

 

[element94]

Maybe it does come down to that. I'm mystified by the entire phenomenon. People will study the age of Trump for a generation.

I think almost everything you said is true. I think there's more, but I haven't been able to put my finger on it just yet. There's a particular flavor of pride amongst Trump supporters. It's smug. There's an attitude of "taking back our country", which relates to the racism you described. There's also an air of "sticking it to the liberals". It feels like accomplishment is less important to them than bothering liberals and defeating liberalism. To the extent they associate liberalism with Obama (and they do), that might be racism or it might not be. They're also obsessed with Bill and Hillary Clinton, so unless they dislike the Clintons more after Obama became associated with liberalism, then it's not racism. It's just anti-liberalism, which curiously, has become synonymous with what we used to call conservatism.

Where I don't fully agree with you is that white people don't want to be in the minority because they fear the treatment that non-white people receive. I don't think most white people have any realistic concept of the way non-white people are treated in most of the US. That's evidenced by the fact that so many white Americans claim that racism is gone or exaggerated or insignificant (in comparison to the racism of years past or not) and also by the fact that so many white people oppose civil rights for minorities. If they were scared about being in the minority for the right reasons, they would be passing as many anti-discrimination laws as they could write before they find themselves without the homefield advantage.

While I agree that fear is a motivator, I feel like something else is also at work. I know I'm going to send some people into apoplexy by saying this, but I think it's privilege. The benefits of the majority have always belonged to white Americans, so they feel a sense of ownership over them. They don't want to lose control of "their" country because it's no one's to take. Too bad it's inevitable and the Republican party has decided to go down in history kicking and screaming about the non-white invasion. This will be regarded as a very dark time in the party's history.

The fear is being the minority eventually. While I don't think the eventual immigrant majority will sink to the depths of the past and present white majority, I do believe that is exactly what the Trump base fears.

 

[Anthony60]

I don't support Crooked Donald, but you do.

You support the left making a mockery of our Constitution, as they claim to be upholding it. They are doing the exact opposite, running this non-impeachment like the secret police in old East Germany.

 

[Parrish]

Can anyone explain why POTUS would go through impeachment when he could clear himself by allowing witnesses for his defense to testify? He could release exculpatory documents and this would be all over and POTUS could declare victory. Am I right?

 

[MauiMan]

You support the left making a mockery of our Constitution, as they claim to be upholding it. They are doing the exact opposite, running this non-impeachment like the secret police in old East Germany.

Meanwhile...Trump thinks he’s "The Leader". :stooges

 

[Parrish]

You support the left making a mockery of our Constitution, as they claim to be upholding it. They are doing the exact opposite, running this non-impeachment like the secret police in old East Germany.

POTUS has the power to release documents and allow testimony that would prove the House wrong. Why hasn't he?

 

[MauiMan]

POTUS has the power to release documents and allow testimony that would prove the House wrong. Why hasn't he?

Because he would be impeached and removed from office.