[W:411]Proof of Trump Causing Unnecessary Covid-19 Deaths

[JMaximus]

We started social distancing 9 weeks after out first reported infection. That is the responsibility of the president ...

But is it, really?

Is it really the responsibility - or even within the authority - of the US President to decree by Executive Order that people cannot gather in groups or even get closer than a few feet from one another?

 

[Bullseye]

You have yet to prove what those statistics actually conclude in terms of your "verifiable results around the world especially in those liberal utopian countries the left would like this country to be like.". Drawing unsupported conclusions is poor form, and does little for your credibility. Germany has a mixed private/universal healthcare system, and South Korea has a universal healthcare system and both have a lower mortality rate than the US. What conclusions do you draw from those "results"?

Comparing Korea to the US is sketchy, at best. It's far more densely populated and geographically tiny - the entire country comprise less the one-fourth of California's area with about ten million more people; mostly in four large population centers. The did a good job, granted.

 

[Bullseye]

Most every country started getting infections at mid January. South Korea and Germany started testing within 1-2 weeks. We started testing mid March, 9 weeks after the first infection is Washington.

I heard this morning that the U.S. is ranked about 130th in the world regarding deaths per capita. I could not find a chart that shows that. Nonetheless, below is a chart with the worst 10 countries in the world with deaths per capita to the virus. The U.S. is #7

View attachment 67281219

Factor NY, NJ, MA out and how does it look?

 

[ElChupacabra]

Comparing Korea to the US is sketchy, at best. It's far more densely populated and geographically tiny - the entire country comprise less the one-fourth of California's area with about ten million more people; mostly in four large population centers. The did a good job, granted.

Clearly there are differences between the two countries in terms of population sizes and urban centers, but in that comparison it's a question of whether the US would have been able to scale to the degree urban centers were the focus versus the entire population; especially early on. Seoul is comparable in size to some of our large cities. My response was to the erroneous claims made regarding a poster's mortality rate conclusions.

 

[Bullseye]

You are attacking the messenger. This was a study done by Columbia University and if you have a problem with their findings, take it up with them.

Bottom line is that Trump was 100% responsible for the delay in addressing the issue. When Germany and South Korea are studied, they started social distancing within 2 weeks of the first corona virus infection. We started social distancing 9 weeks after out first reported infection. That is the responsibility of the president and it not something you can throw bias accusations at. It is simply fact. The fact that you refuse to accept it, is your problem. You do not want to make Trump responsible for anything but facts and numbers don't lie. As such, you refusal to accept facts, is totally on you.

It is not surprising though, given your track record of defending Trump no matter what. You are the man of a thousand-excuses-for-Trump. He is not guilty or responsible for anything. Everyone else is to blame. Reality begone.

Yet, when Trump claimed he had the authority to dictate closure to the states all you lefties screamed like scalded cats that it was the state governors who had the authority. Same thing you guys are arguing about opening up.

 

[Bullseye]

You cannot get away from this simple fact:

View attachment 67281221

We were supposed to be the best and we are not. Trump is the reason.

Lies, damn lies, and statistics. :lamo

 

[Conservative]

Again. It's easier when the graphs are all going up when you take charge. I'd like to know however where the concept of the worst recovery from a depression in modern history sprang from with a few facts rather than an assertion. What depressions in modern history are your using for reference.

May I also assume that we are incorporating the present state of the economy in all of these statistics? It would be a shame otherwise to claim all the credit without at the same time accepting some of the blame.

NO, it isn't easier, it is tougher. Do you have any Private sector experience? Stunning how loyal people are to liberal ideology but never seeing any liberal results, why?

 

[Conservative]

My focus is on the statistics that you seem to feel tell so much - like the 40 million unemployed and over 93,000 dead from the virus - both hitting within the last three months under Trumps turn at the helm.

Nothing wrong with your statistics but not much value in your analysis. The economy was shutdown due to a virus, explain how that is Trump's fault?

 

[Bullseye]

Evidently, you have not been reading any OP's that have been put here before showing Trump pooh-poohing the virus for 2 months. I suggest you take a look at the countless videos of his statements (not biased opinions).

And yet all the while he was taking actions - from late December and early Januarty he and his staff were working on it.

Impeachment distraction is pure BS. That ended in mid January before the first case of the virus occurred.

Go back on this forum to the times of impeachment and count the threads related to impeachment vs the thread about the virus. Report back.

I am sure you can invent something else to excuse Trump from his responsibility of the presidency. C'mon, you could say that Schiff was driving him crazy, or that Shumer was to blame since he should have said something. Perhaps Pelosi should have kept quiet and Trump would have been able to put his attention on the pandemic. Perhaps if the media had not said anything, Trump would have done his job. I am sure there is some excuse for his actions you can come up with. You are a resourceful man, especially with excuses for the Lord.

His team was working, even though many still didn't thing COVID was any more serious than a flu. Human to human transmission wasn't confirmed until mid-January; after the Chinese had claimed they could confirm that.

 

[haymarket]

Nothing wrong with your statistics but not much value in your analysis. The economy was shutdown due to a virus, explain how that is Trump's fault?

The numbers say it all. 40 million out of work and over 93,000 dead and climbing higher. And it all happened on Trumps watch. He takes the credit for all that is good - he has to take the blame for this too.

 

[Bullseye]

of course Trump ****ed up. what idiot doesn't know that by now?

Most idiots think that. They'd be eaten alive by their fellow Democultists if they didn't.

 

[Bullseye]

Are you trying to compare in order to excuse Trump?

The Columbia University clearly stated that if social distancing had started 1 weeks earlier, 36,000+ lives would have been spared. That is all that is needed to support the idea that Trump did not do his job well. One week! and 36.000 lives would have been spared.

You are going to explain that away with results in Europe?

And by the way, the chart I provided regarding pandemic preparedness came out in 2019 regarding our preparedness then. This is not what the previous administration left us with, it is where the U.S. was supposed to be a year ago. What happened? Trump lack of leadership is what happened.

You assume the Columbia model was anywhere near accurate. If so it would be the first COVID related model that was.

 

[Bullseye]

So in your world rhetoric is more important than results? "Pooh-poohing" the virus for two months? When was the pandemic declared and whose responsibility is it to declare a pandemic?

What was the Democratic Response to the virus in January? You blame Trump for incompetence ignoring the state and local government incompetence due to the belief in liberal rhetoric while ignoring liberal results. Looks to me based upon the world results that Trump is doing his job. Let's face it you hate Trump and offer nothing but blame to the discussion, you want to blame someone for the spread blame the failure of personal responsibility issues being handled by the people. Who is forcing you into social distancing? I keep waiting for you to give us your solution to preventing deaths in this country that Trump hasn't proposed and what is within his authority under our Constitution to provide?

Is there ever going to be a time where you focus on real issues and not liberal rhetoric and politics of personal destruction? The American people get it, they got it in the special election in California and Wisconsin as that anti Trump backlash didn't occur in either of those elections. You would willing give away your freedoms rather than take personal responsibility for your actions and that is exactly what drives the liberal ideology, dependence


5/20/2020 Cases Deaths

United States 1581903 93806 5.9%

Spain 279524 27888 10.0%

Italy 227364 32330 14.2%

England 248293 35704 14.4%

France 143845 28132 19.6%

Netherlands 44700 5775 12.9%

Canada 80142 6031 7.5%

Germany 178531 8270 4.6%

WORLD 5014943 328462 6.5%

Coronavirus (COVID-19) live map tracker from Microsoft Bing

The dems were laughing the virus off deep into February. Trump's China travel shut down was called xenophobic, racist, too hasty, etc.

 

[Bullseye]

To answer all your questions with one phrase.

The leaders of each country are the ones responsible for pandemic response. Nothing can happen in any country without the president's approval.

And, other than the US which of those countries have a federal system of government? Are you claim state and local governments can't do anything without the President's permission?

 

[Schism]

The dems were laughing the virus off deep into February. Trump's China travel shut down was called xenophobic, racist, too hasty, etc.

Democrats can't discuss policy, vision, or direction for the future, so they look for blame targets.

They've descended into a mob, and all that's left is the violence. Wait'll we see the lunacy when they lose in November.

 

[Bullseye]

Wrong, you really don't understand our Constitution as is evident here nor states' rights and responsibilities. Americans have the freedoms guaranteed, and if a citizen doesn't want to be tested or practice social distancing what is your solution?

I'd bet a considerable amount that he was one of the loudest screams when Trump tried to claim he was in charge of shutting down the states. Convenient federalism, the left's favorite mantra.

 

[Bullseye]

You are attempting to change the subject.

Here is my answer

Funny, actually more scholarly and intellectually consistent than most of your posts. Thanks.

 

[Bullseye]

Are we not supposed to be the best? Didn't Trump Make America Great Again?

Comparing a rat with a cockroach is what you are trying to do, saying that we should be happy we are rats and not cockroaches. Ever thought that both are bad and that we should attempt to be a steed, a lion, a bald eagle?

So, when we get through this and the economy starts growing at and creating jobs are you going to give Trump credit for that?

 

[Bullseye]

Why is it people who hate Trump hang on his every word so much?

Say you're a typical New Yorker. You almost certainly voted for Hillary and think Trump is an embarrassment to your state and city. Yet you wouldn't dream of socially distancing without Trump telling you to do so first.

Never mind that you have a city health dept and normally makes such recommendations. Never mind that you have a Mayor who is a lot closer to the populace than Trump. Never mind that you have a governor who also could have recommended it.

It's Trumps fault. Because Trump!

I've done my best to socially distance from Hilary. So far, so good.

 

[Bullseye]

Clearly there are differences between the two countries in terms of population sizes and urban centers, but in that comparison it's a question of whether the US would have been able to scale to the degree urban centers were the focus versus the entire population; especially early on. Seoul is comparable in size to some of our large cities. My response was to the erroneous claims made regarding a poster's mortality rate conclusions.

I don't believe the provinces of S Korea have the power and authority of our states; S Korea is far more Seoul-centric. My point was that organizing and executing a nationwide testing plan would be far easier under that system. We know when Trump tried to take national control the states pushed back seriously; rightfully, IMO. Trump beat the bushes for companies to manufacture the supplies and equipment the states needed, he signed off on the stimulus bills and kept us informed without having that information filtering through the leftwing propaganda filters. He's received praised from several governors, including Democrats for his actions.

 

[CaughtInThe]

Most idiots think that. They'd be eaten alive by their fellow Democultists if they didn't.

^ Trump foot soldier.

 

[Dayton3]

I heard this morning that the U.S.

Oh yeah. More of your type of "evidence". You are smart enough to know I hope that you can find a "study" somewhere proving nearly anything.

 

[Kushinator]

Again, you left out South Korea:

11,122 cases 264 deaths.

I wonder why that is...

J/K, I know why!

Because he's attacking a strawman, and doesn't even know what that means. He is trying to say: anyone who doesn't worship Trump believes Europe is a socialist utopia. In an attempt to tarnish the "credibility" of his strawmen, he then cherry-picks the EU countries with the highest number of deaths as a percentage of infections. That's how people who haven't made it past 8th grade argue.

 

[TypicalRussian]

What is political is who we want to lead us for the next 4 years. I do not believe Trump is competent enough to do so.

why do you think that, especially with biden

 

[avatar]

NO, it isn't easier, it is tougher. Do you have any Private sector experience? Stunning how loyal people are to liberal ideology but never seeing any liberal results, why?

Just trying to have a discussion. You win by claim of expertise. Bye.