How big will this year's deficit be?

[Conservative]

He keeps wanting to compare apples to oranges
You can't compare coming out of the worst recession EVER , almost a depression to one that has recovered and going good, it wasn't going " Great " like Trump says but it was going good
Yes it was a slow recovery nobody disputes that
again maybe IF the Republicans would have given two ----- about the American people and not done everything they could to destroy Obama we could have had a lot better recovery and it would have been better , faster, and more robust but they didn't
have a nice afternoon

And your love affair with Obama is stunning, prove the information posted false. did the Democrats give a **** about the American people when they took over Congress in 2007?

There seems to be a real disconnect when it comes to debt and the results generated from that debt thus showing that all debt isn't equal. What exactly did the American taxpayers get out of the Obama debt??

1. The worst recovery from a major recession in modern history
2. Employment not getting back to pre recession levels until 2014
3. Record numbers of part time for economic reason employment meaning part time jobs thus lower taxpaying jobs
4. 500 billion average annual GDP growth for 8 years(4.0 Trillion GDP growth)
5. 9.3% U-6 Unemployment rate
6. Bail out of the pubic sector and claimed saved jobs which didn't generate the promised new jobs thus new taxpayers from 842 billion dollar shovel ready jobs stimulus

What have we gotten for the Trump debt

1. Strong economic growth, 900 billion average GDP growth 2017-2018-2019(2.7 trillion growth)
2. Employment of 6.6 million jobs created in 3 years vs. 6 million jobs created prior to taking office the last 9 years
3. 6.9% U-6 vs. 9.3% that he inherited
4. 1.4 million fewer part time for economic reason employees than inherited
5. 6% African American unemployment vs. the 8% inherited
6. Record state and local tax revenue due to consumer spending as a result of the tax cuts
7. No massive Gov't stimulus program pre pandemic

Looks to me like the Trump debt generated better return than Obama's, await your reply?

 

[Dittohead not!]

Trump colored glasses? What exactly would those be and why is it that official data doesn't resonate with you? You challenged me on the GDP numbers and ignored the link and the official BEA.gov spreadsheet posted. You seem to be looking at everything through those rosy California glasses that you have where liberal social results are ignored.

This thread is all about blaming Trump for the deficit during the pandemic and shows total ignorance of the results pre pandemic. No matter what data I posted you won't buy it including why the deficits rose during Trump's two budget years and your total lack of objectivity in reviewing the Obama and Trump deficits and debt, what the American people got for both.

You show a typical liberal ignorance regarding the private sector and seem to lean on the need for California style liberal economic and social policies. The fifth largest economy in the world isn't reaching the people that the left claims they want to help. Why should we re-elect a career politician to the Presidency?

Seems that when I post official data it is called Trump blinders. Why is it that official results don't resonate with you? The love affair you and the rest of the left have with Obama and liberalism is staggering ignorance as to the true role of the Presidency and of individual state governors

I was blaming Trump for the deficit before the pandemic. I thought I'd made that one pretty clear.
I'm not rejecting the GDP numbers, just your interpretation of those numbers.
Trump is about as far left as any president we've had thus far.
Liberal politics in California hasn't kept this state from having a higher GDP than most major nations. Were it an independent country, it would be one of the wealthiest in the world. We've been all over that already, and your pointing out the poor and homeless just makes you sound like a bleeding heart liberal.

 

[Conservative]

I was blaming Trump for the deficit before the pandemic. I thought I'd made that one pretty clear.
I'm not rejecting the GDP numbers, just your interpretation of those numbers.
Trump is about as far left as any president we've had thus far.
Liberal politics in California hasn't kept this state from having a higher GDP than most major nations. Were it an independent country, it would be one of the wealthiest in the world. We've been all over that already, and your pointing out the poor and homeless just makes you sound like a bleeding heart liberal.

My interpretation? Where are yours?

You are right about California keeping the high GDP growth, the problem is liberalism promotes the redistribution of wealth to those less fortunate but is generating liberal results, multi millionaire public servants and dependent people. Your state is force taxpayers to leave and then expecting the federal taxpayers to bail the state out. It isn't about being a bleeding heart liberal it is about the fraud of the liberal ideology on display

I gave you a comparison between Obama and Trump debt, and still no response.

 

[Dittohead not!]

My interpretation? Where are yours?

You are right about California keeping the high GDP growth, the problem is liberalism promotes the redistribution of wealth to those less fortunate but is generating liberal results, multi millionaire public servants and dependent people. Your state is force taxpayers to leave and then expecting the federal taxpayers to bail the state out. It isn't about being a bleeding heart liberal it is about the fraud of the liberal ideology on display

I gave you a comparison between Obama and Trump debt, and still no response.

I've given you my interpretation many times. There was a steady growth in the economy starting in 2008. You just don't believe it despite what your own figures are saying.

What you're saying about California and wealth disparity indicates you think it's not liberal enough.

The difference between debt accrued during the Obama Administration and that accrued between 2016 and the pandemic is that the former was due to a deep recession. The latter was during relative prosperity and no crises to deal with.

 

[Conservative]

I've given you my interpretation many times. There was a steady growth in the economy starting in 2008. You just don't believe it despite what your own figures are saying.

What you're saying about California and wealth disparity indicates you think it's not liberal enough.

The difference between debt accrued during the Obama Administration and that accrued between 2016 and the pandemic is that the former was due to a deep recession. The latter was during relative prosperity and no crises to deal with.

The problem is your definition of steady growth which I refuted with very simple math. Steady growth was due mostly to gov't spending not consumer spending and coming off a recession the difference between Obama and Reagan recovery was stark. Seems the problem you have is with context totally ignoring the impact of gov't spending on GDP growth

A deep recession was 81-82 affecting millions and millions of Americans. Obama and the left has no clue how the private sector works and that is why the so called deep recession recovery by Obama was so poor, the worst in modern history

Liberal definition of steady is typical, very low expectations and very poor results

 

[Dittohead not!]

The problem is your definition of steady growth which I refuted with very simple math. Steady growth was due mostly to gov't spending not consumer spending and coming off a recession the difference between Obama and Reagan recovery was stark. Seems the problem you have is with context totally ignoring the impact of gov't spending on GDP growth

A deep recession was 81-82 affecting millions and millions of Americans. Obama and the left has no clue how the private sector works and that is why the so called deep recession recovery by Obama was so poor, the worst in modern history

Liberal definition of steady is typical, very low expectations and very poor results

The liberal definition of steady growth is an increase from one year to the next to the next. The conservative definition may be different from that.

If the growth during the Obama Administration is due to government spending, then the same is true during the Trump administration. In both administrations, the government was spending more than it was taking in. Deficit spending is seen as a way to stimulate the economy during a recession. During continued good economic growth, it's not necessary. The spending during the Trump Administration was not necessary as the recession had already been ended by then.

 

[Conservative]

The liberal definition of steady growth is an increase from one year to the next to the next. The conservative definition may be different from that.

If the growth during the Obama Administration is due to government spending, then the same is true during the Trump administration. In both administrations, the government was spending more than it was taking in. Deficit spending is seen as a way to stimulate the economy during a recession. During continued good economic growth, it's not necessary. The spending during the Trump Administration was not necessary as the recession had already been ended by then.

Yes that is the definition, here is reality, employment positive trend, reality part time for economic reasons were most of the jobs created. People getting part time jobs boosted the employment and lowered the unemployment rate, Democrats touted that, the public got it and rejected the Obama economic results

Obama average growth 500 billion per year in 8 years, Trump 900 billion per year in 3. Seems like another simple result to understand but apparently not.

Components of GDP Consumer spending/Consumption, Gov't spending, Trade, Business investment

Trump GDP growth due to consumer spending/Consumption and less gov't spending than Obama whose GDP growth was due to the 842 billion stimulus. Seems like a simple concept to understand but too difficult for you

I am going to show you how easy it is to admit when wrong, I have stated many times that liberals are book smart, I was wrong, SEE?? Liberals have very low expectations with Democrat economics and rightly so. How do you explain Obama losing the House in 10-12-14-16 and the Senate in 14-16 with that steady upward trend?

 

[Far right dem]

Yes that is the definition, here is reality, employment positive trend, reality part time for economic reasons were most of the jobs created. People getting part time jobs boosted the employment and lowered the unemployment rate, Democrats touted that, the public got it and rejected the Obama economic results

Obama average growth 500 billion per year in 8 years, Trump 900 billion per year in 3. Seems like another simple result to understand but apparently not.

Components of GDP Consumer spending/Consumption, Gov't spending, Trade, Business investment

Trump GDP growth due to consumer spending/Consumption and less gov't spending than Obama whose GDP growth was due to the 842 billion stimulus. Seems like a simple concept to understand but too difficult for you

I am going to show you how easy it is to admit when wrong, I have stated many times that liberals are book smart, I was wrong, SEE?? Liberals have very low expectations with Democrat economics and rightly so. How do you explain Obama losing the House in 10-12-14-16 and the Senate in 14-16 with that steady upward trend?

What about trump losing the house in 18 because of his failed economic policies?

 

[Dittohead not!]

Yes that is the definition, here is reality, employment positive trend, reality part time for economic reasons were most of the jobs created. People getting part time jobs boosted the employment and lowered the unemployment rate, Democrats touted that, the public got it and rejected the Obama economic results

Obama average growth 500 billion per year in 8 years, Trump 900 billion per year in 3. Seems like another simple result to understand but apparently not.

Components of GDP Consumer spending/Consumption, Gov't spending, Trade, Business investment

Trump GDP growth due to consumer spending/Consumption and less gov't spending than Obama whose GDP growth was due to the 842 billion stimulus. Seems like a simple concept to understand but too difficult for you

I am going to show you how easy it is to admit when wrong, I have stated many times that liberals are book smart, I was wrong, SEE?? Liberals have very low expectations with Democrat economics and rightly so. How do you explain Obama losing the House in 10-12-14-16 and the Senate in 14-16 with that steady upward trend?

You aren't doing a very good job of admitting it when you're wrong, as you keep posting the same false information over and over.

Since Obamacare became law, "most of our new jobs have been part-time jobs."

 

[Conservative]

You aren't doing a very good job of admitting it when you're wrong, as you keep posting the same false information over and over.

Since Obamacare became law, "most of our new jobs have been part-time jobs."

Good Lord, you people and your total ignorance of the official data, you ought to know better by now that question me on official data. Learn how to do research and stop buying liberal rhetoric. Proved that Obama GDP was 500 billion per year vs Trump's 900 billion and you refused to acknowledge. Now the U-3 which includes part time for economic reasons being 7-9 million. He left us with 152 million employed and of that 5.7 million were part time jobs. Total jobs created since the recession started was 6 million,

Your love affair with Obama is cult like

Labor Force Statistics from the Current Population Survey
Original Data Value

Series Id: LNS12032194
Seasonally Adjusted
Series title: (Seas) Employment Level - Part-Time for Economic Reasons, All Industries
Labor force status: Employed
Type of data: Number in thousands
Age: 16 years and over
Hours at work: 1 to 34 hours
Reasons work not as scheduled: Economic reasons
Worker status/schedules: At work part time
Years: 2008 to 2019
`
Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec
2008 4846 4902 4904 5220 5286 5540 5930 5851 6148 6690 7311 8029
2009 8046 8796 9145 8908 9113 9024 8891 9029 8847 8979 9114 9098
2010 8530 8936 9233 9178 8845 8577 8500 8800 9246 8837 8873 8935
2011 8470 8464 8645 8652 8576 8427 8281 8788 9166 8657 8447 8171
2012 8305 8238 7775 7913 8101 8072 8082 7974 8671 8203 8166 7943
2013 8151 8178 7722 7964 7937 8103 8099 7816 7764 7936 7718 7827
2014 7296 7299 7435 7509 7254 7422 7402 7177 7020 7025 6898 6856
2015 6808 6671 6629 6608 6628 6383 6249 6423 6043 5811 6174 6084
2016 5941 5978 6066 6006 6467 5748 5926 5995 5918 5971 5738 5621
2017 5753 5603 5455 5279 5234 5266 5281 5237 5179 4912 4866 4986
2018 4982 5115 4969 4952 4920 4736 4588 4368 4656 4630 4781 4657
2019 5147 4310 4499 4654 4355 4347 3984 4381 4350 4438 4322 4148
2020 4182

 

[Tbird19482]

You aren't doing a very good job of admitting it when you're wrong, as you keep posting the same false information over and over.

Since Obamacare became law, "most of our new jobs have been part-time jobs."

Come on now WE all know Conservative is ALWAYS right ( at least in his mind ) Just ask him
he will tell you he is
You can post all the facts in the world and if he doesn't agree with them he will try to chang the subject or belittle you
Have a good evening

 

[Dittohead not!]

Good Lord, you people and your total ignorance of the official data, you ought to know better by now that question me on official data. Learn how to do research and stop buying liberal rhetoric. Proved that Obama GDP was 500 billion per year vs Trump's 900 billion and you refused to acknowledge. Now the U-3 which includes part time for economic reasons being 7-9 million. He left us with 152 million employed and of that 5.7 million were part time jobs. Total jobs created since the recession started was 6 million,

Your love affair with Obama is cult like

The post you quoted didn't mention Obama. It is Politifact. I can see where a self described conservative wouldn't like that, as it uses the F word, which is not allowed in conservative circles.

Spoiler

F word = Fact

Your figures did not show that the economy suddenly went from 500 billion growth to 900 billion when Trump was elected, nor that the presidents were the cause.

 

[Dittohead not!]

Come on now WE all know Conservative is ALWAYS right ( at least in his mind ) Just ask him
he will tell you he is
You can post all the facts in the world and if he doesn't agree with them he will try to chang the subject or belittle you
Have a good evening

Can't use the F word. Conservatives (self described) don't like it.

 

[swing_voter]

How big will this year's deficit be?



A bigger question is: why do they keep lending us money?

Because when all the borrowers are questionable, the least questionable borrower is the safest bet.

 

[Conservative]

The post you quoted didn't mention Obama. It is Politifact. I can see where a self described conservative wouldn't like that, as it uses the F word, which is not allowed in conservative circles.

Spoiler

F word = Fact

Your figures did not show that the economy suddenly went from 500 billion growth to 900 billion when Trump was elected, nor that the presidents were the cause.

Politifact doesn't trump BLS, this is getting old and tiring as facts don't seem to resonate with you. Never said the results went directly from 500 billion to 900 billion, that is the average for Obama's term and Trump's and that includes gov't spending although they did go from 487 billion growth to 840 billion growth then over a trillion in 2018. You really need to learn how to do research from official sites

This has to be an act and you are baiting me right? Bls.gov doesn't lie, nor does Bea.gov which is Treasury.

 

[Conservative]

Can't use the F word. Conservatives (self described) don't like it.

Only in the liberal world does the bureau of labor statistics and bureau of economic analysis provide false data

 

[Dittohead not!]

Only in the liberal world does the bureau of labor statistics and bureau of economic analysis provide false data

It's not the data that are false. It's your interpretation of the data and the conclusions you're drawing that are faulty.

 

[Conservative]

It's not the data that are false. It's your interpretation of the data and the conclusions you're drawing that are faulty.

LOL, so you interpret it for me, Keep hearing this from book smart liberals who after all these years don't show a lot of book smarts? that is the comment the left makes when they have no answer. You are rapidly becoming one. Must be in the polluted California air

 

[Dittohead not!]

LOL, so you interpret it for me, Keep hearing this from book smart liberals who after all these years don't show a lot of book smarts? that is the comment the left makes when they have no answer. You are rapidly becoming one. Must be in the polluted California air

I've already interpreted it for you, based on "book smarts," as opposed to simply believing what you want to believe based on some ideology.

 

[Conservative]

I've already interpreted it for you, based on "book smarts," as opposed to simply believing what you want to believe based on some ideology.

No, you didn't interpret anything and fail to admit you were wrong. I admitted I was wrong and will do it again, I believed you were smarter than you appear, I was wrong

 

[Dittohead not!]

No, you didn't interpret anything and fail to admit you were wrong. I admitted I was wrong and will do it again, I believed you were smarter than you appear, I was wrong

and you are wrong about Trump having brought about economic growth. What do you think he did that helped the economy?

 

[Kushinator]

No, you didn't interpret anything and fail to admit you were wrong. I admitted I was wrong and will do it again, I believed you were smarter than you appear, I was wrong

You've rejected anything that paints the Trump administration in the poor light you yourself have constructed. On every single basis of comparison, the Trump economy performed roughly about the same as the Obama economy prior to the pandemic... other than the deficit.

Had the economy been suffering from an aggregate supply shortfall, tax cuts and regulation would have driven the economy to the point where deficits would fall as revenues would grow to reflect a boom.

But it didn't happen. And you pretend that it did. Nominal GDP isn't a metric that can be used to make historical comparison. This would be covered in a freshman macro course or sophomore economic statistics course. Nevertheless... your comparison is invalid and therefore your argument fails.

 

[Conservative]

and you are wrong about Trump having brought about economic growth. What do you think he did that helped the economy?

You wouldn't understand it because you don't understand incentive and the private sector

 

[Conservative]

You've rejected anything that paints the Trump administration in the poor light you yourself have constructed. On every single basis of comparison, the Trump economy performed roughly about the same as the Obama economy prior to the pandemic... other than the deficit.

Had the economy been suffering from an aggregate supply shortfall, tax cuts and regulation would have driven the economy to the point where deficits would fall as revenues would grow to reflect a boom.

But it didn't happen. And you pretend that it did. Nominal GDP isn't a metric that can be used to make historical comparison. This would be covered in a freshman macro course or sophomore economic statistics course. Nevertheless... your comparison is invalid and therefore your argument fails.

Have to tell you again, I admit when I am wrong and when I said you were book smart I was wrong. You aren't book smart at all and have no understanding of the private sector

 

[Kushinator]

Have to tell you again, I admit when I am wrong and when I said you were book smart I was wrong. You aren't book smart at all and have no understanding of the private sector

And once again you refuse to address anything i stated, and once again you address me personally. Your concession is noted.