Hope is ending ....

[Cable]

Your speal reminds me of Jurrassic Park...Dr. Ian Malcolm: Oh, yeah. Oooh, ahhh, that's how it always starts. Then later there's running and um, screaming. If Trump can keep us out of recession or a major terror attack for a few years, I will eat my words. But until then beware..We are dealing with a leader devoid of empathy or even decency and anything can happen.

No cadidate could accomplish your two wishes. We are destined for a monetary collapse. BO doubled the debt in his frantic thrashing to stave off collapse, and he was successful. But he leaves a real house of cards for Trump to try and hold up. With the crash may come many things. Time to keep an eye open.

 

[Moderate Right]

So what you are saying is that Trump has a chance to set things right; back to where they should have remained all along.

Perhaps this wisdom of the electorate that so much talked about isn't all just so much hyperbole, in that recognizing what you've described, they've elected someone who might be able to set things right, once again.

Or perhaps not. I'm actually satisfied that he turn back or halt the advance of the leftists, excessive PC correct direction, and it would seem the majority of electorate would agree, for quite some time already.



If so many are thinking that the nation is going in the wrong direction, how wise is it to run an 'establishment' candidate, who promises just more of the same?

According to lefties, since Obama was president, the lefties believed that those saying that we were on the wrong track were talking about the Republican Congress. Apparently the voters didn't agree with that assessment.

 

[Master PO]

So what you are saying is that Trump has a chance to set things right; back to where they should have remained all along.

Perhaps this wisdom of the electorate that so much talked about isn't all just so much hyperbole, in that recognizing what you've described, they've elected someone who might be able to set things right, once again.

Or perhaps not. I'm actually satisfied that he turn back or halt the advance of the leftists, excessive PC correct direction, and it would seem the majority of electorate would agree, for quite some time already.



If so many are thinking that the nation is going in the wrong direction, how wise is it to run an 'establishment' candidate, who promises just more of the same?

well i am not saying he will set things right, he and congress have the ability to do that to do what is right by the constitution, however i don't expect it because it would mean the dismantling of some of the federal government, and government never wants to shrink.

so iam not trying to project trump is the right man for America because George w. bush was in the same spot, and he did not do the right thing by the constitution, but instead grew the federal government further outside the constitution.

but what i have said is the left has moved our federal government to a position it was never meant to be in, involved directly with the people

if the American people had not allowed the federal government to grow outside of the constitution, then Trump, Obama, Bush, Reagan, and many others in their execution of their duties would have little to no effect on us all, which is what the plan of the constitutional convention.

 

[iguanaman]

No cadidate could accomplish your two wishes. We are destined for a monetary collapse. BO doubled the debt in his frantic thrashing to stave off collapse, and he was successful. But he leaves a real house of cards for Trump to try and hold up. With the crash may come many things. Time to keep an eye open.

You are already making excuses for the mess Trump is gong to make of the economy I see. Why is it that Republicans always screw it up? Could it be that they do it on purpose so the billionaires can grab more assets cheap? It amazes me how you bend over and let the wealthy steal your livelihoods, when are you going to learn?

 

[Cable]

You are already making excuses for the mess Trump is gong to make of the economy I see. Why is it that Republicans always screw it up? Could it be that they do it on purpose so the billionaires can grab more assets cheap? It amazes me how you bend over and let the wealthy steal your livelihoods, when are you going to learn?

Are you in denial about Obama having to use the drastic act of doubling the debt just to keep if from failing on his watch? I won't be surprised if Trump does the same to save his 4 years, but at some point the reckoning will happen.
I know you have your talking points to hit, but try to think along the way. Your double dealing logic failed you this election. Learn from it.

 

[iguanaman]

Are you in denial about Obama having to use the drastic act of doubling the debt just to keep if from failing on his watch? I won't be surprised if Trump does the same to save his 4 years, but at some point the reckoning will happen.
I know you have your talking points to hit, but try to think along the way. Your double dealing logic failed you this election. Learn from it.

Obama has cut the deficit more than any other President ever. No Republican has left office with the deficit lower than when he arrived. Trump has been handed a economy with low unemployment, rising wages and GDP growth that is the highest in the free world. It is up to Trump to IMPROVE those numbers because that is why he was elected and it is what he promised to do. If he cannot he is a failure and you cannot deny that.

 

[Moderate Right]

You are already making excuses for the mess Trump is gong to make of the economy I see. Why is it that Republicans always screw it up? Could it be that they do it on purpose so the billionaires can grab more assets cheap? It amazes me how you bend over and let the wealthy steal your livelihoods, when are you going to learn?

The Republicans always screw up? Since 2010 they have taken over almost every state, they have taken over the presidency, the House, and the Senate. If they are the ones screwing up, how do you explain that? Oh, please say that it is the voters screwing up. I love it when the left blames the voters for their own mistakes.

 

[Visbek]

Hope is over now according to Michelle O.

What she doesn't get, and what Hillary didn't get ("Why aren't I 50 points ahead?"), is that this is a repudiation of Progressive Globalism.

You mean, by the nearly 3 million more people who voted for Clinton than Trump?

You should also keep in mind that globalism is not a progressive concept, it's nonpartisan. In fact, progressives have spent years fighting against globalism, which they see as exploitation of foreign and non-union labor; as a strike against American unions; as problematic for environmental protections. In contrast, conservatives and Republicans have pushed for free markets and free trade for decades, including voting in large numbers for NAFTA and other trade agreements. Bill Clinton's support of NAFTA was in no small part a pivot to

It is true that some people are tired of losing their jobs. However, Trump's protectionism will not improve their job prospects, it will actually exacerbate their situation. Tariffs have never worked, and will just kill off jobs for workers that export goods and services, while increasing the cost of goods across the board.

You hear the Progressives crying about a Russian hack influencing the election, and to some extent, rightfully so. But the main stream media has been influencing elections for quite some time, and they have now lost their reputations over it.

Uh, yes, it's the media's job to report and provide opinions about elections. They are accountable to their readers for what they report. The idea that Putin is in any way comparable to Woodward and Bernstein is absurd.

There is also little sign that anyone has "lost their reputations" over this; e.g. the New York Times gained tens of thousands of subscribers after the election. What's happened is that individual media companies have gradually dispersed their influence, as we've gone from 3 major TV networks and three nationally influential newspapers (NYT, WaPo, Chicago Trib) to a dozen news channels and hundreds of websites. The people screaming about "lost reputations" are the ones that are reading fake news instead of real news, and haven't cared about the NYT for a long time -- not because the reporting is wrong, but because it's saying things they don't want to hear.

People aren't stupid.

That doesn't mean they are well-informed.

We now have hope for jobs vs. a fear of the environment failing. Yes, global warming is real, and it's been going on for thousands of years. Deal with it.
America is a nation. To heck with the globalists. They are getting a spanking all over the glove now. Amen.

If we actually followed this logic, then 2008 and 2012 should have been taken as massive mandates for progressivism, as Obama spanked McCain and Romney. Conservatives should have completely given up all economic hope; climate change deniers should have thrown in the towel, and so forth.

As to the idea that Trump is a triumph of hope over fear -- what are you smoking? He spent his entire campaign fearmongering about Mexicans, Muslims, Clinton, and pretty much everything except Putin. His "hope" is indulging in nostalgia for a time that a) was not great for a lot of Americans, and b) is not coming back.

And what will you do, when Trump's policies wind up providing few jobs for those unemployed aging white male workers, and lines the pockets of the wealthy?

 

[iguanaman]

The Republicans always screw up? Since 2010 they have taken over almost every state, they have taken over the presidency, the House, and the Senate. If they are the ones screwing up, how do you explain that? Oh, please say that it is the voters screwing up. I love it when the left blames the voters for their own mistakes.

Voting against your own best interests is a mistake and that is what Trump's win was. Foolish voters voting to put themselves out of a job. You will see soon enough. The wage growth that is starting cannot be allowed to stand, and another recession will take care of it handily. If it is bad enough we might lose our social safety net too. This will cause a revolution and the people won't believe right wing lies anymore.

 

[Moderate Right]

Voting against your own best interests is a mistake and that is what Trump's win was. Foolish voters voting to put themselves out of a job. You will see soon enough. The wage growth that is starting cannot be allowed to stand, and another recession will take care of it handily. If it is bad enough we might lose our social safety net too. This will cause a revolution and the people won't believe right wing lies anymore.

Talk about lies. You just state the normal liberal fear mongering. The safety net will be gone. Social security will be gone. The poor will starve in the streets. There jobs will be taken away. Immigrants will be rounded up and deported. There will be a war on women. Etc. Etc. Doesn't your side ever get tired of spewing the lies? Voters have begun to realize that that is all the Democrats and the mainstream media do - lie, lie, lie. And now you have even started calling your very own Democratic voters racists and bigots for voting for Trump.

 

[iguanaman]

Talk about lies. You just state the normal liberal fear mongering. The safety net will be gone. Social security will be gone. The poor will starve in the streets. There jobs will be taken away. Immigrants will be rounded up and deported. There will be a war on women. Etc. Etc. Doesn't your side ever get tired of spewing the lies? Voters have begun to realize that that is all the Democrats and the mainstream media do - lie, lie, lie. And now you have even started calling your very own Democratic voters racists and bigots for voting for Trump.

Facts are facts and employment has risen under Democratic Presidents and fallen under Republican ones. Now you can lie your way out of that. Because lies are the only thing you have. When the jobs start falling under Trump you can lie about that too. Democrats that voted for Trump are just fools that believe the words of a conman and have very short memories. I feel sorry for what they have done to themselves. You on the other hand deserve whatever hardships Trump brings you....

Each party has held the presidency for the same number of years since 1945. During those years, the unemployment rate has risen 11.8% under Republican presidents and has fallen 7.2% under Democratic presidents. Unemployment has fallen during the overwhelming majority of Democratic years since 1949. Unemployment rose steadily under Republicans up until 1982, then fell during the remaining Reagan years, and then rose again under both Bush Presidents.

The stark gap between the performance of the parties on unemployment may be surprising to many people. But, it really should not. Unemployment has dropped dramatically under both Presidents Clinton and Obama and rose drastically under President Bush Jr.

Unemployment by Party of President

 

[Moderate Right]

Facts are facts and employment has risen under Democratic Presidents and fallen under Republican ones. Now you can lie your way out of that. Because lies are the only thing you have. When the jobs start falling under Trump you can lie about that too. Democrats that voted for Trump are just fools that believe the words of a conman and have very short memories. I feel sorry for what they have done to themselves. You on the other hand deserve whatever hardships Trump brings you....

Unemployment by Party of President

You forgot the real facts. The fact that Republicans own most of the states. The Republicans own the presidency. The Republicans own the Senate. The Republicans own the House. The Republicans are going to own the Supreme Court. The Republicans will probably add more to those totals come 2018. Spout all the facts you want but the facts are voters have voted out the bums and voted in the Republicans. Now those are facts and they are eating you alive.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

You forgot the real facts. The fact that Republicans own most of the states. The Republicans own the presidency. The Republicans own the Senate. The Republicans own the House. The Republicans are going to own the Supreme Court. The Republicans will probably add more to those totals come 2018. Spout all the facts you want but the facts are voters have voted out the bums and voted in the Republicans. Now those are facts and they are eating you alive.

None of which is even remotely relevant to what he stated.

Why do you live in fear of the facts he presented?

 

[Moderate Right]

None of which is even remotely relevant to what he stated.

Why do you live in fear of the facts he presented?

Why do you ignore the fact that the voters have rejected Democratic liberalism? That's your loss, not mine. If you can't learn from your mistakes you are doomed to repeat them. Long live the Republicans! No matter how many cherry picked facts you want to present it still doesn't change the fact that voters have given Republicans the governorships, their state houses, the presidency, the House, the Senate, the Supreme Court, and so far 2018 is looking even better. All you have left is your minority opinion and your cherry picked facts that voters rejected.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

Why do you ignore the fact that the voters have rejected Democratic liberalism?

Why are you lying about me ignoring anything?

That's your loss, not mine. If you can't learn from your mistakes you are doomed to repeat them. Long live the Republicans! No matter how many cherry picked facts you want to present it still doesn't change the fact that voters have given Republicans the governorships, their state houses, the presidency, the House, the Senate, the Supreme Court, and so far 2018 is looking even better. All you have left is your minority opinion and your cherry picked facts that voters rejected.

Thanks for proving my point.

 

[Moderate Right]

Why are you lying about me ignoring anything?

Thanks for proving my point.

You're welcome. I feel better now that you have come around to understanding reality. I wasn't sure there for a while.

 

[Cable]

Obama has cut the deficit more than any other President ever. No Republican has left office with the deficit lower than when he arrived. Trump has been handed a economy with low unemployment, rising wages and GDP growth that is the highest in the free world. It is up to Trump to IMPROVE those numbers because that is why he was elected and it is what he promised to do. If he cannot he is a failure and you cannot deny that.

Do you have a link to support your BO deficit claims? I could use a little entertainment.
I will grant you this, BO had no choice in much of the debt increase. Had he done anything major about it the economy would have collapsed.
Trump is in the same position. The dollar will collapse at some point, and it fun to speculate when that event will occur. But Trump will do what BO has done, and play along for the most part.
The Fed is raising rates, but it's a token effort and not the measures that are needed to ensure the survival of the U.S. dollar. It will give them a little ammunition when the day of reckoning comes, but it won't be enough. At best it will delay the inevitable.
You can accuse me of apologizing for Trump in advance, but it's been going on for decades. Volker was the one who attempted to put it right, or at least appeared to want to put it right.
But our economy and the worlds economy could not withstand such a drastic measure today without so much pain and crying by the People that it will just never happen.
If it does, good. But likely it won't. It will be easier to let the dollar fail, and pick up the pieces with a new dollar. It will be interesting whether it will be backed by precious metals or guns. I guess both of those metals are precious.

My point is this, and it is part of the reason Hillary lost: Many liberals and conservatives focus on the minutia, and lose the big picture. And that is of course what makes those in power most happy. Blissful ignorance in the people.

 

[Cable]

... The people screaming about "lost reputations" are the ones that are reading fake news instead of real news, and haven't cared about the NYT for a long time -- not because the reporting is wrong, but because it's saying things they don't want to hear.
..

As to the idea that Trump is a triumph of hope over fear -- what are you smoking? He spent his entire campaign fearmongering about Mexicans, Muslims, Clinton, and pretty much everything except Putin. His "hope" is indulging in nostalgia for a time that a) was not great for a lot of Americans, and b) is not coming back.

And what will you do, when Trump's policies wind up providing few jobs for those unemployed aging white male workers, and lines the pockets of the wealthy?

There isn't much here that I will respond to, so just the points above.

Fake news? Let me stop chuckling... ok. So let's take a couple of examples. Lester Holt was on air for months prior to the election. His content? Several minutes of how great Hillary was doing and what a wonderful person she is. Several minutes of Trumps gaffs and foolishness. Balanced? Not really.
Hillary's take on Trumps support for the golf war?
Trump offhandedly said "Yeah, I guess so" to Howard Sterns question about supporting the war.
Now if -10 is = to "Heck no, I do not support the war" and +10 is I thoroughly support and endorse the war, Trump would probably have rung in at about a +1. But Hillary attempted to put him at +10 with his off-handed statement. And the MSM supported her take. Is that fake news?

I really get tired of the privileged white male racist BS. Any other race can have their race based support infrastructure and it's more power to them from the liberal side. This is a racist issue from the start and Progressives make it so to build their platform. But a white male can't even appear to care about their own welfare in society without being labeled racist or intolerant. That is why Trump won in large part. Every individual has a right to take their own welfare seriously.
Personally I support immigration from Latin America to a point. Reason dictates that we can only accept so many folks from these countries without ruining our economy. I don't think anyone can dispute this fact.
But because most of these immigrants are hard working and Christian to boot, I do give them a lot of credit and hope that they can begin to instill these two traits back into our country. Many here are the same, but our country is slowing losing these and we need them back to survive.
Yes, immigrants take jobs Americans would do. They are largely entry level jobs, but not totally.
These immigrants are now running business that Americans used to run. That is a net loss of jobs. So we can only take so much of this before the tide is lowered across the board. It's simple math.

This is why Progressives lost this election. Folks cared enough about their own welfare to look out for it.

 

[Cable]

.... The wage growth that is starting cannot be allowed to stand, ....

What do you mean by this?

 

[Hawkeye10]

But Obama also seemed to be modeling an almost magical belief that strength of mind can shape our reality, and that thinking well of people—her successor, her fellow citizens—could make them worthy of her good opinion. Asked about the Trumps’ visit, she called it “very pleasant,” emphasizing, “we are going to be there for the next president and do whatever we have to do to make sure that he is successful, because if he succeeds, we all succeed.”

Michelle Obama’s Oprah exit interview was almost weirdly serene.

OK, good on Michelle here, maybe driven in part by the fact that Trump took the high road that last time she insulted him and his supporters...maybe Trump succeeded in leading by example. Not shocked to see Slate calling her doing so an act of magical thinking(I am ignoring the "almost", and suggest that you do too).

 

[prometeus]

Sort of like Agincourt. What would Henry do with his victory?

Could make one of his sons both the Republican and Democratic nominee in the next election.

 

[Nap]

If asked in a survey right now if I have a favorable impression of Michelle Obama. I would answer "Yes" and say I think she performed her role as First Lady honorably. If asked in the same imaginary survey if I agree with any portion of her notion that the election of Trump gives cause for a loss of hope, I would answer "I strongly disagree" then think to myself "... another partisan politician's spouse willing to sell off parts of her soul for personal power".

I think she honestly tried to do alot of good during her time as First Lady but she bookended her tenure with some pretty disparaging remarks. It reflects pretty poorly on her character and is rather narcissistic to think the only time she can feel proud and have hope for this country is if her husband is the president. I think she might be racist, would she be making these comments if it were a black guy got elected?

Actually, I'm just kidding. I think most of this crap is just blown out of proportion. I have to admit fake outrage has me feeling pretty liberal at the moment.

 

[joG]

Could make one of his sons both the Republican and Democratic nominee in the next election.

Now that would be an interesting innovation for the Republic.