FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Email S

[WCH]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

The pardon was in reference to Nixon, here with Hillary I doubt we'll ever see a prosecution!

That's the consensus but, stranger things have happened. Most of us never thought they would come down on Bill either.

 

[ludin]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

Which has nothing to do with your rambling thanks.

actually it did. you asked a question I gave you an answer that proved you wrong as usual.

 

[Texmex]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

Surely even with a pardon, she won't be able to hold public office.

Wishful thinking on your part.

 

[faithful_servant]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

Ford pardoned Nixon within a month of attaining office, effectively stopping prosecution.

What makes you think Obama will direct the Department of Justice to prosecute Hillary?

[Please bear in mind President Obama also has directed ICE to *not* deport or prosecute illegal aliens]

Because Ford's decision to pardon Nixon was based on the idea that the trial of a former President would be devastating to the nation. He knew that doing so would mean the end of his political career, but he chose to do it anyway. Hillary going to trial wouldn't be devastating to the nation, so I doubt that Pres. Obama will protect her. Doing so would mean that there was something that she needed protection from and that would substantially taint her chances of winning and would keep a lot of Dem. voters at home on Election Day. It's a huge negative for the Dem. Machine for the President to intervene. It would also stain Pres. Obama's legacy with something that will destroy his political career, just as pardoning Nixon destroyed Ford's.

 

[zimmer]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

let us be certain what the charges were for which scooter libby was found guilty:

Yes... he was charged for "forgetting".

Libby did not leak Plame's name...

Hillary... measured by the Scooter Standard... will make Felonious Bill a free man.

 

[Absentglare]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

There is a very meaningful distinction between the two. A pardon forgives someone of their crimes and wipes their record clean just as if the crime never took place. The commutation handed down by president Bush did not forgive Libby of the crimes he was convicted of and didn't wipe his record clean. What it did was eliminate the 30 month prison sentence, while leaving in place the other penalties handed down by the judge. Libby is still a convicted felon and in my opinion, if the judge had sentenced Libby to a more reasonable prison term, Bush would have never commuted it.

The reason I engaged Absentglare on his use of the word "pardon" wasn't just because it was incorrect, but because the word falsely implies Libby was forgiven for his actions and his record wiped clean by the administration.



I agree totally. Although I understood Bush's reasoning, I was still surprised when he commuted his prison sentence.

No, there is no LEGAL distinction between a pardon and a conditional pardon (commutation of sentence). The power is granted by the Pardon Clause. The power of the pardon is distinct from a Reprieve, where punishment is delayed without otherwise changing the sentence.

Again :

"U.S. Constitution, in Article II, Section 2, Clause 1, provided that the president "shall have Power to grant Reprieves and Pardons for Offences against the United States, except in Cases of Impeachment.""

And while i appreciate your sentiment that my language implied a full pardon when none took place, you took it upon yourself to continue to try to split this hair :

BS... Somehow I just knew you would try and defend your misstatement.

 

[Absentglare]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

actually it did. you asked a question I gave you an answer that proved you wrong as usual.

No, Hillary would have to have lied under oath rather than simply to the public.

 

[WCH]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

Wishful thinking on your part.

Damn straight!

 

[ludin]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

No, Hillary would have to have lied under oath rather than simply to the public.

you are wrong as usual.

lying to law enforcement is a crime during an investigation.
she lied to the FBI during an investigation that is at least a misdemeanor.

 

[justabubba]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

Yes... he was charged for "forgetting".

i do not see 'forgetting' anywhere
maybe you would be kind enough to point it out [my emphasis added immediately below]:

Pursuant to the grand jury leak investigation, Libby was convicted on March 6, 2007, on four counts of perjury, obstruction of justice, and making false statements. He was acquitted of one count of making false statements.

Libby did not leak Plame's name...

Hillary... measured by the Scooter Standard... will make Felonious Bill a free man.

scooter libby took one for the team
because he refused to cooperate with the prosecution the dicknbush regime got away with exposing a covert CIA analyst who specialized in iran's nuclear capabilities

 

[Gimmesometruth]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

Libby did not leak Plame's name...

Judith Miller testimony on 2003 meeting with Libby:


Q: Did there come a time following the publication of [Ambassador Joseph] Wilson's op-ed [July 6, 2003] that you met with Mr. Libby again?

A: Yes.

Q: When was that?

A: July 8th.

[...]

Q: Was there discussion at any time about Mr. Wilson's wife [Plame] on this occasion?

A: Yes.

Q: Can you tell us what you recall about that?

A: Yes. Mr. Libby was discussing what he called two streams of reporting on uranium and on efforts by Iraq to acquire sensitive materials and components. He said the first stream was reports like that of Joe Wilson. Then he said the second stream, and at that point he said, once again, as an aside, that Mr. Wilson's wife worked at WINPAC.

Q: Can you tell us what WINPAC is?

A: Yes, WINPAC is, stands for Weapons Intelligence Non-Proliferation and Arms Control. It's a part of the CIA which is specifically focused on weapons of mass destruction.

 

[Grim17]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

Judith Miller testimony on 2003 meeting with Libby:


Q: Did there come a time following the publication of [Ambassador Joseph] Wilson's op-ed [July 6, 2003] that you met with Mr. Libby again?

A: Yes.

Q: When was that?

A: July 8th.

[...]

Q: Was there discussion at any time about Mr. Wilson's wife [Plame] on this occasion?

A: Yes.

Q: Can you tell us what you recall about that?

A: Yes. Mr. Libby was discussing what he called two streams of reporting on uranium and on efforts by Iraq to acquire sensitive materials and components. He said the first stream was reports like that of Joe Wilson. Then he said the second stream, and at that point he said, once again, as an aside, that Mr. Wilson's wife worked at WINPAC.

Q: Can you tell us what WINPAC is?

A: Yes, WINPAC is, stands for Weapons Intelligence Non-Proliferation and Arms Control. It's a part of the CIA which is specifically focused on weapons of mass destruction.

The thing everyone forgets is, the reason nobody could be prosecuted for leaking Plame's identity is because nobody from the CIA ever informed anyone at the WH that Plame was considered a covert operative. The law clearly states that a person must "knowingly" disclose the identity of a covert operative and to this very day, I have never heard of any documents or testimony that the WH had been informed of such prior to disclosing her role in getting her husband the gig in Africa. Disclosing the name of someone who works for WINPAC at langley is not illegal.

 

[Chomsky]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

Because Ford's decision to pardon Nixon was based on the idea that the trial of a former President would be devastating to the nation. He knew that doing so would mean the end of his political career, but he chose to do it anyway. Hillary going to trial wouldn't be devastating to the nation, so I doubt that Pres. Obama will protect her. Doing so would mean that there was something that she needed protection from and that would substantially taint her chances of winning and would keep a lot of Dem. voters at home on Election Day. It's a huge negative for the Dem. Machine for the President to intervene. It would also stain Pres. Obama's legacy with something that will destroy his political career, just as pardoning Nixon destroyed Ford's.

Yours is a fair assessment in historical and political terms, however I wasn't anticipating an official public intervention, but rather the President using his influence behind closed doors.

 

[Chomsky]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

That's the consensus but, stranger things have happened. Most of us never thought they would come down on Bill either.

True.

However, from my memory of Bubba's impeachment: It was a political stunt with Newt Gingrich & crew fully realizing their actions in the House would never meet the 67 vote threshold required in the Senate to ratify. So I see that incident back then as political posturing rather than a serious attempt, similar to the current multitude of House 'ObamaCare repeal' votes.

The impeachment was designed to give the President a black-eye and the GOP a leg-up in the upcoming mid-term elections, but failed pretty miserably in public perceptions as seen with the House subsequently flipping to the Dems ousting Gingrich from his Speakership, the party turning against Gingrich (similar to Ted Cruz in the 2012/13 government shutdown), and President Clinton leaving office with the highest favorability rating of any modern President! :doh

 

[Absentglare]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

you are wrong as usual.

lying to law enforcement is a crime during an investigation.
she lied to the FBI during an investigation that is at least a misdemeanor.

You're not being specific.

Some statements she made to the public turned out to be inaccurate.

You can't use those inaccuracies to declare her guilty of any crime.

 

[Gimmesometruth]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

The thing everyone forgets is, the reason nobody could be prosecuted for leaking Plame's identity is because nobody from the CIA ever informed anyone at the WH that Plame was considered a covert operative. The law clearly states that a person must "knowingly" disclose the identity of a covert operative and to this very day, I have never heard of any documents or testimony that the WH had been informed of such prior to disclosing her role in getting her husband the gig in Africa. Disclosing the name of someone who works for WINPAC at langley is not illegal.

WINPAC is part of the CIA’s Directorate of Intelligence. Why is this significant?
The Directorate of Operations works undercover. As the CIA website states:
The Directorate of Operations is responsible for the clandestine collection of foreign intelligence. The current director is under cover and cannot be named at the present time.

 

[ludin]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

You're not being specific.

Some statements she made to the public turned out to be inaccurate.

You can't use those inaccuracies to declare her guilty of any crime.

read my previous email I was specific. as usual you ignore pretty much everything someone posts
to go on some strawman rant.

so you are telling me that she was not aware that she was using an email server when she said she wasn't?

 

[Monte]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

 

[Absentglare]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

read my previous email I was specific. as usual you ignore pretty much everything someone posts
to go on some strawman rant.

so you are telling me that she was not aware that she was using an email server when she said she wasn't?

I assume you mean here :

Hillary has made about a dozen false statements including the fact she never sent any classified info even though
they have thousands of emails that they found that are classified and some above top secret that she sent through there.

she was also caught lying when she said she didn't use it prior a certain date but then it was found out that she was.
it doesn't help that the state department is trying to thwart the investigation by not turning over requested information.

they have plenty to hang her with.

regardless of what she thinks she isn't above the law nor should she be.

Well you seem to be very vague here. Lots of info is determined classified after the fact, lots of that information was propagated by someone else, and it turns out that previous secretaries of state had the exact same "problem" of having some "classified" info on unclassified servers.

She said she wasn't using it as part of her job as secretary of state until March. Sending an email to Petraeus doesn't necessarily qualify.

You can be wrong in a statement if you thought you were accurate at the time.

Your personal opinion is not terribly convincing.

 

[ludin]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

I assume you mean here :



Well you seem to be very vague here. Lots of info is determined classified after the fact, lots of that information was propagated by someone else, and it turns out that previous secretaries of state had the exact same "problem" of having some "classified" info on unclassified servers.

She said she wasn't using it as part of her job as secretary of state until March. Sending an email to Petraeus doesn't necessarily qualify.

You can be wrong in a statement if you thought you were accurate at the time.

Your personal opinion is not terribly convincing.

nope not vague at all.
the FBI investigation has found thousands of classified emails that she supposedly never sent.

not to mention she was using the server before when she said she wasn't.

so you have to be completely obtuse to say that she didn't know what she was doing.
if you say that she didn't know what she was then she is incompetent and should never have held the position
to begin with.

if that is the case that alone is enough to disqualify her from presidency.

my opinion is based on FBI investigation facts. sorry you don't like them.
are you wanting us to believe that she didn't know that what she was doing was not correct
even though she was warned to stop doing it?

if so then she is a bigger moron than what we already knew.

 

[Absentglare]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

nope not vague at all.
the FBI investigation has found thousands of classified emails that she supposedly never sent.

not to mention she was using the server before when she said she wasn't.

so you have to be completely obtuse to say that she didn't know what she was doing.
if you say that she didn't know what she was then she is incompetent and should never have held the position
to begin with.

if that is the case that alone is enough to disqualify her from presidency.

my opinion is based on FBI investigation facts. sorry you don't like them.
are you wanting us to believe that she didn't know that what she was doing was not correct
even though she was warned to stop doing it?

if so then she is a bigger moron than what we already knew.

You should learn to understand the nuances of language. She said she wasn't using the email server in an official capacity until March. Or do you think her use of a private email server for private correspondence is automagically the FBI's business ?

You'll need to find her taking classified information, herself, from classified sources to be sent out her unclassified server to demonstrate that she lied. You didn't do that.

Your statement of guilt is as convincing of her guilt as a rotten potato.

 

[Grim17]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

WINPAC is part of the CIA’s Directorate of Intelligence. Why is this significant?
The Directorate of Operations works undercover. As the CIA website states:
The Directorate of Operations is responsible for the clandestine collection of foreign intelligence. The current director is under cover and cannot be named at the present time.

That's a very nice article from Think Progress... Too bad it doesn't add up to squat.

How about you come up with something from a credible source that doesn't have the stench of moonbat all over it?

.

 

[faithful_servant]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

Yours is a fair assessment in historical and political terms, however I wasn't anticipating an official public intervention, but rather the President using his influence behind closed doors.

This isn't something that the President could do "behind closed doors", it's something that by definition would be a public matter. One single FOI request and the whole thing would be blown out of the water.

 

[Glen Contrarian]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

I assume you mean here :



Well you seem to be very vague here. Lots of info is determined classified after the fact, lots of that information was propagated by someone else, and it turns out that previous secretaries of state had the exact same "problem" of having some "classified" info on unclassified servers.

She said she wasn't using it as part of her job as secretary of state until March. Sending an email to Petraeus doesn't necessarily qualify.

You can be wrong in a statement if you thought you were accurate at the time.

Your personal opinion is not terribly convincing.

If there's anything I've noticed over the years of debating on line, it's that a lot of people - almost all of whom are conservative - are so quick to throw the "you're lying!" accusation when there is no indication that the accused really thought that he or she was being anything but accurate at the time. I remember one conversation where I asked a conservative if a four year-old kid was lying if he said that 2+2=5...and the conservative replied that YES, if the kid gave a wrong answer, then he was lying.

It's almost as if we're speaking not just two different languages, but we're almost from two different species. Think back to H.G. Wells' "The Time Machine", and his descriptions of the Morlocks and Eloi. The more I think about it, the more I think his descriptions were not based on mere happenstance.

 

[Glen Contrarian]

Re: FBI Reveals New Details About Its Probe Into Hillary Clinton's Use of Private Ema

This isn't something that the President could do "behind closed doors", it's something that by definition would be a public matter. One single FOI request and the whole thing would be blown out of the water.

That depends on the one(s) judging the FOIA request...because just as with the Constitution, the Bible, the Qur'an, and every other great, important document of any real length, ten very intelligent people can read it and come to ten very different conclusions...and do so based on sound logic.