Why is abortion acceptable?

[Phys251]

Don't you believe that at some point in the pregnancy there is some voice that says "oh crap, I am pregnant, this baby is coming out, there is no turning back."

If are skydiving, you can back out at any time before actually skydiving. But once you actually jump off you can't all of a sudden change your mind at that point. Some people consider that non-reversal momement the birth of the baby. I consider it a little bit earlier.

Spare me your faux outrage. You want a woman to have fewer bodily rights than a corpse does.

 

[Integrityrespec]

Re: We don't know enough to choose wisely; it may be beyond us politically/socially, even if we do k

Roe v Wade may be law but that doesn't make it moral.
At one time it was law to own other humans. It was law to count blacks as 3/4 of a person. Also according to law Donald Trump is the president.

 

[Praxas]

Re: We don't know enough to choose wisely; it may be beyond us politically/socially, even if we do k

Roe v Wade may be law but that doesn't make it moral.
At one time it was law to own other humans. It was law to count blacks as 3/4 of a person. Also according to law Donald Trump is the president.

And there are lots of legal things that you may not think are moral. Legal does not equal moral. So what’s your point?

 

[minnie616]

As they are before birth...they're not dogs or cats...humans beget humans...

An unborn human is human but it is not a child.
A fertilized chicken egg is not a chick.

A wise farmer does not count his chicks before they hatch.

 

[Daisy]

An unborn human is human but it is not a child.
A fertilized chicken egg is not a chick.

A wise farmer does not count his chicks before they hatch.

We're not talking about a chick's life, either...:roll:

 

[Bodi]

Isn't it morally hypocritical to say abortion is simply a health issue/procedure and has zero ethical implications?

I just find it odd how some people can morally justify aborting a pre-birth baby that could live outside the womb, yet find aborting a baby after birth murder. That fetus pre-birth has exactly the same prospect, future and life as a baby just newborn.



Abortion, by Peter Singer

So the moral line between good and bad is simply birth? That does not seem correct IMO. I am no pro-life nut. I do not believe once an egg is fertilized that doesn't constitute a human being with rights. That's a silly argument. But to say a fetus that is viable is not deserving of rights is equally silly.

IMO if you morally can justify aborting a fetus that is 9-months old, viable to be born, you most likely justify some form of infanticide and killing a human in some circumstances, which IMO is still morally reprehnsible.

I definitely think this is worth discussing. I have received pm's here that said I shouldn't be discussing abortion because I am a man. That is BS. This is a moral issue. Just because I am a man should not disqualify me from discussing abortion!

Women are essentially natural incubators... that role does not come with an off switch. They incubate and then deliver... then repeat.

 

[Bodi]

We're not talking about a chick's life, either...:roll:

Tell that to my scrambled eggs this morning...

 

[Bodi]

Re: We don't know enough to choose wisely; it may be beyond us politically/socially, even if we do k

And there are lots of legal things that you may not think are moral. Legal does not equal moral. So what’s your point?

Laws are based off of morals... Fail Harder...

 

[Stopandthink]

Re: Because abortion law hadn't kept up with medical advances

So then you are completely disregarding the moral implications of forcing a woman to remain pregnant against her will? What that would require by the govt to identify and enforce?

Like I said earlier to the OP, you won’t get an honest answer to the original question. Care to reply without a straw man?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[minnie616]

We're not talking about a chick's life, either...:roll:

Really?

Then let me make it clear.
An unborn is not a child.

I had 6 known pregnancies.
I have 4 born children.
I had 2 miscarriages.
The miscarriages never were children and they will never be children.

Calling them a child/children before they are born does not make them a child or children.

 

[southwest88]

Re: There are lots of resources available, & that's a good thing

Originally Posted by southwest88
The point stands - age 18 is much too late to start formal education.

With a public K-12 education only gets people to accept a very basic education. Everyone in America gets a basic k-9 education and when you turn 16 your can quite school. Sure, you can get a GED and go to a community college and get your degree of a two year schooling at the level of a community level. Sure you can transfer, but that is very uncommon then the general practice.

Yah, by formal education I meant curriculum, textbooks/workbooks, licensed teachers - K-12 in the US, for instance. Postsecondary education is postsecondary - after high school.

 

[Daisy]

Really?

Then let me make it clear.
An unborn is not a child.

I had 6 known pregnancies.
I have 4 born children.
I had 2 miscarriages.
The miscarriages never were children and they will never be children.

Calling them a child/children before they are born does not make them a child or children.

I've read your story before...God says He forms the unborn in the womb and He knows them before they are born so I will take His word for it......Jeremiah 1:5; Psalm 139:15,16; Job 31:15...humans, even the unborn will be resurrected in the last day...John 5:28,29; Acts 24:15...

 

[southwest88]

The cost in blood was high

Roe v Wade may be law but that doesn't make it moral.
At one time it was law to own other humans. It was law to count blacks as 3/4 of a person. Also according to law Donald Trump is the president.

Yes. But the US is a secular government, not a theocracy. & so national law is a fair indication of what the voters as a whole think is moral, or @ least the minimum acceptable level of behavior. Polling indicates that the majority of the US population wants Roe v. Wade to remain in place.

Yep, slavery goes back to @ least Biblical times (what was the source of that morality, again?) & yes, for purposes of representation of state population in the US House of Representatives, Black slaves were counted as 3/5 of a person (this gave the slaveholding South a lot of political power in the House, @ the federal level). & then the US Civil War finally exploded, as everyone who thought about the matter feared. & slavery was rescinded, the 3/5 rule went away.

 

[minnie616]

I've read your story before...God says He forms the unborn in the womb and He knows them before they are born so I will take His word for it......Jeremiah 1:5; Psalm 139:15,16; Job 31:15...humans, even the unborn will be resurrected in the last day...John 5:28,29; Acts 24:15...

That is your belief and you are welcome to it.

But my Mainline Protestant Christian Church and I sincerely belive that life begins when a newborn takes their first breath which is “ the breath of life”. It is then that they become a living souls.

Please allow me to respect my belief as I allow you to respect yours.

When it comes to reproduction health pro choice allows all religious faith to follow their tenets.


The Supreme Court took the Jewish beliefs and the Protestant beliefs into concideration when they decided Roe.

From part IX of Roe:

There has always been strong support for the view that life does not begin until live' birth. This was the belief of the Stoics. [Footnote 56] It appears to be the predominant, though not the unanimous, attitude of the Jewish faith. [Footnote 57] It may be taken to represent also the position of a large segment of the Protestant community, insofar as that can be ascertained; organized groups that have taken a formal position on the abortion issue have generally regarded abortion as a matter for the conscience of the individual and her family. [Footnote 58]

 

[Daisy]

That is your belief and you are welcome to it.

But my Mainline Protestant Christian Church and I sincerely belive that life begins when a newborn takes their first breath which is “ the breath of life”. It is then that they become a living souls.

Please allow me to respect my belief as I allow you to respect yours.

When it comes to reproduction health pro choice allows all religious faith to follow their tenets.


The Supreme Court took the Jewish beliefs and the Protestant beliefs into concideration when they decided Roe.

From part IX of Roe:

But you don't...you responded to me first...if you respected my belief, you would've left well enough alone...

 

[Praxas]

Re: We don't know enough to choose wisely; it may be beyond us politically/socially, even if we do k

Laws are based off of morals... Fail Harder...

So gambling and prostitution are legal in areas of Nevada, does that mean gambling and prostitution are moral? Stick your foot in your mouth more, you might be able to taste the **** you just stepped in trying to act smart.

 

[AGENT J]

1.) Isn't it morally hypocritical to say abortion is simply a health issue/procedure and has zero ethical implications?
2.)I just find it odd how some people can morally justify aborting a pre-birth baby that could live outside the womb, yet find aborting a baby after birth murder. That fetus pre-birth has exactly the same prospect, future and life as a baby just newborn.
3.)
Abortion, by Peter Singer

3.)So the moral line between good and bad is simply birth? That does not seem correct IMO. I am no pro-life nut. I do not believe once an egg is fertilized that doesn't constitute a human being with rights. That's a silly argument. But to say a fetus that is viable is not deserving of rights is equally silly.

4.)IMO if you morally can justify aborting a fetus that is 9-months old, viable to be born, you most likely justify some form of infanticide and killing a human in some circumstances, which IMO is still morally reprehnsible.

5.) I definitely think this is worth discussing. I have received pm's here that said I shouldn't be discussing abortion because I am a man. That is BS. This is a moral issue. Just because I am a man should not disqualify me from discussing abortion!

well this is easy

1.) morals are subjective
2.) same way its odd to value the woman as a lesser and think its ok to violate her legal and human rights
3.) everything you just said instantly fails because you ignore the woman while judging others for ignore the ZEF . . thats what is hypocritical. Falsely trying to deny what you are doing while judging others.
4.) you are free to have that opinion but its meaningless to abortion
5.) again morals are subjective and theres no moral high ground here and YES being a man can take away from any argument yo make on this because its not your legal and human rights at stake.

Heres the facts. No matter if you are pro-life or pro-choice you value one entity (woman/ZEF) over the other, the only difference is why and when . . . HONEST, EDUCATED and OBJECTIVE from both sides admit this :shrug:

 

[minnie616]

But you don't...you responded to me first...if you respected my belief, you would've left well enough alone...

I respect your beliefs.

Just pointing out not all Christian religions have the same tenets/beliefs.

I’m not trying to pass a law that would force my religious belief on you or any other citizens who have different religious beliefs than mine.

 

[Daisy]

I respect your beliefs.

Just pointing out not all Christian religions have the same tenets/beliefs.

I’m not trying to pass a law that would force my religious belief on you or any other citizens who have different religious beliefs than mine.

Uh huh...I did not mention passing any laws...

 

[Bodi]

Re: We don't know enough to choose wisely; it may be beyond us politically/socially, even if we do k

So gambling and prostitution are legal in areas of Nevada, does that mean gambling and prostitution are moral? Stick your foot in your mouth more, you might be able to taste the **** you just stepped in trying to act smart.

Yes. Prostitution and gambling are moral. Your argument fails for a very simple fundamental reason. Do you know what it is?

 

[minnie616]

Uh huh...I did not mention passing any laws...

Good. Glad you do support laws that would ban abortions and thus take away my religious liberty.

 

[Daisy]

Good. Glad you do support laws that would ban abortions and thus take away my religious liberty.

I could not care less what the secular laws are since I obey God's laws first, then man's second...when man's interferes with God's, God's comes first...Acts 5:29...

 

[Bodi]

I could not care less what the secular laws are since I obey God's laws first, then man's second...when man's interferes with God's, God's comes first...Acts 5:29...

No. God's still comes second and you are forced to adhere to man's laws as a result.

 

[Daisy]

No. God's still comes second and you are forced to adhere to man's laws as a result.

No, I am not...if man's law interferes with God's law, I will obey God...

 

[Bodi]

No, I am not...if man's law interferes with God's law, I will obey God...

and be arrested by man... that is the point. Sell your child into slavery or prostitution and see what happens... "And I will sell your sons and your daughters into the hand of the children of Judah"