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Venezuelan scavengers vie with vultures for Brazilian trash

Brilliant. Absolutely brilliant. The degree of insight required to recognize that the American left is desperate to turn the US into a ****hole like Venezuela is astounding.
It's reassuring, too, to know that you and your ilk are maintaining the vigilance needed to prevent such a tragedy. Don't ever let anyone stop you from preparing for, even encouraging, the irreparable fracturing of American society. And don't ever let 'reason' and 'sanity' interrupt your poisonous fantasies.
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No run along and worry about your own little pissant country. Literally could not give a **** about your opinion if I bought 3 extra ****s on special and had them lying around spare to give.
 
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No run along and worry about your own little pissant country. Literally could not give a **** about your opinion if I bought 3 extra ****s on special and had them lying around spare to give.

Inneresting thing about Google- if you right-click on a pic you get a menu that includes 'search Google for this image'. Provides context, you know, like that first pic which comes up...

L.A. homeless crisis grows despite political promises, many speeches and millions of dollars. How do we fix this? - Los Angeles Times

Tents line up along South Beaudry Avenue. Homelessness across greater L.A. stretches in skid rows from Burbank to Bel-Air.

Second one comes up with...

Trash Homeless People | www.picswe.com

Trash is piled up near a camp site near royal brougham way and airport way...

More @ seattletimes.com

Third one comes up with...

In pictures: 'Freegans' find dinner in Dumpsters - The Globe and Mail

"A group of young women climb around in Dumpsters in the back alleys of Coquitlam, B.C., searching for discarded food. These women are not homeless or poor, but choose to scavenge their meals this way. They are part of a movement called 'freeganism'. A 'freegan' is someone who gathers edible food from the dumpster bins of grocery stores or food stands that would otherwise have been thrown away. Freegans aim to spend little, if no money on purchasing food and other goods. Rather, they see the potential in discarded items whether it be clothes, food, or other goods. The choice to not spend money on items such as food is rarely based on a financial need; rather it is trying to address issues of over-consumption and excess."

What was your point again?
 
Merely confirmation of previous lies. The fact that Maduro's cheerleaders claim something does not make it less of a lie. The US does indeed have poor relations with Venezuela, largely provoked by the Venezuelan regime. That is, however, well short of "unconventional war." Again, if you want your posts to be read in full they should not open with a lie.

Jack Hays:

So Col. David S Maxwell a special forces specialist writing in the Small Wars Journal and the US Army Unconventional Warfare Manual writers are Maduro's cheerleaders?

Col. Maxwell provides/cites a definition for Unconventional Warfare (UW) and that is:

The USSOCOM approved definition for UW is:
"Activities conducted to enable a resistance movement or insurgency to coerce, disrupt or overthrow a government or occupying power by operating through or with an underground, auxiliary and guerrilla force in a denied area."

That fits the bill for what is happening in Venezuela nicely. The opposition is armed and has killed/murdered Venezuelans as part of their resistance to the Maduro Regime (which has also killed/murdered protesters and insurgents). The US Government has been cooperating with that opposition resistance and that cooperatin includes sanctions, using organisations like the World Bank, the IMF, etc., restricting Venezuelan trade, breaching Venezuelan sovereignty, and threatening both proxy and direct military intervention as per the US Army UW Manual linked to in my last post.

Against these sources you have provided nothing except your own opinion and repeated declarations that claiming UW by the US Government is happening in Venezuela is a lie. It clearly is not, no matter how many times you repeat your baseless denial.

As per our new SOP, no cheers for you.
Evilroddy.
 
Jack Hays:

So Col. David S Maxwell a special forces specialist writing in the Small Wars Journal and the US Army Unconventional Warfare Manual writers are Maduro's cheerleaders?

Col. Maxwell provides/cites a definition for Unconventional Warfare (UW) and that is:



That fits the bill for what is happening in Venezuela nicely. The opposition is armed and has killed/murdered Venezuelans as part of their resistance to the Maduro Regime (which has also killed/murdered protesters and insurgents). The US Government has been cooperating with that opposition resistance and that cooperatin includes sanctions, using organisations like the World Bank, the IMF, etc., restricting Venezuelan trade, breaching Venezuelan sovereignty, and threatening both proxy and direct military intervention as per the US Army UW Manual linked to in my last post.

Against these sources you have provided nothing except your own opinion and repeated declarations that claiming UW by the US Government is happening in Venezuela is a lie. It clearly is not, no matter how many times you repeat your baseless denial.

As per our new SOP, no cheers for you.
Evilroddy.

Sorry, but nothing done by the US fits Col. Maxwell's definition. To claim that it does is simply another restatement of the original lie.
 
Sorry, but nothing done by the US fits Col. Maxwell's definition. To claim that it does is simply another restatement of the original lie.

Jack Hays:

I have proved otherwise. You have proved nothing. The US Government is engaged in a regime change UW campaign in Venezuela.

U.S. Puts New Sanctions on Cuba Targeting Venezuela - The Atlantic

Your personal opinion, unsupported by facts or authority is irrelevant. This is a debate site and not a platform for your peculiar brand of Papal Bull.

SOP re Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
Jack Hays:

So Col. David S Maxwell a special forces specialist writing in the Small Wars Journal and the US Army Unconventional Warfare Manual writers are Maduro's cheerleaders?

Col. Maxwell provides/cites a definition for Unconventional Warfare (UW) and that is:



That fits the bill for what is happening in Venezuela nicely. The opposition is armed and has killed/murdered Venezuelans as part of their resistance to the Maduro Regime (which has also killed/murdered protesters and insurgents). The US Government has been cooperating with that opposition resistance and that cooperatin includes sanctions, using organisations like the World Bank, the IMF, etc., restricting Venezuelan trade, breaching Venezuelan sovereignty, and threatening both proxy and direct military intervention as per the US Army UW Manual linked to in my last post.

Against these sources you have provided nothing except your own opinion and repeated declarations that claiming UW by the US Government is happening in Venezuela is a lie. It clearly is not, no matter how many times you repeat your baseless denial.

As per our new SOP, no cheers for you.
Evilroddy.


Can you blame them? You try going a month without electricity and a couple weeks without running water and let's find out how peaceful you are. It was telling when I saw a group of Venezuelans waiting for a coyote to escort them back home shout "Venezuela" at the taxi I was in. It was meant to throw it in the face of prejudiced Colombians that they were still proud to be Venezuelan. I shouted "Estados Unidos" and they applauded.

It was interesting to watch taxi drivers pull of to the side of the road buy 5 gallons of gas lugged over in gas cans from Venezuelans who smuggle it across the Tachira River.
 
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Jack Hays:

I have proved otherwise. You have proved nothing. The US Government is engaged in a regime change UW campaign in Venezuela.

U.S. Puts New Sanctions on Cuba Targeting Venezuela - The Atlantic

Your personal opinion, unsupported by facts or authority is irrelevant. This is a debate site and not a platform for your peculiar brand of Papal Bull.

SOP re Cheers.
Evilroddy.

The facts are not in dispute. The lie is in characterizing US policy as unconventional war, which it manifestly is not.
 
The facts are not in dispute. The lie is in characterizing US policy as unconventional war, which it manifestly is not.

Jack Hays:

Still no evidence to support your unsubstantiated opinion, therefore still irrelevant prattle.

No cheers for you.
Evilroddy.
 
Jack Hays:

Still no evidence to support your unsubstantiated opinion, therefore still irrelevant prattle.

No cheers for you.
Evilroddy.

A lie is a lie. After identifying the lie, nothing further is needed.
 
Venezuleans are not stupid; they know what's going on. They are being held at gunpoint in an unbearable situation. They are being repressed by brute force. What Maduro is doing qualifies as crimes against humanity. Venezuela is essentially one big prison.
 
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A lie is a lie. After identifying the lie, nothing further is needed.

I saw what Venezuelans are going through with my own eyes. I don't need a "link".
 
Jack Hays:

Still no evidence to support your unsubstantiated opinion, therefore still irrelevant prattle.

No cheers for you.
Evilroddy.

It seems that you don't give a damn what Maduro does to his own people.
 
Can you blame them? You try going a month without electricity and a couple weeks without running water and let's find out how peaceful you are. It was telling when I saw a group of Venezuelans waiting for a coyote to escort them back home shout "Venezuela" at the taxi I was in. It was meant to throw it in the face of prejudiced Colombians that they were still proud to be Venezuelan. I shouted "Estados Unidos" and they applauded.

It was interesting to watch taxi drivers pull of to the side of the road buy 5 gallons of gas lugged over in gas cans from Venezuelans who smuggle it across the Tachira River.

I don't blame the protestors for protesting to remove the Maduro regime. That is their right if they are willing to accept the risks of doing so, I applauded them.

However I do not approve of or support a right-wing opposition dressed up in social-democracy camouflage which would never get an electoral mandate from Venezuelans for its neo-liberal policies seizing power by force with the help of foreign powers. Chavismo and Chavistas are not going to simply evaporate should the Lopez-Guaido circle seize power. They will fight and that will plunge Venezuela into a viscious guerrilla civil war and COIN campaign which will make the Caracados look like a national flesh-wound.

Let the protestors of all persuasions remove the sitting president by recall petition and then have general elections to replace him within thirty consecutive days as per the constitution. If the people of Venezuela decide to knowingly elect a neo-liberal and anti-welfare state government then fine. But far more likely they will replace the president with another Chavista or former Chavista in order to continue the Bolivarian Revolution which helped millions of Venezuelans to be fed, housed, trained and educated towards a better life. That progress was derailed by the death of Hugo Chavez and the US/Saudi-led plunge in world oil prices in response to the Russian seizure of Crimea. The failure of the Venezuelan government runs as much through Rhiyad and Washington DC as it does through the presidential palace in Caracas.

As to living without electricity and water utilities for months on end, you have just described many of my best past summer and two winter vacations in Canada's wilderness. The people of Venezuela are tougher than we think and the fanatic Chavistas will prove much tougher still. This is a replay of the 1970's UW campaign in Chile to make Chileans "scream" but when it fails to produce the desired results for the US Government, as it failed in Chile, then the ne'er ening and brutalising generals will be Columbian and Brazilian ones rather than local ones in Venezuela.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
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A lie is a lie. After identifying the lie, nothing further is needed.

Jack Hays:

Identifying/labelling something as a lie does not make it so. Proving it by falsifying the claim is needed. That requires proof, evidence and authority, none of which you have provided. Your words are empty and meaningless opinions unless substantiated and your devotion to repetition recalls to my mind pictures of the rocking-back-and-forth students indoctrinated in madrassas in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia. Prove your case or you have no case at all.

No cheers for you.
Evilroddy.
 
I don't blame the protestors for protesting to remove the Maduro regime. That is their right if they are willing to accept the risks of doing so, I applauded them.

However I do not approve of or support a right-wing opposition dressed up in social-democracy camouflage which would never get an electoral mandate from Venezuelans for its neo-liberal policies seizing power by force with the help of foreign powers. Chavismo and Chavistas are not going to simply evaporate should the Lopez-Guaido circle seize power. They will fight and that will plunge Venezuela into a viscious guerrilla civil war and COIN campaign which will make the Caracados look like a national flesh-wound.

Let the protestors of all persuasions remove the sitting president by recall petition and then have general elections to replace him within thirty consecutive days as per the constitution. If the people of Venezuela decide to knowingly elect a neo-liberal and anti-welfare state government then fine. But far more likely they will replace the president with another Chavista or former Chavista in order to continue the Bolivarian Revolution which helped millions of Venezuelans to be fed, housed, trained and educated towards a better life. That progress was derailed by the death of Hugo Chavez and the US/Saudi-led plunge in world oil prices in response to the Russian seizure of Crimea. The failure of the Venezuelan government runs as much through Rhiyad and Washington DC as it does through the presidential palace in Caracas.

As to living without electricity and water utilities for months on end, you have just described many of my best past summer and two winter vacations in Canada's wilderness. The people of Venezuela are tougher than we think and the fanatic Chavistas will prove much tougher still. This is a replay of the 1970's UW campaign in Chile to make Chileans "scream" but when it fails to produce the desired results for the US Government, as it failed in Chile, then the ne'er ening and brutalising generals will be Columbian and Brazilian ones rather than local ones in Venezuela.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.

Are you quite sure it failed in Chile? Salvador Allende was about to turn Chile into what Venezuela is today. The sequence of events in Chile wasn't pretty, but today Chile is doing quite well. To this day Chile has a better retirement system than we have here in the USA.
 
I saw what Venezuelans are going through with my own eyes. I don't need a "link".

SDET:

You're on record here as supporting the corrupt and violence-prone Bolsonaro Regime in Brazil. Maduro is bad and must go by Venezuelans doing what is needed. But a Lopez-Guaido junta would very likely be worse than what the Maduro Regime is doing now to the people of Venezuela. Your cure may be far worse than the disease Maduro has brought. So you will please forgive me if I don't trust your eyes on this issue.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
Are you quite sure it failed in Chile? Salvador Allende was about to turn Chile into what Venezuela is today. The sequence of events in Chile wasn't pretty, but today Chile is doing quite well. To this day Chile has a better retirement system than we have here in the USA.

SDET

Killing and disappearing thousands of human beings is never justified and the US Government's policy inspired by the radical neo-liberal Chicago School of economists were the main drivers of Chile's moribund economy at the time. Nixon, not Allende, made Chile "Scream". Trump and Maduro would make Venezuela scream.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.
 
SDET:

You're on record here as supporting the corrupt and violence-prone Bolsonaro Regime in Brazil. Maduro is bad and must go by Venezuelans doing what is needed. But a Lopez-Guaido junta would very likely be worse than what the Maduro Regime is doing now to the people of Venezuela. Your cure may be far worse than the disease Maduro has brought. So you will please forgive me if I don't trust your eyes on this issue.

Cheers.
Evilroddy.

Then go to Cucuta and Maicao yourself and have a look-see. This isn't exactly hidden. It takes 500 or 600 dollars to get there and maybe a week of one's time.

Guaido is just another socialist, so I agree he wouldn't be much of an improvement. However, Venezuela can't allowed to be a colony of Cuba and Hezbollah and a staging area for attacks on the USA.
 
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Jack Hays:

Identifying/labelling something as a lie does not make it so. Proving it by falsifying the claim is needed. That requires proof, evidence and authority, none of which you have provided. Your words are empty and meaningless opinions unless substantiated and your devotion to repetition recalls to my mind pictures of the rocking-back-and-forth students indoctrinated in madrassas in Pakistan or Saudi Arabia. Prove your case or you have no case at all.

No cheers for you.
Evilroddy.

No. You made the claim of unconventional war. The burden of evidence is yours. I say there is no war; I need not prove a negative. The fact is that everything you have so far identified as "war" is fully within bounds of non-war state-to-state relations. Your claim is a lie.
 
No. You made the claim of unconventional war. The burden of evidence is yours. I say there is no war; I need not prove a negative. The fact is that everything you have so far identified as "war" is fully within bounds of non-war state-to-state relations. Your claim is a lie.

Jack Hays:

I have provided ample proof and citations to back up my position. You have answered with unsubstantiated opinion and an absence of sources. I have fulfilled my burden of proof and you have not refuted my case nor my sources, you have simply rejected them or have dismissed them out of hand. If you want to be obstreperous and simply engage in reflexive contradiction in the face of evidence and authority that's your choice. But you are not making any kind of argument to support your counter-assertions.

Now I will offer my own take on this. I am not impressed with your claim that I have lied. Since you made that claim you must back it up with evidence and authority. Put up or shut up as the saying goes. You have not proved anything yet, despite the burden of proof being on the accuser, so I posit that you are the more likely liar in this instance. Prove your accusation or you are revealed as a dissembler and a mendacious fraudster, which given your self-admitted and alleged professional connection with the CIA, would seem to fit into a behavioural pattern of deception and lying.

Still no cheers for you.
Evilroddy.
 
Jack Hays:

I have provided ample proof and citations to back up my position. You have answered with unsubstantiated opinion and an absence of sources. I have fulfilled my burden of proof and you have not refuted my case nor my sources, you have simply rejected them or have dismissed them out of hand. If you want to be obstreperous and simply engage in reflexive contradiction in the face of evidence and authority that's your choice. But you are not making any kind of argument to support your counter-assertions.

Now I will offer my own take on this. I am not impressed with your claim that I have lied. Since you made that claim you must back it up with evidence and authority. Put up or shut up as the saying goes. You have not proved anything yet, despite the burden of proof being on the accuser, so I posit that you are the more likely liar in this instance. Prove your accusation or you are revealed as a dissembler and a mendacious fraudster, which given your self-admitted and alleged professional connection with the CIA, would seem to fit into a behavioural pattern of deception and lying.

Still no cheers for you.
Evilroddy.

You have cited a number of events and actions. None is unconventional war. The claim that they are is a lie.
 
You have cited a number of events and actions. None is unconventional war. The claim that they are is a lie.

From: https://file.wikileaks.org/file/us-fm3-05-130.pdf

Financial Instrument of U.S. National Power and Unconventional Warfare:
2-44. The agent controlling the creation, flow, and access to “stores of value” wields power. Although finance is generally an operation of real and virtual currency, anything that can serve as a “medium of exchange” provides those who accept the medium with a method of financial transaction. For both reasons, ARSOF understand that they can and should exploit the active and analytical capabilities existing in the financial instrument of U.S. power in the conduct of UW.
2-45. Like the economic activity, which all nation-states, human groups, and individuals respond to, ARSOF can use financial power as a weapon in times of conflict up to and including large-scale general war. Like the economic activity that it is related to, most financial power is unmanaged, routine, and peaceful. However, manipulation of U.S. financial strength can leverage the policies and cooperation of state governments. Financial incentives and disincentives can build and sustain international coalitions waging or supporting U.S. UW campaigns. As part of an interagency effort, the U.S. Treasury can recommend changes to U.S. policy that can provide such incentives to state governments and others at the national strategic policy level. Participation in international financial organizations, such as the World Bank (WB), International Monetary Fund (IMF), Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development (OECD), and the Bank for International Settlements (BIS), offers the U.S. diplomatic-financial venues to accomplish such coalitions.
....
2-47. If properly authorized and coordinated, ARSOF can use—or coordinate for other agencies to use— measured and focused financial incentives or disincentives to persuade adversaries, allies, and surrogates to modify their behavior at the theater strategic, operational, and tactical levels. Such application of financial power must be part of a circumspect, integrated, and consistent UW plan.
2-48. Like all other instruments of U.S. national power, the use and effects of financial weapons are interrelated and they must be coordinated carefully. Once again, ARSOF must work with the DOS and IC to determine which elements of the human terrain in the UWOA are most susceptible to financial engagement and what second- and third-order effects are likely from such engagement. The Treasury’s Office of International Affairs and Office of Terrorism and Financial Intelligence (TFI) (and its components), together with the Financial Crimes Enforcement Network (FinCEN), provide financially mission-focused channels for identifying opportunities to employ the financial weapon. In addition to intelligence and policy changes that may provide active incentive or disincentive leverage, the Office of Foreign Assets Control (OFAC) has a long history of conducting economic warfare valuable to any ARSOF UW campaign.

Bolding mine. Your smoking gun Jack Hays. What the US Government is doing in Venezuela is Unconventional Warfare as per the Army Unconventional Warfare Manual. You are the liar, sir and this proves it.

Still no cheers for you.
Evilroddy.
 
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Sorry, but a doctrine document from 2008 is not proof of anything except your desperate attempt to shore up a lie.

Jack Hays:

Yes it does and you're in denial. I have proved my case and you have proved nothing. I will let others decide the case based on the evidence as you seem blind to evidence, authority and reason.

No cheers for you.
Evilroddy.
 
Jack Hays:

Yes it does and you're in denial. I have proved my case and you have proved nothing. I will let others decide the case based on the evidence as you seem blind to evidence, authority and reason.

No cheers for you.
Evilroddy.

Sorry, but you only make yourself look foolish citing an 11-year-old leaked doctrine document to "prove" unconventional war is being conducted now. It's not only a lie, it's a silly lie.
 
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