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Who won the Veep Debate tonight? [W:47]

Who won? Vote now!

  • Total voters
    112
cpwill said:
Biden. Not nearly as much as Romney beat Obama, but still; Biden. The question now is how much his behavior will Al-Gore-sigh-like negate his victory.
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A lot of people seem to think Biden won this...But did he really win the debate if his botched response to the embassy attack and his constant laughing is dominating the news?
 
shiang said:
Stuff like raising taxes to upper 40%, first off no one is paying over 40% federal tax period even with ending Bush tax cuts. 2nd effective tax rates after deductions is more around lower 20% right now and will probably not even go over 25% average for any bracket, though some people may not take any deductions and pay maximum of slightly under 40%. Throwing around big, completely baseless numbers to scare people.
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The top federal tax rate is set to move to 35% alone. State income adds to that, plus there's social security and medicare tax. Not to mention property and sales tax. It's not a lie.

$700+ Billion dollars take out of medicare, every penny was put back.
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Funding is going to be cut from medicare. That's taking money out. Not a lie.

Various other things I don't recollect. Ryan agreed 1/4-1/3 of the time, the rest was pretty much all flat out lies that were way beyond the "stretch" limit.
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The rest you can't rmember is probably more a difference of opinion, not an "outrageous lie".

Obama and Biden stretched the truth too obviously, but there's arguments to be made. Obama's 5 Trillion tax cut is the closes thing to a lie. Romney said a few lies about medicare but at least it's part of their platform and I believe some money was temporarily taken out but was put back in once things were sorted out. Again didn't flat out lie over half the time. Ryan probably lied more than all 3 of them combined.
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Romney wasn't in the debate.

What kills me is people that haven't done the research couldn't tell the difference.
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Exactly.
 
shiang said:
Didn't say that, it matters how much you stretch it. If it breaks and becomes indefensible from any perspective, it's lying. There is a difference between misleading/stretching the truth and flat out lying. Ryan lied a lot more than any of the other 3, this includes Romney.
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Your idea of a lie and my idea of a lie are two different things. Ryan didn't lie, he's been saying the same thing about his platform the entire time. Where you think he is lying is you think he is purposely misleading because you don't trust the man's character. It doesn't mean that he is lying when there is a disconnect between what you have read he is going to do, and what he actually says he is going to do.
 
shiang said:
Stuff like raising taxes to upper 40%, first off no one is paying over 40% federal tax period even with ending Bush tax cuts. 2nd effective tax rates after deductions is more around lower 20% right now and will probably not even go over 25% average for any bracket, though some people may not take any deductions and pay maximum of slightly under 40%. Throwing around big, completely baseless numbers to scare people.

$700+ Billion dollars take out of medicare, every penny was put back.

Various other things I don't recollect. Ryan agreed 1/4-1/3 of the time, the rest was pretty much all flat out lies that were way beyond the "stretch" limit.

Obama and Biden stretched the truth too obviously, but there's arguments to be made. Obama's 5 Trillion tax cut is the closes thing to a lie. Romney said a few lies about medicare but at least it's part of their platform and I believe some money was temporarily taken out but was put back in once things were sorted out. Again didn't flat out lie over half the time. Ryan probably lied more than all 3 of them combined.

What kills me is people that haven't done the research couldn't tell the difference.
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1. He didn't lie you just aren't understanding the argument. He's talking marginal rates. Not to mention you aren't seeing the bigger picture, you can be taxed in other ways that don't show up on your tax form. For instace capital gains, I hear so much about how a 15% rate is unfair. But, when you look at the stock market, prices of stocks have a direct correlation with the earnings of a company. We already tax earnings at a 35% rate, the highest in the OECD. So you may only see the 15% rate and think that is unfair, but in reality their gains are already getting spanked with a 35% corporate rate. It affects the bottom line regardless.

2. Not every penny was put back. That's a lie and you know it.

3. The "5 trillion dollar tax cut" is a much bigger lie then anything you mentioned, considering he has said multiple times he is NOT going to CUT TAXES. He is reproportioning the burden by limiting deductions (he hinted at $25,000 limitation) and lowering the rates for everyone else. He has said 20%, but I think you are purposely fixating on that number and saying "oh look, that isn't going to work, he's really raising taxes on the middle class." As the Irish would call it that's malarky, I'm willing to bet that they are only going to lower the rates for as much revenue they can find from cutting upper class loopholes. That may be 10%, it may be 14%, it may be 20%, who knows. But Obama knows that is his intention and is purposely misleading about it.
 
Stephanie Cutter already admitted that the $5Trillion figure was a lie.
 
Strucky said:
A lot of people seem to think Biden won this...But did he really win the debate if his botched response to the embassy attack and his constant laughing is dominating the news?
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It's a good question. I wonder if he won it immediately out the gate, and the media is nowlosng it for him.
 
cpwill said:
Biden. Not nearly as much as Romney beat Obama, but still; Biden. The question now is how much his behavior will Al-Gore-sigh-like negate his victory.
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Biden won the fist fight, Ryan won the image fight.
Good thing elections are an image fight.
 
Arbo said:
You sound just like Biden...



Repeat a lie, repeat a lie, repeat a lie, repeat a lie, repeat a lie.

How about that, it's still not true.
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Sorry.....not a lie....its been part of Romney's platform for the last 6 months. Except he calls it tax cuts to "job creators". Sorry.....but just because Romney calls the wealthy "job creators" doesn't change the facts. Get a clue.
 
Born Free said:
Biden acted like a 3 yr old. One would think we would have someone more presidential for VP.
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LOL....Biden completely schooled Ryan. He made Ryan look like a little school boy that was caught with his pants down.
 
Blue_State said:
I think Joe walked over the moderator, took control and won.
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One cannot win a debate by slandering the moderator and continually interrupting while laughing about it.

This debate showed the world what a jackass Biden actually is......

Obama/Biden talk about transparency and bipartisanship - yet Ryan could hardly get a word out - or make a point - without Crazy Joe interrupting him...

So how could the administration make their "bipartisanship" claims after Biden put on that show?

The rudeness, arrogance and contempt will certainly hurt the DNC and the polls show it (not that polls matter to me or mean much).
 
JohnWOlin said:
I just watched it today and clearly Biden commanded the debate. However it was still fairly close and both of these guys are sharp as a tac. Did anyone else have the feeling that these guys knew more about what they were talking about though than their bosses or is it just me?
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If you think Biden is sharp as a tack, you should be disqualified from voting.
 
disneydude said:
Sorry.....not a lie....its been part of Romney's platform for the last 6 months. Except he calls it tax cuts to "job creators". Sorry.....but just because Romney calls the wealthy "job creators" doesn't change the facts. Get a clue.
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too bad your posts lack any logic or facts...
 
disneydude said:
LOL....Biden completely schooled Ryan. He made Ryan look like a little school boy that was caught with his pants down.
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well, that's what they needed to do, right there. Figuring they wouldn't lose any independents from the VP debate, they needed Biden to act like an ass to fire up the base.
 
Travis007 said:
too bad your posts lack any logic or facts...
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The facts are out there for anyone who takes the time to look. You obviously have spent little time paying attention for the last 6 months...but I would expect nothing less from someone of your ilk.
 
cpwill said:
well, that's what they needed to do, right there. Figuring they wouldn't lose any independents from the VP debate, they needed Biden to act like an ass to fire up the base.
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Have you been paying attention? Biden won in a landslide (20+ Points) among independents. Looks like the only "base" that got fired up by Ryan was the extreme right-wing nutjobs. To everyone else, Ryan looked throughly overmatched and came across like a little school boy.
 
disneydude said:
The facts are out there for anyone who takes the time to look. You obviously have spent little time paying attention for the last 6 months...but I would expect nothing less from someone of your ilk.
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again you can not point to one good economic indicator..and if ya could it would be in spite of Obama...

Your posts are comedy at best..

so if Obama who hates the USA, if you think his plan is working, then how come its a disaster?
 
disneydude said:
Have you been paying attention? Biden won in a landslide (20+ Points) among independents. Looks like the only "base" that got fired up by Ryan was the extreme right-wing nutjobs. To everyone else, Ryan looked throughly overmatched and came across like a little school boy.
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Biden won by 20 points? where in China?... Russia? Iran?...
 
disneydude said:
LOL....Biden completely schooled Ryan. He made Ryan look like a little school boy that was caught with his pants down.
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Lets hope Barry Soetero uses the Stupid Joe method tomorrow.. since you think it was so effective..

right?
 
disneydude said:
The facts are out there for anyone who takes the time to look. You obviously have spent little time paying attention for the last 6 months...but I would expect nothing less from someone of your ilk.
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wow.... you keep telling yourself that.. and dont forget the tell yourself Micky Mouse is a real mouse and mice can talk..
 
Biden easily won. He dominated the debate and even got the moderator on his side at certain points.
 
disneydude said:
LOL....Biden completely schooled Ryan. He made Ryan look like a little school boy that was caught with his pants down.
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I await the big huge Obama / Biden pump in the polls, let me know when it happens.
 
Born Free said:
I await the big huge Obama / Biden pump in the polls, let me know when it happens.
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Who said anything about a huge bump in the polls? The VP debate rarely has any effect. I just find it incredibly hilarious that the right-wingers all thought that Ryan would destroy Biden and had looked forward to the debate for weeks....and then it turns out that Ryan is the one who got completely clocked. DOH!
 
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