Trump uses Defense Production Act to require GM to make ventilators

[Napoleon]

Why the hell would he pick GM? They dont even specialize in medical technology.

GM developed a partnership with ventilator manufacturer Ventec Life Systems that turned out to be a scheme to fleece taxpayers. Their original commitment of 20,000 at-cost ventilators became 7,500 ventilators for $1 billion.

 

[ClaraD]

GM is a piece of crap. Riasing the price of Ventilators from 20,000$ to 25,000$ each. When each one should cost 5-8,000$ but they have a inflated monopoly on the product. We should be tearing GM's stock prices even further into the ground and look for new honest producers.

25,000$ per ventilator during a time of crisis.....

I surely won't be buying any GM products...though I probably wouldn't anyway...since I am partial to Toyota and Ford.

 

[SheWolf]

You say "I am not going to condemn Trump for doing this"

I just want to be clear: I'm not condemning Trump for doing it. I'm not sure you were saying I was condemning him, but like I said....to be clear.. My comment was tongue-in-cheek, but I also rather meant it. He's always claimed he's this great big dealmaker. But yet again, we see that he's not. He has to invoke the law to get it done.

If he was the great negotiator, he'd have been able to get their price down and pay them. Ok, so he's doing it this way. Trouble is, the workers and customers will suffer. They just pass on the cost. The only way to stop that is price controls, but that ends badly more often than it ends well.

So yes, it's good on the one hand that we will get those ventilators, BUT it is bad that the people who shouldn't pay for it will. And that's because he's a galaxy-class dumbass, not some great negotiator.



And that Jones thing. Yeah, that was chilling. I, against my better judgment, went and listened to the recordings of him convincing his followers to do it. Just.. ****.

I agree with your statement. He says he has a great deal maker, but he is really just a bully and in the real world, he can quickly move on to the person. It isn’t like that for the president if the United States, especially not during a crisis. Who knows why he picked GM. Maybe he was offended at GM, and wanted to punish them through force of law. He isn’t a good deal maker. He is not a good president either. He is a bully and liar. I have to wait and see results.

He exaggerates and makes big promises. We still don’t have the mass drive through testing he promised.

I have read many books on many different cults. It’s funny, but it’s something that interests me.

 

[RAMOSS]

Why the hell would he pick GM? They dont even specialize in medical technology.

They have unused production that can deal with electronics in addition.

 

[Roadvirus]

Trump has finally done something right in this crisis. Shame on GM for offering help only to demand a billion dollars to retrofit their factories. Good on Trump for ordering them to shove it and eat the cost.

GM is a government tit-sucker. Absolutely useless.

 

[goodbyte]

His original tweet also had Ford in it. What happened there? Why only GM?

 

[Tbird19482]

GM is a piece of crap. Riasing the price of Ventilators from 20,000$ to 25,000$ each. When each one should cost 5-8,000$ but they have a inflated monopoly on the product. We should be tearing GM's stock prices even further into the ground and look for new honest producers.

25,000$ per ventilator during a time of crisis.....

a Monopoly is when you control the entire market and nobody else can produce your product
well GM doesn't have a monopoly on anything not even cars
They maybe trying to gouge the gov. and if they are it should be looked into
Ford is also making ventilators and if they and the other companies are charging less or the same as everybody else that is what it is
have a nice night

 

[Phys251]

On a side note, I have came to see another similarly between Rev Jim Jones, Trump, and their followers. Jones also had a clean up crew and PR team. They were called this Planning Commission/PC. They knew all of Jones' worst instincts and plans, including mass murdering the followers. The PC were the most loyal followers. They served to insulate Jones, create propaganda, and clean up his messes. Jones' followers did see a lot of his bad instincts. He even talked about mass suicide years before it happened. His followers, however, made a decision to ignore Jones' instincts and impulsive statements. Such instinctual behavior is the most revealing about the person you are following. Instead of recognizing the red flags, the followers rationalized all of his craziness... he didn't mean it, etc.

I personally talked to a Jonestown survivor, and she said, "the hardest thing about leaving a cult, is admitting you're wrong." You let a person define your worldview and reality. Once you buy in, it's hard to leave it. She wasn't totally buying into Jones in the end, but she couldn't bring herself to leave. She survived because she wasn't in Jonestown during the massacre.

A lot of good people get caught in cults. Jonestown was one example. So is Trumpworld.

 

[SheWolf]

A lot of good people get caught in cults. Jonestown was one example. So is Trumpworld.

I think Trump’s inner circle and partisan advisors function like Jim Jones’ Planning Committee/PC. They advice him to walk things back. They help him clean up. They work PR. They take papers off his desk so he doesn’t sign them. They know he is temperamentally unfit, but they are trying to get something out of him because of his power.

There were plenty of people like that in Jonestown. They knew Jones was a scam artist and faked healings. Eventually he started fake resurrections. They/the PC enabled him and furthered his scams, because they believed in everything else he stood for and promised. It was all BS, and at his core, he was a liar and scam artist. He promised heaven on earth, and a promise land in South America. Trump promised a wall, and making Mexico pay for it. He promised better healthcare than Obamacare. They are both demagogues.

I know Trump’s enablers, loyalists, and apologists know they need to stifle his natural instincts. We all know he has to contained and controlled, because at his core he is demagogue and liar.

 

[apdst]

they won't eat the cost. they'll screw their employees or vendors or pass on the cost somehow.

The unions are going to make out like bandits.

 

[dirtpoorchris]

a Monopoly is when you control the entire market and nobody else can produce your product
well GM doesn't have a monopoly on anything not even cars
They maybe trying to gouge the gov. and if they are it should be looked into
Ford is also making ventilators and if they and the other companies are charging less or the same as everybody else that is what it is
have a nice night

Bull**** if someone 3d prints a ventilator for 1,000$ GM sues them.

 

[Decypher]

Wow Trump actually did something right for once. Good on him.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Wow Trump actually did something right for once. Good on him.

No No NO...U R not allowed to say anything nice about Trump and remain in polite company.....Your peers suck this much now!

 

[ludin]

And if it's one thing we know from history, when government gets to apply some of it's "limited" powers, it tends to give those powers right back when it no longer needs them. :lol:

exactly. because government is so benevolent.

 

[ludin]

I agree with your statement. He says he has a great deal maker, but he is really just a bully and in the real world, he can quickly move on to the person. It isn’t like that for the president if the United States, especially not during a crisis. Who knows why he picked GM. Maybe he was offended at GM, and wanted to punish them through force of law. He isn’t a good deal maker. He is not a good president either. He is a bully and liar. I have to wait and see results.

He exaggerates and makes big promises. We still don’t have the mass drive through testing he promised.

I have read many books on many different cults. It’s funny, but it’s something that interests me.

this is where lack of education and the inability to educate yourself on the topic makes leftist look foolish.

the president both asked gm and ford etc to help produce ventilators. for and gm were both in the act of getting the specs etc ... to build them from various manufacturers. trump was attempting to work out a deal to pay for them.

gm wanted like 1b dollars to make them then renigged on the number. they also wanted millions of dollars up front.

the president tired of the run around with gm used his authority to just make them do it. now gm said they were making them and selling them at cost. too late for that though.

ford is not in the same boat because they are being reasonable in their approach.

 

[Drawdown]

Trump has finally done something right in this crisis. Shame on GM for offering help only to demand a billion dollars to retrofit their factories. Good on Trump for ordering them to shove it and eat the cost.

Good luck actually getting them.

 

[CaughtInThe]

The unions are going to make out like bandits.

slick. very, very slick.

 

[SheWolf]

this is where lack of education and the inability to educate yourself on the topic makes leftist look foolish.

the president both asked gm and ford etc to help produce ventilators. for and gm were both in the act of getting the specs etc ... to build them from various manufacturers. trump was attempting to work out a deal to pay for them.

gm wanted like 1b dollars to make them then renigged on the number. they also wanted millions of dollars up front.

the president tired of the run around with gm used his authority to just make them do it. now gm said they were making them and selling them at cost. too late for that though.

ford is not in the same boat because they are being reasonable in their approach.

So he couldn’t get a good deal with GM and had to use legal force. How does this prove he’s a great deal maker?

 

[apdst]

slick. very, very slick.

I can't wait for the UAW's deal to come out.

 

[CaughtInThe]

I can't wait for the UAW's deal to come out.

very slick for you change the subject away from what the company will do to "unions". it's what Sean and Rush constantly do.

you have learned well.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

GM is a piece of crap. Riasing the price of Ventilators from 20,000$ to 25,000$ each. When each one should cost 5-8,000$ but they have a inflated monopoly on the product. We should be tearing GM's stock prices even further into the ground and look for new honest producers.

25,000$ per ventilator during a time of crisis.....

A 0.25 HP electric motor to power a suction pump used in a factory costs approximately 25% of what a 0.25 HP electric motor to power a suction pump used in a hospital. The difference between them is that the one for use in the hospital has "MEDICAL" on its label and the one for use in the factory does not.

The cost of "medical grade" Oxygen is much higher than the cost of "welding grade" Oxygen and the difference is that "medical grade" Oxygen is put in cylinders that say "MEDICAL" on them while "welding grade Oxygen is put into mechanically identical cylinders which do NOT say "MEDICAL" on them.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Didn't we bail GM out a while back?

They built tanks during WW2. They can build ventilators or such now.

The government paid for the retooling and the construction of any needed additional facilities so that GM could build the tanks at a guaranteed profit during WWII. At the end of WWII, those facilities were no longer needed and so were sold off (with the people currently using them getting first crack at them). Of course, since so much stuff was being flogged as surplus the government seldom received as much as 5¢ on the dollar.

 

[TU Curmudgeon]

Why did he do this? He said we don't need that many ventilators.

Because he paid attention to the recommendations from the "Associated Ventilator And Respirator Industrial Consulting Industries Of the United States"?

 

[AliHajiSheik]

A 0.25 HP electric motor to power a suction pump used in a factory costs approximately 25% of what a 0.25 HP electric motor to power a suction pump used in a hospital. The difference between them is that the one for use in the hospital has "MEDICAL" on its label and the one for use in the factory does not.

The cost of "medical grade" Oxygen is much higher than the cost of "welding grade" Oxygen and the difference is that "medical grade" Oxygen is put in cylinders that say "MEDICAL" on them while "welding grade Oxygen is put into mechanically identical cylinders which do NOT say "MEDICAL" on them.

Oversimplification. The motor and the tank in each case is the difference. If you want to save money using a welding oxygen tank in any medical use, you will quickly learn the difference.

 

[TomFitz]

What makes anyone here actually believe that this actually amounts to anything other than Trump’s usual pattern of senseless dithering, followed by a largely senseless, but publicity grabbing stunt designed to make Trump look decisive, while hiding the fact that he dithered on this for a couple of days in the first place.

How America’s ventilator shortage became GM’s problem - Axios