Pence leaving game "oppression"?

[Removable Mind]

that's not a difference, the loony "conservative" right does it too. That's how this whole issue became not about the perceived racial divide in our law enforcement/judicial system (which is actually what the point of kneeling was about), but somehow morphed it into "disrespecting the flag" or "spitting on the anthem" and other nonsense in order to ignore the actual point of the protest and make a political brouhaha out of it instead.

lol

Peas in a pod.

This is what it's morphed into:

WASHINGTON — President Trump threatened on Tuesday to use federal tax law to penalize the National Football League over players who kneel in protest during the national anthem as he sought to escalate a political fight that has resonated with his conservative base.

In one of a series of combative early morning tweets, Mr. Trump said that Congress should eliminate a law that has allowed the N.F.L. central office to avoid paying taxes as a nonprofit entity. “Why is the N.F.L. getting massive tax breaks while at the same time disrespecting our Anthem, Flag and Country?” he wrote. “Change tax law!”

https://mobile.nytimes.com/2017/10/.../www.nytimes.com/section/politics?nytmobile=0

This is an act of aggression and total disrespect for both the spirit and the letter of the Constitution by a self-will-run-riot authoritarian, narcissist, megalomaniac, passive-aggressive president who's pissed because his ego has been hurt.

What a crybaby, tantrum throwing ass!

 

[Old Sarge]

that's not a difference, the loony "conservative" right does it too. That's how this whole issue became not about the perceived racial divide in our law enforcement/judicial system (which is actually what the point of kneeling was about), but somehow morphed it into "disrespecting the flag" or "spitting on the anthem" and other nonsense in order to ignore the actual point of the protest and make a political brouhaha out of it instead.

lol

Peas in a pod.

Just what does kneeling during the National Anthem have to do with city police shooting black men? Kaepernick's original protest was a slap in the face of the country which had nothing to do with what he was protesting.

 

[Ikari]

Just what does kneeling during the National Anthem have to do with city police shooting black men? Kaepernick's original protest was a slap in the face of the country which had nothing to do with what he was protesting.

That was WHY he was kneeling.

It wasn't a "slap in the face of the country", that's dumb. That's the ignorant, emotionalized, vapid, political propaganda spin put on it so people didn't have to consider WHY he was kneeling. Blown up by Trump because it's the least damaging of all his twitter tirades, and something he figures is an easy win and can rile people up to get behind him, thinking maybe we'll forget about the **** show he made of Puerto Rico responses, to getting into Jr. High level tiffs with Kim Jung Un, to not being about to get any amount of support and legislation through Congress, etc.

Look over here, look over here! A football player is kneeling. Oh woe are we! They're disrespecting the flag!!!!!!! No! Don't look over there where my track record of my administration lie, that's nothing to see. Look over here! Kneeling football players!!!!!

 

[Oreo]

Trump does not hire and fire NFL players silly... lol

Trump was stating to NFL managers to fire players that kneel. He's a total jackass--and continually sticks his nose into area's where it doesn't belong.

The NFL were huge supporters of Trump during the campaign season, but no more.
Here are the NFL owners who have donated to Trump - NY Daily News

You couldn't have found a worse President if you had gone out on a midnight scavenger hunt in search of one.

 

[CanadaJohn]

Just a bit of background:

1. Mike Pence is the former Governor of Indiana, and long time politician in the State.

2. Peyton Manning was the long time star QB for the Indianapolis Colts.

3. Peyton Manning is/was a long time supporter and friend of the Republicans and Governor Pence and Governor Pence is/was a long time supporter of Peyton Manning.

4. The Indianapolis Colts, long before President Trump's speech about NFL players kneeling, decided to honour their long time QB with a halftime presentation at the game last Sunday. As a supporter of his state's NFL team, I'd bet that the Colts invited Vice-President Pence to attend the game and ceremonies many months ago, long before President Trump's speech.

5. Basically, the VP represents the administration on occasions where the President is unable to attend and represents the policies of the administration and the views of the President.

6. It's clear that the President instructed the VP to leave the game if any of the NFL players chose to disrespect the anthem/flag during the opening of the game. It's likely that the VP was torn between his good friend Peyton Manning's big day and serving at the will of the President who honored him with the position of VP. As with many of us, serving our employer comes before our personal feelings and friendships.

Bottom line, for me, this wasn't a publicity stunt planned by the White House and orchestrated by the administration. It is the confluence of circumstances that could not have been envisioned months ago. Just like the Pittsburgh Penguins accepting an invitation to the White House to celebrate their Stanley Cup win today is not an endorsement of Trump's views on the NFL player's protests, Pence's attendance at the Colts game this past Sunday was not an attempt to put Trump's views into action.

Perhaps, in hindsight, the Vice-President should have scheduled to attend the game midway through the second quarter to arrive just before the Manning ceremonies and avoided being in the stands during the anthem. But then, he likely would have been criticized for that too.

The other bottom line for me is that the NFL protests that are centered on the national anthem and flag are so misguided that they have lost direction and focus and have become highly political and divisive for reasons totally divorced from the original cause. For that reason alone they should be ended and refocused elsewhere.

 

[Old Sarge]

That was WHY he was kneeling.

It wasn't a "slap in the face of the country", that's dumb. That's the ignorant, emotionalized, vapid, political propaganda spin put on it so people didn't have to consider WHY he was kneeling. Blown up by Trump because it's the least damaging of all his twitter tirades, and something he figures is an easy win and can rile people up to get behind him, thinking maybe we'll forget about the **** show he made of Puerto Rico responses, to getting into Jr. High level tiffs with Kim Jung Un, to not being about to get any amount of support and legislation through Congress, etc.

Look over here, look over here! A football player is kneeling. Oh woe are we! They're disrespecting the flag!!!!!!! No! Don't look over there where my track record of my administration lie, that's nothing to see. Look over here! Kneeling football players!!!!!

Oh look at me I'll show you I'll piss you off so you will support my position. Typical liberal thinking.
Anyone who believes that kneeling during the national anthem or abusing the flag isn't showing disrespect to not only the one's country but every man and woman who has worn the uniform and especially those who paid the ultimate sacrifice, is either a fool or and idiot or both.

 

[antiquity]

I don't think it's "oppression", but it was clearly an orchestrated political stunt.

For some reason sitting or kneeling is not a political stunt? Enlighten me?

 

[Ikari]

Oh look at me I'll show you I'll piss you off so you will support my position. Typical liberal thinking.
Anyone who believes that kneeling during the national anthem or abusing the flag isn't showing disrespect to not only the one's country but every man and woman who has worn the uniform and especially those who paid the ultimate sacrifice, is either a fool or and idiot or both.

I would say that anyone who thinks that kneeling during the natural anthem is showing disrespect to not only the one's country but every man and woman who has worn the uniform and especially those who paid the ultimate sacrifice, is either a fool or and idiot or both.

lol

In the 49ers' final preseason game, backup quarterback Colin Kaepernick decided to kneel for the national anthem instead of taking a seat on the bench.

Turns out it was former Seahawks player and Green Beret Nate Boyer who talked Kap into making the change. Boyer wrote an open letter to Kaepernick earlier this season, and it caused the two to meet up and discuss America and honoring the anthem.

On the upcoming episode of HBO's "Real Sports With Bryant Gumbel" (airing Tuesday night at 10 p.m. ET), Boyer reveals what happened in the discussion between the two men.

"We sorta came to a middle ground where he would take a knee alongside his teammates," Boyer says. "Soldiers take a knee in front of a fallen brother's grave, you know, to show respect. When we're on a patrol, you know, and we go into a security halt, we take a knee, and we pull security."

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/...in-kaepernick-to-go-from-sitting-to-kneeling/

So we see that Kaepernick used to sit, but changed to sitting after talking with a Green Beret about it, and the kneeling was a compromise to show his protest but still demonstrate respect.

lol

But keep up with the faux outrage over some political propaganda that seeks to hide the root causes of the issue at hand. That will accomplish a lot.

lol

 

[Ikari]

For some reason sitting or kneeling is not a political stunt? Enlighten me?

It's perhaps a publicity stunt, some attempt to raise awareness of a perceived racial divide in our policing/judicial system. But it's not really for the R or the D, nor are football players politicians (likely a good thing). A politician staging the even, just as Pence did, is a political stunt. It's just some silly, staged and choreographed protest to capitalize on some political rift.

 

[Moderate Right]

I would say that anyone who thinks that kneeling during the natural anthem is showing disrespect to not only the one's country but every man and woman who has worn the uniform and especially those who paid the ultimate sacrifice, is either a fool or and idiot or both.

lol

Straight from the horse's mouth:

"I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color,"


In other words, he is for disrespecting the flag and our country.


Colin Kaepernick explains why he sat during national anthem - NFL.com

 

[Ikari]

Straight from the horse's mouth:

"I am not going to stand up to show pride in a flag for a country that oppresses black people and people of color,"


In other words, he is for disrespecting the flag and our country.


Colin Kaepernick explains why he sat during national anthem - NFL.com

Not being prideful in something, and purposefully disrespecting something are two very different things.

Furthermore, that was his statement when he was sitting. After talking with a Green Beret about the protest, he agreed to kneel as a sign of protest but to still show respect.

As previously quoted and demonstrated.

But have fun with the faux outrage and political propaganda. It sure is easier than engaging in discussion with the root cause.

 

[Old Sarge]

Ikari said "I would say that anyone who thinks that kneeling during the natural anthem"

Before you laugh too much it is the "National Anthem" NOT the "Natural Anthem". If you are going to be snarky at least get the statement correct.

 

[Moderate Right]

Not being prideful in something, and purposefully disrespecting something are two very different things.

Furthermore, that was his statement when he was sitting. After talking with a Green Beret about the protest, he agreed to kneel as a sign of protest but to still show respect.

As previously quoted and demonstrated.

But have fun with the faux outrage and political propaganda. It sure is easier than engaging in discussion with the root cause.

Kaepernick specifically said that he would not stand for the flag or the country. In other words, he does not respect the flag or the country.

 

[Ikari]

Kaepernick specifically said that he would not stand for the flag or the country. In other words, he does not respect the flag or the country.

In other words, he was not prideful of it. After discussing the protest with a Green Beret, he agreed to kneel as a sign of his protest but to still show respect.

 

[Ikari]

Ikari said "I would say that anyone who thinks that kneeling during the natural anthem"

Before you laugh too much it is the "National Anthem" NOT the "Natural Anthem". If you are going to be snarky at least get the statement correct.

Oh no! A typo! that's never happened before.

Good to see you have no further rebuttal.

 

[Bodi]

Trump was stating to NFL managers to fire players that kneel. He's a total jackass--and continually sticks his nose into area's where it doesn't belong.

The NFL were huge supporters of Trump during the campaign season, but no more.
Here are the NFL owners who have donated to Trump - NY Daily News

You couldn't have found a worse President if you had gone out on a midnight scavenger hunt in search of one.

This thread is about Pence.

 

[lurchadams]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...ional-anthem-protest-walkout-colts/744748001/

IMO this is just another example that we don't know what oppression is in the US. It takes no courage or heroism in the US to kneel during the anthem. Nobody's going to be disappearing under mysterious circumstances because of it. Don't get me wrong, I'm really not happy this got re-ignited again and Pence's actions definitely did that but, at the same time, nobody is obligated to support or respect the players protest. As long as those who disagree with the protest are peaceful in their actions then they have the same rights to their own form of speech.

Ok, enough rant, attaching poll.

It wasn't oppression. It's just another attempt to play to Trump's base. It was a premeditated stunt. Pence was just being a good boy and doing what he was told.

It only cost the taxpayers a couple hundred thou. It's not like Pence was taking his wife to see the eclipse at Fort Knox. That would have been really irresponsible!

 

[X Factor]

I have no problem with most of what you've wrote. I disagree with it, but I can see where you are coming from.

Not the case when you talk about the VP defending the Constitution by flying to a football game that he knew he was going to walk out of. The President has already talked about this issue so we know his viewpoint. What exactly was accomplished besides keeping this story in the news and stroking his base? Kneeling athletes at football games could probably be moved down on the "**** the US executive branch has to do" list.

And I agree with this. It was a fun, little harmless drama at first, but the Trump admin has actually done the protesting players a favor by keeping it in the news.

 

[X Factor]

This thread is about Pence.

It's made me pensive.

 

[Old Sarge]

Oh no! A typo! that's never happened before.

Good to see you have no further rebuttal.

A typo yea right. As to rebuttal I have shown that the fans of the NFL seem to feel the same as I do. You can try to sell the kneeling crap as not disrespecting the country till the cows come home, and you will still be wrong.

 

[Ikari]

A typo yea right. As to rebuttal I have shown that the fans of the NFL seem to feel the same as I do. You can try to sell the kneeling crap as not disrespecting the country till the cows come home, and you will still be wrong.

People "feeling" and something being are two different things. Believe the spin if you want. But as shown, Kaepernick changed from sitting to kneeling after talking with a Green Beret and the compromise was to demonstrate protest while still showing respect.

 

[akyron]

Honestly, this trip has been scheduled for weeks, before Trump jumped into the fray. It was Peyton Manning day. While governor, Pence declared a Peyton Manning day. If you want to talk honestly, then Pence, in the beginning, planned on staying for most of the game (they had a celebration during half time (I was there at the game) and I'm sure that Pence had been planning on staying for that but both he and Trump had RECENTLY decided that if players spit on the flag during the anthem that Pence would leave. That's honesty. Hypocrisy is when the players pull a publicity stunt to get attention and then accuse Pence of pulling a publicity stunt to get attention. That's more honesty.

I have little doubt Pence would have stayed for Mannings ceremony if not the rest of the game if he wasnt forced to bear the oppression of witnessing a heinous subversion of a traditional basic civic american ceremony.

Historically he does award ceremonies and such there.

Whats good for the goose I guess.

 

[Nickyjo]

I am all for protest but showing total disrespect for the nation that gives you the right to protest is like biting the hand that feeds you. Besides WTF are they protesting?

The fact that you ask shows Trump's genius at using the media to distract. I believe the original protest by Colin K was in the context of police shootings. Trump worked his magic and we are discussing the flag, kneeling, etc.

Wouldn't it be nice if Trump had the class to address the issue? Nah, I ask that from a guy who deals in lynch-mob rhetoric. Still, hope springs eternal.

 

[Casca XV]

Do you mean to consider the physical act of Pence leaving the game as oppression? It's not clear from your post.

He is calling out the Leftist lie that the VP leaving is an act of oppression on the NFL players.

 

[Casca XV]

I don't think it's "oppression", but it was clearly an orchestrated political stunt.

Just as the kneeling itself is political stunt. A Political Stunt based on a Leftist political lie of systemic minority oppession.