Trump to Cut Food Stamps

[grip]

Nah, he's not for the affluent and rich, he just hates people out of work. He says he's for another stimulus check but that the new relief bill is dead on arrival because it doesn't give enough to businesses or high earners, like a payroll tax cut.

With Millions Out of Work, the Trump Administration Pushes to Limit Food Stamps

Amid a global pandemic that has rattled the United States economy and led to record-breaking job losses, the Trump Administration is continuing to push to restrict access to the nation's largest food assistance program.

On Tuesday, the U.S. Department of Agriculture quietly issued a notice that it was appealing a judge's injunction that blocked the cabinet agency from proceeding with cuts to the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP), colloquially known as food stamps.

If the USDA wins its appeal, the new requirements would strip 688,000 Americans of their food benefits, according to Department's own estimates. In March, Congress passed legislation that temporarily paused limits on how long most SNAP recipients could receive benefits without working for the duration of the COVID-19 public health emergency. Thus, if the USDA is victorious in its court challenge, the stricter work requirements would be temporarily delayed until the public health emergency was over-but that may be long before the economy rebounds.

To give credit where it's due, I do applaud this program headed by Ivanka.

Coronavirus: Ivanka Trump pushes food distribution program

WASHINGTON - The U.S. Agriculture Department is unveiling a new food distribution program with an emphasis on aiding small businesses.

Under the "Farmers to Families Food Box Program," the federal government buys meat, produce and dairy products from farmers and ranchers, then provides it to local distribution centers that pack and deliver food boxes to those in need.

The distributors will pack the food into boxes for delivery to food banks, community and non-profits that have had trouble getting food because of problems with the supply chain.

The Agriculture Department has already awarded $1.2 billion to food distributors to buy meat, dairy and produce products that farmers have been unable to sell because of government lockdowns.

 

[Drawdown]

Not sure that program is "new" since those were the only things our local food bank was giving out to people already approved through a federal grant once COVID happened. Otherwise their doors remained shut. They were just required to service the contract they had with Uncle Sam.

 

[OldFatGuy]

Nah, he's not for the affluent and rich, he just hates people out of work. He says he's for another stimulus check but that the new relief bill is dead on arrival because it doesn't give enough to businesses or high earners, like a payroll tax cut.

To give credit where it's due, I do applaud this program headed by Ivanka.

Ivanka is not her father. She's brighter and more empathetic toward others. Chelsea Clinton in the background has been organizing Ivanka's 2024 run for the presidency. Interesting that they both have Jewish husbands.

Most may not realize it, like any president, Trump is not his administration. Confusing bit that. But that is part of the problem, discerning where the power truly lays. As FDR learned within a week of Pearl Harbor, and expressed to his cabinet, "I can't believe that all you speak about, apparently think about, is defeat. America thinks otherwise." Two weeks later as CiC he approved the Doolittle raid on Tokyo as a symbol of what would be coming.

 

[grip]

Ivanka is not her father. She's brighter and more empathetic toward others. Chelsea Clinton in the background has been organizing Ivanka's 2024 run for the presidency. Interesting that they both have Jewish husbands.

Most may not realize it, like any president, Trump is not his administration. Confusing bit that. But that is part of the problem, discerning where the power truly lays. As FDR learned within a week of Pearl Harbor, and expressed to his cabinet, "I can't believe that all you speak about, apparently think about, is defeat. America thinks otherwise." Two weeks later as CiC he approved the Doolittle raid on Tokyo as a symbol of what would be coming.

It's simply good PR to help those out of work and the poor right now during this crisis. And those stories of meat, dairy, and egg producers throwing out tons of their product due to distribution problems was sickening, especially with so many people crowding food banks.

 

[OldFatGuy]

It's simply good PR to help those out of work and the poor right now during this crisis. And those stories of meat, dairy, and egg producers throwing out tons of their product due to distribution problems was sickening, especially with so many people crowding food banks.

Don't believe all that you hear from the media. We have a situation with two largest meat processing companies crying for aid. Both were in fiscal trouble before the virus effected the economy, from over expansion. While each threatened and are threatening reduced production, both sold record amounts of pork to China and other parts of Asia, thanks to their problems with swine fever.

Today's immense farms are corporate and cooperative owned, they are taking a hit from lack of distribution in a reduced chain of delivery, but that hit is translating as reduced profits. They are the ones claiming they are destroying products, all of which is in surplus because of poor planning for a stable market but expected export increases that did not materialize. Small, boutique farmers and ranchers who produce for high end purveyors and direct to high end restaurants are being creative, finding new ways to sell directly to the public, and some of them are making even more money doing so, buying product from other small farmers and ranchers to meet the market demands for deliveries as people stay home and cook for themselves. Nothing is what it seems. There is an expected 10% surplus of milk and milk products this year despite all the brouhaha.

Yes, demand from public pantries is up as many lose their jobs, but that too is being addressed with donations and deliveries of government bought surpluses for times like these. What they need is more volunteers to help with distribution, not more product. They are beginning to mine their own beneficiaries for those volunteers. Not what we want to see, because we'd rather see them employed with all that comes from it, including self-respect.

 

[Court Jester]

I hate the food stamp program because it gives people on welfare too many bad choices. Food stamps can't be used for booze and cigarettes, and can't be used for most non food items. But they allow people to buy food from fast food restaurants, ice cream, candy, snack foods--and all sorts of CRAP.

People on welfare should be given assistance that limits their choices. Many are on welfare because of bad choices, so why give people the liberty to make more bad choices? Food assistance should ony be for staple food items---most which people would need to cook themselves if possible. Why allow a welfare person to buy some $8 frozen dinners when they could buy a few bags of rice, some fresh vegetables, and some fresh meat or chicken. Learning how to handle life should be part of the goal with welfare assistance, not allowing people to line up at a 'pig trough and get their slop.

 

[Rexedgar]

Ivanka is not her father. She's brighter and more empathetic toward others. Chelsea Clinton in the background has been organizing Ivanka's 2024 run for the presidency. Interesting that they both have Jewish husbands.

Most may not realize it, like any president, Trump is not his administration. Confusing bit that. But that is part of the problem, discerning where the power truly lays. As FDR learned within a week of Pearl Harbor, and expressed to his cabinet, "I can't believe that all you speak about, apparently think about, is defeat. America thinks otherwise." Two weeks later as CiC he approved the Doolittle raid on Tokyo as a symbol of what would be coming.

I know you are up there in NY and all, but I sure haven’t seen any evidence of this...:shrug:

 

[grip]

Don't believe all that you hear from the media. We have a situation with two largest meat processing companies crying for aid. Both were in fiscal trouble before the virus effected the economy, from over expansion. While each threatened and are threatening reduced production, both sold record amounts of pork to China and other parts of Asia, thanks to their problems with swine fever.

Today's immense farms are corporate and cooperative owned, they are taking a hit from lack of distribution in a reduced chain of delivery, but that hit is translating as reduced profits. They are the ones claiming they are destroying products, all of which is in surplus because of poor planning for a stable market but expected export increases that did not materialize. Small, boutique farmers and ranchers who produce for high end purveyors and direct to high end restaurants are being creative, finding new ways to sell directly to the public, and some of them are making even more money doing so, buying product from other small farmers and ranchers to meet the market demands for deliveries as people stay home and cook for themselves. Nothing is what it seems. There is an expected 10% surplus of milk and milk products this year despite all the brouhaha.

Yes, demand from public pantries is up as many lose their jobs, but that too is being addressed with donations and deliveries of government bought surpluses for times like these. What they need is more volunteers to help with distribution, not more product. They are beginning to mine their own beneficiaries for those volunteers. Not what we want to see, because we'd rather see them employed with all that comes from it, including self-respect.

I read a story about how Trump forced the meat-producing plants, Tyson and Purdue, back open to fulfill China exports, due to the swine flu. I know the bulk of huge American farms are now run by subsidized, corporate co-opts. One or two simultaneous hiccups throws a big monkey wrench in their distribution and delivery. The smaller boutique and organic farmers are slowly starting to gain traction in farmers' markets, restaurants, and local grocery buying programs, like Walmart's.

I knew an eye doctor who's family owned a big potato farm here in FL. They grew oversized red potatoes. He brought me a 50 lb bag once, and they were the best tasting potatoes I'd ever eaten, scalloped, julienned, fried, boiled or baked. I asked him, why can't I find them locally and he said because we sell them to Maine markets while they ship us their Maine potatoes. I told him that's stupid and wasteful but he said they get better prices that way.

 

[JustHanging]

Today's immense farms are corporate and cooperative owned,

And that was likely a big part of the trade wars Trump started in the first place. Corporations could easily borrow money from the bank while they waited for government bail-out money to arrive, after their lawyers had gone through the piles of required paperwork. A lot of family farms wouldn't be so lucky, and faced with bankruptcy, were forced to sell to Corporations for pennies on the dollar.

Trump is always helping out his buddies. And anyone who knows Trump knows he expects them to pay him back.

 

[grip]

I hate the food stamp program because it gives people on welfare too many bad choices. Food stamps can't be used for booze and cigarettes, and can't be used for most non food items. But they allow people to buy food from fast food restaurants, ice cream, candy, snack foods--and all sorts of CRAP.

People on welfare should be given assistance that limits their choices. Many are on welfare because of bad choices, so why give people the liberty to make more bad choices? Food assistance should ony be for staple food items---most which people would need to cook themselves if possible. Why allow a welfare person to buy some $8 frozen dinners when they could buy a few bags of rice, some fresh vegetables, and some fresh meat or chicken. Learning how to handle life should be part of the goal with welfare assistance, not allowing people to line up at a 'pig trough and get their slop.

That's too close to telling people how to live. Here's some assistance, only if you buy exactly what we say. People need some latitude and freedom to make their own mistakes and learn. Nobody gains experience from anything or becomes unique if you force them to always choose what you think is best for them. They just become cattle.

 

[JustHanging]

I asked him, why can't I find them locally and he said because we sell them to Maine markets while they ship us their Maine potatoes. I told him that's stupid and wasteful but he said they get better prices that way.

A similar thing happens with our BC lumber, the good stuff goes overseas while we're left with the crap. If you need a good hockey stick and the sporting good stores are closed, you can hop down to Home Depot's 2x4 bin.

 

[grip]

A similar thing happens with our BC lumber, the good stuff goes overseas while we're left with the crap. If you need a good hockey stick and the sporting good stores are closed, you can hop down to Home Depot's 2x4 bin.

We used to have FL fruit stands with all kinds of citrus for tourists to buy. Best oranges you ever tasted. They disappeared over 30 yrs ago and the oranges we get at the grocery now are tasteless. Probably from South America.

 

[Court Jester]

That's too close to telling people how to live. Here's some assistance, only if you buy exactly what we say.

People who don't want to be told how to live need to pay for their own stuff themselves. When anyone gets bailed out by someone else---especially hard working taxpayers who aren't on the dole, then being given conditions comes with the territory. Everytime I see some dufus at the grocery buying junk food and candy with food stamps while I am shopping on a budget I get annoyed. I AM PAYING FOR THEIR STUFF.

People need some latitude and freedom to make their own mistakes and learn. Nobody gains experience from anything or becomes unique if you force them to always choose what you think is best for them. They just become cattle.

They already had latitude and they squandered it in most of these cases which is why they are on welfare. Poor life choices is still the number one reason why people are poor, so you think giving failure MORE latitude is a good plan? I disagree.

So do you think the many middle class working Americans who live their entire lives never accepting welfare didn't make choices which kept them off public assistance? That they didn't benefit from learning what works and what doesn't work? If I invite someone to my house for a meal they are going to eat what I put on the table; they don't get to just go to the icebox and start preparing what they prefer, they get what I give them or they can go home and make their own meal.

The problem today with welfare/food stamps---especially EBT cards, is that people can just use them at the point of payment like they are credit or debit card--- and there isn't any public shame involved. They just walk in and use the cards like the funds came form their own hard work and not mine and the other taxpayers. What used to keep many people off of welfare was shame---- that and being regulated to "poor farms" (actual places) where people had to line up and get their portion of food from a bucket. A little scorn and ridicule to the recipe of public assistance is a good thing.... another method of what a "learning experience" should be.

 

[grip]

People who don't want to be told how to live need to pay for their own stuff themselves. When anyone gets bailed out by someone else---especially hard working taxpayers who aren't on the dole, then being given conditions comes with the territory. Everytime I see some dufus at the grocery buying junk food and candy with food stamps while I am shopping on a budget I get annoyed. I AM PAYING FOR THEIR STUFF.



They already had latitude and they squandered it in most of these cases which is why they are on welfare. Poor life choices is still the number one reason why people are poor, so you think giving failure MORE latitude is a good plan? I disagree.

So do you think the many middle class working Americans who live their entire lives never accepting welfare didn't make choices which kept them off public assistance? That they didn't benefit from learning what works and what doesn't work? If I invite someone to my house for a meal they are going to eat what I put on the table; they don't get to just go to the icebox and start preparing what they prefer, they get what I give them or they can go home and make their own meal.

The problem today with welfare/food stamps---especially EBT cards, is that people can just use them at the point of payment like they are credit or debit card--- and there isn't any public shame involved. They just walk in and use the cards like the funds came form their own hard work and not mine and the other taxpayers. What used to keep many people off of welfare was shame---- that and being regulated to "poor farms" (actual places) where people had to line up and get their portion of food from a bucket. A little scorn and ridicule to the recipe of public assistance is a good thing.... another method of what a "learning experience" should be.

You have some good points but too few to mention. You have no love in your heart and think money should control everything. If you're fortunate enough to pay taxes to help others, be grateful. You're only a few missteps and bad circumstances away from being one of the ignorant poor.

 

[Jason Warfield]

I hate the food stamp program because it gives people on welfare too many bad choices. Food stamps can't be used for booze and cigarettes, and can't be used for most non food items. But they allow people to buy food from fast food restaurants, ice cream, candy, snack foods--and all sorts of CRAP.

People on welfare should be given assistance that limits their choices. Many are on welfare because of bad choices, so why give people the liberty to make more bad choices? Food assistance should ony be for staple food items---most which people would need to cook themselves if possible. Why allow a welfare person to buy some $8 frozen dinners when they could buy a few bags of rice, some fresh vegetables, and some fresh meat or chicken. Learning how to handle life should be part of the goal with welfare assistance, not allowing people to line up at a 'pig trough and get their slop.

Because...and I'm not trying to be snarky...it is cheaper to feed a family on microwave meals and processed food than it is to feed a family on fresh food and rice and it stretched the value out to get more food that way. Not to mention that many of those who use food stamps are also working exhausting jobs that underpay or are working multiple jobs and do not have the time to be able to make from scratch a meal every day. Before COVID-19.

And now, even if they aren't working because of COVID-19 they have to contend with fresh food that is higher priced, which means they may not even get enough to make the food stamps worth it if they were not allowed to get processed and frozen meals.

 

[OldFatGuy]

I know you are up there in NY and all, but I sure haven’t seen any evidence of this...:shrug:

At this point in time, all campaigning for 2024 is at the philanthropies, the fund raisers, it is very much a social thing, dominated by the women, with the men later subject to their decisions. Right now, with Covid 19 being what it is, the events are at a standstill, but those letters and phone calls are damn busy. "I'm calling in behalf of .... who expects your donation for ....., no matter how small (this last means it better be large ).

 

[Casper]

Nah, he's not for the affluent and rich, he just hates people out of work. He says he's for another stimulus check but that the new relief bill is dead on arrival because it doesn't give enough to businesses or high earners, like a payroll tax cut.





To give credit where it's due, I do applaud this program headed by Ivanka.

He will also cut Medicare and Social Secury, he does not care one way or the other, but his Republican Minions in the Senate want it. Funny part is many of trump's and the GOP supporters don't actually know he is about to Reduce their Benefits.

 

[Jason Warfield]

Just a reminder...the pandemic has caused tens of millions to lose their jobs through no fault of their own.

This situation may go on for some time yet. And Trump wants to cut food stamps...that those very people who lost their jobs due to being closed down by COVID-19.

How are those people lazy and can they really be classified as "takers" or "leeches" when they are trying to find a job in one of the nation's worst times to even try to do that, are being forced to deplete their savings because the state they live in is so overwhelmed in the backlog of unemployment.

And remember, we are just talking about food here...not the other monthly bills they are responsible for.

 

[OldFatGuy]

And that was likely a big part of the trade wars Trump started in the first place. Corporations could easily borrow money from the bank while they waited for government bail-out money to arrive, after their lawyers had gone through the piles of required paperwork. A lot of family farms wouldn't be so lucky, and faced with bankruptcy, were forced to sell to Corporations for pennies on the dollar.

Trump is always helping out his buddies. And anyone who knows Trump knows he expects them to pay him back.

This all has little or nothing to do with Trump. Take a good look at the cattle industry. Those huge herds that dominate the market belong to European investors, and it has been that way since day one. The rancher who runs 50 head or less is incidental to the marketplace. I know ranchers who run a dozen or so cattle, and they do well in their own eyes. Unfortunately, many small farmers were caught between rocks and a hard place. Over farmed soil, insufficient funds and credit to modernize, a hard scrabble life farming rocks abandoned by many. Not just economics, but dreams that made for poor realities. This nation was built on greed, greed for cheap land desired by the European and Asian masses. Land in Europe and Asia was controlled by the nobility and translated as real sustainable wealth.

Here today, that is far from reality. During the 19th and early 20th century, more "farm" and "ranch" lands were bought by the railroads and mining companies than by big farms and ranches. It wasn't until the 1950's and 60's did the big farms start buying from the bankrupt railroads and failed mining companies. Why buy 20 or 60 acres from a foreclosing bank trying to recover mortgage money when you could buy 2,000 acres for less?

Take a good look, it isn't banks who finance our food industries today. It is still European and Asian investment groups, led by American money managers. I've been buying abandoned small farms in northern NY for decades, usually for a portion of back taxes, properties that have been on county books for decades. Unwanted, and un-arable. I worked with cash profits from other real property investments. Never took out a mortgage. Now I am 4th largest land owner in northwestern and northeastern NY, managing that land for future timber harvests, sustainable softwoods now to carry costs, old growth hardwoods for future harvest long after I am gone. Not a week passes where I do not receive unsolicited financing offers a hundred to two thousand times my original investments from investment groups from overseas, hedge funds and money managers. I could easily cash out and walk away because I have proved it can be done. However, not even considering the environmental improvements, the return of NY rain forests, and all that means, the real profits will be enjoyed by my heirs 4 to 5 generations from now with sustainable forestry on lands that never should have been cleared and farmed. My partners in other ventures, well satisfied with my acumen, thought this was folly. Now, those of them who are still alive wish they had joined me.

 

[Court Jester]

Because...and I'm not trying to be snarky...it is cheaper to feed a family on microwave meals and processed food than it is to feed a family on fresh food and rice and it stretched the value out to get more food that way.

Maybe you are using the "new math" version of home economics, but frozen dinners and other processed meals all cost more per ounce than making meals from scratch using staple food ingredients. For one you get MORE meals out of a batch---often able to feed the entire family and then put the rest in the fridge (or freezer) for additional meals. And why do you say "feed a family"? Why can't they feed themselves?

Not to mention that many of those who use food stamps are also working exhausting jobs that underpay or are working multiple jobs and do not have the time to be able to make from scratch a meal every day. Before COVID-19.

Oh please!!!! Please stop with what one President called "the soft bigotry of low expectations". Everybody who works a job has challenges, and the harder you work the hungrier you will be---- thus more MOTIVATED to handle your meals. You think hunter gatherers weren't out exhausting themselves trying to find enough calories to get through a week? You think when they got back to the cave exhausted they didn't prepare their meals? Weren't any microwaves back then.

And now, even if they aren't working because of COVID-19 they have to contend with fresh food that is higher priced, which means they may not even get enough to make the food stamps worth it if they were not allowed to get processed and frozen meals.

A few weeks ago I bought a 20lb bag of jasmine rice for only $8. Add to that some chicken at 99 cents per pound, and some fresh green vegetables--- and we are talking a dozen or more meals for about $25. What is so hard about that? These people can't figure this out?

But maybe you are right, maybe many Americans have grown so soft they need to be "spoon fed". Maybe it takes people like Viet Cong soldiers who could live on a pound of rice for a week to make it through hard times. I guess some of us just grew up in a different world; had parents and grandparents who taught us life lessons and skill sets which are helpful in hard times. Wasn't like they were rich or not "exhausted" from hard work either. Maybe 50 years and several generations now who grew up under the society destroying programs of "the great society" is why some people can't figure stuff out for themselves.

Pretty sad I say.

 

[Hatuey]

I hate the food stamp program because it gives people on welfare too many bad choices. Food stamps can't be used for booze and cigarettes, and can't be used for most non food items. But they allow people to buy food from fast food restaurants, ice cream, candy, snack foods--and all sorts of CRAP.

People on welfare should be given assistance that limits their choices. Many are on welfare because of bad choices, so why give people the liberty to make more bad choices? Food assistance should ony be for staple food items---most which people would need to cook themselves if possible. Why allow a welfare person to buy some $8 frozen dinners when they could buy a few bags of rice, some fresh vegetables, and some fresh meat or chicken. Learning how to handle life should be part of the goal with welfare assistance, not allowing people to line up at a 'pig trough and get their slop.

I... I agree ....? Yes. And no tax cuts for fast food megacorporations. All their taxes should go towards funding markets catering to poor people.



Я Баба Яга [emoji328]

 

[OldFatGuy]

I... I agree ....? Yes. And no tax cuts for fast food megacorporations. All their taxes should go towards funding markets catering to poor people.

Why? No one owes poor people anything. Anything done for the benefit of the poor by the wealthy is an obligation fulfilled by choice, not overstepping societal laws and governance. Give away your own wealth if you have it, not the wealth of others. Empowering government to steal is theft.

 

[Hatuey]

Why? No one owes poor people anything.

Except the people begging for the tax dollars of those poor people whenever the economy takes a nose dive. They definitely owe.

You're embarrassing yourself. Make up a story, I dare ya.

Я Баба Яга [emoji328]

 

[OldFatGuy]

Except the people begging for the tax dollars of those poor people whenever the economy takes a nose dive. They definitely owe.

You're embarrassing yourself. Make up a story, I dare ya.

Life sucks and it is unfair, too bad. You are embarrassing yourself with sentiment. Why should I care about the poor? I care about my family first, then my friends, then my neighbors, then my community. Your sentiments mean nothing to me, an embarrassment as you put it, to those who have worked and risked for what they have. I'm not begging for anything, least of all someone else's tax dollars. Talk to me about politicians like Bill DeBlasio, Andy Cuomo, Sheldon Silver, all big spenders of tax money who have done well lining their own pockets. And Silver, a convicted felon walks free because of democrat corruption. There's you story. Deny it.

 

[jonny5]

Nah, he's not for the affluent and rich, he just hates people out of work. He says he's for another stimulus check but that the new relief bill is dead on arrival because it doesn't give enough to businesses or high earners, like a payroll tax cut.

Hes right, and theres no need for hyperbole. He clearly doesnt hate people out of work. SNAP is wasteful, unneccesary, and illegal. The federal govt should not be taking money from me and buying food for my neighbor. Especially when that neighbor is perfectly capable of working and there are jobs available, before, now, and after this virus. In the 90s we had something called welfare to work, which got millions of people off welfare and into jobs so they could be self sufficient. And since then, its been eroded to where we now have more people than ever dependant on the govt.

Such that when an emergency comes along, we have to spend trillions bailing everyone and everything out. Billions that I will have to pay for since I actually work and save my money and can take care of myself. All Trumps rule does is reduce abuse by setting higher standards of eligibility.

New USDA Rule Will Help Reduce SNAP Abuse and Encourage Work | Citizens Against Government Waste

Program loopholes and lax oversight have resulted in billions of dollars in wasteful improper payments.

The Secretary’s new proposed rule will redefine categorical eligibility as ongoing and substantial, worth at least $50 or more per month, targeted toward clear benefits like transportation or childcare support.