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Are Gun banners anti woman?

TurtleDude said:
about a year ago, this then 15 year old girl, asked me if I would take her (and her dad) shooting. I said sure-what do you want to shoot? And I told her we had lots of things she could try. Before I got past pistols, she said she didn't want to shoot an AR 15. I didn't comment and said OK but when she went to the range, I had a customized AR 15 that didn't say AR 15 on it. We set up a rest and she shot it at 25 yards. She shot it well and blew out the middle of the target. And what did she say? DAD I WANT ONE OF THESE FOR CHRISTMAS. He had a lower he had bought before the election and I told him to bring it to me and I would add an upper. When I explained she had just shot an AR 15 she looked at me and said-so why are all these people wanting to ban them--that was FUN!
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I found that women tend to like firearms just fine when they get to the target range. Its the same reason I believe they tend to like SUV's it gives them a sense of power they don't seem to think they have.

The women in my family shoot all sorts of esoteric firearms and replicas I have made over the years. My wife and each of my children each have been given a blade(s) and firearm(s) that I custom built for them exclusively. For my SO it was as marriage gifts, for my children it was a coming of age gift, there are no others exactly like them, in fact all the parts are one off custom pieces even the ammunition and propellants are exclusive. I keep CAD/CAM and other files for duplication of parts and such. I wanted the gifts to be a statement for them that they are part of my clan and the clan is part of them, that they singular human beings that are unique sovereign and no ones prey, that they serve only those they wish to. I wanted them to understand they are special and can be and are part of things special that they themselves choose to be part of. That there is balance in the dichotomy of being an individual and being part of a community, and that balance is what they themselves choose. They alone hold the keys to chains which they bind to themselves.

Now that I think of it, I find it interesting to have gone down a philosophical path with this discussion.
 
Aside from the points made in the article about the AR 15, without a firearm there is simply no way a 120lb female is going to be able to defend herself against a 200lb male attacker. Leftist know this, but since they are by definition. collectivists, they have no problem sacrificing individuals for the "common good". It's no exaggeration to say that a modern progressive would prefer to see a woman raped and murdered rather than see her armed and capable of defending herself.

Almost 50 years ago my mom was attacked by two guys late at night in a church parking lot. She ran to her car, but realized she wouldn't have time to unlock it and get in before they would get to her. She pulled out a little .22 that she carried in her purse, and she told me as soon as they saw the gun they stopped dead in their tracks, backed up, and went away.
 
for those who think AR 15s are not appropriate for home defense or much better choices exist

Why An AR-15 For Home Defense Is The Best Choice | Gun Digest

The author

Patrick Sweeney is the author of many of Gun Digest books' best-selling titles, including Gun Digest Book of the 1911, Vols. I & II; Gun Digest Big Fat Book of the .45 ACP, Gun Digest Book of the AR-15, Gun Digest Book of the AK and SKS, Gun Digest Book of the Glock and Gunsmithing: Pistols and Revolvers, among other titles. A master gunsmith, Patrick is also Handguns Editor for Guns & Ammo magazine

also
Patrick Sweeney (gunsmith) - Wikipedia

He teaches law enforcement classes on the patrol rifle, and gunsmithing the AR-15.
 
PirateMk1 said:
Why is it you feel the need to tell others what weapon is best the defense of our homes? As far as I am aware there is no one size fits all weapon for home defense. Rifles and carbines have their place just as shotguns and pistols do. Why do you even care what weapons people choose to defend themselves and their homes?
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Asking why I would debate something on a debate site is a very strange question. I make this argument because I think it is correct. I'm aware there's no one size fits all weapon, and that is just as true for the AR-15. For the purpose of home defense, I believe a shotgun is superior, for the reasons I have listed.
 
Irredentist said:
An AR-15 is not an ideal weapon for home defense. You'd be better off with a shotgun. Wider spread means you're more likely to hit the target, lower muzzle velocity means you're less likely to shoot through a wall and kill someone else by accident. Rifles are designed for long distance accuracy, not for close quarters.
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You aren't going to get a spread large enough, inside a house, to be affective. You will still be shooting a rifle, basically.

 
Irredentist said:
Asking why I would debate something on a debate site is a very strange question. I make this argument because I think it is correct. I'm aware there's no one size fits all weapon, and that is just as true for the AR-15. For the purpose of home defense, I believe a shotgun is superior, for the reasons I have listed.
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Why do you feel the need to tell people which arms they may or may not posses.
 
apdst said:
Why is that?
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To be fair, ultimately it comes down to training and capability of the person holding whatever weapon... but my comment was about mainly size of the AR-15 and reason for its design. Those in this thread that immediately said shotgun may or may not be amplifying the problem.

AR-15s were designed around the use of warfare, and even our military with their similar style of weapons faced challenging conditions and the need for additional training in urban warfare and room clearing tactics with weapons of that length.

While I would agree with the AR-15 vs. shotgun in the debate over recoil since even a 20 Gauge would be more difficult for some to handle over an AR-15, the issue of maneuverability inside close quarter conditions like a home is still there. Now you can modify the AR-15 in all kinds of ways, allowing for distance firing down or going the other way with 16" short barrel changes but the overall length of the weapon is still something that takes training to use that way. Just going to a range is not near enough in firing that weapon inside a home.

Depending on condition of the home defense scenario you may have to consider multiple options.

If surprised the entire thing may happen in one to two rooms of the house, or a hallway, in other conditions it may be a terrible game of cat and mouse looking for the invader. You may or may not have to move around in the dark, various low light conditions depending on where someone is in the house, deal with doors open or closed, dealing with children or others in the house, maybe multiple floor homes, etc. all of which changes having a free hand where as an AR-15 in that condition would mostly require precision to fire using both hands. Having a free hand calling for help or opening a door requires training on holding the weapon multiple ways while moving around a house room to room. A shotgun has the same condition, amplified by how long those tend to be (even the shotguns called "home protection" ready are not all that short.)

For most people, even though it is a weapon with less control dealing with recoil, I'd go with a pistol of a caliber the user is comfortable with. Under conditions of "home defense" where the defender has little control over the conditions of their own home being broken into a pistol allows for the most options in how things may play out.
 
apdst said:
What's the ideal home defense weapon?
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Hand guns and shotguns. I prefer handguns for lots of ammo, portability, low over penetration with good stopping power. But I train. If you dont train much you cant miss with a shotgun
 
vegas giants said:
Hand guns and shotguns. I prefer handguns for lots of ammo, portability, low over penetration with good stopping power. But I train. If you dont train much you cant miss with a shotgun
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A 9mm has more penetration than a .223 and a shotgun will way over penetrate at 10-20 feet.
 
OrphanSlug said:
To be fair, ultimately it comes down to training and capability of the person holding whatever weapon... but my comment was about mainly size of the AR-15 and reason for its design. Those in this thread that immediately said shotgun may or may not be amplifying the problem.

AR-15s were designed around the use of warfare, and even our military with their similar style of weapons faced challenging conditions and the need for additional training in urban warfare and room clearing tactics with weapons of that length.

While I would agree with the AR-15 vs. shotgun in the debate over recoil since even a 20 Gauge would be more difficult for some to handle over an AR-15, the issue of maneuverability inside close quarter conditions like a home is still there. Now you can modify the AR-15 in all kinds of ways, allowing for distance firing down or going the other way with 16" short barrel changes but the overall length of the weapon is still something that takes training to use that way. Just going to a range is not near enough in firing that weapon inside a home.

Depending on condition of the home defense scenario you may have to consider multiple options.

If surprised the entire thing may happen in one to two rooms of the house, or a hallway, in other conditions it may be a terrible game of cat and mouse looking for the invader. You may or may not have to move around in the dark, various low light conditions depending on where someone is in the house, deal with doors open or closed, dealing with children or others in the house, maybe multiple floor homes, etc. all of which changes having a free hand where as an AR-15 in that condition would mostly require precision to fire using both hands. Having a free hand calling for help or opening a door requires training on holding the weapon multiple ways while moving around a house room to room. A shotgun has the same condition, amplified by how long those tend to be (even the shotguns called "home protection" ready are not all that short.)

For most people, even though it is a weapon with less control dealing with recoil, I'd go with a pistol of a caliber the user is comfortable with. Under conditions of "home defense" where the defender has little control over the conditions of their own home being broken into a pistol allows for the most options in how things may play out.
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Our military has been clearing rooms with rifles for nearly 100 years. While one can't be geared for every single scenario, there's nothing wrong with using an AR, or AK type rifle/carbine as a home defense weapon. That being said, there's no such thing as a "bad" home defense firearm. I'd rather have the wrong gun for the scenario than no gun at all.
 
vegas giants said:
Who mentioned 9mm?



You
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You said a pistol. Most pistol calibers (357, 38 spc, 44 mag, 44 spcl, 45 acp, 9mm, 327 Fed, etc) out-penetrate a .223. Or are you going in with a 22 LR?
 
apdst said:
You said a pistol. Most pistol calibers (357, 38 spc, 44 mag, 44 spcl, 45 acp, 9mm, 327 Fed, etc) out-penetrate a .223. Or are you going in with a 22 LR?
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I don't believe a 38 penetrates more than a 5.56
 
PirateMk1 said:
Why do you feel the need to tell people which arms they may or may not posses.
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I'm not. Pick any weapon you want, within the bounds of legality. You are free to do so, and I am free to criticize your choice on its merits.
 
apdst said:
You aren't going to get a spread large enough, inside a house, to be affective. You will still be shooting a rifle, basically.

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A rifle with a smooth bore, firing pellets. So, not a rifle at all, basically. The advantage of a shotgun for home defense isn't just the spread, it's the lower muzzle velocity, making shot much less likely to go through a wall and hit something or someone in the next room over.
 
beancounter said:
No, people who want more effective laws are anti-senseless death.
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maybe some of the followers are. The people who constantly push to disarm honest people are almost invariably leftwing operatives who push gun bans as a weapon against GOP/conservative voters
 
Rich2018 said:
In an armed Home Invasion scenario (and we're talking about a large home not some suburban 3 bedroom house) an AR-15 is way better than any pistol or shotgun.
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You are right but yet you want to prevent people from owning them
 
AProudLefty said:
"Many Democratic politicians, including 2020 frontrunner Joe Biden, have long decried the AR-15 as both dangerous and an impractical or unnecessary firearm for civilians, especially women."
Source for this?
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You are denying women the right and ability to defend themselves in the era of #ME TOO. How wrong.
 
Rich2018 said:
Yes I do because there's also a preferred choice of mass shooters
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So lets examine your thinking.

If there is a ban on semi auto rifles, who is more likely to be disarmed or prevented from owning one by such a law

a single mother who wants one for protection

a homicidal active shooter like Paddock who planned his massacre for several years and is going to get-at least, a LWOP sentence if he survives.
 
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