Woman on Woman Body Shaming

[FastPace]

Is what the older lady did at that pool something that's not uncommon?

I think part of the incident stemmed the culture of the nationalities involved. In this case Americans I presume. I gather it took place in Kansas between two women reared if not born as well in the United States.

This might be a less common occurrence in say... Brazil or France. Maybe it would be even more common in certain other countries outside of the United States. Pakistan, of course, likely, but I am thinking more of European countries. I'm wondering more about Northern European countries that don't have the semi-tropical climates that tend to lead to a practice of "body cultures" like in Florida. But i could be wrong given Northern European countries are supposedly pretty tolerant of many things.

Supposedly, in Brazil, women like her walk around on beaches in bikinis. But due to the strong body culture in say... cities like Rio the visual competition is present and in your face, I would hazard a guess that works on most peoples minds and sparks them to work on improving their physiques. But then again, the body culture of Rio de Janeiro is supposedly more something the city's middle-class is engaged in, as Rio's poor supposedly have greater concerns. Not sure how true that is but it's something I think I read from a Brazilian sociologist before.

 

[Dragonfly]

Many times they are. Women can be absolutely vicious to each other --- especially online.

And especially when younger. Like Middle School. I've heard some horror stories of bullying.
Not mention read about it in the news.

 

[Dragonfly]

For the same reason men do.

For the same reason men do what?

Men attack women?

Or.

Men attack men?

You don't think it's maybe just selfishness? Or perhaps jealousy? Becoming more competitive and not knowing how to control it?
Asserting their new found "power"? Thinking that's what feminism is all about?
Having watched trash like The Kartrashian's and Real House Wives and crap they're emulating what they think is their new right?


There's no chance this isn't a purely female thing? A female evolution of sorts?

Men used to fist fight to dominate others and/or settle scores with guys they thought to be a threat.

Is female on female body shaming just a choice the females are making that's not quite as harsh as getting into physical confrontations?

 

[FastPace]

...Do you think it's a coincidence that this older woman grew up in an intensely objectifying culture, and then espouses objectifying things onto other women?

Liberal women demanded the objectification, or rather increased sexualization (they just wanted men to divorce their brains from the testosterone in their body) of women. Which to be honest, I've never had a problem with. Ergo, I never wanted the cultural norms of female fashion to entirely go back to not only the 1950s or early '60s but worst yet the 1800s.

Have you ever seen how women dressed in the USA in the 1800s. Aside from those working in brothels... a lot of the American women in the 1800s dressed more "conservatively" than June Cleaver.

You see... the idea was in the 1970s and 1980s even... that men are sooooooo afraid of female sexual power we keep them hostage by not making it socially acceptable for girls and women to dress like a "hooker."

Being a woman doesn't free a person from the psychological affects of sexism. It magnifies them, if anything. After all, women are the targets of said sexism, and there is no better way to continue oppressing people than to get your targets to do your dirty work for you.

Males have body image problems too. The thing is most men keep their mouth shut about other grown men. Usually at least.

Women feel they were given more power than Christ himself to preach the gospel of how people should act, think, do, and dress whether the person is male or female. And it's not that men don't make judgements, they do! But more often they keep it to themselves. Accept for certain things. They are more vocal in their negative judgments about gay men than women are. One example.

Male Body Image - GI Joe 60's to 90's

Published on Dec 22, 2008

From my blog at This is where it all begins... - Steve McMinn's DoStrength This clip is from the movie "Bigger Stronger Faster", which can be found on YouTube. A psychiatrist shows how much bigger and more muscular the GI Joe doll has gotten since it originally came out in the 60's. The 90's version has the equivalent of 16-inch biceps!

Published on Oct 8, 2008

Photographer, Rick Schaff exposes how companies create misleading advertisements to sell their products.

If the vast majority of men had zero body image concerns, then it would be reasonable to hypothesize or guess that the supplement industry, weight lifting mags or sites, equipment etc. would be an industry not making much money. Small business.

 

[FastPace]

Men used to fist fight to dominate others and/or settle scores with guys they thought to be a threat.

What do you mean used to? They still do.

And girls and women have joined in on the fist fighting. I mean... with modern technology you can record this stuff and post it on Facebook or youtube etc.

Men remain some violent SOBs. We still remain less violent than Chimpanzees but we still remain more violent than Bonobos.

 

[Lovebug]

Is it?

What makes you think she was "well meaning"?

How do you know she wasn't? We have a few lines of something, but weren't there and don't know the woman. I like to give her the benefit of the doubt instead of making a big whopping deal out of it.

 

[CLAX1911]

Yes, I have. No problems. Nicest office I ever worked in. Maybe the problem was you.

You are female.

 

[Lovebug]

I don't know if it's "above and beyond" or not. I just know it exists.

Generally, I think people are vicious to each other because they're miserable and want everyone else to be as miserable as they are. I think the lady in the OP just lived at a different time when women stayed covered up especially after giving birth. She probably thought she was giving good advice to a young woman.

Exactly. We don't know her circumstances to say otherwise.

 

[Dragonfly]

The old biddy at the pool was being mean.

She said, "the men at the pool would feel more comfortable if I was in a one-piece swim suit because a bikini isn't appropriate for a mother, especially one who's "still recovering,"

That's all bull crap.

Why would the woman lie about how the men felt? How would she even know?

 

[FastPace]

I love watching YouTube video about beauty products. Below those videos (as we all know) you can comment on the video. You will not believe how vicious women are to female youtubers. They pick apart their physical appearance daily, tell them they're stupid, talk crap about their husbands, boyfriends, kids, mothers. People are just awful. There are entire forums dedicated to talking trash about women on youtube -- and I guarantee you that 99% of the members are female.

Here's a video a very popular beauty youtuber made about these comments:

When I first got on the internet I was naive. But today I'm of the staunch belief that you will find some people online to attack a person over anything. I mean... I'm convinced if you had a youtube channel and you said, "Hey, my favorite color is green, what is yours?" you would get personally attacked by some people.

I'll watch youtube videos on wet shaving gear and I'll also watch videos on reviews of colognes as well. And there are people that get into verbal fights over that stuff too. :lol: Amazing.

But I will say I think it is less common, or frequent I should say, among men than among women. Nonetheless, you can still find it happening among men at times. Why some dude or dudes hate on a guy because he loves a certain cologne you or I dislike, or how some shaving soap lathers, is beyond me.

I mean I can see I guess, getting into a slightly heated exchange over particular facts about a product (like where and who it is made by, dates, ingredients etc.), assuming some false info was being spread. I mean I fall into the camp of those guys that like the scent of the now classic cologne Kouros. Yes, it has a note of urine cakes in it. But some men who hate Kouros seem to get really annoyed by the fact some men like it. I mean I get it's one of those scents that either people usually really like or they really hate. Unlike more "generic" aquatic scents that few people in the general population will find "offensive."





Anyways... I did not watch this whole video below (I did watch that video you posted) but I at times check this dude's reviews out on youtube. And I recall one video in the past in which he spoke briefly about having to shut down an argument between two guys that got very insulting towards one another.

 

[VanceMack]

Women are the primary 'culprits' when it comes to body shaming, appropriate attire, breast feeding in public, the wear of yoga pants as an approved workplace outfit, etc. Men....we say go bra-less, breastfeed wherever you like, yoga pants...yes please...and for your own comfort of course you are encouraged to wear as little as you like.

 

[FastPace]

For the same reason men do.

There's two basic modes for how to discuss women's bodies in patriarchy: commodity, or source of shame. Either sex can take either side depending on their position relative to the woman in question and what serves their desire to control the interaction.

That's some feminist nonsense that totally rejects any explanations of why the two sexes are the way they are based on the Theory of Evolution. Either that or biological evolution was bad.

Possibly, most (not all) men are just more attracted to certain features (e.g., fewer scars) and morphology?

I don't see women running around after male midgets (dwarfs).

 

[William Rea]

I guess I just don't understand, then, why women's meanness is talked about as being so above and beyond when, in reality, it isn't. To me, the conversation to be had here is more to do with the why.

It's a Tu Quoque along the lines of if women are doing it then it excuses men from doing it.

The Holocaust was fine because some Jews collaborated, Black slavery was fine because some Black people collaborated, Vichy France was fine because some French people collaborated and yet, you will now hear outrage that I even suggested some of those.

 

[William Rea]

That's some feminist nonsense that totally rejects any explanations of why the two sexes are the way they are based on the Theory of Evolution. Either that or biological evolution was bad.

Possibly, most (not all) men are just more attracted to certain features (e.g., fewer scars) and morphology?

I don't see women running around after male midgets (dwarfs).

Bullcrap, if we were acting on evolution we would be attracted to women with wide hips and a good excess of fat.

I will throw the thought out there that the obsession with wide eyed, skinny and androgynous women is a form of covert paedophilia and homosexuality.

The fact that overweight women are attractive in some cultures shows how absurd any kind of evolutionary explanation for this is.

 

[SmokeAndMirrors]

You are female.

Facts. But what is being alleged is that women are horrible to each other. So... I would say I make a better test subject than he does for that theory, dontcha think?

 

[SmokeAndMirrors]

For the same reason men do what?

Men attack women?

Or.

Men attack men?

You don't think it's maybe just selfishness? Or perhaps jealousy? Becoming more competitive and not knowing how to control it?
Asserting their new found "power"? Thinking that's what feminism is all about?
Having watched trash like The Kartrashian's and Real House Wives and crap they're emulating what they think is their new right?


There's no chance this isn't a purely female thing? A female evolution of sorts?

Men used to fist fight to dominate others and/or settle scores with guys they thought to be a threat.

Is female on female body shaming just a choice the females are making that's not quite as harsh as getting into physical confrontations?

Yes to all of those reasons. But feminism isn't the ideology that promotes looking at social interaction as some sort of power struggle. That's patriarchy.

No, there is no chance it is a female thing. Because there is no evidence that only women do it, only to other women. So when everyone all tends to do the exact same thing in the exact same way to the exact same people for the exact same reasons, then no, it's not "a female thing."

Female-on-female body shaming is exactly the same as male-on-female body shaming. It is a form of policing and breaking down self-esteem mandated by a system that believes women don't belong to themselves, and that being horrible to women is ok, because women are horrible anyway.

The fact that you believe women are just bitches by "evolution" just shows how embedded you are in that same belief system, and how you reinforce that it's therefore ok to talk **** about how horrible "women" are to whoever's around you.

 

[wanderlust]

Unfortunately women can be very cruel to other women. I was bullied a lot throughout middle school and high school and even now in college there is still the occasional passive aggressive jab here and there, but not nearly as bad as grade school. My freshman year of college was almost like an extension of high school with the bullying, which was a disheartening way of hoping to start a new chapter in my life, but it's much better now thankfully. And now if someone wants to make fun of me or belittle me or make a passive aggressive jab at my appearance or clothes or interests then that's ok, I'm proud to be me.

 

[Dragonfly]

Yes to all of those reasons. But feminism isn't the ideology that promotes looking at social interaction as some sort of power struggle. That's patriarchy.

No, there is no chance it is a female thing. Because there is no evidence that only women do it, only to other women. So when everyone all tends to do the exact same thing in the exact same way to the exact same people for the exact same reasons, then no, it's not "a female thing."

Female-on-female body shaming is exactly the same as male-on-female body shaming. It is a form of policing and breaking down self-esteem mandated by a system that believes women don't belong to themselves, and that being horrible to women is ok, because women are horrible anyway.

The fact that you believe women are just bitches by "evolution" just shows how embedded you are in that same belief system, and how you reinforce that it's therefore ok to talk **** about how horrible "women" are to whoever's around you.

Whoah whoah whoah....ease up there Miss.

You're projecting quite a bit. Getting aggressive. Hmmmm....how about that.

You're suggesting this new phenomena of women becoming more and more aggressive and mean towards other women is 100% and completely the fault of men.

I'm suggesting that's quite a huge amount of scapegoating.

Women are making free choices here. They're not being told what to do by men. They're not being "trained" by men to be more aggressive and combative.
Men don't demand that their daughters become bullies.

Women have the freedom to make their own choices. A side-effect of that is that it seems quite a few of them are choosing to become bullies.

That's not men programming women. That's women choosing a path.

Women want to be in the military. Women want to be police officers. Women want to be corporate leaders. Women want to be MMA fighters. Women want to be weightlifters.
Women want to be strong, independent, and in charge of their own destiny.

Part of that involves being far more competitive. More aggressive.

Your trying to pin all this on men seems rather odd.
Women have all the free rope they need.
What's unfortunate is that a growing portion of women appear to be hanging themselves with all that rope.

I find it quite sad that women are attacking women. Very counter-productive.

 

[SmokeAndMirrors]

Whoah whoah whoah....ease up there Miss.

You're projecting quite a bit. Getting aggressive. Hmmmm....how about that.

You're suggesting this new phenomena of women becoming more and more aggressive and mean towards other women is 100% and completely the fault of men.

I'm suggesting that's quite a huge amount of scapegoating.

Women are making free choices here. They're not being told what to do by men. They're not being "trained" by men to be more aggressive and combative.
Men don't demand that their daughters become bullies.

Women have the freedom to make their own choices. A side-effect of that is that it seems quite a few of them are choosing to become bullies.

That's not men programming women. That's women choosing a path.

Women want to be in the military. Women want to be police officers. Women want to be corporate leaders. Women want to be MMA fighters. Women want to be weightlifters.
Women want to be strong, independent, and in charge of their own destiny.

Part of that involves being far more competitive. More aggressive.

Your trying to pin all this on men seems rather odd.
Women have all the free rope they need.
What's unfortunate is that a growing portion of women appear to be hanging themselves with all that rope.

I find it quite sad that women are attacking women. Very counter-productive.

I'm not though. You literally claimed women are mendacious by nature, despite ample evidence men do all of the exact same things.

Being mean has nothing to do with enjoying working out. And by the way, women have always been like that. Anthropologically, women were usually more active than men, in fact. Wanting to be recognized as an independent, sentient being also has nothing to do with being "aggressive." That's just called being human, which is something people for some reason find shocking coming from women.

I didn't say anything at all about "men" as a gender monolith, and I've tried to explain this several times. You just have a very simple-minded and politicized understanding of how patriarchy works.

I frankly just have no interest in silly black-and-white jousting with someone who is refusing to read my responses.

 

[Harshaw]

Whoah whoah whoah....ease up there Miss.

You're projecting quite a bit. Getting aggressive. Hmmmm....how about that.

You're suggesting this new phenomena of women becoming more and more aggressive and mean towards other women is 100% and completely the fault of men.

I'm suggesting that's quite a huge amount of scapegoating.

Women are making free choices here. They're not being told what to do by men. They're not being "trained" by men to be more aggressive and combative.
Men don't demand that their daughters become bullies.

Women have the freedom to make their own choices. A side-effect of that is that it seems quite a few of them are choosing to become bullies.

That's not men programming women. That's women choosing a path.

Women want to be in the military. Women want to be police officers. Women want to be corporate leaders. Women want to be MMA fighters. Women want to be weightlifters.
Women want to be strong, independent, and in charge of their own destiny.

Part of that involves being far more competitive. More aggressive.

Your trying to pin all this on men seems rather odd.
Women have all the free rope they need.
What's unfortunate is that a growing portion of women appear to be hanging themselves with all that rope.

I find it quite sad that women are attacking women. Very counter-productive.

I'm sure they only think they want these things because they were programmed to want them by the patriarchy.

This idea that women don't make decisions for themselves, that they have no moral agency of their own, or the intelligence to think for themselves and use it, seems awfully demeaning to women. I'm glad I don't think that way.

 

[Harry Guerrilla]

Whoah whoah whoah....ease up there Miss.

You're projecting quite a bit. Getting aggressive. Hmmmm....how about that.

You're suggesting this new phenomena of women becoming more and more aggressive and mean towards other women is 100% and completely the fault of men.

I'm suggesting that's quite a huge amount of scapegoating.

Women are making free choices here. They're not being told what to do by men. They're not being "trained" by men to be more aggressive and combative.
Men don't demand that their daughters become bullies.

Women have the freedom to make their own choices. A side-effect of that is that it seems quite a few of them are choosing to become bullies.

That's not men programming women. That's women choosing a path.

Women want to be in the military. Women want to be police officers. Women want to be corporate leaders. Women want to be MMA fighters. Women want to be weightlifters.
Women want to be strong, independent, and in charge of their own destiny.

Part of that involves being far more competitive. More aggressive.

Your trying to pin all this on men seems rather odd.
Women have all the free rope they need.
What's unfortunate is that a growing portion of women appear to be hanging themselves with all that rope.

I find it quite sad that women are attacking women. Very counter-productive.

I know you're usually a supporter of feminism and I'm not attacking you for it.
That stuff is why a lot of men oppose it.

Patriarchy theory is the near equivalent of the various grand Jewish conspiracies, (protocols of the elders of Zion style).
It's nutty as hell and even nuttier that it's mainstream to believe.

 

[_Sal]

Yes to all of those reasons. But feminism isn't the ideology that promotes looking at social interaction as some sort of power struggle. That's patriarchy.

No, there is no chance it is a female thing. Because there is no evidence that only women do it, only to other women. So when everyone all tends to do the exact same thing in the exact same way to the exact same people for the exact same reasons, then no, it's not "a female thing."

Female-on-female body shaming is exactly the same as male-on-female body shaming. It is a form of policing and breaking down self-esteem mandated by a system that believes women don't belong to themselves, and that being horrible to women is ok, because women are horrible anyway.

The fact that you believe women are just bitches by "evolution" just shows how embedded you are in that same belief system, and how you reinforce that it's therefore ok to talk **** about how horrible "women" are to whoever's around you.

exceptional analysis

:thumbs:

 

[Dragonfly]

I'm not though. You literally claimed women are mendacious by nature, despite ample evidence men do all of the exact same things.

You just have a very simple-minded and politicized understanding of how patriarchy works.

I frankly just have no interest in silly black-and-white jousting with someone who is refusing to read my responses.

No, there is no chance it is a female thing. Because there is no evidence that only women do it, only to other women. So when everyone all tends to do the exact same thing in the exact same way to the exact same people for the exact same reasons, then no, it's not "a female thing."

Female-on-female body shaming is exactly the same as male-on-female body shaming. It is a form of policing and breaking down self-esteem mandated by a system that believes women don't belong to themselves, and that being horrible to women is ok, because women are horrible anyway.

The fact that you believe women are just bitches by "evolution" just shows how embedded you are in that same belief system, and how you reinforce that it's therefore ok to talk **** about how horrible "women" are to whoever's around you.

I've read your responses. I think a great deal of what you've posted is nonsense. Including the quoted stuff above.

The "system"? What "system"?

Sounds an awful lot like the "agenda" thing some right-wing hacks try to insist the gay community is pushing.

I know of no "system" designed to break down self esteem, or that insists women shouldn't belong to themselves.

Also, when you type out crap like this:

The fact that you believe women are just bitches by "evolution" just shows how embedded you are in that same belief system, and how you reinforce that it's therefore ok to talk **** about how horrible "women" are to whoever's around you.

and this:

and that being horrible to women is ok, because women are horrible anyway.

why should I really put much thought into trying to decipher what you're saying?

I was raised almost exclusively by my mother.
About 99% of all schooling I had up until high school was taught by lady teachers.
I have one sister. No brothers.
My dad died before I became an adult.
I have a wife and two daughters. No sons.

Why on Earth would I believe women are just bitches by evolution?
In fact it's rather offensive on every level for you to post such ridiculous garbage.

I'm trying to understand why women are getting meaner and meaner towards each other.
I'm trying to understand why girls are bullying other girls more and more.

I don't believe saying "it's because men have created this culture/society" is the actual answer.
I think that's a cop-out. The easy way to answer. Shifting blame.

 

[Harry Guerrilla]

exceptional analysis

:thumbs:

That analysis is akin to "It's the Jews fault."
Exceptional scapegoating.

 

[KevinKohler]

As an old coworker used to say...

"Bitches be trippin, yo."