Pence leaving game "oppression"?

[Tanngrisnir]

And I'm an astronaut.

It's OK that you're an astronaut.

Fun times at juice and cookies break!

 

[Lursa]

They are protesting our anthem and our flag over a few bad cops. They don't have the courage to address the police where and when it happens. I haven't seen 1 of them protest a police station where this may have happened. They need to go grab a sign and march in front of a police station like they have a pair and stop disrespecting our country's anthem and flag.

What??? Nobody recommends that...that's a good way to get killed. (And not sure where you've been but there have been plenty of community protests in those neighborhoods.)

For God's sake...even in such cases you wait and report it later to the proper people...and then if needed, you take it to the media. But you certainly do not confront the police. That should be obvious...it's what they're protesting.

Toooooo many police shootings are deemed 'justified' in what certainly appear to be bull**** or borderline cases and these men ARE making an appropriate protest.

 

[Phys251]

I think that Pence was a...

 

[DiAnna]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...ional-anthem-protest-walkout-colts/744748001/

IMO this is just another example that we don't know what oppression is in the US. It takes no courage or heroism in the US to kneel during the anthem. Nobody's going to be disappearing under mysterious circumstances because of it. Don't get me wrong, I'm really not happy this got re-ignited again and Pence's actions definitely did that but, at the same time, nobody is obligated to support or respect the players protest. As long as those who disagree with the protest are peaceful in their actions then they have the same rights to their own form of speech.

Ok, enough rant, attaching poll.

If you'd included the option of a set-up PR stunt between Trump and Pence that cost taxpayers $240,000, it would have been the clear winner. I settled for other.

Do try better options than "Do you agree with me, yes, no, I don't know and other". Xy, Xy, Xy... what am I gonna do with you? :lol:

 

[Skeptic Bob]

Pence's act was a protest, and he had as much right to do that as the athletes had to make their protest.

I don't think it especially reflects well on him to react in that way in the face of a silent and peaceful protest, but he had that right just the same.

It's not quite the same. The football players' protest has zero impact on my life or wallet. Pence went to the game knowing this would happen with the intent of doing his own protest. Security for the VP at a football stadium is pretty elaborate, and costs tax payer money. In the grand scheme of things it isn't a big deal, but there are some differences.

 

[ecofarm]

Should Pence be protesting while at work?

 

[Oreo]

They are not being forced to stand and if the owners make it a job requirement they are still not being forced. They don't have to be employees of the nfl. They do that voluntarily.

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Well--I think that's exactly what I said. Under 1st amendment rights no one is required to stand for the National Anthem. Here is that video again, you might want to actually watch it. There is a volumn icon on the video if you have issues hearing it.

https://www.facebook.com/Mediamatters/videos/10154960994046167/

 

[trouble13]

Well--I think that's exactly what I said. Under 1st amendment rights no one is required to stand for the National Anthem. Here is that video again, you might want to actually watch it. There is a volumn icon on the video if you have issues hearing it.

https://www.facebook.com/Mediamatters/videos/10154960994046167/

You used the word forced in your post. I pointed out that nobody is being forced.

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[PIPEWRENCH]

What??? Nobody recommends that...that's a good way to get killed. (And not sure where you've been but there have been plenty of community protests in those neighborhoods.).

The cops are not going to gun down a bunch of multimillion dollar NFL players protesting police abuse of black people. I don't mean at the time of the incident I am talking after the incident. Protest the police dept. where the problem took place.

Toooooo many police shootings are deemed 'justified' in what certainly appear to be bull**** or borderline cases and these men ARE making an appropriate protest.

Too much race card being thrown out before the facts are brought to light. If there is clear evidence of wrong doing people do not get off. Sorry but too many times people want to convict when their is not enough evidence to support a conviction. The only solution to that is vigilante justice and witch hunts.

Go after the problem. Don't disrespect the flag and the anthem. That flag and anthem represent me. I have never done anything to anyone of these people. So again go after the problem. That would be the police. Not the 100's of millions of decent people of this country who love and support our flag and anthem.

If you truly think things are that bad maybe you might want to move to all the better places all over the world welcoming unrestricted immigration with open arms.

 

[Oreo]

You used the word forced in your post. I pointed out that nobody is being forced.

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Sweet Baby Jesus--If you threaten to fire them if they don't stand--then they are being forced to stand. These are TRUMP'S words, not mine. Trump specifically stated 'I would fire that son of a bitch"--if they didn't stand during the National Anthem--and you know this, I don't need to tell you that.

 

[trouble13]

Sweet Baby Jesus--If you threaten to fire them if they don't stand--then they are being forced to stand. These are TRUMP'S words, not mine. Trump specifically stated 'I would fire that son of a bitch"--if they didn't stand during the National Anthem--and you know this, I don't need to tell you that.

Nobody is forcing anyone to do anything. It is a condition of their employment. Owners are not forced to employ them and they are not forced to work there.

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[The Mark]

https://www.usatoday.com/story/spor...ional-anthem-protest-walkout-colts/744748001/

IMO this is just another example that we don't know what oppression is in the US. It takes no courage or heroism in the US to kneel during the anthem. Nobody's going to be disappearing under mysterious circumstances because of it. Don't get me wrong, I'm really not happy this got re-ignited again and Pence's actions definitely did that but, at the same time, nobody is obligated to support or respect the players protest. As long as those who disagree with the protest are peaceful in their actions then they have the same rights to their own form of speech.

Ok, enough rant, attaching poll.

It was a publicity stunt.

 

[Bodi]

Sweet Baby Jesus--If you threaten to fire them if they don't stand--then they are being forced to stand. These are TRUMP'S words, not mine. Trump specifically stated 'I would fire that son of a bitch"--if they didn't stand during the National Anthem--and you know this, I don't need to tell you that.

Trump does not hire and fire NFL players silly... lol

 

[X Factor]

If you'd included the option of a set-up PR stunt between Trump and Pence that cost taxpayers $240,000, it would have been the clear winner. I settled for other.

Do try better options than "Do you agree with me, yes, no, I don't know and other". Xy, Xy, Xy... what am I gonna do with you? :lol:

It's funny what liberals feel entitled to. :2razz: JANFU gave me **** about this too, as if this is the only poll that could possibly be created about it and I owe it to everyone to find out which poll choices they'd like to see most. This was the question I wanted to ask. Someone else could ask a different one you know.

 

[Slyfox696]

You don't know that he didn't have any intention of staying

:lol:

Oh, I see. You likely have no intention of discussing this honestly. Okay, good to know.

Of course he had no intention of staying. It was a political stunt, to the point they even told the media to just wait outside the stadium since he'd "possibly" be leaving early. He had no intention of staying.

and it really doesn't matter. Do you have proof that he wasn't planning on staying?

I have logic and common sense, which says he was attending a game the 49ers were playing, the team from where the protests started and have been the most active. I also have the fact media was told not to even bother coming in the stadium, since Pence would "possibly" be leaving early. I even have the President of the United States tweeting he basically put Mike Pence up to it.

He had no intention of staying. Do you have any intention of discussing this honestly or are you just going to lie and shill for your team?

 

[Moderate Right]

Difference: players are protesting a social issue, VP is (attempting) furthering his career..and pandering to his boss.

Difference: The loony liberal left wants people to hear their protests and wants to stifle protests they don't like.

 

[Moderate Right]

:lol:

Oh, I see. You likely have no intention of discussing this honestly. Okay, good to know.

Of course he had no intention of staying. It was a political stunt, to the point they even told the media to just wait outside the stadium since he'd "possibly" be leaving early. He had no intention of staying.

I have logic and common sense, which says he was attending a game the 49ers were playing, the team from where the protests started and have been the most active. I also have the fact media was told not to even bother coming in the stadium, since Pence would "possibly" be leaving early. I even have the President of the United States tweeting he basically put Mike Pence up to it.

He had no intention of staying. Do you have any intention of discussing this honestly or are you just going to lie and shill for your team?

Honestly, this trip has been scheduled for weeks, before Trump jumped into the fray. It was Peyton Manning day. While governor, Pence declared a Peyton Manning day. If you want to talk honestly, then Pence, in the beginning, planned on staying for most of the game (they had a celebration during half time (I was there at the game) and I'm sure that Pence had been planning on staying for that but both he and Trump had RECENTLY decided that if players spit on the flag during the anthem that Pence would leave. That's honesty. Hypocrisy is when the players pull a publicity stunt to get attention and then accuse Pence of pulling a publicity stunt to get attention. That's more honesty.

 

[iliveonramen]

In other words, you are saying that one side should be able to do whatever the hell they want and the other side shouldn't be able to do the exact same thing. On top of that, there is no evidence to prove that Pence was actually doing a publicity stunt. But, the players certainly were.

No, I'm saying that the President and Vice President should be held to a different standard than athletes or entertainers.

There is plenty of evidence that Pence and Trump expected Pence to walk out of that game.

 

[Old Sarge]

No, I'm saying that the President and Vice President should be held to a different standard than athletes or entertainers.

There is plenty of evidence that Pence and Trump expected Pence to walk out of that game.

The President and VP took an oath to support and defend the Constitution. Now the Constitution is the guiding document of the country, while the flag, and anthem are symbols of this country.

So I and most other Americans expect them to do just what Pence did.

I for one will not support any team that shows disrespect for the country. And the players are doing just that by kneeling or sitting during the anthem. By buying merchandise with their logo or going to their games I am indirectly supporting that disrespect and I refuse to do that. It looks like most fans are thinking like me as people are not going or watching NFL games.

 

[iliveonramen]

The President and VP took an oath to support and defend the Constitution. Now the Constitution is the guiding document of the country, while the flag, and anthem are symbols of this country.

So I and most other Americans expect them to do just what Pence did.

I for one will not support any team that shows disrespect for the country. And the players are doing just that by kneeling or sitting during the anthem. By buying merchandise with their logo or going to their games I am indirectly supporting that disrespect and I refuse to do that. It looks like most fans are thinking like me as people are not going or watching NFL games.

I have no problem with most of what you've wrote. I disagree with it, but I can see where you are coming from.

Not the case when you talk about the VP defending the Constitution by flying to a football game that he knew he was going to walk out of. The President has already talked about this issue so we know his viewpoint. What exactly was accomplished besides keeping this story in the news and stroking his base? Kneeling athletes at football games could probably be moved down on the "**** the US executive branch has to do" list.

 

[Old Sarge]

I have no problem with most of what you've wrote. I disagree with it, but I can see where you are coming from.

Not the case when you talk about the VP defending the Constitution by flying to a football game that he knew he was going to walk out of. The President has already talked about this issue so we know his viewpoint. What exactly was accomplished besides keeping this story in the news and stroking his base? Kneeling athletes at football games could probably be moved down on the "**** the US executive branch has to do" list.

I don't have any evidence it was planned but if it was it wouldn't surprise me. Either way it was symbolism which all politicians practice. I still agree with the principle of not supporting those who blatently show disrespect for the country that gives them the right to protest. The original kneeling was in protest of police shooting black men. I fail to see how the country was responsible but that is another argument.

 

[Ikari]

Sure peaceful protests are publicity stunts, designed to get news coverage. That's what protests are. Trump and Pence have been posting for not disrespecting the flag, the country, and our national anthem. It's only different to you because you are for spitting on the flag for your cause. Pence was there for Peyton Manning day. https://ind.247sports.com/Bolt/Vice-President-Mike-Pence-in-attendance-for-Colts-vs-49ers-108617495

Pence was there as a paid protester to walk out when some players took a knee. It's not to say he can't, but this was nothing more than a political stunt.

 

[Ikari]

Difference: The loony liberal left wants people to hear their protests and wants to stifle protests they don't like.

that's not a difference, the loony "conservative" right does it too. That's how this whole issue became not about the perceived racial divide in our law enforcement/judicial system (which is actually what the point of kneeling was about), but somehow morphed it into "disrespecting the flag" or "spitting on the anthem" and other nonsense in order to ignore the actual point of the protest and make a political brouhaha out of it instead.

lol

Peas in a pod.

 

[Slyfox696]

Honestly, this trip has been scheduled for weeks, before Trump jumped into the fray. It was Peyton Manning day. While governor, Pence declared a Peyton Manning day. If you want to talk honestly, then Pence, in the beginning, planned on staying for most of the game (they had a celebration during half time (I was there at the game) and I'm sure that Pence had been planning on staying for that but both he and Trump had RECENTLY decided that if players spit on the flag during the anthem that Pence would leave. That's honesty. Hypocrisy is when the players pull a publicity stunt to get attention and then accuse Pence of pulling a publicity stunt to get attention. That's more honesty.

I see you chose the "not honest/shill" option. Can't say I'm surprised. Have a good day.

 

[Lursa]

Difference: The loony liberal left wants people to hear their protests and wants to stifle protests they don't like.

Feel free to provide the evidence of this regarding Pence's stunt. (bold)

Er, we're calling out his behavior, not hiding it, not saying he doesnt have the right to voice his opinion in public.