Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds[W:165]

[Parrish]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

He was shot in the back for god's sake.

 

[holbritter]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Not the one in this thread do you have that one? is it in the other thread?

I'll try and find it. It was the one from overhead from the helicopter. I'd like to look at it again.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

I'll try and find it. It was the one from overhead from the helicopter. I'd like to look at it again.

ok thank you!
theres one earlier in this thread (post 18) but it doesnt seem to show anything really. The chopper is just rounding the corner and basically 1,2 seconds after you can see stephon he is being shot.

 

[holbritter]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

ok thank you!
theres one earlier in this thread (post 18) but it doesnt seem to show anything really. The chopper is just rounding the corner and basically 1,2 seconds after you can see stephon he is being shot.

Here's one. It's hard to tell exactly, but I think he is facing them when he falls?

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/30/us/stephon-clark-independent-autopsy.html

 

[holbritter]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

ok thank you!
theres one earlier in this thread (post 18) but it doesnt seem to show anything really. The chopper is just rounding the corner and basically 1,2 seconds after you can see stephon he is being shot.

Towards the end of it it seems more clear. I believe his back was to the house when the shooting started.

 

[AGENT J]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Here's one. It's hard to tell exactly, but I think he is facing them when he falls?

https://www.nytimes.com/2018/03/30/us/stephon-clark-independent-autopsy.html

I dont see his hands out at all or an object. doesnt mean they are not i just dont see any evidence on the video that is clear in anyway. when he falls he falls facing the back of the yard, you then see his arms clealry come out.

another thing that bothers me is the speed which the one cop yells gun ( i mean if you see gun you yell it i get that) but he says show me your hands (a terrible command IMO) and then yells gun so quickly seemingly before they have a real beat on him. Then they retreat for a second, why poke your head back out and give more commands if you thought there was a gun? I have zero police training but that certainly wasnt my training in home self defense. Anyway they peak back around the corner, say show me your hands again, he yells gun gun gun again and they open fire.

As for wrong doing, i guess the more that comes out the more we will know either way. Being a cop is a hard job, one that many times goes way under-praised because the good stuff is expected and taken for granted while the bad stuff is tv news. i have cops and troopers has family and friends and i want them to come home safe but there is risk with the job. Im just always gonna have some issues when things escalate this fast over (known at the time) a POSSIBLE vandal. now NONE of my LEO friends and family are the authority on all matters and NONE of them most certainly were there so they dont know for sure. But looking at everything available to us so far (havent had time to talk to them about this new info of possible shoots in the back) none of them feel the cops responded probably starting with no identification, bad commands and quick escalation. The trooper also stated, like i mentioned above, that him and his fellow trooper would NEVER identify gun then retreat, then peak again in that situation.manner these cops did (place to fall back to, outdoors, no shots fired, no victims etc) (oh and it was also brought up about their lack of proper response after he was down)

Anyway its impossible NOT to think poor training, execution of training and or faulty personnel are not at fault in many of these cases. When we have videos of people attacking the police with a knife or fighting with them and reaching for their gun or being a KNOWN murder/terrorist and NOT being killed or even shot and then we have people shot with no weapon or choked to death over misdemeanors it makes little sense. Of course NO training and conduct will ever be perfect but it seems like we have much work to do.

Im greatly in favor of body cams on all officers at all times with redundancy systems and no ability to disable them.

 

[Renae]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

I'm on the right and even to me, this shooting doesn't sound right. Hopefully they have body cam footage. If not, the forensic evidence between both coroners will be brought forth and the grand jury will either see evidence that contradicts between coroners, or evidence that confirms the forensic findings.

At this point, I don't know. But if that report (linked) is accurate. The cops are in for a world of trouble.

They have body cam footage

 

[chuckiechan]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

That doesn't bode well. They will get off anyway.

I guess I should change my tune on this shooting, when I watched the video of him running and hoping fences (still should not have done that) it wasn't as outrageous as people were making but shooting in the back is bad

I hear he was just walking down the street minding his own business and the cops shot him.

 

[chuckiechan]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Absolutely horrible. No doubt this will be brought before a grand jury and charges likely (should be) pressed. When you read the details in the article, you'll see why. I'm curious what the body cameras (hopefully available) show. Really bad.

Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Stephon Clark, the unarmed African American man whose shooting by police has caused protests and national outcry, was shot six times in the back, an independent forensic pathologist said Friday.

Dr. Bennet Omalu conducted an autopsy days after Clark was killed by police. He told reporters that his examination showed that Clark was hit by eight bullets, and all but one entered while his back was facing police.

Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Here is a link to the video. The guy was suspected of breaking into cars and was fleeing the police.
Cop #2 yelled gun and they shot him.

Top Stephon Clark shooting stories and video | The Sacramento Bee

 

[Linc]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

I hear he was just walking down the street minding his own business and the cops shot him.

The underground slime being thrown at the assassinated African American is worth noting.
These murderers are no better than any mass shooter, and the chair is too good for them.
Let them be sentenced to hard labor in a prison with every known gang ...

 

[Linc]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

How “reputable “ does one need to be to determine the front from the back?

Rhetorically shooting the messengers; the doctors; how unpredictable from these people.
And yet the cowards in the WhiteR House call this a 'local' problem, even though it continues to happen nationwide ...

 

[exoplanet]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

I can tell ya one thing, I've never had reason to run from LE nor have I ever given them reason to chase me...

Not sure why you think your personal criminal history is relevant to proper police procedure.

the things you are talking about are totally different from what this guy did...LE was in the vicinity because there were reports of someone going through the neighborhood breaking people's windows...

Not sure what you're contending here. That a deaf, impaired or inebriated person can't break a car window? That as soon as someone breaks a car window cops can start shooting at anyone that runs from them?

 

[holbritter]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

I dont see his hands out at all or an object. doesnt mean they are not i just dont see any evidence on the video that is clear in anyway. when he falls he falls facing the back of the yard, you then see his arms clealry come out.

another thing that bothers me is the speed which the one cop yells gun ( i mean if you see gun you yell it i get that) but he says show me your hands (a terrible command IMO) and then yells gun so quickly seemingly before they have a real beat on him. Then they retreat for a second, why poke your head back out and give more commands if you thought there was a gun? I have zero police training but that certainly wasnt my training in home self defense. Anyway they peak back around the corner, say show me your hands again, he yells gun gun gun again and they open fire.

As for wrong doing, i guess the more that comes out the more we will know either way. Being a cop is a hard job, one that many times goes way under-praised because the good stuff is expected and taken for granted while the bad stuff is tv news. i have cops and troopers has family and friends and i want them to come home safe but there is risk with the job. Im just always gonna have some issues when things escalate this fast over (known at the time) a POSSIBLE vandal. now NONE of my LEO friends and family are the authority on all matters and NONE of them most certainly were there so they dont know for sure. But looking at everything available to us so far (havent had time to talk to them about this new info of possible shoots in the back) none of them feel the cops responded probably starting with no identification, bad commands and quick escalation. The trooper also stated, like i mentioned above, that him and his fellow trooper would NEVER identify gun then retreat, then peak again in that situation.manner these cops did (place to fall back to, outdoors, no shots fired, no victims etc) (oh and it was also brought up about their lack of proper response after he was down)

Anyway its impossible NOT to think poor training, execution of training and or faulty personnel are not at fault in many of these cases. When we have videos of people attacking the police with a knife or fighting with them and reaching for their gun or being a KNOWN murder/terrorist and NOT being killed or even shot and then we have people shot with no weapon or choked to death over misdemeanors it makes little sense. Of course NO training and conduct will ever be perfect but it seems like we have much work to do.

Im greatly in favor of body cams on all officers at all times with redundancy systems and no ability to disable them.

Yes, the 'show me your hands' was a very poor choice, imo. This case is clearly one that should never have gone this far. As you said, escalating this fast over vandalism is questionable at best. It's also odd that a helicopter would be involved in such a police call as well.

I also see him fall forward into the backyard. Which is why I don't understand how he can be shot in the back? I'm not seeing something, or he wasn't shot in the back.

 

[Hawkeye10]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Yes, the 'show me your hands' was a very poor choice, imo. This case is clearly one that should never have gone this far. As you said, escalating this fast over vandalism is questionable at best. It's also odd that a helicopter would be involved in such a police call as well.

I also see him fall forward into the backyard. Which is why I don't understand how he can be shot in the back? I'm not seeing something, or he wasn't shot in the back.

That....and why would we be looking at bullet holes on a body to figure out what happened when we have the videos?

But notice if you will how such an idea never occurs to these so-called journalists.

That is how much they suck now.

 

[Daisy]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Not sure why you think your personal criminal history is relevant to proper police procedure.
Not sure what you're contending here. That a deaf, impaired or inebriated person can't break a car window? That as soon as someone breaks a car window cops can start shooting at anyone that runs from them?

Because you went there first with my personal criminal history to begin with, not me...your arguments are irrelevant to this situation of a thug out to deliberately break the law...that's why...stick to the subject...

And it wasn't "as soon as someone breaks a car window"...he was running through the neighborhood to escape police...

 

[Thoreau72]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Absolutely horrible. No doubt this will be brought before a grand jury and charges likely (should be) pressed. When you read the details in the article, you'll see why. I'm curious what the body cameras (hopefully available) show. Really bad.

Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Stephon Clark, the unarmed African American man whose shooting by police has caused protests and national outcry, was shot six times in the back, an independent forensic pathologist said Friday.

Dr. Bennet Omalu conducted an autopsy days after Clark was killed by police. He told reporters that his examination showed that Clark was hit by eight bullets, and all but one entered while his back was facing police.

Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

And the cops scratch their heads trying to understand why they are so frequently despised and feared.....

 

[Fenton]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

I don't know. I think it would be hard to disguise entry and exit wounds to a FP. Seen a few of them myself.

Concussion Movie Subject Exaggerated Role, Researcher Say

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.apnews.com/amp/00e9b68e26e649118f4f4279e7455d1c

Concussion Pathologist Says Hillary May Have Been Poisoned

https://www.google.com/amp/thehill....ogist-says-clinton-may-have-been-poisoned?amp

There is something wrong with Omalu, seriously, he's a little nutty.
He claimed Hillary was being poisoned and he claims to be the first to discover and name the disease CTE

Im not defending the cops, but Omalu's credibility should be in question here.

 

[Thoreau72]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Because you went there first with my personal criminal history to begin with, not me...your arguments are irrelevant to this situation of a thug out to deliberately break the law...that's why...stick to the subject...

And it wasn't "as soon as someone breaks a car window"...he was running through the neighborhood to escape police...

It is a natural reaction for some people to run when the cops arrive, especially with a helicopter spotlight being shined on you.

The video reminded me of chasing and treeing raccoons.

My fine upstanding young nephew also ran from the police as they arrived at an early evening beer keg party. He was underage at the time. It's not the right thing to do, but it is a natural reaction for many.

 

[Daisy]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

It is a natural reaction for some people to run when the cops arrive, especially with a helicopter spotlight being shined on you.

The video reminded me of chasing and treeing raccoons.

My fine upstanding young nephew also ran from the police as they arrived at an early evening beer keg party. He was underage at the time. It's not the right thing to do, but it is a natural reaction for many.

Well, yeah, exactly...if you are doing something wrong, you run...that was my point...the cops know that...everyone knows that...

 

[Thoreau72]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Well, yeah, exactly...if you are doing something wrong, you run...that was my point...the cops know that...everyone knows that...

Good point. I will say that just as many humans have confessed to crimes that they did not actually commit (Central Park Five), my bet is that many humans will flee under those conditions.

 

[chuckiechan]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

The underground slime being thrown at the assassinated African American is worth noting.
These murderers are no better than any mass shooter, and the chair is too good for them.
Let them be sentenced to hard labor in a prison with every known gang ...

If you watched the video, he was running from the police through several back yards. Now I agree he should not have died but then you leave the offices with the choice of:
Let him go
Tell him to stop and ignore him when he doesn't
Since we can see on infrared what was happening, the police were in the dark.
The office that yelled "gun" is the one that caused the shooting. When a cop yells "gun" everyone starts firing like opening day of duck season.
Just what are cops supposed to do then subjects elude and won't cooperate?

Can you find any fault with the guy that was shot?

 

[exoplanet]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Because you went there first with my personal criminal history to begin with, not me...your arguments are irrelevant to this situation of a thug out to deliberately break the law...that's why...stick to the subject...

Well, you seemed to have this theory about criminal behavior (small crimes lead to big crimes) that was pretty absurd. I just used you as an example, to show you how your theory made no sense. It's called reducto ad absurdium. By continuing to insist that despite possible small crimes you are a good citizen, only weakens your original argument.

Once again, why do you consider him a "thug"? This word is generally reserved for notably violent criminals. It seems like you feel the need to distort who he was as a person.

And it wasn't "as soon as someone breaks a car window"...he was running through the neighborhood to escape police...

Ok, so there is certain distance they have to run before we can shoot them? You're not defining what you think is acceptable in any intelligible way.

Generally speaking, police are not supposed to shoot a fleeing suspect unless they present some kind of immediate danger to them or the community. Someone who had just shot someone for example. The cop who killed a fleeing Walter Scott went to prison.

Breaking a car window is not a danger to the community. Running from the police is not a danger to the community. So I'm not sure how you can possibly justify killing someone.

 

[calamity]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Absolutely horrible. No doubt this will be brought before a grand jury and charges likely (should be) pressed. When you read the details in the article, you'll see why. I'm curious what the body cameras (hopefully available) show. Really bad.

Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Stephon Clark, the unarmed African American man whose shooting by police has caused protests and national outcry, was shot six times in the back, an independent forensic pathologist said Friday.

Dr. Bennet Omalu conducted an autopsy days after Clark was killed by police. He told reporters that his examination showed that Clark was hit by eight bullets, and all but one entered while his back was facing police.

Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

Several possible explanations:

1. He spun around after being shot once, and the remaining bullets entered more or less from behind

2. Bogus autopsy finding

3. Cops blasted him as he tried to run, again.


IMO, this guy is a terrible martyr. Once again, the SJW picked a guy who was a career criminal. I'm not suggesting that he deserved to be killed, but eliminating him from society before he began committing serious crimes and wreaked even more havoc in his environment is certainly not something I'm against. And, I suspect enough people feel like I do that not much sympathy will be bestowed upon him.

 

[ThoughtEx.]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

I believe this mans fifth and second amendment rights were violated.

Let me spell out what I mean for the slow kids in the back of the class.

The possession of a gun, is not a crime. If he had had a gun, until he used it to commit a crime, he was within his rights to have it on his own property. I believe Turtledude best explained why this is by illustrating the difference between yelling fire in a crowded building and owning a gun. One is an action, the other is a right of possession. You can legislate against actions, but not inalienable rights of possession. Why is the NRA not calling for these cops head, weird...

And the fifth amendment has this to say.

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

This is oppression, pure and simple. And I for one won't stand for it.

 

[Trinnity]

Re: Stephon Clark was shot six times in the back, independent autopsy finds

I don't know. I think it would be hard to disguise entry and exit wounds to a FP. Seen a few of them myself.

I've seen too many -it does get wearing over the years- being an xray tech and working a lot of ER over the years. Unless clothing or another object impedes the exit would, it'll look different than an entrance wound. If the exit is shored by something external like furniture, clothes, or a wall, the exit wound can look like an entrance wound, with a circular defect or abrasion around the edges. A FP can tell the difference with a microscopic exam.