What is really behind the hatred of the President?

[lurchadams]

Calling it spin does not render it spin. I see you are another of those ardent Trump supporters who is either ignorant of his incompetence or just in denial about his dwindling support. Even the base who supported him in the election are now growing silent. All the Dems have to do is put forth a semi-worthwhile candidate at the next election and the GOP will completely turn on Trump in favor of someone else.

You're asking why people hate Trump but you won't accept the answers you don't like, especially the truthful ones. He is unqualified and mean. That's why people hate him.

I could not have said it better? On one of the O.P.'s comments on this thread they mention, "the genius in his presumed madness"

Are you suggesting that so many people are so shallow, so bereft of integrity, so empty of intellectual honesty, so hateful and mean spirited that they would attack President Trump the way they have just because they are upset that Hillary, their hope to at last make progressivism the law of the land, didn't win?

The OP spews utter hatred of the other side and has sacrificed credibility and integrity in favor of simply scoring "hate points".

As Trump often says, "Sick and sad". :thumbdown:screwy

 

[AlbqOwl]

Trump is rich and famous, he's had three hot wives, he's now the President, and he got all of that while breaking every rule the Left believes in. By their worldview, he ought to be a poor nobody, despised by women and ridiculed by voters. If you're somebody who plays by the progressive rulebook but doesn't get anywhere, how can you not feel resentment towards Trump for "cheating" his way to the top?

I don't care that they resent President Trump. Nobody can control how they feel about somebody. You either like them or not.

But I was raised that libel and slander, i.e. bearing false witness, against a person in a way that harms that person is unjustifiable, contemptible, and morally wrong. I think probably most of these people smearing the President believe they are speaking the truth about him. I am just asking them to give me the evidence for their smears. So far. . .zilch.

 

[MrPeanut]

I would say my hatred of Trump is mainly due to how much he lies about things, and the fact that it is blatantly obvious he doesn't know what the hell he's doing. My evidence would be any interview he has done, and every speech with the exception of his teleprompter ones. He's just so openly incompetent it confuses me more when people don't hate him. I can at least understand people liking that he is pushing Republican policies, but liking Trump himself just seems crazy.

 

[lurchadams]

And yet his support is a high as it is, which means that you have missed something.

I'm just happy not to be missing points like the Colorado Buffaloes are tonight !:thumbs::2usflag::good_job: Cougars!

 

[AlbqOwl]

I don't hate him. I also oppose illegal immigration, but you are not actually paying attention to the current rhetoric. Illegal immigration is an outdated meme. The current dialogue now includes legal immigration, and Trump wants to scale back the number of legal immigrants allowed into the country each year. He also wants changes VISA programs, and has made statements about foreign workers taking jobs from Americans on H1B1 VISAS.

I also know Mexicans opposed to illegal immigration. I will dispute some of the generalizations you're making however. There might be some Muslims supporting Trump, but definitely not many. I know a lot of Muslims, and Muslims don't like Trump. I will leave it at that. On the flip side, many Muslims would probably prefer voting conservative over liberal, but they are not going to vote for the current state of the GOP. I have heard a lot of black people make similar statements, because many of them are very religious and attend church a lot. They are more socially conservative than liberals. Asians have also been leaving the GOP. These groups of people have reasons to be attracted to conservatism over liberalism, but there is a reason the current GOP and Trump can't get the vote.

It's very easy for you to tell all of these people, including me, to not get bogged down in the "petty stuff" and the "poorly phrased statement" and "stumbles." I don't consider it petty or any of the above to propose registering and banning a religious group. I have family members in the immigration process. They live here, but they are not a permanent resident or citizen at this time. They have legal VISAS and green cards, which have to be constantly renewed. Anybody in the process, has every right to be concerned about Trump's rhetoric and what he can do to the immigration process.

At the mosque I attend, many of us know somebody who was held up at the airport because of the Trump's travel ban. Those people were here LEGALLY, and had legal VISAS. They have a right to be here, yet they were detained in airports.

You talk as if you consider me and my concerns petty, but to people like me, it's not petty. These are real concerns that can change my family and how we live as a family in America.

As I said, the day after Trump won, I looked at my neighbors and coworkers, and I questioned how they saw my place in America. I really did do that, and it hurt to think that somebody I love could lose their VISA and not be allowed back in the country, and my neighbors and coworkers could possibly be ok with that.

I suppose everybody knows somebody who was inconvenienced or suffered damages because of some rule or action of government. I sure do and have experienced that myself. I am not unsympathetic to those who cite personal experiences with that kind of thing.

But I wonder how many people in the United States are able to go to church or synagogue or mosque or school or work or shopping or hug their family at night because the President's efforts to increase the safety of the American people prevented some bad people from getting into the country? I couldn't agree more that he bungled it at the beginning--a novice kind of mistake much as President Obama committed a lot of when he was first getting his sea legs as President--but he has been getting it much more right as he goes along.

So if you think mishandling the travel ban initially disqualifies him to be President for all time, then that's what you think. I would strongly disagree. President Obama deliberately and with forethought lied to us again and again and again to get the people to accept a deeply flawed healthcare overhaul. I think that was despicable and indefensible, but I didn't call for his impeachment or think he was disqualified then for doing anything at all. I suppose it is all a matter of perspective. The anti-Trump crowd are very one note allowing no possibility that their criticisms of him might be in error or unfair or excessive.

And obviously on this thread, most have absolutely no clue why they are reciting the slurs, smears, talking points, hateful sound bites, etc. They want to believe it so badly they aren't about to even question themselves whether they are being honest or fair about it.

 

[AlbqOwl]

What talking points? Is that just what you call absolutely everything that isn't mindlessly agreeing with you? :lol:

Ok, let's try this. Complaint: Trump is unfit for office. Context: Jesus, where do I start... Ok, let's go with aforementioned nuclear goading, a wreck of a healthcare platform that even other Republicans don't support, aaaand... let's throw in the nepotism for good measure. 'K? I mean, I'm just plucking stuff off the top of my head, man. I could go on for pages.

Exactly how much do I need before I'm allowed to have an opinion different from yours which doesn't immediately get met with "EVIL HATEFUL LIBRULS" as a sole response, ironically to someone who's not even a liberal and doesnt think someone like Trump is even worth the strength of emotion required to hate him?

I think you really need to take a look in the mirror before you go on about other people's debate tactics.

Still not a single example honestly presented in its full context. Sad.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Looking at your statement that I bolded, are you saying, then, that if Obama had (1) dissed McCain for BEING a POW, (2) claimed that he knew more about ISIS than all the generals, (3) dissed a Gold Star family for being Muslim, (4) claimed repeatedly that our CIA, FBI, and NSA were ALL wrong about Russia interfering in an election to his benefit, (5) admitted to sexual assault that he could get away with because he was a celebrity, (6) publicly and physically mocked the disability of a reporter, (7) claimed that he could be more presidential than any other president except Lincoln, and (8) gave himself a "10" for his administration's response to the devastation in Puerto Rico...

...I have to ask, if Obama had done all that, could you please tell me if you would have considered all that "petty stuff" that people shouldn't "get bogged down" into? Would you be so eager to give Obama a pass as you apparently are for us to give Trump a pass?

I know all the criticisms. Everybody keeps listing them. Most I know to be untrue or presented dishonestly but that is what prompted the thread.

Now pick one of those on your list here and give me the evidence--not media spin, not the anti-Trump soundbites, but the full context of the event. What he actually said, not what the spin doctors say he said, the context and setting, and the backstory plays a part in this too--what prompted the President's remark and what exactly was he responding to? Do that and I will absolutely take you seriously if you can actually prove that he was as bad as you are portraying him.

And then we are left with whether the offense was serious enough to disqualify him as President of the United States and/or whether it justifies the unbridled contempt, disrespect, and hatred of him we see from most of the left.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Why do you need someone to criticize Trump? it isnt like you are going to listen to what any snowflake says. You certainly havent listened to any of the people in this thread yet.

I'm listening very carefully. And as yet, not one of the anti-Trump people have given a single example in full context and honestly represented of why the unbridled contempt, disrespect, and hatred is justified.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Here's another reason Trump is utter pond-scum. I can't believe you can keep up this fake support for this nut-case because you love it that normal people are horrified by this guy.

https://www.huffingtonpost.com/entr...a6fe4b0a484d063b916?ncid=inblnkushpmg00000009



Trump just continues to stick his tiny foot in his ugly mouth, denying it, elisting otherwise honorable people to spread his lies, and then attacks anyone who calls him on his horse-hockey.

You ask what has Trump done to inspire such fair criticism.

You should already have the answer, but I'll continue to play!

Give me what the President actually said in its full context please, and not how the media or you are spinning it please.

 

[AlbqOwl]

You better check to see what Sarah Huckabee Sanders called us too.

This thread is not about Sarah Huckabee.

 

[AlbqOwl]

I could not have said it better? On one of the O.P.'s comments on this thread they mention, "the genius in his presumed madness"



The OP spews utter hatred of the other side and has sacrificed credibility and integrity in favor of simply scoring "hate points".

As Trump often says, "Sick and sad". :thumbdown:screwy

The empty barrels pretty much get around to attacking the messenger. That is sad.

 

[Oreo]

I see it. I recognize it. It is prevalent everywhere--among the Democrats in Congress and some Republicans, in the mainstream media, on social media, on message boards, etc. The President is stupid, ugly, hateful, racist, bigoted, sexist, inappropriate, arrogant, dangerous, etc. etc. etc. etc.

I get it.

But where is that coming from really?

Do all those people really believe Hillary was the better choice and think if they can destroy Trump they'll get somebody they can approve of? Or are they too partisan to see any positives in any conservative?

Do they get some kind of emotional satisfaction in singling out somebody to hate? Is using ugly imagery or 'clever' derogatory terms to describe him recreation for them?

Do they think they look smart by dismissing all evidence to the contrary and continuing to recite the talking points to describe him as terrible, unacceptable even when it is intellectually dishonest to do so?

Do they have no sense of justice or fair play when they are unwilling to acknowledge what was actually said or done and instead spin the accurate statement/situation into something they can attack?

Is it impossible for them to see it any other way than from a highly prejudiced and biased leftist point of view?

Is it so impossible to support his idea or work with him to accomplish something good? How do rational people deal with such obvious fear that he might get credit for something good?

And finally. . .

Is it possible to have a discussion about this in a civil, intelligent, philosophical manner that isn't derailed and destroyed by sound bites and other trollish methods?

So from your best rational perspective, what is behind the hatred of President Donald J. Trump?

You have elected a man with no honor, no respect, no dignity, no humility, no decency, and the only loyalty he has ever shown to anyone was to himself and Vladimir Putin.

Whom along with some of his surrogates are enthralled in the most serious scandal in this Nation's history--who (within 6 months of being in office) is under investigation for Obstruction of Justice over the firing of FBI director James Comey. It didn't help that he announced on an NBC interview with Lestor Holt that he fired Comey over the Russian investigation.
https://www.cbsnews.com/news/james-...ndal-pales-in-comparison-with-russian-claims/



He is mentally unfit to hold this office, and many are bringing that up now. Trump has a narcissistic personality disorder--where he is a person that requires constant attention, but that attention has to come in the form of praise and adoration. He cannot tolerate any form of criticism and is the reason he is constantly attacking private citizens of this country in elementary school playground comments through his tweety account. Knowing that any President, no matter how good they are will get criticism coming in from every direction, 24 hours a day, 7 days a week, exemplifies exactly how UNFIT Trump was ever to hold this office.
https://www.rawstory.com/2016/01/a-...rder-that-makes-him-a-dangerous-world-leader/

No one could have watched any of those debates, either in the Primary or with Hillary Clinton and walked away believing that Trump was qualified or competent to be POTUS. If they tell you otherwise, they're lying through their teeth.

Republicans only have two options:
1. Remove Trump from office asap or
2. Burn the entire party down in 2018--2020 & beyond.

If Republicans can do 8 investigations into Benghazi and endless talks about emails, it's not hard to imagine what Democrats will do with Treason, Obstruction & Lies when they take over in 2018. You'll also get a great education into what that Emoluments clause is in the Constitution, which is also a reason for impeachment, if Democrats don't want to go along with the current setup.
https://www.brookings.edu/research/...xt-meaning-and-application-to-donald-j-trump/

As far as your question--would Hillary Clinton have been a better President? I'll let a long time friend and former staffer of RONALD REAGAN answer that.

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

I'm listening very carefully. And as yet, not one of the anti-Trump people have given a single example in full context and honestly represented of why the unbridled contempt, disrespect, and hatred is justified.

If someone delivers that are you going to not try and make excuses?

 

[RabidAlpaca]

Exhausted? The left has been treating Trump the same since the day he announced that he was running. The day he won the primary the left went full on ballistic. The left never even attempted to give Trump a chance.

Yes, exhausted from the daily grind of stupid **** coming out of his mouth and then him lying about it. I gave him more than enough benefit of the doubt and he pissed all over it day in and day out for 18 months leading up to now. He's gone out of his way to attack every group in America while stroking the balls of his base and looking back you can't find any legitimate reasons why an American might not like Trump? This is far past partisanship. I still respected Bush as a human being and our president. Trump is not deserving of the same respect we've afforded every other president because he's not rational, honest or an adult.

I'm listening very carefully. And as yet, not one of the anti-Trump people have given a single example in full context and honestly represented of why the unbridled contempt, disrespect, and hatred is justified.

Literally dozens of issues have been brought up to you as to why we don't like Trump and you've summarily dismissed each and every one of them as liberal nonsense. You don't want to hear it, so stop asking for it. I listed one of my MANY issues with him and you dismissed it with "Well, I hated that too but that's just ONE thing? You couldn't think of anything else other than this ONE thing???" No, I listed one of many. There are hundreds of examples and you're not ready to accept any of them.

I'll give you an example:

I would say my hatred of Trump is mainly due to how much he lies about things, and the fact that it is blatantly obvious he doesn't know what the hell he's doing. My evidence would be any interview he has done, and every speech with the exception of his teleprompter ones. He's just so openly incompetent it confuses me more when people don't hate him. I can at least understand people liking that he is pushing Republican policies, but liking Trump himself just seems crazy.

I'll play AlbqOwl: "These aren't real reasons, they're fake news liberal media slants against a good man! He's never lied once in his life. Nobody can give me ONE reason why they don't like him??? NOT ONE??? Why is nobody able to give me one reason they don't like him? You're not even trying to answer my op!! He screwed up ONCE and that's all you can think about??? Nobody can explain why they don't like our dearest lord and savior Trump???? Nobody???"

 

[Glen Contrarian]

I know all the criticisms. Everybody keeps listing them. Most I know to be untrue or presented dishonestly but that is what prompted the thread.

Now pick one of those on your list here and give me the evidence--not media spin, not the anti-Trump soundbites, but the full context of the event. What he actually said, not what the spin doctors say he said, the context and setting, and the backstory plays a part in this too--what prompted the President's remark and what exactly was he responding to? Do that and I will absolutely take you seriously if you can actually prove that he was as bad as you are portraying him.

And then we are left with whether the offense was serious enough to disqualify him as President of the United States and/or whether it justifies the unbridled contempt, disrespect, and hatred of him we see from most of the left.

Good grief. What you seem to be saying, then, is that if it's reported by any news agency NOT approved by Breitbart or Fox News, it must therefore be fake news. I strongly recommend laying off the grape juice - it's not good for you.

But to answer your challenge, okay, you got it - I'll use the first one. From Breitbart, when Frank Luntz was interviewing Trump:

Trump was asked about political correctness and previous remarks where he called McCain a “dummy.” Trump answered by first talking about his rally in Phoenix, which he said was attended by “wonderful, great Americans.” He continued, “John McCain goes, [paraphrasing] ‘Oh, boy, Trump makes my life difficult. He had 15,000 crazies show up.’ He called them all crazy. I said, ‘They weren’t crazy. They were great Americans.’ These people, if you were to see these people you — I know what crazy is. I know all about crazies, these weren’t crazy. So, he insulted me, and he insulted everybody in that room. And I said, ‘Somebody should run against John McCain who has been, you know, in my opinion, not so hot.’ And I supported him, I supported him for president. I raised a million dollars for him, that’s a lot of money. I supported him. He lost, he let us down, but, you know, he lost. So, I’ve never liked him as much after that, because I don’t like losers.”

"So I never liked him as much after that, because I don't like losers." Was that somehow taken out of context, or was was that a puerile insult? If you watch the video link included, he's obviously not trying to make a joke - he's serious. And did Obama ever say anything like that in public? The interview continues:

Frank Luntz, who was leading the Q&A session, repeatedly protested, “He’s a war hero.” Trump responded, “He’s a war hero because he was captured. I like people that weren’t captured, okay? I hate to tell you.” Trump re-iterated, “He’s a war hero because he was capture, okay? You can have — and I believe — perhaps he’s a war hero, but right now, he said some very bad things about a lot of people. So, what I said is, John McCain, I disagree with him, that these people aren’t crazy. And, very importantly, and I speak the truth, he graduated last in his class at Annapolis. So I said, nobody knows that. I said he graduated last or second to last — he graduated last in his class at Annapolis. And he was upset. I say, ‘What? For telling the truth?’

Again, Trump obviously wasn't trying to make a joke or to be funny. He was being insulting. What's more, he obviously has no clue as to WHY Sen. McCain is considered a war hero - not because he was a POW, but because of what he did while he was a war hero.

You know how liberal I am, and you also know I'm retired Navy. If Obama had ever said anything close to being so insulting or disrespectful to a war hero, he would have lost my vote and support forever.

So now the ball's back in your court - I answered your challenge. You said, "pick one of those on your list here and give me the evidence--not media spin, not the anti-Trump soundbites, but the full context of the event". I've done that, and even gave it to you from the website that's been the single strongest supporter of Trump. Now it's up to you to tell me exactly how I supposedly misconstrued or misunderstood what Trump said, and it's up to you to find where Obama - or Clinton or even Carter, for that matter - said anything so egregiously insulting as that. Oh, and remember, no media spin, no anti-Obama/Clinton/Carter soundbites, but the full context. I'll be waiting right here.

 

[SmokeAndMirrors]

You said he did it. So show me the evidence in full context--what he actually said without goading for nuclear war--his actual words and not the media spin. Can you do that? If you can't, you are just echoing the spin which makes you one of those empty barrels Gen. Kelly was talking about.

...Dude, it's right in his Twitter feed and a bunch of interviews. Are you willfully blind?

Dumb question I guess.

And I've been watching tons of people give you links and direct quotes and you have no response to any of them, or simply deny that they were given. I've been here too long to let partisans waste my time and energy.

 

[Perotista]

The question is whether he is actually doing and saying the things the haters accuse him of. This thread is to challenge them to come forward with the evidence that he is the evil, bad, terrible person they say he is. So far they keep saying how evil, bad, terrible he is, but not one has come up with any honest, unembellished, and verifiable evidence for any of it.

They have gone back into his past to dig up past shortcomings and sins and such. But so far as his performance as President goes, they are all empty barrels so are. Speaking their feelings, but offering nothing substantive to justify them.

Personal attacks on one's opponent if what our elections have come down to these days. Elections are not a battle about substance, ideas, solutions, visions etc. it has become an arena where one tries to get the voters to hate the guy more than you. Last year's election was exactly that and that has carried over into the Trump presidency.

One has to remember that around 60% of all Americans didn't like Trump to begin with. But enough of that 60% disliked Hillary more than Trump to give Trump 46% of the popular vote and the presidency. For Democrats in general, that dislike has turned into hate. They view Trump as a dangerous, obnoxious, incompetent, name calling bully. Trump also defeated their queen. Thus a lot of Democrats view him as an illegitimate president also.

Independents are that bad. They just don't like Trump's persona, his character, his temper tantrums via twitter. They view him as an uncouth, foul mouthed, unpresidential character. Still 40% of independents approve of the job he is doing vs. 50% who disapprove give or take depending on the poll. Republicans, there is still that 15% of or so who once were never Trumpers. They view Trump as an egotistical, opportunistic interloper. Not a republican. These guys are disgusted with Trump, they view Trump as one who will lead or cause the Democrats to take back power in congress.

Hate is just the sign of the times in politics these days. Trump has caused a lot of that himself. Throw in the fact Trump never tried to unite the Republican Party behind him after he was nominated and that since he has become president, has tried to increase his base. People don't trust him. Trump is an easy target and has himself provided much of the ammunition shot back at him.

 

[SheWolf]

I have family members that immigrated to this country and very good friends that are here on work visas as well. It was a nightmare to legally immigrate to this country long before Trump took office. My brothers wife could not get immigration status in this country. They were married in Mexico when he was working there. When his job moved him back his wife was not even allowed to come back with him. The son they had in Mexico was allowed back and granted citizenship but they did not honor the marriage done in Mexico.

Reapplying for work Visas has been going on long before Trump took office. At any time your renewal could be denied and back to your country you go. Again this has been going on long before Trump took office. I used to write letters explaining how valuable they were to the company to get them to renew 2 of my workers when I managed a plumbing company. It took a millionaire with political connections to get their visas renewed.



There is a big difference between a temporary visa and immigration status. People think being allowed to come to this country on a visa to work is automatic immigration status. Not by a long shot. It doesn't work that way in other countries either. Once you are granted immigration status you are here unless you really screw up. A visa can be revoked at any time or not renewed for almost any reason.

I personally think we need to grant more work visas. But not to come here and see if you can take a job away from a citizen by working for less money or benefits. I think we need to do thorough background checks on everyone entering our country on a visa. Anyone coming here on work visa needs to already have a job. Information needs to be provided showing where they will work and documentation that all taxes are paid needs to be verified.

People often think if an immigrant marries, they are automatically a US citizen. It's not true either. My husband's green card is about to expire. We turn in the paperwork, do the interviews, and pay a lot of money and then wait. We have to do another round of interviews, but it looks like his VISA could actually expire before they get back to us.

 

[bearpoker]

The President can't make a tweet that the haters won't make something out of that wasn't intended. Now look at the full situation, what President Trump has explained with the situation, and what he meant by those tweets. And then show me how it is justified to hold him in contempt, disrespect him, hate him for his point of view on that. Explain how those tweets are dangerous within the context he made them?

The secretary of state was talking to the Chinese, attempting to get them do do more to reign in North Korea. Trump's tweet undercut him. Maybe it's naive of me but when he tweets that Tillerson is wasting his time, I take it to mean that he thinks what Tillerson is wasting his time. What do you think he meant? How did this not undercut Tillerson's efforts?

 

[eohrnberger]

Personal attacks on one's opponent if what our elections have come down to these days. Elections are not a battle about substance, ideas, solutions, visions etc. it has become an arena where one tries to get the voters to hate the guy more than you. Last year's election was exactly that and that has carried over into the Trump presidency.

One has to remember that around 60% of all Americans didn't like Trump to begin with. But enough of that 60% disliked Hillary more than Trump to give Trump 46% of the popular vote and the presidency. For Democrats in general, that dislike has turned into hate. They view Trump as a dangerous, obnoxious, incompetent, name calling bully. Trump also defeated their queen. Thus a lot of Democrats view him as an illegitimate president also.

Independents are that bad. They just don't like Trump's persona, his character, his temper tantrums via twitter. They view him as an uncouth, foul mouthed, unpresidential character. Still 40% of independents approve of the job he is doing vs. 50% who disapprove give or take depending on the poll. Republicans, there is still that 15% of or so who once were never Trumpers. They view Trump as an egotistical, opportunistic interloper. Not a republican. These guys are disgusted with Trump, they view Trump as one who will lead or cause the Democrats to take back power in congress.

Hate is just the sign of the times in politics these days. Trump has caused a lot of that himself. Throw in the fact Trump never tried to unite the Republican Party behind him after he was nominated and that since he has become president, has tried to increase his base. People don't trust him. Trump is an easy target and has himself provided much of the ammunition shot back at him.

"Personal attacks on one's opponent if what our elections have come down to these days. Elections are not a battle about substance, ideas, solutions, visions etc. it has become an arena where one tries to get the voters to hate the guy more than you. Last year's election was exactly that and that has carried over into the Trump presidency. "
Agreed. Now, a root cause analysis on this particular issue might be useful. Identity politics would seem to be a largely contributing factor.

As for the rest of your post, yes, the last presidential was the typical choice between bad and worse. Seems the electorate chose only bad instead of worse this time.

 

[HowardBThiname]

Poor Don, he's such a snowflake, like many of his syncophants. Don generated all kinds of hate before he ever got into the political arena based upon the lies of birtherism and accusing Ted Cruz's father of involvement in the Kennedy assassination. Anyone who realizes Don is full of **** hates him? Nah, he's just a whiney little bitch. Like you.

LOL

This is the perfect example of what the OP was talking about. Nonsensical. Reactionary. Sour grapes. None of it makes a lick of sense. Just all hatred -- all the time.

Fascinating.

 

[SheWolf]

I suppose everybody knows somebody who was inconvenienced or suffered damages because of some rule or action of government. I sure do and have experienced that myself. I am not unsympathetic to those who cite personal experiences with that kind of thing.

But I wonder how many people in the United States are able to go to church or synagogue or mosque or school or work or shopping or hug their family at night because the President's efforts to increase the safety of the American people prevented some bad people from getting into the country? I couldn't agree more that he bungled it at the beginning--a novice kind of mistake much as President Obama committed a lot of when he was first getting his sea legs as President--but he has been getting it much more right as he goes along.

So if you think mishandling the travel ban initially disqualifies him to be President for all time, then that's what you think. I would strongly disagree. President Obama deliberately and with forethought lied to us again and again and again to get the people to accept a deeply flawed healthcare overhaul. I think that was despicable and indefensible, but I didn't call for his impeachment or think he was disqualified then for doing anything at all. I suppose it is all a matter of perspective. The anti-Trump crowd are very one note allowing no possibility that their criticisms of him might be in error or unfair or excessive.

And obviously on this thread, most have absolutely no clue why they are reciting the slurs, smears, talking points, hateful sound bites, etc. They want to believe it so badly they aren't about to even question themselves whether they are being honest or fair about it.

No. The way he has spoken to and about, and has treated certain communities is far worse than any other previous president has in recent history. I knew from the onset Trump supporters were eating it up, why, because they are afraid and angry. They are afraid of Islam and Muslims. They think immigrants and Hispanics are taking their jobs, and getting Affirmative Action, and getting stuff for free.

Nobody should campaign on banning and registering a religious group. You don't know how that feels, so don't even pretend Obama put you in the situation Trump put millions on Americans in with his rhetoric and actions. I said from the beginning, millions of us were not going to give Trump a chance because of his rehotic, scapegoating, and treatment of certain groups. Now he is president, the GOP is mostly all white people, and racial division is deeper than I have ever seen it.

Your fear is no excuse. If my family were split apart. If my husband's immigration were stopped, and he forced to leave, how would you feel? Would that make you feel safer? Would that be the action you wanted to see?

I can't even. There is no excuse to make another group of people feel so uncertain, unwelcome, and ironically afraid in America. You don't know how that feels, and it's not an issue of a new president getting his sea legs. It's an issue of not respecting certain groups of people and their rights.

 

[HowardBThiname]

No. The way he has spoken to and about, and has treated certain communities is far worse than any other previous president has in recent history. I knew from the onset Trump supporters were eating it up, why, because they are afraid and angry. They are afraid of Islam and Muslims. They think immigrants and Hispanics are taking their jobs, and getting Affirmative Action, and getting stuff for free.

I don't really think this was the reason. I think Trump was elected because Obama, and progressives in general, kept pointing fingers at conservatives and telling them they were racists, bigots, etc. They were tired of being blamed for everything that was wrong, and they didn't want another president that would do that.

Nobody should campaign on banning and registering a religious group. You don't know how that feels, so don't even pretend Obama put you in the situation Trump put millions on Americans in with his rhetoric and actions. I said from the beginning, millions of us were not going to give Trump a chance because of his rehotic, scapegoating, and treatment of certain groups. Now he is president, the GOP is mostly all white people, and racial division is deeper than I have ever seen it.

Here again, it was obvious under Obama that Christians were to be shunned -- remember his "guns and bibles" comment? When citizens were frightened about Islamic terrorism, progressives pointed and said, "you stupid Christians." I'm an atheist and even I understood what was happening there.

Your fear is no excuse. If my family were split apart. If my husband's immigration were stopped, and he forced to leave, how would you feel? Would that make you feel safer? Would that be the action you wanted to see?

As long as your husband came here legally, why would he have to be afraid? I completely support his immigration process. If he broke the law in coming here, however, I have no sympathy for him.

I can't even. There is no excuse to make another group of people feel so uncertain, unwelcome, and ironically afraid in America. You don't know how that feels, and it's not an issue of a new president getting his sea legs. It's an issue of not respecting certain groups of people and their rights.

Only people who've done something wrong should feel uncertain. It's not okay to break the law. If you don't like the law, set about trying to change it -- but, if you break it -- don't be surprised if you suffer the consequences. Actions have consequences, after all.

 

[bearpoker]

I don't really think this was the reason. I think Trump was elected because Obama, and progressives in general, kept pointing fingers at conservatives and telling them they were racists, bigots, etc. They were tired of being blamed for everything that was wrong, and they didn't want another president that would do that.



Here again, it was obvious under Obama that Christians were to be shunned -- remember his "guns and bibles" comment? When citizens were frightened about Islamic terrorism, progressives pointed and said, "you stupid Christians." I'm an atheist and even I understood what was happening there.



As long as your husband came here legally, why would he have to be afraid? I completely support his immigration process. If he broke the law in coming here, however, I have no sympathy for him.



Only people who've done something wrong should feel uncertain. It's not okay to break the law. If you don't like the law, set about trying to change it -- but, if you break it -- don't be surprised if you suffer the consequences. Actions have consequences, after all.

My son-in-law is of Chinese descent. He immigrated legally with his parents as a child. He is now a citizen. He has a masters degree from the University of Tennessee and has been a teacher for over 10 years. He is married and has two children. When Trump was elected, he was told by some people that it was time for him to go home to Mexico! Call me a hateful liberal (I'm used to it), but I think that was racist of them. In my opinion Trump encourages this sort of nastiness.

 

[Perotista]

"Personal attacks on one's opponent if what our elections have come down to these days. Elections are not a battle about substance, ideas, solutions, visions etc. it has become an arena where one tries to get the voters to hate the guy more than you. Last year's election was exactly that and that has carried over into the Trump presidency. "
Agreed. Now, a root cause analysis on this particular issue might be useful. Identity politics would seem to be a largely contributing factor.

As for the rest of your post, yes, the last presidential was the typical choice between bad and worse. Seems the electorate chose only bad instead of worse this time.

Identity politics, sure. This all makes me miss the good old days when there wasn't that many personal attacks or trying to paint your opponent as the reincarnate of the devil. There has always been some personal attacks. Opposition research, but never in the amount shown last year.