Trump Ordered To Pay $364 Million In Civil Fraud Case As Judge Finds Ex-President Knowingly Committed Fraud

[post]

not sure how it matters when the bank can assess the property themselves, OR knowingly give the loan with the risk of using someone's stated wealth and value.

These banks made tons of money off of this venture. The only people it matters to are the ones out to get Trump. It is not like he is lying to little old ladies about snake oil to take their hard earned cash... the banks can assess the risk properly in every case, if they choose to do so, OR they can choose to accept the risk on name and provided numbers only.

all of these real estate moguls fudge numbers at times. Stop that and less money will flow in these cities.

Just stop! You're only fooling yourself. Trump set you on autopilot, a hand off from your early childhood development.

https://www.psychologytoday.com › us › blog › freedom-learn › 201702 › childrearing-beliefs-were-best-predictor-trump-support

Childrearing Beliefs Were Best Predictor of Trump Support​

Specifically, he asked whether it is more important to raise a child to be (1) respectful or independent; (2) obedient or self-reliant; (3) well-behaved or considerate; and (4) well-mannered or ...

• https://www.npr.org › 2016 › 05 › 10 › 477041094 › the-empire-state-building-and-the-art-of-trumps-deal
  

  The Empire State Building And The Art Of Trump's Deal : NPR​

  May 10, 2016 To break the lease, Trump argued that the 102-story building had been mismanaged by Helmsley and Peter Malkin, Wien's son-in-law. It was infested with rodents, Trump said, and the elevators didn't ...
• 
  
• The state of NY has a law making it illegal to create false or fraudalant business records that are subsequently just filed away. Your reaction
• is, "what is the harm," right?
• 
  
• The Trumps own a company that does only that! LOL!
• 
  
• https://www.politico.eu/article/why-germany-lifeless-coalition-wont-die/
• The company was called All County Building Supply & Maintenance and it was created in 1992 for the purpose of providing inflated invoices to contractors for Fred Trump’s sprawling real estate holdings in Brooklyn and Queens.
• 
  
• Sister the judge resigned from senior status @ federal appeals court to end investigationof her lucrative felonies!
• https://theweek.com › speedreads › 834533 › trumps-sister-just-retired-federal-judge-apparently-remarkably-trumpy-reason
  

  Trump's sister just retired as a federal judge, apparently for a ...​

  Barry's partial ownership of a shell company, All County Building Supply & Maintenance, earned her millions, according to financial disclosure forms — that money came from reduced-tax income ...

 

[Ambig]

not sure how it matters when the bank can assess the property themselves,

No. They can't. He has 500 shell companies and is not known for being truthful. No one can assess Trump's net worth.

OR knowingly give the loan with the risk of using someone's stated wealth and value.

What if a (Russia-affiliated) bank wanted to buy influence from a major American politician? Couldn't they make him a loan without vetting him properly... as a way to buy that influence?

These banks made tons of money off of this venture.

They lost tons of money. That has been proven.

The only people it matters to are the ones out to get Trump.

Yes. Otherwise known as 'law enforcement'.

the banks can assess the risk properly in every case

You keep saying that, but it isn't true.

if they choose to do so, OR they can choose to accept the risk on name and provided numbers only.

But how would we stop a (Russia-affiliated) bank from buying influence that way?

all of these real estate moguls fudge numbers at times.

No real estate mogul ever triples the size and value of their real estate when they make loan applications. If they do, point them out to law enforcement.

Stop that and less money will flow in these cities.

Stop that, and legitimate business people will be able to make use of those loans.

 

[poweRob]

he will appeal and win

Maybe, if Aileen canon gets to hear it.

I'll send him $10 right now, I'd send $50 and maybe $100 .... tell me how to do it and I will

Mommy, why do they call us cultists?
Well because we send our broke ass money to a billionaire.

I disagree, there will be no magic 15 million more mail in ballots this election year unless the come from the GOP

Sorry. This isn't the conspiracy theory forum.

 

[SkyFox76]

Great news everyone!!!!!!!! Trump's GFM has reached----$1,350,222

Not even enough to cover the $2 million interest that's occurred so far.

 

[Ouroboros]

Is it unreasonable for someone to return ill gotten gain as per the letter of the law?

You evidently missed my post about how Engoron and James failed to establish a reasonable standard for penalization. Not surprising, but I'm not reprinting it for someone who didn't (and probably won't) read the first time.

It's not a theoretical crime though, because the actions taken were in violation of fraud law. If you commit a crime but there's no victim doesn't absolve you of committing the crime.

That's your false narrative, all right.

Sure they were. What we learned from their testimony is that bankers assume there will be over valuations from those applying for loans and listing their assets as collateral and adjust accordingly; what they refer to is as a "haircut". That is a work around indicating there is this kind of fraud going on, and banks have chosen how to protect themselves but not others. Where this is relevant is that people who cheat on their loan applications will skew the market because they will receive favorable rates through deception and impact those reporting accurately.

What you're choosing to call "fraud" is standard business practice.

Who are these "others" that you think the law is protecting? I mean, I know James and Engoron are actually protecting the Swamp's denizens, but let's hear what you come up with.

Then you're already at a disadvantage because you've established a rather silly bias.

I'm happy to keep repeating all the moral flaws in your championing of lawfare.

 

[Ouroboros]

I'd be curious to know what percentage of "law and order" you support.


Is it ok for some to get away with crimes while others don't? If you're advocating for Trump to be spared for committing fraud, why not for your average joe when they apply for a loan?

What's your point here? Are you claiming some average joes are being driven into penury for lying on their loan applications?

 

[Ouroboros]

Glad you clarified it was only the “idiot Dems” you are talking about because there are so few of them.

As I remember, pretty every Dem in congress jumped onto the first impeachment narrative. How many exceptions can you name?

 

[Ouroboros]

Trump claims to be a billionaire, how is this fine ruinous unless he's lying about his wealth?

It could ruin his campaign and that's all that matters to Mad Libs.

 

[Ouroboros]

Trump, the confederacy, and you are the real victims.

In your insular world, taking the Fifth 440X, refusing to be responsive in the discovery phase, filing a tsunami of frivolous and or repetitive motions and or appeals do not influence the court to regard the defendant's pleadings in the worst possible light.

Why did News Corp. provide Dominion with internal communications resulting in a $760 ,million settlement? Because the consequences of the Trump
nonresponsiveness have to be more severe than results of cooperating in the adversarial process!

New York business fraud lawsuit against the Trump Organization - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

What "confederacy" are you talking about? I mean, I know you like word salads as much as Kamala, but that's a weird ingredient.

Since you're not talking about the topic, I may as well respond to some poster I've forgotten. He asked why whatever appeal Trump made on the May 2023 Carroll case wasn't granted. He MAY have meant state supreme court only, but just in case he was asking about higher levels, I found this tidbit to share:

Under no circumstances may a federal court second-guess a state supreme court's determinations of state law. A federal court may find that a state law conflicts with a federal statute or with the (federal) Constitution, but it may not say, for example, "the state supreme court got the (state) law wrong."

 

[Ouroboros]

Trump and other white nationalists are unaccountable if they cloak themselves in imaginary politically protected exemption supported by
mob lawyer tactics.

More word salads. What does "white nationalism" have to do with this topic?

 

[The Hairy Fiddler]

Half a billion dollars Trump has to fork over for cheating banks. That's all anyone needs to know. End of thread.

 

[Peter]

It could ruin his campaign and that's all that matters to Mad Libs.

Maybe Trump should have considered that being a criminal may hurt his campaign?
The Dems have sod all to do with the courts actions.

 

[ClaraD]

That's probably why Cocaine Head Biden didn't miss it.

He wasn’t even there and he’s been clean since 2019

 

[ElChupacabra]

You evidently missed my post about how Engoron and James failed to establish a reasonable standard for penalization. Not surprising, but I'm not reprinting it for someone who didn't (and probably won't) read the first time.

I read it the first time, it's just a silly notion given that it was a civil trial and the grounds for disgorgement (and its amount) were clearly established.

That's your false narrative, all right.

There's nothing false about it since it is the letter of the law. You can keep doing your Tango around this basic fact, but it changes nothing.

What you're choosing to call "fraud" is standard business practice.

It is not, because if anyone outside financial elites tried this, they'd get taken to court by the lender. Perhaps you can put this to the test with your property taxes and loan documentations and let us know how it turns out. Your definition of "standard" is fraud that's factored into how lenders approach their well heeled clients.

Who are these "others" that you think the law is protecting? I mean, I know James and Engoron are actually protecting the Swamp's denizens, but let's hear what you come up with.

Other loan recipients and the market itself. Or are you positing that fraud should be an acceptable practice? I guess if you think that elites should be able to lie to get favorable loan rates while everyone else doesn't then that rationale might make some kind of warped sense.

I'm happy to keep repeating all the moral flaws in your championing of lawfare.

You haven't at all. You've been spinning in circles down the loo supporting fraud and using child-like reasoning to support it: "b..b..but other people do iiiiit!!".

 

[ElChupacabra]

Maybe Trump should have considered that being a criminal may hurt his campaign?
The Dems have sod all to do with the courts actions.

Well, it's this idea that if Trump is held accountable then it's LAWFARE™, because Trump can never be held accountable despite having a questionable business record. Trump's stance has always been one of avoiding personal responsibility like the plague, and clearly others have taken that laughable rationale and made it their own. What's comical is the endless mental gymnastics that basically puts Trump supporters in the position of defending violations of the law solely because it's Trump. You see this peppered in everything Trump does, because at the core of Trump's thinking is that nothing is his fault, and his failure is not due to his actions but others who are out to get him. The persecution complex I described above has been a feature throughout his public life, where he endlessly deflected his failures and shortcomings on other people.

 

[ElChupacabra]

What's your point here? Are you claiming some average joes are being driven into penury for lying on their loan applications?

The question is obvious. You can figure it out if you try.

 

[EnigmaO01]

The question is obvious. You can figure it out if you try.

I think you're wasting your time with that one.

 

[Ambig]

What you're choosing to call "fraud" is standard business practice.

Nope. That's false.

If you don't believe me, ask that Shark guy if he triples the size and value of his real estate on his loan applications.

 

[Ambig]

It could ruin his campaign and that's all that matters to Mad Libs.

It's all that matters to all decent and patriotic Americans, of whatever political ideology.

 

[Sweden]

Trump Ordered To Pay Over $350 Million In Civil Fraud Case As Judge Finds Ex-President Knowingly Committed Fraud

Judge Engoron’s ruling finds Trump and his co-defendants broadly liable for fraudulently misstating the value of their assets.

www.forbes.com

I lost track of this one, can he repeal?

Either way, it's not a good result for him.

I have heard that a US Judge has ordered Mr Trump to pay $364 million trillion in a civil car parking case. This strikes me as being not in the least improbable in the light of other occurrences inn the world famous United States 'Justice' system.

 

[ElChupacabra]

I have heard that a US Judge has ordered Mr Trump to pay $364 million trillion in a civil car parking case. This strikes me as being not in the least improbable in the light of other occurrences inn the world famous United States 'Justice' system.

If he's racked up $364m in parking tickets should he not pay that back, or is compliance with the law just reserved for society's peons?

 

[The Mark]

I have heard that a US Judge has ordered Mr Trump to pay $364 million trillion in a civil car parking case. This strikes me as being not in the least improbable in the light of other occurrences inn the world famous United States 'Justice' system.

The number in that headline has changed a few times, but the number when I first posted it was $364 million.

It's for fraud, not parking tickets.

More specifically, as I understand it, it's for repeatedly inflating the value of various properties when seeking loans from banks.

 

[Ambig]

I have heard that a US Judge has ordered Mr Trump to pay $364 million trillion in a civil car parking case.

That would be nice, but I haven't heard about it. Just the $455M or so for business fraud and the $80M or so for slander.

But it's a great thought. Let's pile more trouble on the violent insurrectionist, documents' thief and election cheater.

 

[Ouroboros]

Half a billion dollars Trump has to fork over for cheating banks. That's all anyone needs to know. End of thread.

Half a billion dollars, to make sure Brain Dead Biden doesn't have to dodder out of his basement to campaign,

 

[Ouroboros]

Maybe Trump should have considered that being a criminal may hurt his campaign?
The Dems have sod all to do with the courts actions.