What is really behind the hatred of the President?

[AlbqOwl]

I've said this before, more than once.

I don't hate Trump. I don't believe he's a competent, qualified president who cares about the majority of the citizens in the country. For me to see him in a favorable light I'd probably need to be in one of the groups he is actually helping:
1) The authoritarians among the extremely wealthy.
2) The authoritarian, mostly evangelical christians.

I don't think I'd be happy with him if I was simply part of the "base" he panders to with his divisive verbal and twitter farts.

I honestly hoped he would sober up a bit after he took office, but it's clear he's either not capable or not willing.

His cabinet is made up mostly of people who want to destroy or rob the departments they oversee. Those appointments were where I stopped 'giving him a chance'.

Yes, all those are the talking points and spin the anti-Trump people are putting out there. I don't disagree that is what many across the land are saying. What many at DP say. What several on this thread are saying or probably will say.

The question is not what the anti-Trump people are saying.

The question is why are they saying it? What is the basis for the anger? The disrespect? The contempt? The accusations? And for some the pure hatred? Give me something to go on here. What specifically has he done that supports your opinion of him? Give me evidence that his appointees are robbing or destroying the departments they oversee. He had one department head caught with his hand in the cookie jar, i.e. wasting the taxpayer's money, and that person was immediately sent packing.

So what justification do you have for your opinion? THAT is what this thread is about.

 

[Unitedwestand13]

Yes, all those are the talking points and spin the anti-Trump people are putting out there. I don't disagree that is what many across the land are saying. What many at DP say. What several on this thread are saying or probably will say.

The question is not what the anti-Trump people are saying.

The question is why are they saying it? What is the basis for the anger? The disrespect? The contempt? The accusations? And for some the pure hatred? Give me something to go on here. What specifically has he done that supports your opinion of him? Give me evidence that his appointees are robbing or destroying the departments they oversee. He had one department head caught with his hand in the cookie jar, i.e. wasting the taxpayer's money, and that person was immediately sent packing.

So what justification do you have for your opinion? THAT is what this thread is about.

Why?

Why do i hate trump?


Because I find believe trump is morally bankrupt, politically abhorant, and possibly mentally deranged. He does not represent the american values I was born and raised with.

 

[katzgar]

Yes, all those are the talking points and spin the anti-Trump people are putting out there. I don't disagree that is what many across the land are saying. What many at DP say. What several on this thread are saying or probably will say.

The question is not what the anti-Trump people are saying.

The question is why are they saying it? What is the basis for the anger? The disrespect? The contempt? The accusations? And for some the pure hatred? Give me something to go on here. What specifically has he done that supports your opinion of him? Give me evidence that his appointees are robbing or destroying the departments they oversee. He had one department head caught with his hand in the cookie jar, i.e. wasting the taxpayer's money, and that person was immediately sent packing.

So what justification do you have for your opinion? THAT is what this thread is about.

when trump went birther when trump pretended America isnt great he plain ass lied to pander to what is now his base...simple.

 

[AlbqOwl]

I see it is class Warfare Trump appeals to the lower class and yet Clinton appealed to some of the upper class. The problem is neither one of them was a competent candidate. When Trump went birther he knew what kind of people his Market was and he Pandered to them. For some the change in America was just too fast and Broad for them to handle and Trump was their solution. The depth and breadth of Trumps stupidity has been mind numbing. The one thing I do give him credit for is figuring out a path to the White House, his pandering to the birthers showed he knew what he was doing.

Yes I agree that is also included in the spin from the anti-Trump haters. But it wasn't Trump playing the class warfare card. That was Obama--people clinging to their guns and religion--and that was Hillary--the basket of deplorables. And yes they took their lumps for those idiotic remarks as they should have, but it didn't define their entire campaign or record.

And thank you for describing Trump supporters as lower class. I hadn't thought of Trump supporters that way and I thought the left always holds up the down trodden, poor, and oppressed as Hillary's constituents, but oh well. That is neither here nor there.

I don't recall the birther issue coming up during the campaign other than Trump stating unequivocably that Barack Obama was a U.S. citizen born in Hawaii and both Obama and Hillary were forgiven for their more nefarious sides from the past so I can't believe the birther issue is the source of all the contempt, hate, disrespect of the President now.

So what is it that he has actually DONE--in context and explained as it actually happened--that justifies the contempt, disrespect, and hatred now?

 

[Greenbeard]

I don't recall the birther issue coming up during the campaign other than Trump stating unequivocably that Barack Obama was a U.S. citizen born in Hawaii and both Obama and Hillary were forgiven for their more nefarious sides from the past so I can't believe the birther issue is the source of all the contempt, hate, disrespect of the President now.

Are you denying Trump was a key figure in the racist birther movement for years?

 

[AlbqOwl]

Let me ask you an honest question: what are the values that trump stands for or claims to uphold?

Honest answer:
Respect for the voter
Respect for the common man.
Respect for the soldier and the veteran.
Respect for the flag.
Respect for the National Anthem.
Respect for Christians, Jews, Muslims, and the religious values people hold.
Respect for America and its self interests.
Respect for language, borders, culture.
Honesty in what is wrong in this country and in the world and why it is wrong despite how politically incorrect it is to say so.
Belief in the values of the Founders that a people given maximum liberty will do more, accomplish more, and be greater than those who live under the dictates of authoritarian government ever can.
Understanding how bad laws and unnecessary regulation infringe on the people's ability to do more, accomplish more, and be greater.
A contempt for and refusal to bow to political correctness and the vicious scourge it has become in the country.
A belief that Supreme Court Justices should be bound by the Constitution and the existing law and should not be making law.
A belief that peace through strength is the only lasting peace.
Refusing to be blindly partisan.
Refusing to be blindly ideological.

 

[katzgar]

Yes I agree that is also included in the spin from the anti-Trump haters. But it wasn't Trump playing the class warfare card. That was Obama--people clinging to their guns and religion--and that was Hillary--the basket of deplorables. And yes they took their lumps for those idiotic remarks as they should have, but it didn't define their entire campaign or record.

And thank you for describing Trump supporters as lower class. I hadn't thought of Trump supporters that way and I thought the left always holds up the down trodden, poor, and oppressed as Hillary's constituents, but oh well. That is neither here nor there.

I don't recall the birther issue coming up during the campaign other than Trump stating unequivocably that Barack Obama was a U.S. citizen born in Hawaii and both Obama and Hillary were forgiven for their more nefarious sides from the past so I can't believe the birther issue is the source of all the contempt, hate, disrespect of the President now.

So what is it that he has actually DONE--in context and explained as it actually happened--that justifies the contempt, disrespect, and hatred now?

thats what I suspected just a thread to try to defend trump. trump started the birther thing in 2010 and you dont remember it? Trump makes no apologies for his birther past - POLITICO trump is a racist pandering scum.

 

[Unitedwestand13]

Honest answer:
Respect for the voter
Respect for the common man.
Respect for the soldier and the veteran.
Respect for the flag.
Respect for the National Anthem.
Respect for Christians, Jews, Muslims, and the religious values people hold.
Respect for America and its self interests.
Respect for language, borders, culture.
Honesty in what is wrong in this country and in the world and why it is wrong despite how politically incorrect it is to say so.
Belief in the values of the Founders that a people given maximum liberty will do more, accomplish more, and be greater than those who live under the dictates of authoritarian government ever can.
Understanding how bad laws and unnecessary regulation infringe on the people's ability to do more, accomplish more, and be greater.
A contempt for and refusal to bow to political correctness and the vicious scourge it has become in the country.
A belief that Supreme Court Justices should be bound by the Constitution and the existing law and should not be making law.
A belief that peace through strength is the only lasting peace.

What about creating a system of law so that strong shall not harm the weak?

 

[katzgar]

Honest answer:
Respect for the voter
Respect for the common man.
Respect for the soldier and the veteran.
Respect for the flag.
Respect for the National Anthem.
Respect for Christians, Jews, Muslims, and the religious values people hold.
Respect for America and its self interests.
Respect for language, borders, culture.
Honesty in what is wrong in this country and in the world and why it is wrong despite how politically incorrect it is to say so.
Belief in the values of the Founders that a people given maximum liberty will do more, accomplish more, and be greater than those who live under the dictates of authoritarian government ever can.
Understanding how bad laws and unnecessary regulation infringe on the people's ability to do more, accomplish more, and be greater.
A contempt for and refusal to bow to political correctness and the vicious scourge it has become in the country.
A belief that Supreme Court Justices should be bound by the Constitution and the existing law and should not be making law.
A belief that peace through strength is the only lasting peace.
Refusing to be blindly partisan.
Refusing to be blindly ideological.

trump disrespects the military https://www.theguardian.com/comment...ect-military-veterans-appalling-unprecedented

 

[AlbqOwl]

Why?

Why do i hate trump?


Because I find believe trump is morally bankrupt, politically abhorant, and possibly mentally deranged. He does not represent the american values I was born and raised with.

I know all that.

The question though is why? It is a question that isn't answered via more insults and sound bites. It is a question I would like an honest answer based on a verifiable fact illustrated and linked in its full context.

I would be the first to say that the President is sometimes out of line, wrong, mistaken, even cringeworhy at times. I can't recall a President who never stepped in it though Reagan was probably the best at avoiding that. But I can't find anything President Trump has ever said or done that justifies that total and utter contempt, disrespect, and hatred directed at him by those who do not support any part of his agenda.

Will you be the first to do show me that?

 

[AlbqOwl]

Are you denying Trump was a key figure in the racist birther movement for years?

Nope. I think he was genuinely curious as to what Obama was trying to hide as many of us were. But he never said once that Obama was unequivocably a Muslim or was born in Kenya. He just set out to find the truth. If I had Donald Trump's resources, I might easily have done the same just to see if I could get that birth certificate or other records that Obama so long refused to release.

But since that was not an issue of the campaign or his Presidency, why all the hatred, angst, contempt, disrespect now?

 

[Northern Light]

The topic of the thread is not what I am. I, however, majored in journalism and communications and know with 100% certainty what 'spin' is. And something presented as something it is not is one of several definitions of 'spin'. I am on very solid ground in that regard and in this context.

I only fault the answers that confirm the premise of the OP. Now you can either support your answers with reason, logic, and/or evidence/facts in their full context, or you are just another hater who spouts the spin, the contempt, the disrespect, the anger, the hatred even though you cannot find the words or evidence to justify it.

I don't care what your education is in, and neither should you if this topic is "not about you". You asked for people's opinions and then when I gave you one, you've come back accusing me of failed logic or failure to provide evidence. It seems your main interest here is in corralling the topic into what suits you, rather than letting people give you their answers.

The President is unqualified and mean. That's why people dislike him. How do I know this? Because I have eyes and ears, I studied politics in my undergrad, and I'm capable of making a realpolitik assessment without listening to the news. Anyone can run for President, but not everyone should. He falls into this category. He got elected based on personal qualities and political trends that should not be factors in electing a President to the most powerful nation on Earth. Trump has not done anything to warrant him being an important President, whether it's a scandal, a successful or failed policy. When he leaves office the only mark he will leave is being a reality TV President. We have had worse Presidents.

Trump is ironically a GOP creation. They used Fox news to warp the GOP base into an irrational, Obama-hating regime. When the base then indicated they'd vote for someone whose entire platform was a hate-on for the establishment and anything left wing, the GOP begged them not to vote for him -- but they did anyway. Their whole plan backfired and now we have at minimum 4 years of embarrassment to show for it.

Trump is a result of the GOP's, and to some extent America's in general, identity crisis. He is hated because he represents our own confusion, and because he's unqualified and mean.

 

[Unitedwestand13]

I know all that.

The question though is why? It is a question that isn't answered via more insults and sound bites. It is a question I would like an honest answer based on a verifiable fact illustrated and linked in its full context.

I would be the first to say that the President is sometimes out of line, wrong, mistaken, even cringeworhy at times. I can't recall a President who never stepped in it though Reagan was probably the best at avoiding that. But I can't find anything President Trump has ever said or done that justifies that total and utter contempt, disrespect, and hatred directed at him by those who do not support any part of his agenda.

Will you be the first to do show me that?

Because trump is destroying the institutions of our country, he is tarnishing the reputations of our government and is undermining the fundamental nature of our democratic government. He is morally abhorrent and unprincipled.

 

[AlbqOwl]

thats what I suspected just a thread to try to defend trump. trump started the birther thing in 2010 and you dont remember it? Trump makes no apologies for his birther past - POLITICO trump is a racist pandering scum.

Okay. Thank you for showing up to reinforce the OP. Maybe somebody, anybody will actually be able to show me something that justifies the hatred, contempt, disrespect for the President. I accept that somebody won't be you.

 

[Goshin]

I see it. I recognize it. It is prevalent everywhere--among the Democrats in Congress and some Republicans, in the mainstream media, on social media, on message boards, etc. The President is stupid, ugly, hateful, racist, bigoted, sexist, inappropriate, arrogant, dangerous, etc. etc. etc. etc.

I get it.

But where is that coming from really?

Do all those people really believe Hillary was the better choice and think if they can destroy Trump they'll get somebody they can approve of? Or are they too partisan to see any positives in any conservative?

Do they get some kind of emotional satisfaction in singling out somebody to hate? Is using ugly imagery or 'clever' derogatory terms to describe him recreation for them?

Do they think they look smart by dismissing all evidence to the contrary and continuing to recite the talking points to describe him as terrible, unacceptable even when it is intellectually dishonest to do so?

Do they have no sense of justice or fair play when they are unwilling to acknowledge what was actually said or done and instead spin the accurate statement/situation into something they can attack?

Is it impossible for them to see it any other way than from a highly prejudiced and biased leftist point of view?

Is it so impossible to support his idea or work with him to accomplish something good? How do rational people deal with such obvious fear that he might get credit for something good?

And finally. . .

Is it possible to have a discussion about this in a civil, intelligent, philosophical manner that isn't derailed and destroyed by sound bites and other trollish methods?

So from your best rational perspective, what is behind the hatred of President Donald J. Trump?

Every conservative president, since I started paying attention in the 70s, has drawn a significant amount of unreasoning hate from the opposition.

The Trump-hate though, has just been beyond belief. Some of the things said about him are literally insane, as well as unfounded. The hysteria and orgy of hate from the left has been quite astonishing.


Granted, he brings a lot of it on himself. He has a tendency to just say whatever he thinks instead of parsing his words cautiously and scouring them for anything that might be misconstrued or used against him... as many conservative politicians have discovered to be a survival skill. He's got a big mouth and and a faulty regulator.

And you can't expect the left to be reasonable about a conservative in the WH. Apparently... no sign of it for decades that I've noticed anyway.


But STILL.... the hysterical hate-on has just been stunningly over the top. He's kind of a dick sometimes and history probably won't smile on him, but he's not THAT bad. He's not Hitler, as one of the favorite comparisons go.


I think a lot of it is because most on the Left were so sure Hillary would beat Trump in a landslide that they're still stuck in wounded-disbelief mode. We're still dealing with people who feel like car battery cables are hooked to their nipples and their drink is full of ground up glass, because "Hillary was supposed to win dammit! This CAN'T be right!! Trump MUST have cheated!!!"


That's a lot of it I think... along with the usual Left desire to destroy any Republican Prez, which seems to get worse and more shrill every go-round...

 

[katzgar]

Okay. Thank you for showing up to reinforce the OP. Maybe somebody, anybody will actually be able to show me something that justifies the hatred, contempt, disrespect for the President. I accept that somebody won't be you.

birthers just keep on creating their own pretend world. the rest of us know what trump is

 

[ecofarm]

Nope. I think he was genuinely curious as to what Obama was trying to hide as many of us were. But he never said once that Obama was unequivocably a Muslim or was born in Kenya. He just set out to find the truth. If I had Donald Trump's resources, I might easily have done the same just to see if I could get that birth certificate or other records that Obama so long refused to release.

But since that was not an issue of the campaign or his Presidency, why all the hatred, angst, contempt, disrespect now?

Obama released his birth certificate before his election. Birtherism is racist garbage.

 

[Greenbeard]

Nope. I think he was genuinely curious as to what Obama was trying to hide as many of us were. But he never said once that Obama was unequivocably a Muslim or was born in Kenya. He just set out to find the truth. If I had Donald Trump's resources, I might easily have done the same just to see if I could get that birth certificate or other records that Obama so long refused to release.

But since that was not an issue of the campaign or his Presidency, why all the hatred, angst, contempt, disrespect now?

You might have easily done the same? Well there's your problem.

I think you need to step back from Trump and investigate more basic questions about the human condition. Like: what do people have against racism, sexual assault, Nazis, bullies, etc? Until you understand why those things set people off, you're definitely not going to understand what people have against Trump.

 

[AlbqOwl]

I don't care what your education is in, and neither should you if this topic is "not about you". You asked for people's opinions and then when I gave you one, you've come back accusing me of failed logic or failure to provide evidence. It seems your main interest here is in corralling the topic into what suits you, rather than letting people give you their answers.

The President is unqualified and mean. That's why people dislike him. How do I know this? Because I have eyes and ears, I studied politics in my undergrad, and I'm capable of making a realpolitik assessment without listening to the news. Anyone can run for President, but not everyone should. He falls into this category. He got elected based on personal qualities and political trends that should not be factors in electing a President to the most powerful nation on Earth. Trump has not done anything to warrant him being an important President, whether it's a scandal, a successful or failed policy. When he leaves office the only mark he will leave is being a reality TV President. We have had worse Presidents.

Trump is ironically a GOP creation. They used Fox news to warp the GOP base into an irrational, Obama-hating regime. When the base then indicated they'd vote for someone whose entire platform was a hate-on for the establishment and anything left wing, the GOP begged them not to vote for him -- but they did anyway. Their whole plan backfired and now we have at minimum 4 years of embarrassment to show for it.

Trump is a result of the GOP's, and to some extent America's in general, identity crisis. He is hated because he represents our own confusion, and because he's unqualified and mean.

I cited my education only to support my reasonable authority to define and recognize 'spin' when I see it. You accused me of not knowing what spin is or something akin to that. I didn't go back to re-read the exact post.

Otherwise, again I get it. You don't like Trump. You hold him in contempt. You think he is mean, evil, racist, bigoted or add in any of the other ugly adjectives used by the left. I fully understand that.

But so far you have given me one example of how he was bad or wrong. And I asked you if that one example was justification to hold a person in contempt, to disrespect him, to hate everything about him in everything for all time? Do you hold any other person on Earth to that kind of standard?

Or do you have any honest evidence to show us that he is the terrible person you describe?

 

[AlbqOwl]

Obama released his birth certificate before his election. Birtherism is racist garbage.

Perhaps except for the racist part. John McCain and Ted Cruz were both questioned on their credentials to be President. They both had to go to court to settle the matter. Was it racist to question them? If not, then what makes it racist to question Obama? Or is it racist for those who see Obama as a BLACK MAN and therefore he cannot be questioned?

Regardless, the President is not a birther now. He went fully on the record to state unequivocably that he is satisfied that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii and is a U.S. citizen.

So what specifically justifies the total contempt, disrespect, hatred of President Trump?

Those who don't like him keep telling us what a liar, hatemonger, sexist, racist, incompetent, stupid, hateful, etc. etc. etc. person he is.

But so far, nobody can show me anything substantive of why those opinions are justified.

Is it too unreasonable to ask for substance to justify an opinion?

Or is it that those on the left are just morally superior, nicer people, with pure motives and therefore whatever opinion they hold about somebody should just be accepted and never questioned?

 

[iguanaman]

I get it that the left were bitterly disappoint when Trump won. I felt the same way when Obama won the second time. In the first term, I gave him the full benefit of the doubt until he proved he didn't deserve my support. And then I was so hopeful we would get Romney who I didn't like all that much but who I still believe would have started turning things around and would have done some good things for the country. So I was bitterly disappointed when Obama won re-election after giving us so many reasons that he shouldn't be re-elected. I understand the disappointment. But I have tried hard never to criticize President Obama for anything he didn't actually do. I have defended President Obama when I thought people on the right were being hatefully cruel and/or accused him of something he didn't deserve.

And for the left, Trump wasn't supposed to happen. The pollsters had assured them it wasn't going to happen. It was Hillary's turn. Many didn't like her all that much but at least she was one of THEM. And it was taken away from her. And them. I appreciate that.

But I don't understand people who would rather see the country fail than to help President Trump get anything done. Who target him for some of the most hateful and dishonest attacks I have EVER seen launched against a person.

I do not understand that kind of hatred.

Sadly the only people hoping for this country to fail are Trump supporters. Bannon says so daily. The reason Trump cannot getting anything done is 2 fold. First Trump is his own worst enemy but more importantly what he has promised his clan is IMPOSSIBLE to achieve. No one can turn America back to when it was 80% white, ending NAFTA would collapse the economies of BOTH our neighbors and be disastrous here too. Virtually nothing Trump has promised is at all practical or logical. You were duped by a conman and are too proud to admit it. It is also ironic that you rail against attacks on Trump when most of his supporters think that best thing he has done was to piss off his detractors. You don't swoon over how upset most of us get when Trump behaves like ...Trump? I bet you get a kick out of it too.

 

[AlbqOwl]

You might have easily done the same? Well there's your problem.

I think you need to step back from Trump and investigate more basic questions about the human condition. Like: what do people have against racism, sexual assault, Nazis, bullies, etc? Until you understand why those things set people off, you're definitely not going to understand what people have against Trump.

I'm giving you every chance to explain what you have against Trump. I'm begging people to come up with specifics--something that actually disqualifies him for the position he holds and/or justifies the opinions about him they hold.

So far all I have had is the same talking points repeated over and over and over by the anti-Trump people plus several ugly shots taken at me, but so far nobody has chosen to explain what justifies all that criticism.

 

[katzgar]

Perhaps except for the racist part. John McCain and Ted Cruz were both questioned on their credentials to be President. They both had to go to court to settle the matter. Was it racist to question them? If not, then what makes it racist to question Obama? Or is it racist for those who see Obama as a BLACK MAN and therefore he cannot be questioned?

Regardless, the President is not a birther now. He went fully on the record to state unequivocably that he is satisfied that Barack Obama was born in Hawaii and is a U.S. citizen.

So what specifically justifies the total contempt, disrespect, hatred of President Trump?

Those who don't like him keep telling us what a liar, hatemonger, sexist, racist, incompetent, stupid, hateful, etc. etc. etc. person he is.

But so far, nobody can show me anything substantive of why those opinions are justified.

Is it too unreasonable to ask for substance to justify an opinion?

Or is it that those on the left are just morally superior, nicer people, with pure motives and therefore whatever opinion they hold about somebody should just be accepted and never questioned?

It is obvious that the only reason Trump went with the birther thing was to Pander to the uneducated lower class. Presidents have been confirmed as being American citizens for decades and decades by the elections commission but this is only something educated people know. Trump Pander to the racists and Trump Pandered to the uneducated in our society.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Sadly the only people hoping for this country to fail are Trump supporters. Bannon says so daily. The reason Trump cannot getting anything done is 2 fold. First Trump is his own worst enemy but more importantly what he has promised his clan is IMPOSSIBLE to achieve. No one can turn America back to when it was 80% white, ending NAFTA would collapse the economies of BOTH our neighbors and be disastrous here too. Virtually nothing Trump has promised is at all practical or logical. You were duped by a con and are too proud to admit it. It is also ironic that you rail against attacks on Trump when most of his supporter think that best thing he has done was to piss off his detractors. You don't swoon over how upset most of us get when Trump behaves like ...Trump? I bet you get a kick out of it too.

Okay you've taken your shots at me and repeated a lot of the assigned talking points yet again.

But once, more what has he specifically done or said that justifies the criticisms sufficiently for all the vitrol, disrespect, contempt, and hatred of the man? And again I want the evidence in its full context and as it was specifically said/delivered/done and not how the media and/or message boards, etc. have spun it.

 

[<alt>doxygen]

Yes, all those are the talking points and spin the anti-Trump people are putting out there. I don't disagree that is what many across the land are saying. What many at DP say. What several on this thread are saying or probably will say.

The question is not what the anti-Trump people are saying.

The question is why are they saying it? What is the basis for the anger? The disrespect? The contempt? The accusations? And for some the pure hatred? Give me something to go on here. What specifically has he done that supports your opinion of him? Give me evidence that his appointees are robbing or destroying the departments they oversee. He had one department head caught with his hand in the cookie jar, i.e. wasting the taxpayer's money, and that person was immediately sent packing.

So what justification do you have for your opinion? THAT is what this thread is about.

So you dismiss my reasons as anti_Trump spin, and ask me again for reasons?

How about you give us a list of the things he's done or is trying to do that make you want to support him? And no I don't want a link to the WH compiled list of his "accomplishments".