Cliven Bundy, 4 others, face federal indictment in Nevada

[lb_on_teh_cb]

Its a radio talk show.... who worked with Art Bell FFS.. Wells is a damn conspiracy nut job. SO I am not going to believe anything the guy says.

good enough

Appears you have a closed mind, referring to these people as Patriots?

notice the quotes? im not sure if they are or not.

 

[Thrilla]

I looks like the federal government is going after them with gusto.... and lefties are now enamored with law enforcement and the criminal justice system again, as if by magic.

my personal opinion.... they need to face the music... but it looks like they are throwing the whole damned band at them.
and it's a damned shame to see that happen when they didn't actually harm anyone or anything

nothing they have done warrants more than a year or 2 in jail, if that.

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

I looks like the federal government is going after them with gusto.... and lefties are now enamored with law enforcement and the criminal justice system again, as if by magic.

The Republican party is Left compared to these militia folk.

my personal opinion.... they need to face the music... but it looks like they are throwing the whole damned band at them.
and it's a damned shame to see that happen when they didn't actually harm anyone or anything

nothing they have done warrants more than a year or 2 in jail, if that.

The only reason that the militia idiots didnt harm anyone is because the FBI did not allow them the chance to do it. Unless you have been under a rock it was clear that the intent was to get the Feds to attack the militia folk in order to provoke a revolution to take over the US of A. They have made it very clear that they wanted to replace our government with their government.

there was a dramatic change in tactics after Cliven was arrested. One could say they did a 180. They went from calling everybody to bring their weapons and be prepared, to we are peaceful. I guess they think that people are stupid enough to just not notice the change. Too bad though that this has probably inspired some nut case militia folks into attacking someone at later date. Go ahead keep saying that no one was harmed. Just wait, it will happen.


" Please come prepared with civilian attire and adhere to the policy of no long guns within the community."

 

[danarhea]

I looks like the federal government is going after them with gusto.... and lefties are now enamored with law enforcement and the criminal justice system again, as if by magic.

my personal opinion.... they need to face the music... but it looks like they are throwing the whole damned band at them.
and it's a damned shame to see that happen when they didn't actually harm anyone or anything

nothing they have done warrants more than a year or 2 in jail, if that.

Some of them pointed rifles at FBI agents. A couple of years? Try a couple of decades.

 

[Thrilla]

The Republican party is Left compared to these militia folk.

maybe so, but that's irrelevant to my point.

The only reason that the militia idiots didnt harm anyone is because the FBI did not allow them the chance to do it. Unless you have been under a rock it was clear that the intent was to get the Feds to attack the militia folk in order to provoke a revolution to take over the US of A. They have made it very clear that they wanted to replace our government with their government.

the only thing that actually matters in all those words is that you also agree they did no harm to anyone or anything..... therefore, they should not be punished as if they did.

and no, there is no evidence of them wanting to replace the federal government with their own... you literally made that up..... not cool on your part.

there was a dramatic change in tactics after Cliven was arrested. One could say they did a 180. They went from calling everybody to bring their weapons and be prepared, to we are peaceful. I guess they think that people are stupid enough to just not notice the change. Too bad though that this has probably inspired some nut case militia folks into attacking someone at later date. Go ahead keep saying that no one was harmed. Just wait, it will happen.


" Please come prepared with civilian attire and adhere to the policy of no long guns within the community."

if it happens, then it must be addressed accordingly..... but we don't punish people according to what others might do, maybe, possibly, sometime in the future...that's not justice in any universe.

as I said, they must face the music, but going overboard with "justice" is , in itself, unjust.....nothing they have done warrants locking them up and throwing away the key, as so many here openly support.

they have said since day 1 that they are peaceful, it's not a new thing at all.... it does seem that they have dropped the declarations of defending themselves , though.
that's not much of a 180.
the only 180 I see is the liberal view of law enforcement and overbearing policing....but that's easily explained.... these folks were white and right wing.

 

[Thrilla]

Some of them pointed rifles at FBI agents. A couple of years? Try a couple of decades.

how'd that FBI investigation into the pointing of the rifle go?.. it's been 2 years, heard anything yet?

they caused no harm to anyone , so how are you justifying your opinion they should spend 20 years in prison?

 

[danarhea]

how'd that FBI investigation into the pointing of the rifle go?.. it's been 2 years, heard anything yet?

they caused no harm to anyone , so how are you justifying your opinion they should spend 20 years in prison?

Yea, actually, that's included in the charges. Let the thugs rot.

 

[lb_on_teh_cb]

Yea, actually, that's included in the charges. Let the thugs rot.

it did happen? i hadnt heard that. was a little surprised to read it in this thread.

 

[Lethargic Aptitude]

how'd that FBI investigation into the pointing of the rifle go?.. it's been 2 years, heard anything yet?

they caused no harm to anyone , so how are you justifying your opinion they should spend 20 years in prison?

It was part of why they just got arrested.

 

[Thrilla]

Yea, actually, that's included in the charges. Let the thugs rot.

yeah,I just found a link that goes over it a bit.....I think he'll be found guilty on 2 of the 6 charges, and walk on the others.

the US attorney, like many folks here , keep tryign to sell them as violent .. and charged them with 3 felonies based on violence..... violence that did not occur.
for example " assault on a federal law enforcement officer"... it carries a 20 year sentence.
the funny thing is, Bundy didn't' commit an assault on anyone, nor did any of his people..... even a rookie attorney can fight that one with ease.
( the real reason they are charged with so many crimes isn't to secure a lengthy sentence, or even convictions for that matter.... it's to secure a much higher bail, so they have to sit in jail until trial... and to secure a plea deal )

in any event, it's nice to see so many American wanting non-violent offenders to rot in Jail.... as if prison aren't already chock full of non-violent offenders.

 

[Jack Fabulous]

yeah,I just found a link that goes over it a bit.....I think he'll be found guilty on 2 of the 6 charges, and walk on the others.

the US attorney, like many folks here , keep tryign to sell them as violent .. and charged them with 3 felonies based on violence..... violence that did not occur.
for example " assault on a federal law enforcement officer"... it carries a 20 year sentence.
the funny thing is, Bundy didn't' commit an assault on anyone, nor did any of his people..... even a rookie attorney can fight that one with ease.
( the real reason they are charged with so many crimes isn't to secure a lengthy sentence, or even convictions for that matter.... it's to secure a much higher bail, so they have to sit in jail until trial... and to secure a plea deal )

in any event, it's nice to see so many American wanting non-violent offenders to rot in Jail.... as if prison aren't already chock full of non-violent offenders.

Engaging in an armed stand off with law enforcement is non-violent?

Since when?

 

[Thrilla]

Engaging in an armed stand off with law enforcement is non-violent?

Since when?

since came up with a bunch of words to define violence and entered them into the dictionary.
being armed does not equate to being violent....end of story.

if it did, we could charge almost every law enforcement officer with some sort of violent felony... and every one who simply carries a firearm.

 

[Jack Fabulous]

since came up with a bunch of words to define violence and entered them into the dictionary.
being armed does not equate to being violent....end of story.

if it did, we could charge almost every law enforcement officer with some sort of violent felony... and every one who simply carries a firearm.

Threatening people with a firearm does, though.

Story continues...

 

[Thrilla]

Threatening people with a firearm does, though.

Story continues...

it depends entirely on what the threat is comprised of.

" I'm going to kill you" is one thing
" I'm going to defend myself from your aggression" is quite another.

 

[Mr Person]

in any event, it's nice to see so many American wanting non-violent offenders to rot in Jail.... as if prison aren't already chock full of non-violent offenders.

Um.... generally speaking, violence in law is the unlawful exercise of physical force or intimidation by the exhibition of such force.

Hence, one of the two ways "assault" is typically defined is a deliberate action that puts another person in fear of an imminent battery. (Battery being an unlawful touching).



Pointing guns at people is violence, even if you don't fire the gun.

 

[Mr Person]

it depends entirely on what the threat is comprised of.

" I'm going to kill you" is one thing
" I'm going to defend myself from your aggression" is quite another.

Imposing grazing fees and using government agents to collect those fees is not "aggression." Enough with these silly framing games.

Bundy et. al. didn't want to pay fees that they were required to pay. Instead of fighting in court and accepting the result, they decided to point guns at government agents. Usually that gets you shot. They lucked out.

Claiming to have a particular philosophy of the role and powers of government does *not* permit you to point guns at government agents, nor can you successfully bootstrap it into self-defense by calling the government's attempt to collect owed fees "aggression".

 

[Moot]

i heard it on John B. Wells' Caravan to Midnight show. he interviewed people in the area, also survivors from the reported "shootout"

its good to hear both sides sometimes - for example 10-15 yrs ago i would listen occasionally to a guy named Mike Malloy on Air America and he would start talking about "The Bush Crime Family" and i would laugh and think he was a complete nutjob. However last couple of years i hear more and more people saying it and they are not always leftists and they sound like they know what they're talking about.

Here's the other side of the story....

"... A woman charged with conspiracy for the prolonged takeover of a federal building in Oregon is suing federal employees for committing “the works of the devil” on her, and she wants billions of dollars for it — specifically, $666,666,666,666.66....

In her so-called “counter criminal complaint,” which Cox filed Wednesday independently of legal counsel, she says “arrogant, narcissi Federal Government officials” (sic) tried to “hijack” the Constitutional rights of her and her fellow armed occupiers....

The complaint says the government committed "the works of the devil" on Shawna Cox for her role in the weeks-long occupation of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge in Burns...

“I am being maliciously prosecuted by State and Federal Bar Association members because they do not want to be held accountable for their subversive activities against the people of the United States,” Cox writes in a bolded passage of the complaint.​

Woman charged for Oregon occupation files $666 billion suit - NY Daily News

 

[Thrilla]

Um.... generally speaking, violence in law is the unlawful exercise of physical force or intimidation by the exhibition of such force.

Hence, one of the two ways "assault" is typically defined is a deliberate action that puts another person in fear of an imminent battery. (Battery being an unlawful touching).



Pointing guns at people is violence, even if you don't fire the gun.

I agree pointing a gun can be construed as violence( its an intimidating act, usually known as "brandishing")... my point is that simply being armed is not violent.

if it were legally construed as such, every single concealed carrier in the country would be arrested for violent crimes...as would every law enforcement officer.

 

[Thrilla]

Imposing grazing fees and using government agents to collect those fees is not "aggression." Enough with these silly framing games.

Bundy et. al. didn't want to pay fees that they were required to pay. Instead of fighting in court and accepting the result, they decided to point guns at government agents. Usually that gets you shot. They lucked out.

Claiming to have a particular philosophy of the role and powers of government does *not* permit you to point guns at government agents, nor can you successfully bootstrap it into self-defense by calling the government's attempt to collect owed fees "aggression".

1st... none of this is relevent to my point.

2nd, stop being a hypocrite... if you really don't like "framing games" , don't play your own.

 

[Mr Person]

it depends entirely on what the threat is comprised of.

" I'm going to kill you" is one thing
" I'm going to defend myself from your aggression" is quite another.

Imposing grazing fees and using government agents to collect those fees is not "aggression." Enough with these silly framing games.

Bundy et. al. didn't want to pay fees that they were required to pay. Instead of fighting in court and accepting the result, they decided to point guns at government agents. Usually that gets you shot. They lucked out.

Claiming to have a particular philosophy of the role and powers of government does *not* permit you to point guns at government agents, nor can you successfully bootstrap it into self-defense by calling the government's attempt to collect owed fees "aggression".

1st... none of this is relevent to my point.

2nd, stop being a hypocrite... if you really don't like "framing games" , don't play your own.

Ummmmm...........

Did you follow the link in the OP? It's about the standoff in 2014, where Bundy and supporters pointed guns at federal agents during a standoff over grazing fees. Hence the article begins "A federal grand jury in Nevada indicted Cliven Bundy and four others Wednesday on 16 charges related to an armed standoff near his ranch in 2014 over unpaid grazing fees."

It's not about the wildlife building occupation.

You're playing silly framing games by trying to call what the government did "aggression".

You're also playing silly framing games if you call Bundy & supporters' action anything but "violence". I'm not making this up. There are tons of photographs of those guys proudly training rifles on government agents, etc.



If you don't like the government charging you grazing fees for feeding your cattle on federal land for private gain, then you fight it in court. If you don't like the result, you fight it in the political arena next. In a country with the rule of law, you do not get to point guns at government agents because you don't like what it did.

...cause that's generally considered something between violence and treasonous armed insurrection....

They lucked out when the government decided to back off and catch them later, to avoid bloodshed.





OP:

Finally, charges have been brought against Cliven Bundy and 4 others for threatening the FBI during the standoff in Nevada last year.

Here are your patriots, folks. They are thugs, and they will be doing a whole lot of time in prison. Bundy will probably spend the rest of his life there. Serves them right. No matter what the hate radio talking heads bloviate from their fat mouths, these punks are not patriots. They are just common criminals who hate America. Let them rot.

Article is here.

 

[Moot]

I agree pointing a gun can be construed as violence( its an intimidating act, usually known as "brandishing")... my point is that simply being armed is not violent.

if it were legally construed as such, every single concealed carrier in the country would be arrested for violent crimes...as would every law enforcement officer.

The law has already defined "intimidation."

Legal Definition of Intimidate

 

[danarhea]

yeah,I just found a link that goes over it a bit.....I think he'll be found guilty on 2 of the 6 charges, and walk on the others.

the US attorney, like many folks here , keep tryign to sell them as violent .. and charged them with 3 felonies based on violence..... violence that did not occur.
for example " assault on a federal law enforcement officer"... it carries a 20 year sentence.
the funny thing is, Bundy didn't' commit an assault on anyone, nor did any of his people..... even a rookie attorney can fight that one with ease.
( the real reason they are charged with so many crimes isn't to secure a lengthy sentence, or even convictions for that matter.... it's to secure a much higher bail, so they have to sit in jail until trial... and to secure a plea deal )

in any event, it's nice to see so many American wanting non-violent offenders to rot in Jail.... as if prison aren't already chock full of non-violent offenders.

I disagree, although when the FBI arrested them, they pretty much threw everything at them they could, and they could walk on a couple of the charges. However, pointing weapons at FBI agents, which is what a couple of them did, is extremely serious, and will result in some major prison time. Pointing a weapon at anybody IS assault under the law. When I took my gun safety course as a kid, one thing was stressed over and over, and I have carried this with me my entire life. Never pull or point a weapon at someone unless you intend to fire it. Legally, in the Nevada standoff, the intent was clearly there. Had the FBI ratcheted this up any further, we would have been looking at dead FBI agents. Or maybe they were bluffing, but bluffing is not a defense under the law. The video evidence is clear. They will be doing major time.

 

[poweRob]

Finally, charges have been brought against Cliven Bundy and 4 others for threatening the FBI during the standoff in Nevada last year.

Here are your patriots, folks. They are thugs, and they will be doing a whole lot of time in prison. Bundy will probably spend the rest of his life there. Serves them right. No matter what the hate radio talking heads bloviate from their fat mouths, these punks are not patriots. They are just common criminals who hate America. Let them rot.

Article is here.

 

[danarhea]

I used to sing that song, back in the days when I could sing. LOL.

 

[poweRob]

I used to sing that song, back in the days when I could sing. LOL.

Bass players are not allowed to sing. It is unnatural.