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How big will this year's deficit be?

Conservative said:
Do you even understand the components of GDP? Stop the left wing bs, and do some research, Look at the dollar growth Trump inherited and you had the gall to say there wasn't significant growth? Wow, you are rapidly becoming a liberal.

Obama GDP growth 4 trillion in 8 years INCLUDING THE STIMULUS which has gov't spending a component of GDP

Trump GDP growth 2.7 trillion in three years WITHOUT massive gov't spending.

Do you not see the difference?
Click to expand...

That's quite a difference, if it's real.
 
Conservative said:
I knew there was a reason I ignore your posts, thanks for proving it, This is a recession under Trump's watch but a pandemic generated recession not an economic one. Your partisan Chicago style BS is on full display. Placing blame is what you do ignoring the results posted that were due to economic policies. Obviously you have no understanding as to the difference between a shutdown and collapse, no reason to continue reading your posts
Click to expand...

The reason why you ignore me is because you have surrendered to me. Just like you ignore obama results of 10,000 added to the dow and 20 million jobs created, bush deficit of 1.4 trillion lowered to 400 trillion. Just like you ignore trump results of 30 million jobs lost and 5 trillion deficit. The results dont matter to partisan hacks like you. You will defend the guy with the R next to his name no matter what. I am a true conservative and you are not. that's why you stopped debating true conservatives like me.
 
99percenter said:
The reason why you ignore me is because you have surrendered to me. Just like you ignore obama results of 10,000 added to the dow and 20 million jobs created, bush deficit of 1.4 trillion lowered to 400 trillion. Just like you ignore trump results of 30 million jobs lost and 5 trillion deficit. The results dont matter to partisan hacks like you. You will defend the guy with the R next to his name no matter what. I am a true conservative and you are not. that's why you stopped debating true conservatives like me.
Click to expand...

Fact is he is so right wing brainwashed he can't for the life of him give any Dem. credit for anything.
He loves to compare the economy under Obama and under Trump
He doesn't realize the Recession Bush ( a Republican ) left Obama was the WORST recession EVER almost a depression and the economy Obama left Trump was in way better shape
I am just about done with him , no matter how many facts you post and how many things you post to back it up you are ALWAYS wrong
Have a nice evening
 
Dittohead not! said:
First, you throw out numbers with no link, then you post a link to the general economic data and expect me to sift through it.
Click to expand...

I thought someone as intelligent as you wouldn't have any problem finding the link under gross domestic product at the link I gave you but since you do have a problem here are the results supporting my claim now where are yours?

Table 1.1.5. Gross Domestic Product
[Billions of dollars]
Bureau of Economic Analysis
Last Revised on: April 29, 2020 - Next Release Date May 28, 2020

Line 2008 2009 2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015 2016 2017 2018 2019
Line
1 Gross domestic product 14712.8 14448.9 14992.1 15542.6 16197 16784.9 17527.3 18224.8 18715 19519.4 20580.2 21427.7
Click to expand...

Obama 14.7 trillion to 18.7 trillion

Trump 18.7 trillion to 21.4 trillion

Do the math or do you want me to do that for you as well?
 
Tbird19482 said:
Fact is he is so right wing brainwashed he can't for the life of him give any Dem. credit for anything.
He loves to compare the economy under Obama and under Trump
He doesn't realize the Recession Bush ( a Republican ) left Obama was the WORST recession EVER almost a depression and the economy Obama left Trump was in way better shape
I am just about done with him , no matter how many facts you post and how many things you post to back it up you are ALWAYS wrong
Have a nice evening
Click to expand...

Please stop showing your ignorance of civics. What was the Democratic Congress doing after taking over in January 2007? You buy what the left tells you even though it makes you look foolish. Why don't you have more concern about your own credibility. I haven't seen any facts from you or him, only opinions, do you know what a fact is?

Post 506 is full of facts not that they matter. You talk about easy brainwashing?? Look in the mirror
 
Conservative said:
Please stop showing your ignorance of civics. What was the Democratic Congress doing after taking over in January 2007? You buy what the left tells you even though it makes you look foolish. Why don't you have more concern about your own credibility. I haven't seen any facts from you or him, only opinions, do you know what a fact is?

Post 506 is full of facts not that they matter. You talk about easy brainwashing?? Look in the mirror
Click to expand...

why don't you stop all your lying
I have posted many facts on here and posted where I got them
I see again you can not give a Dem president any credit for anything but you give a Republican President credit for everything
again if it is something good that happened and we have a Dem President he had nothing to do with it and if it is something bad he did it
and if it is a Republican president and something good happens HE had everything to do with it and if it is bad it was some body else's fault
why can't you admit we would have had a more robust recovery if the Republicans would have worked with Obama and not do every thing they could do to make him a one term President
They didn't give a dang about the American people and what they were going through all they could think about was taking Obama down
Have a nice day
 
Tbird19482 said:
why don't you stop all your lying
I have posted many facts on here and posted where I got them
I see again you can not give a Dem president any credit for anything but you give a Republican President credit for everything
again if it is something good that happened and we have a Dem President he had nothing to do with it and if it is something bad he did it
and if it is a Republican president and something good happens HE had everything to do with it and if it is bad it was some body else's fault
why can't you admit we would have had a more robust recovery if the Republicans would have worked with Obama and not do every thing they could do to make him a one term President
They didn't give a dang about the American people and what they were going through all they could think about was taking Obama down
Have a nice day
Click to expand...

You post facts without context and it is context that matters and shows you to be clueless on this issue. I gave you specifics and links which you ignored. Nothing is going to change your mind thus making you the one brainwashed by the liberal rhetoric. I do feel sorry for you

You keep ignoring actual verifiable data and my history of being a JFK Democrat all out of having a unhealthy love affair with Obama.
 
Conservative said:
I thought someone as intelligent as you wouldn't have any problem finding the link under gross domestic product at the link I gave you but since you do have a problem here are the results supporting my claim now where are yours?



Obama 14.7 trillion to 18.7 trillion

Trump 18.7 trillion to 21.4 trillion

Do the math or do you want me to do that for you as well?
Click to expand...

no, I can do the math. I just don't want to have to do your research for you.

According to your figures: Growth during the Obama years was 4 trillion, or just over 27%.
During the Trump years, prior to the pandemic, it was 2.7 trillion or just over 14%.

Now, what is it you conclude from those figures? I've already shown you a graph showing a steady growth starting in 2008 with no sudden jumps. Your figures are showing the same thing.

Anyway, you can't attribute economic growth to the occupant of the White House.
 
Dittohead not! said:
no, I can do the math. I just don't want to have to do your research for you.

According to your figures: Growth during the Obama years was 4 trillion, or just over 27%.
During the Trump years, prior to the pandemic, it was 2.7 trillion or just over 14%.

Now, what is it you conclude from those figures? I've already shown you a graph showing a steady growth starting in 2008 with no sudden jumps. Your figures are showing the same thing.

Anyway, you can't attribute economic growth to the occupant of the White House.
Click to expand...

LOL, percentage change means what? Dollars matter not percentage and the higher the numerator and Denominator the lower the percentage is going to be yet generate dollar growth.

You focus on Trends but even the trends don't support your claims as the trend in dollar growth dropped in 2016 which is what Trump inherited,

You don't seem to able to admit when wrong and yes you can attribute growth when the occupant in the WH implements pro growth/pro private sector economic policies
 
Conservative said:
LOL, percentage change means what? Dollars matter not percentage and the higher the numerator and Denominator the lower the percentage is going to be yet generate dollar growth.

You focus on Trends but even the trends don't support your claims as the trend in dollar growth dropped in 2016 which is what Trump inherited,

You don't seem to able to admit when wrong and yes you can attribute growth when the occupant in the WH implements pro growth/pro private sector economic policies
Click to expand...

Percentage change means a steady growth starting in 2008, exactly what my chart and your figures show, not that it matters. This nation, despite what some of the so called "conservatives" claim, is a capitalistic nation. The economy is not run by the government, and certainly not by the president.

Tell you what: If you think that percentage growth doesn't matter, then you must think that the dollar growth back in 2008 is worth the same as the same dollar growth in 2020. Now, go try to buy a house for what it cost back in 2008.
 
Dittohead not! said:
Percentage change means a steady growth starting in 2008, exactly what my chart and your figures show, not that it matters. This nation, despite what some of the so called "conservatives" claim, is a capitalistic nation. The economy is not run by the government, and certainly not by the president.

Tell you what: If you think that percentage growth doesn't matter, then you must think that the dollar growth back in 2008 is worth the same as the same dollar growth in 2020. Now, go try to buy a house for what it cost back in 2008.
Click to expand...

Percentage change means nothing compared to dollar growth, you can make $100 this year, 101 next year, 102 the following year and claim upward trends which is what you are trying to do here. Taking GDP growth from 697 billion down to 487 billion is continued growth but declining dollar growth and that is what people see and feel.

You also don't seem to have any understanding for the components of GDP for if you did you would understand the impact the 842 billion dollar shovel ready jobs stimulus had on the Obama GDP growth. The left loves having people like you but thankfully there remains a silent majority that get it and see it in their bank accounts and actions that don't promote dependence
 
Conservative said:
Percentage change means nothing compared to dollar growth, you can make $100 this year, 101 next year, 102 the following year and claim upward trends which is what you are trying to do here. Taking GDP growth from 697 billion down to 487 billion is continued growth but declining dollar growth and that is what people see and feel.

You also don't seem to have any understanding for the components of GDP for if you did you would understand the impact the 842 billion dollar shovel ready jobs stimulus had on the Obama GDP growth. The left loves having people like you but thankfully there remains a silent majority that get it and see it in their bank accounts and actions that don't promote dependence
Click to expand...

You seem to be concerned about the deficit spending under Obama providing for jobs to stimulate the economy, but not for the deficit spending under Trump prior to the pandemic providing for nothing.
 
Conservative said:
Percentage change means nothing compared to dollar growth, you can make $100 this year, 101 next year, 102 the following year and claim upward trends which is what you are trying to do here. Taking GDP growth from 697 billion down to 487 billion is continued growth but declining dollar growth and that is what people see and feel.

You also don't seem to have any understanding for the components of GDP for if you did you would understand the impact the 842 billion dollar shovel ready jobs stimulus had on the Obama GDP growth. The left loves having people like you but thankfully there remains a silent majority that get it and see it in their bank accounts and actions that don't promote dependence
Click to expand...

Ok since percantages dont matter gdp only grew 2 trillion during reagan. So is obama better than reagan?
 
Dittohead not! said:
You seem to be concerned about the deficit spending under Obama providing for jobs to stimulate the economy, but not for the deficit spending under Trump prior to the pandemic providing for nothing.
Click to expand...

Didn't pay any attention to the post I made earlier didn't you? It is about return on that debt and what we got for it. Deficits are made up of both spending and revenue, with the economy shutdown there isn't any revenue going to the federal govt thus the the deficit is going to be huge. Who benefits from a shutdown economy, Trump or Biden?

You keep ignoring official data and results, that is baiting and trolling on your part. Trump's results prior to the pandemic were the best of any President in history for the first three years of any administration but because neither you or the left understands context, you post percentage change and not dollar growth and you promote U-3 percentage for unemployment rather than U-6.

Trump's debt growth pre pandemic was due to entitlement and debt service spending, you keep ignoring that. The benefit to the people however as much greater than Obama's as people were keeping more of what they earned and there was record employment including full time employees. Since you missed the data, here it is again

There seems to be a real disconnect when it comes to debt and the results generated from that debt thus showing that all debt isn't equal. What exactly did the American taxpayers get out of the Obama debt??

1. The worst recovery from a major recession in modern history
2. Employment not getting back to pre recession levels until 2014
3. Record numbers of part time for economic reason employment meaning part time jobs thus lower taxpaying jobs
4. 500 billion average annual GDP growth for 8 years(4.0 Trillion GDP growth)
5. 9.3% U-6 Unemployment rate
6. Bail out of the pubic sector and claimed saved jobs which didn't generate the promised new jobs thus new taxpayers from 842 billion dollar shovel ready jobs stimulus

What have we gotten for the Trump debt

1. Strong economic growth, 900 billion average GDP growth 2017-2018-2019(2.7 trillion growth)
2. Employment of 6.6 million jobs created in 3 years vs. 6 million jobs created prior to taking office the last 9 years
3. 6.9% U-6 vs. 9.3% that he inherited
4. 1.4 million fewer part time for economic reason employees than inherited
5. 6% African American unemployment vs. the 8% inherited
6. Record state and local tax revenue due to consumer spending as a result of the tax cuts
7. No massive Gov't stimulus program pre pandemic

Looks to me like the Trump debt generated better return than Obama's, await your reply?
 
Conservative said:
Didn't pay any attention to the post I made earlier didn't you? It is about return on that debt and what we got for it. Deficits are made up of both spending and revenue, with the economy shutdown there isn't any revenue going to the federal govt thus the the deficit is going to be huge. Who benefits from a shutdown economy, Trump or Biden?

You keep ignoring official data and results, that is baiting and trolling on your part. Trump's results prior to the pandemic were the best of any President in history for the first three years of any administration but because neither you or the left understands context, you post percentage change and not dollar growth and you promote U-3 percentage for unemployment rather than U-6.

Trump's debt growth pre pandemic was due to entitlement and debt service spending, you keep ignoring that. The benefit to the people however as much greater than Obama's as people were keeping more of what they earned and there was record employment including full time employees. Since you missed the data, here it is again

There seems to be a real disconnect when it comes to debt and the results generated from that debt thus showing that all debt isn't equal. What exactly did the American taxpayers get out of the Obama debt??

1. The worst recovery from a major recession in modern history
2. Employment not getting back to pre recession levels until 2014
3. Record numbers of part time for economic reason employment meaning part time jobs thus lower taxpaying jobs
4. 500 billion average annual GDP growth for 8 years(4.0 Trillion GDP growth)
5. 9.3% U-6 Unemployment rate
6. Bail out of the pubic sector and claimed saved jobs which didn't generate the promised new jobs thus new taxpayers from 842 billion dollar shovel ready jobs stimulus

What have we gotten for the Trump debt

1. Strong economic growth, 900 billion average GDP growth 2017-2018-2019(2.7 trillion growth)
2. Employment of 6.6 million jobs created in 3 years vs. 6 million jobs created prior to taking office the last 9 years
3. 6.9% U-6 vs. 9.3% that he inherited
4. 1.4 million fewer part time for economic reason employees than inherited
5. 6% African American unemployment vs. the 8% inherited
6. Record state and local tax revenue due to consumer spending as a result of the tax cuts
7. No massive Gov't stimulus program pre pandemic

Looks to me like the Trump debt generated better return than Obama's, await your reply?
Click to expand...

Of course that's how it looks to you. You're looking at the world through Trump colored glasses. If you looked at your own data critically, you would see that the economy started growing back in 2008 and grew steadily until the pandemic hit. You would see that, while the deficit decreased under Obama, it increased under Trump before the pandemic hit.

But, you can't see those things because you have those Trump blinders on.

You probably think that Mexico is paying for a wall on our southern border and that we now have Trumpcare making sure everyone has access to health care.
 
Conservative said:
What have we gotten for the Trump debt
Click to expand...

100,000+ americans dead because of the trump virus. 40 million americans out of work. negative gdp. $5 trillion deficit. Weakest military in the US history. Our enemies stronger and embolden by trump's pussiness. That's what we have gotten.
 
Dittohead not! said:
Of course that's how it looks to you. You're looking at the world through Trump colored glasses. If you looked at your own data critically, you would see that the economy started growing back in 2008 and grew steadily until the pandemic hit. You would see that, while the deficit decreased under Obama, it increased under Trump before the pandemic hit.

But, you can't see those things because you have those Trump blinders on.

You probably think that Mexico is paying for a wall on our southern border and that we now have Trumpcare making sure everyone has access to health care.
Click to expand...

Trump colored glasses? What exactly would those be and why is it that official data doesn't resonate with you? You challenged me on the GDP numbers and ignored the link and the official BEA.gov spreadsheet posted. You seem to be looking at everything through those rosy California glasses that you have where liberal social results are ignored.

This thread is all about blaming Trump for the deficit during the pandemic and shows total ignorance of the results pre pandemic. No matter what data I posted you won't buy it including why the deficits rose during Trump's two budget years and your total lack of objectivity in reviewing the Obama and Trump deficits and debt, what the American people got for both.

You show a typical liberal ignorance regarding the private sector and seem to lean on the need for California style liberal economic and social policies. The fifth largest economy in the world isn't reaching the people that the left claims they want to help. Why should we re-elect a career politician to the Presidency?

Seems that when I post official data it is called Trump blinders. Why is it that official results don't resonate with you? The love affair you and the rest of the left have with Obama and liberalism is staggering ignorance as to the true role of the Presidency and of individual state governors
 
Conservative said:
Seems that when I post official data it is called Trump blinders. Why is it that official results don't resonate with you? The love affair you and the rest of the left have with Obama and liberalism is staggering ignorance as to the true role of the Presidency and of individual state governors
Click to expand...

Obama has nothing to do with this thread. You're just incapable of having an actual discussion, and so the only strategy you can put forth is to deflect to your army of cherry-picked strawmen.

Remember:

ea4af4065e.png
 
Kushinator said:
Obama has nothing to do with this thread. You're just incapable of having an actual discussion, and so the only strategy you can put forth is to deflect to your army of cherry-picked strawmen.

Remember:

ea4af4065e.png
Click to expand...

There seems to be a real disconnect when it comes to debt and the results generated from that debt thus showing that all debt isn't equal. What exactly did the American taxpayers get out of the Obama debt??

1. The worst recovery from a major recession in modern history
2. Employment not getting back to pre recession levels until 2014
3. Record numbers of part time for economic reason employment meaning part time jobs thus lower taxpaying jobs
4. 500 billion average annual GDP growth for 8 years(4.0 Trillion GDP growth)
5. 9.3% U-6 Unemployment rate
6. Bail out of the pubic sector and claimed saved jobs which didn't generate the promised new jobs thus new taxpayers from 842 billion dollar shovel ready jobs stimulus

What have we gotten for the Trump debt

1. Strong economic growth, 900 billion average GDP growth 2017-2018-2019(2.7 trillion growth)
2. Employment of 6.6 million jobs created in 3 years vs. 6 million jobs created prior to taking office the last 9 years
3. 6.9% U-6 vs. 9.3% that he inherited
4. 1.4 million fewer part time for economic reason employees than inherited
5. 6% African American unemployment vs. the 8% inherited
6. Record state and local tax revenue due to consumer spending as a result of the tax cuts
7. No massive Gov't stimulus program pre pandemic

Looks to me like the Trump debt generated better return than Obama's, await your reply?
 
Kushinator said:
Yep. You are disconnected from reality.

ea4af4065e.png
Click to expand...

Here is reality, yours is fiction

There seems to be a real disconnect when it comes to debt and the results generated from that debt thus showing that all debt isn't equal. What exactly did the American taxpayers get out of the Obama debt??

1. The worst recovery from a major recession in modern history
2. Employment not getting back to pre recession levels until 2014
3. Record numbers of part time for economic reason employment meaning part time jobs thus lower taxpaying jobs
4. 500 billion average annual GDP growth for 8 years(4.0 Trillion GDP growth)
5. 9.3% U-6 Unemployment rate
6. Bail out of the pubic sector and claimed saved jobs which didn't generate the promised new jobs thus new taxpayers from 842 billion dollar shovel ready jobs stimulus

What have we gotten for the Trump debt

1. Strong economic growth, 900 billion average GDP growth 2017-2018-2019(2.7 trillion growth)
2. Employment of 6.6 million jobs created in 3 years vs. 6 million jobs created prior to taking office the last 9 years
3. 6.9% U-6 vs. 9.3% that he inherited
4. 1.4 million fewer part time for economic reason employees than inherited
5. 6% African American unemployment vs. the 8% inherited
6. Record state and local tax revenue due to consumer spending as a result of the tax cuts
7. No massive Gov't stimulus program pre pandemic

Looks to me like the Trump debt generated better return than Obama's, await your reply?
 
Kushinator said:
ea4af4065e.png
Click to expand...

He keeps wanting to compare apples to oranges
You can't compare coming out of the worst recession EVER , almost a depression to one that has recovered and going good, it wasn't going " Great " like Trump says but it was going good
Yes it was a slow recovery nobody disputes that
again maybe IF the Republicans would have given two ----- about the American people and not done everything they could to destroy Obama we could have had a lot better recovery and it would have been better , faster, and more robust but they didn't
have a nice afternoon
 
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