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If Mueller Indicts Putin before Visit

haymarket said:
I see you don't like anyone answering your questions about the hypotheticals you present.
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My post was purely garbage to counter your posts of pure garbage. If it looks like garbage, and quacks like garbage, then it is probably garbage - or something like that. I confess I can't find a way to debate someone who doesn't know which reality is the real reality. Maybe you do this because you always win debates in your own reality.

There is actually a theory, of which even Hawking believed (I believe), of a multi-universe where every possible outcome and scenario actually happens in all of these universes but since these are infinite, I'm just not able to figure out which of the infinite number of universes you live in. It certainly isn't this one. But, somewhere in there, I was complimenting you for being more aware of these multi-universes than I am and it is certainly in your favor to find a universe in which everything makes perfect sense to you, even if it doesn't make sense to anyone else.
 
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haymarket said:
You need to brush up on your counting skills.

Two questions. Two answers.

Reuters reporter Jeff Mason asked on Monday,


and the immediate Putin answer to both parts of the question



Two questions. Two answers.
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Wrong as usual haymarket and stop with the projection.
Two questions and only an answer to the first.
 
Moderate Right said:
My post was purely garbage
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'nuff said.

I confess I can't find a way to debate someone who doesn't know which reality is the real reality.
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There is only one reality. Simply accept that and life will get a great deal easier for you, me and everyone.


There is actually a theory, of which even Hawking believed (I believe), of a multi-universe where every possible outcome and scenario actually happens in all of these universes but since these are infinite, I'm just not able to figure out which of the infinite number of universes you live in. It certainly isn't this one. But, somewhere in there, I was complimenting you for being more aware of these multi-universes than I am and it is certainly in your favor to find a universe in which everything makes perfect sense to you, even if it doesn't make sense to anyone else.
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Interesting. If you don't mind, I will stick to the reality of the USA in July of 2018.
 
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Excon said:
Wrong as usual haymarket and stop with the projection.
Two questions and only an answer to the first.
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There were two answers and I have repeatedly provided them.
 
haymarket said:
There were two answers and I have repeatedly provided them.
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Wrong as usual.
It was all part and parcel of one answer to the first question.

No mater how much you try, you can not change that.


Again, since you clearly are engaged in the very behavior you posted about.

Excon said:
haymarket said:
It does not matter what anybody "believes" or suspects or guesses or speculates about.
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This applies to you, not the person there asking the question, who would certainly have a better feel of what occurred than you can ever have.
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haymarket said:
'nuff said.



There is only one reality. Simply accept that and life will get a great deal easier for you, me and everyone.




Interesting. If you don't mind, I will stick to the reality of the USA in July of 2018.
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In your own universe where rabidness makes total sense.
 
haymarket said:
He gave two answers to the two questions asked.


Reuters reporter Jeff Mason asked on Monday,

and the immediate Putin answer to both parts of the question
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As usual, you're completely wrong.

If you listen to the English translation that was broadcast during the press conference, the Russian leader said, “Yes, I did. Yes, I did. Because he talked about bringing the U.S.–Russia relationship back to normal.” This rendering of Putin’s remarks leaves open the possibility that he’s stating “Yes, I did” in reference not just to wanting Donald Trump to win the 2016 presidential race, but also to ordering Russian officials to help Trump win, even though Putin repeatedly denied Russian interference in the election and collusion with the Trump campaign throughout the rest of the news conference.

But I’ve heard from a number of Russian speakers who point out that Putin’s actual comments in Russian concerning who he wanted to win the election are much less ambiguous than the way they were translated. He seems to have not used the phrase Yes, I did once, let alone twice. Instead, in Russian, Putin roughly said, “Yes, I wanted him to win, because he talked about the normalization of Russian–American relations.” In other words, he was apparently answering the first part of Mason’s question but not the second about whether he directed help Trump’s way. It’s unclear if that’s because Putin didn’t hear the second half of the question, it wasn’t translated into Russian accurately, or he simply chose to ignore it.
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https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2018/07/putin-trump-election-translation/565481/


The question isn't so much why did the original voice over get it wrong, but why, after all the reports clearing up the misunderstanding did YOU continue to get it wrong? It's beyond belief that you didn't take the time to find out the truth.
 
haymarket said:
Why did not apply to the previously cited case of Noriega who was also the head of his own nation? That precedent has already been set.

War with Russia has already been engaged when they attacked our voting and elections systems.
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Panama declared war against the US and the US invaded Panama and ended up capturing Noriega. Good thing Panama didn't have nuclear arms, I guess.
 
Linc said:
Mueller most assuredly has more than the Benghazi kangaroo courts, unless you’ve missed those dozens of indictments. The latest indictments show where the final ones will lead.
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Wishful thinking on your part, methinks. Comparison between Benghazi and Russia leaves you at a disadvantage. In Benghazi we have dead American bodies, a burned out embassy building, and the publicly known testimony of the people involved. In Russia we still have nothing.

How many red herrings will you guys jump at before you learn?
 
Tanngrisnir said:
Don't have to. Things will happen in terms of his own time and choosing.

And that just kills you.

Fun to watch!
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What's fun to watch is you guys dying a slow death. It's been the death of one anti-Trump meme after another for 18 months while Trump keeps winning.
 
Moderate Right said:
In your own universe where rabidness makes total sense.
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Trump is mentally ill. He lives in an alternate reality of his own making.

What is the excuse of his enablers and apologists who also deny reality?
 
LowDown said:
Panama declared war against the US and the US invaded Panama and ended up capturing Noriega. Good thing Panama didn't have nuclear arms, I guess.
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What were the acts of war that Panama engaged in against the USA?

Russia has declared war against the US with its interference in our elections . There is no difference.
 
HowardBThiname said:
As usual, you're completely wrong.


https://www.theatlantic.com/international/archive/2018/07/putin-trump-election-translation/565481/


The question isn't so much why did the original voice over get it wrong, but why, after all the reports clearing up the misunderstanding did YOU continue to get it wrong? It's beyond belief that you didn't take the time to find out the truth.
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That is a second hand interpretation of his statement in which he gave two distinct answers to two distinct questions.

There is no doubt Putin did what he admitted he did, order the interference and attack on the USA .... we have known it for quite a while now and has been confirmed by our intelligence agencies ..... so what are you complaining about in the first place?
 
haymarket said:
Trump is mentally ill. He lives in an alternate reality of his own making.

What is the excuse of his enablers and apologists who also deny reality?
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Seems like if you were going to accuse someone of being mentally ill then you would try to appear in touch with reality yourself. Just because Trump's sanity is questionable at times doesn't give you license to live in your own opposite fantasy world while the rest of us think that neither one of you have been dealt cards from a full deck.
 
haymarket said:
What were the acts of war that Panama engaged in against the USA?

Russia has declared war against the US with its interference in our elections . There is no difference.
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Both Russia and the US as well as other countries have tried to influence other countries elections for decades, if not centuries. Why do you think it just started in 2016?
 
haymarket said:
That is a second hand interpretation of his statement in which he gave two distinct answers to two distinct questions.

There is no doubt Putin did what he admitted he did, order the interference and attack on the USA .... we have known it for quite a while now and has been confirmed by our intelligence agencies ..... so what are you complaining about in the first place?
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It's not a "second hand" interpretation -- it's an explanation by Russian speakers as to what he actually said.
 
haymarket said:
What were the acts of war that Panama engaged in against the USA?

Russia has declared war against the US with its interference in our elections . There is no difference.
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(Sigh) :no:

There is a difference:

On 15 December, the Panamanian general assembly passed a resolution declaring that the actions of the United States had caused a state of war to exist between Panama and the United States.
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https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_invasion_of_Panama

Recall that in the USA it is the Congress that has the power to declare war, not the President. In effect, the Panamanian "Congress" declared war on the USA. That empowered Bush Sr. to take military action. So we did not invade Panama willy-nilly with no legal justification, we were actually at war with Panama.

Now as to Russia? Have either Congress or the Russian Republic declared that a state of war exists between our nations? Absent this, has Russia actually physically attacked the United States, like Japan did with Pearl Harbor and thus bypassed the normal "declaration" requirement?

If you say their alleged hacking is an act of war, then by your argument we must be in a state of actual war with The Peoples Republic of China, since they have been hacking and otherwise attempting to undermine our nation for years. Would you advocate the arrest of President Xi Jinping if he visits the USA?

Moreover, every time we have acted in similar ways to "influence" the outcomes of any foreign nation's elections, we have engaged in an act of war. We must be at war with most of the nations in South America and half the nations in the world by your logic.

Thus, as no "actual state of war" has been declared, Putin is protected by diplomatic immunity if he is invited to visit the United States.

No action can be taken against him during has visit other than to expel him and subsequently declare him persona non grata from that point forward on pain of arrest. :coffeepap:
 
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Moderate Right said:
Seems like if you were going to accuse someone of being mentally ill then you would try to appear in touch with reality yourself. Just because Trump's sanity is questionable at times doesn't give you license to live in your own opposite fantasy world while the rest of us think that neither one of you have been dealt cards from a full deck.
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Resorting to personal insults at me is not a refutation of my point. Please try to stay on the topic being discussed.
 
Moderate Right said:
Both Russia and the US as well as other countries have tried to influence other countries elections for decades, if not centuries. Why do you think it just started in 2016?
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People have been killing each other for all of history. We still prosecute a killer when we find one just the same.
 
HowardBThiname said:
It's not a "second hand" interpretation -- it's an explanation by Russian speakers as to what he actually said.
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No doubt some are trying to place the toothpaste back into the tube.
 
Captain Adverse said:
(Sigh) :no:

There is a difference:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_invasion_of_Panama

Recall that in the USA it is the Congress that has the power to declare war, not the President. In effect, the Panamanian "Congress" declared war on the USA. That empowered Bush Sr. to take military action. So we did not invade Panama willy-nilly with no legal justification, we were actually at war with Panama.

Now as to Russia? Have either Congress or the Russian Republic declared that a state of war exists between our nations? Absent this, has Russia actually physically attacked the United States, like Japan did with Pearl Harbor and thus bypassed the normal "declaration" requirement?

If you say their alleged hacking is an act of war, then by your argument we must be in a state of actual war with The Peoples Republic of China, since they have been hacking and otherwise attempting to undermine our nation for years. Would you advocate the arrest of President Xi Jinping if he visits the USA?

Moreover, every time we have acted in similar ways to "influence" the outcomes of any foreign nation's elections, we have engaged in an act of war. We must be at war with most of the nations in South America and half the nations in the world by your logic.

Thus, as no "actual state of war" has been declared, Putin is protected by diplomatic immunity if he is invited to visit the United States.

No action can be taken against him during has visit other than to expel him and subsequently declare him persona non grata from that point forward on pain of arrest. :coffeepap:
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No ACTUAL WAR needs to be declared. We have the actions of Russia and no amount of words attached changes their actions.

The Noriega episode shows we can take strong action directly against a leader who we want to target. That precedent has already been sent.
 
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