[Live] 2020 Dem NV Primary Debate Live Thread!

[Linc]

I don't recall Sanders approving of Stalinist purges or genocides.

Conversely, I do recall Sanders praising programs that endeavoured to provide the basic needs of Soviet citizens.

Defending Soviet policies is a sure winner for sanders.

 

[Surrealistik]

I take back my socialist sanders moniker. It’s going to be communist sanders on trump and RNC ads.

You do that.

 

[Napoleon]

I don't recall Sanders approving of Stalinist purges or genocides.

Conversely, I do recall Sanders praising programs that endeavoured to provide the basic needs of Soviet citizens.

Programs that had their genesis in mass murder.

 

[GreatNews2night]

I take back my socialist sanders moniker. It’s going to be communist sanders on trump and RNC ads.

And your are the person accusing Sanders and his followers of being dishonest. Great.

 

[Craig234]

Bernie is a socialist and has said so during his political career. This current use of "democratic socialist" is a moot point and just his way of thwarting the socialist label his FELLOW liberals put on him. What Sanders has always said is that he is NOT an "authoritarian communist".

No, actually, he's said for decades that he is a 'Democratic Socialist' - but what's more important is that his policies aren't even that, they're FDR type values. He's gotten better at correcting people who say 'socialist' telling them no, 'Democratic Socialist'.

I think the fact that any politician who needs to qualify their political philosophy by adding "democratic" to his socialist agenda is just a SOCIALIST anyway.

Because you're clueless and don't know what words mean, leading you to post false statements.

 

[Linc]

This debate won't affect Nevada. Bloomberg is not in Nevada. And 75,000 have already early-voted in Nevada before this debate. Probably only another 25,000 will show up on Saturday.

I can’t wait to see how this prediction ages.

 

[GreatNews2night]

Pretty much.

But I kept waiting for the alien insect inside Pete to emerge like in Men In Black...

Yes, Pete is very canned-speech, sounds fake.

 

[Phys251]

Oh, could have fooled me after posts like the one below:

How are you going about making that conclusion exactly?

If you know full-well that Bernie's base will not budge or vote for a Democratic nominee that is not Sanders, then it is your moral obligation to vote for Sanders if the most important thing in 2020 is to see Donald Trump defeated.

You think you can stiff-arm me into voting for Saint Bernard in the primary?

I knew that Sanders supporters were entitled, but damn, y'all are serious about throwing this election away!

I wonder, CMP, who your second-favorite candidate is. Obviously not Warren--she fails your progressive purity test. Nor any of the other candidates that aren't socialists. And third-party candidates are just faceless names, which only leaves one.

Trump. Your second favorite is Trump. It's the only logical conclusion. You want to stiff-arm us into voting for your Chosen One, and if he doesn't get the nomination that you obviously feel he is entitled to, you will deliberately, in effect, help out Trump.

Your pathetic stiff-arming game is not. Going. To. Work. In fact, your attitude is just driving me away from Sanders more.

 

[Linc]

No, actually, he's said for decades that he is a 'Democratic Socialist' - but what's more important is that his policies aren't even that, they're FDR type values. He's gotten better at correcting people who say 'socialist' telling them no, 'Democratic Socialist'.
Because you're clueless and don't know what words mean, leading you to post false statements.

Probably the biggest lie that we see from sanders supporters is that sanders is closest to FDR.

Do you believe that public unions should be able to strike?

 

[TurtleDude]

You're a Nazi communist. Since you keep telling a lie that Bernie is a "socialist", I guess we can just throw those labels around.

you're denying that goofy Bernie is a socialist?

 

[Linc]

Agree 100%, one of the best posts of the night

As he plays right into trump’s hands.

 

[Phys251]

Yes, deserves the nomination, which is done in second ballot with the other delegates rallying behind that person. Again, this is perfectly fine according to the rules and actually is what has always happened in the whole history of the party except in an atypical convention with a resignation and an assassination.

The other 5 candidates are all counting on the party defying the popular will and picking someone else in second ballot, other than the person with the most popular votes, which would be a first except for the atypical situation of 1968.

Less than 50% is not the popular will. :naughty

Don't play that game. You're better than that.

...right?

Who is being more democratic, huh? The one who wants the people to speak and decide, or the other five who want party elders to override the will of the people???

It's much more complicated than that if there's no majority on the first ballot. Much more.

 

[Linc]

you're denying that goofy Bernie is a socialist?

Having fun yet? :mrgreen:

 

[CMPancake]

You think you can stiff-arm me into voting for Saint Bernard in the primary?

I knew that Sanders supporters were entitled, but damn, y'all are serious about throwing this election away!

I wonder, CMP, who your second-favorite candidate is. Obviously not Warren--she fails your progressive purity test. Nor any of the other candidates that aren't socialists. And third-party candidates are just faceless names, which only leaves one.

Trump. Your second favorite is Trump. It's the only logical conclusion. You want to stiff-arm us into voting for your Chosen One, and if he doesn't get the nomination that you obviously feel he is entitled to, you will deliberately, in effect, help out Trump.

Your pathetic stiff-arming game is not. Going. To. Work. In fact, your attitude is just driving me away from Sanders more.

Bernie Sanders is the only candidate that can beat Donald Trump. If Bernie Sanders is not the nominee, Donald Trump will be reelected. If you truly want Donald Trump out of the White House, support and vote for Bernie Sanders.

 

[Court Jester]

Using your analogy, if everyone is a Tom Sawyer, who ends up painting the fence?

I said everyone CAN BE Tom Sawyer. I never said everyone 'will be' Tom Sawyer. That is the problem with you socialists, a complete lack of attention to the details.

 

[GreatNews2night]

I can’t wait to see how this prediction ages.

Last year the Nevada Dem Caucus hat 87,000 participants. This time, they made early voting possible for the first time and 75,000 have done it already. If turnout is similar if leaves only 12,000 left. I doubled it to 25,000 thinking of a bit more enthusiasm this time. This prediction is likely to be fairly accurate.

 

[bradt99]

Trump in the whitehouse forever baby!!!!!!! Stick it to the establishment.

 

[TurtleDude]

Using your analogy, if everyone is a Tom Sawyer, who ends up painting the fence?

a couple illegals from Mexico who work cheaper than Americans

 

[CMPancake]

I said everyone CAN BE Tom Sawyer. I never said everyone 'will be' Tom Sawyer. That is the problem with you socialists, a complete lack of attention to the details.

Okay cool, so not everyone can be Tom Sawyer. Should those who cannot be Tom suffer and die from treatable ailments?

 

[TurtleDude]

Having fun yet? :mrgreen:

just starting to go on the warpath!!

 

[GreatNews2night]

Less than 50% is not the popular will. :naughty

Don't play that game. You're better than that.

...right?



It's much more complicated than that if there's no majority on the first ballot. Much more.

And still, that's what the party has almost always done (picked the one with the most popular votes regardless of majority), except for atypical 1968.

 

[PLizzy]

Sure but the best way to unite the party and fight Trump is to have everybody rally behind the one with the biggest plurarity (therefore most popular votes). And it's interesting to notice that this is what has always happened, except in 1868 when two major candidates abruptly left, one through resigning, and the other one through leaving the planet by force of being assassinated. I think we can safely forget about atypical 1968 and say, the Democratic Party has always nominated the candidate with the most popular vote, in line with the very name of the party, and should do it again in 2020 or else the party will fracture and lose miserably to Trump.

It all depends.

If Sanders gets 47% and two other candidates split 25%-30%, then you'd be right, the DNC would have to go with Sanders. But if you have one moderate that gets their footing and they have a delegate margin similar to Sanders, but also lack a majority, then it would be stupid to ignore that other 20% of the party that also doesn't want Sanders.

It's actually overblown how many Sanders supporters didn't support the last nominee. As matter of fact, there were less defects from Clinton to McCain in 2004, than from Sanders to Trump in 2016. As long as the leader of the moderate lane isn't Bloomberg, the vast majority will still support the winner in November.

 

[jnug]

You not being informed doesn't make you right that the info isn't there.

Free College, Cancel Debt

Bernie's cancel all student loan debt plan is still impractical and illogical. Did we force students to take those loans? Did they take loans for degrees that were in all cases aimed at a career? What does stock trading (what Bernie calls stock speculation) have to do with college loan debt? NOTHING thats what. I do agree that the interest rates should be cut for future college loans.

Yes we screwed up. Most particularly my generation screwed up education in this country completely, K-12 more than anywhere else for that matter. The way we screwed up higher education is actually the cherry on top of this ugly mess we have made. But forgiving all the college loan debt sounds way too much like reparations to me and I simply do not believe in reparations. I believe in fixing problems. But I don't believe in paying reparations particularly when the students and their family made choices to take the loans. I took loans to go to school and yes school was less costly when I went. Picking on stock trading and taxing it as the means to cover $1.6T in student loans simply sounds like trying to pick a target for a tax that is "popular", politically populist....sort of a Trumpian move if you ask me. Find a better idea if you want to pursue this further Bernie. Fully support lowering the interest rate for future student loans. Have favored that in posts before this one but would still be troubled with "forgiving" some portion of loans previously made at a particular interest rate.

As for his free college plank, this is from the link you yourself provided as to what Bernie would do if elected:
"Pass the College for All Act to provide at least $48 billion per year to eliminate tuition and fees at four-year public colleges and universities, tribal colleges, community colleges, trade schools, and apprenticeship programs. Everyone deserves the right to a good higher education if they choose to pursue it, no matter their income."

That sounds pretty open ended and lacking in specificity for s platform plank that Bernie has been supporting for as long as he has supported it. There are plenty of cow dung majors at public universities these days just as an example.

If you are wondering if that link changed my mind....answer NO!

 

[Linc]

You're a Nazi communist. Since you keep telling a lie that Bernie is a "socialist", I guess we can just throw those labels around.

There’s a difference between a poster calling other posters a nazi communist and a poster calling a politician a socialist, Craig234.

 

[Slavister]

The other 5 candidates are all counting on the party defying the popular will and picking someone else in second ballot, other than the person with the most popular votes...

If Progressive lane is owned by Sanders with 30% and Moderate lane with 70% is split 4- or 5-ways, then do you consider 30% to be the true representative "will" of the people?

But if you have one moderate that gets their footing and they have a delegate margin similar to Sanders, but also lack a majority, then it would be stupid to ignore that other 20% of the party that also doesn't want Sanders.

It's actually overblown how many Sanders supporters didn't support the last nominee. As matter of fact, there were less defects from Clinton to McCain in 2004, than from Sanders to Trump in 2016. As long as the leader of the moderate lane isn't Bloomberg, the vast majority will still support the winner in November.

Agreed