[W:532]Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

[jamesbyoung]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Put in jail for tax evasion and lying. Manafort was jailed for process crimes concerning the Russian collusion allegation.

The judge laughed the idea of a "process crime" out of court for either Stone or Manafort.,

 

[iguanaman]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Russia wasn't the only foreign country which meddled in the American 2016 election. A Ukrainian court admitted the Ukraine also meddled in the American 2016 election by leaking payments between the formerly-ousted president of the Ukraine V. Yanukovych and Manafort.
Ukrainian Officials Meddled in 2016 Election by Leaking Secret Manafort Ledger, Court Says

That ruling was purely propaganda to smooth out the relationship with Trump. We have a cooperation agreement with Ukraine and the "leak" that sunk Manafort was Ukraine complying with it. Are you saying that complying with existing agreements is meddling? Manfort was hated in Ukraine for very good reasons too. He was the scum that was paid to do Putin's bidding. You should be asking yourself why Trump chose Manafort as his campaign manager instead of why Ukraine wanted to unmask Manafort.

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Manafort and Stone have always been great business associates, as thick as thieves.

You think that's any where close to proof of their guilt? Why don't you look up the word infer?

Using your inference, wouldn't the gang of four be socialist spies?

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Anyone insists that Ukraine interfered and Russia did not should be registered as a foreign agent working for another nation,

No one that I know of insists only the Ukraine meddled in the 2016 election.

What bothers me is there are those who insist Russia was the only foreign interferer in the 2016 election and places the tag of Putin's friend on anyone who disagrees that Russia didn't solely interfere.
Why is that?

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

The judge laughed the idea of a "process crime" out of court for either Stone or Manafort.,

Since neither Stone nor Manafort was convicted and sentenced with colluding with Russians to interfere in the 2016 election, Stone and Manafort was convicted of process crimes. Manafort, for one, lied about his income to the IRS and Stone just lied.

 

[charliebrown]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

That quote can actually come back to haunt those who seek a successful impeachment.

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

That ruling was purely propaganda to smooth out the relationship with Trump. We have a cooperation agreement with Ukraine and the "leak" that sunk Manafort was Ukraine complying with it. Are you saying that complying with existing agreements is meddling? Manfort was hated in Ukraine for very good reasons too. He was the scum that was paid to do Putin's bidding. You should be asking yourself why Trump chose Manafort as his campaign manager instead of why Ukraine wanted to unmask Manafort.

The Ukraine meddling in the 2016 election against the Trump campaign, yes. The information leaked from the Ukraine was, among other things, that Trump's campaign manager at that time, Manafort, had received income from a Ukrainian oligarch Viktor F. Yanukovych (which Manafort, supposedly, hadn't reported to the IRS).
Who Is Viktor Yanukovych And What's His Connection To Paul Manafort? | HuffPost

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

That quote can actually come back to haunt those who seek a successful impeachment.

Which quote?

 

[jamesbyoung]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Since neither Stone nor Manafort was convicted and sentenced with colluding with Russians to interfere in the 2016 election, Stone and Manafort was convicted of process crimes. Manafort, for one, lied about his income to the IRS and Stone just lied.

There is no such thing, cabse5. You are simply being silly.

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

There is no such thibng, cabse5. You are simply being silly.

Process crimes are crimes you commit but that authorities don't have a warrant for. In other words, if authorities don't have a warrant against you, you can't be charged with the process crimes. Which is why it is vital that there is probable cause for warrants (which there wasn't with the Mueller investigation).

For example, if you are charged with colluding with Russians but, instead, are charged with lying to federal officials, you are charged with a process crime. Also, if there wasn't a warrant for you for colluding with Russians, you wouldn't be charged with process crimes of lying to federal officials, for example.

 

[jamesbyoung]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Which quote?

Tell charliebrown that there has been a successful impeachment, so . . . Merry Impeachmas!

 

[jamesbyoung]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Process crimes are crimes you commit but that authorities don't have a warrant for. In other words, if authorities don't have a warrant against you, you can't be charged with the process crimes. Which is why it is vital that there is probable cause for warrants (which there wasn't with the Mueller investigation).

For example, if you are charged with colluding with Russians but, instead, are charged with lying to federal officials, you are charged with a process crime. Also, if there wasn't a warrant for you for colluding with Russians, you wouldn't be charged with process crimes of lying to federal officials, for example.

Are you mental? Any crime that is detected in an investigation is a crime fair and square. You don't get a pass if someone doing an investigation for you for robbery happens to pick up a rock and finds a body. It's a crime, period.

Cabse5, where did you go to school?

 

[iguanaman]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

The Ukraine meddling in the 2016 election against the Trump campaign, yes. The information leaked from the Ukraine was, among other things, that Trump's campaign manager at that time, Manafort, had received income from a Ukrainian oligarch Viktor F. Yanukovych (which Manafort, supposedly, hadn't reported to the IRS).
Who Is Viktor Yanukovych And What's His Connection To Paul Manafort? | HuffPost

So what made Trump choose Manafort? Surely there was someone available that wasn't in the employ of Vladimir Putin?

 

[jamesbyoung]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

So Ukrainian officials were reporting illegal activities by Trump's campaign manager, Manafort, on behalf of the campaign.

If they were reporting to the US legal authorities, good on them.

 

[charliebrown]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Which quote?

Sorry about that cabse5, the quote in the original post.

 

[trouble13]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Are you mental? Any crime that is detected in an investigation is a crime fair and square. You don't get a pass if someone doing an investigation for you for robbery happens to pick up a rock and finds a body. It's a crime, period.

Cabse5, where did you go to school?

Your both part wrong and part right.
If the police come to your house with a warrant to look for a stollen car and they find a bag of drugs in your dresser drawer, you cant be charged for that because the cop had no reasonable cause to look for a car in your dresser draw.
However if the police are there looking for drugs snd find a stollen car in your garage, you can be charged for that even though thats not what the warrant was for.
The circumstances of how the evidence was found determines if its prosecutable or not.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Sen. Lindsey Graham (R-S.C.) on Tuesday said he's "1,000 percent confident" Russia was responsible for hacking the Democratic National Committee (DNC) as part of an effort to interfere in the 2016 election, dismissing the theory that Ukraine played a role in the breach.....


"I have no evidence [Ukraine] did. Russia stole the emails, not the Ukraine," he added.

Asked about whether Trump was muddying his defense by pushing the claim, Graham said he thinks it's "always wrong to say things that can't be proven."

Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC | TheHill

Wow, even Graham shreds the latest "defense" of trump. to be clear, its not news that the "Ukrainians did it" was a lie. We've always known that. Its news that he's actually saying it.

For what it's worth and SIAP, Graham agreeing Russia hacked the DNC emails is not Graham agreeing that only Russia interfered in the 2016 election as your OP postulates after Graham's quote.

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Your both part wrong and part right.
If the police come to your house with a warrant to look for a stollen car and they find a bag of drugs in your dresser drawer, you cant be charged for that because the cop had no reasonable cause to look for a car in your dresser draw.
However if the police are there looking for drugs snd find a stollen car in your garage, you can be charged for that even though thats not what the warrant was for.
The circumstances of how the evidence was found determines if its prosecutable or not.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

I agree with that. However, there was never any defining warrant issued by/to the the Mueller investigation, just 'stein's proclamation, and it seems, a 'bar conversation', the firing of Comey, and the Steele Dossier, for examples, were used as probable cause of 'guilt' in the Mueller investigation. IMO, the special counsel statue should die an ignominious death. Too much power granted to the special counsel.

 

[trouble13]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

I agree with that. However, there was never any defining warrant issued by/to the the Mueller investigation, just 'stein's proclamation, and it seems, a 'bar conversation', the firing of Comey, and the Steele Dossier, for examples, were used as probable cause of 'guilt' in the Mueller investigation. IMO, the special counsel statue should die an ignominious death. Too much power granted to the special counsel.

I have not looked into the circumstances of how they obtained the evidence they got. It may of been collected illegally but if it was, the defense should of argued that point.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Your both part wrong and part right.
If the police come to your house with a warrant to look for a stollen car and they find a bag of drugs in your dresser drawer, you cant be charged for that because the cop had no reasonable cause to look for a car in your dresser draw.
However if the police are there looking for drugs snd find a stollen car in your garage, you can be charged for that even though thats not what the warrant was for.
The circumstances of how the evidence was found determines if its prosecutable or not.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

Of course in the case of the FBI's investigation of the Trump campaign, warrants were received after misleading the FISA Court.

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

I have not looked into the circumstances of how they obtained the evidence they got. It may of been collected illegally but if it was, the defense should of argued that point.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

In the special counsel investigation, did the defense have a chance to argue the point? Did, for example, Cohen, Trump's personal attorney have a chance to argue the point of privilige between attorney and client? I know Cohen voiced those concerns as Mueller was riffling his offices of Trump memorabilia.

 

[NWRatCon]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Are you mental? Any crime that is detected in an investigation is a crime fair and square. You don't get a pass if someone doing an investigation for you for robbery happens to pick up a rock and finds a body. It's a crime, period.

Cabse5, where did you go to school?

Objection! Assumes a fact not in evidence....

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Are you mental? Any crime that is detected in an investigation is a crime fair and square. You don't get a pass if someone doing an investigation for you for robbery happens to pick up a rock and finds a body. It's a crime, period.

Cabse5, where did you go to school?

If that were the case, why are the parameters of the search warrant specified by the searcher and agreed to by the judge? Why doesn't the warrant just say, we think you're guilty and we're gonna search?

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

Your both part wrong and part right.
If the police come to your house with a warrant to look for a stollen car and they find a bag of drugs in your dresser drawer, you cant be charged for that because the cop had no reasonable cause to look for a car in your dresser draw.
However if the police are there looking for drugs snd find a stollen car in your garage, you can be charged for that even though thats not what the warrant was for.
The circumstances of how the evidence was found determines if its prosecutable or not.

Sent from my SM-G965U using Tapatalk

You agree with me that the warrant has to carried out fully and logically to garner arrests but a warrant that isn't carried out fully and logically won't garner any arrests.

Do you know what a process crime is? Those are the crimes of which Trump campaign workers and hangers-on were convicted and jailed.

 

[cabse5]

Re: Graham says he's '1,000 percent confident' Russia, not Ukraine, hacked DNC

So what made Trump choose Manafort? Surely there was someone available that wasn't in the employ of Vladimir Putin?

Manafort was in the employ of V. Yanukovych, a former president of the Ukraine and head of Burisma Holdings. BTW, the Ukraine hates Russia, is the closest hating nation to Russia and the Crimea used to be part of The Ukraine but was swallowed up by Russia.