The U.S. national debt is rising by $1 trillion about every 100 days

[jonny5]

To continue to use the Japanese system as an example, and my own thoughts; the sales tax here is an additional tax to the income tax. We pay an income tax AND the central government's sales tax. AND citizens from other nations that may make over a certain income or earn revenue over a certain amount also pay tax to our native land.

BUT, I am asking if you folks in the United States would put up with a completely new tax added to your tax burden and that tax being a national sales tax - - - on top of the taxes you already pay?

I mean, if the situation is dire, then maybe something completely different needs to be done to help.

Just wondering. And trying to sort of unjam the ideas being discussed here. Y'all seem so big on your political party's views on this and that and mostly that relates to income tax or corporate earnings tax and I think y'all could debate those two sorts of taxes for ten years and due to the logjam created by political leanings never come up with anything new to fix the trouble. So how about something new? A national/federal sales tax? You might be able to gain a fair bit cash from that to ease the crisis; if it is a crisis.

And if it isn't a crisis, what's all the fuss about? Is a trillion dollars every 100 days a crisis situation?

Funny how this reminds me of that first episode of the Beverly Hillbillies back in sometime in the 60s when that JD character was indicating he wasn't sure what kind of dollars that 25 number was about. He had heard of a silver dollar, a paper dollar, a gold coin dollar, but he wasn't quite sure what a million dollar was. Well, I really can't get a handle in my own brain what a trillion dollar is, but it seems it is a crisis, yes? So find yourselves a whole new tax all y'all can agree on and fix the trouble.

No, half of us would not put up with any higher taxes in any form. The other half would welcome it so long as its only on the rich. However, our debt problem is caused by spending, not taxes. So its moot.

A trillion every 100 days is not a crisis, YET. Because we have a huge economy. But we'll see.

 

[medi]

No, half of us would not put up with any higher taxes in any form. The other half would welcome it so long as its only on the rich. However, our debt problem is caused by spending, not taxes. So its moot.

A trillion every 100 days is not a crisis, YET. Because we have a huge economy. But we'll see.

Not yet a crisis is one I would have to study, as my knowledge on macro economics is way short of acceptable. But my gut feeling is that 3.5 trillion dollars a year is a whole bunch of dollars.

 

[jonny5]

Not yet a crisis is one I would have to study, as my knowledge on macro economics is way short of acceptable. But my gut feeling is that 3.5 trillion dollars a year is a whole bunch of dollars.

Its more like 1.8T for the moment, but our GDP is near 35 trillion. So its more a concern than a crisis at the moment.

 

[rahl]

No, half of us would not put up with any higher taxes in any form. The other half would welcome it so long as its only on the rich. However, our debt problem is caused by spending, not taxes. So its moot.

A trillion every 100 days is not a crisis, YET. Because we have a huge economy. But we'll see.

lol no. It is absolutely a tax problem. For 4 decades republicans have been giving welfare handouts to the rich (tax cuts) while outspending by orders of magnified, democrats.

 

[Visbek]

Yes, we need to cut the debt!!! We need a surplus!!!

Oh, wait. The last time the US federal government generated a surplus, the President started two wars, added an expensive Medicare entitlement, and sent Americans a "rebate check." And he was in the party that had spent over a decade screaming about the evils of government debt.

 

[MTAtech]

Before you can even THINK about filling in a hole (reduce the debt), you first have to stop digging the hole deeper (increasing spending).

That means, NO NEW SPENDING!!

After we've established that, then we can think about whether to increase taxes or use another means to fill in the hole.

What would YOU stop spending money on?

When you talk about stopping new spending you are ignoring current spending. If you’re talking about cutting current spending, you are talking about cutting Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and defense, or you don’t know what you’re talking about.

Think about the federal government, in terms of spending, as a big insurance company with an army. That’s the bulk of federal spending.

The great bulk of federal spending that isn't either defense-related or interest on the debt goes to Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. The first two programs specifically serve seniors. And while Medicaid is often thought of as a poverty program, these days it's largely about providing nursing care, with about two-thirds of its spending now going to the elderly and/or disabled.

 

[Mycroft]

What would YOU stop spending money on?

New spending

When you talk about stopping new spending you are ignoring current spending. If you’re talking about cutting current spending, you are talking about cutting Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and defense, or you don’t know what you’re talking about.

Think about the federal government, in terms of spending, as a big insurance company with an army. That’s the bulk of federal spending.

The great bulk of federal spending that isn't either defense-related or interest on the debt goes to Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. The first two programs specifically serve seniors. And while Medicaid is often thought of as a poverty program, these days it's largely about providing nursing care, with about two-thirds of its spending now going to the elderly and/or disabled.

As I said...stop digging (new spending).

After that, we can talk about what spending to cut.

 

[MTAtech]

New spending


As I said...stop digging (new spending).

After that, we can talk about what spending to cut.

There isn't any new spending and the old spending is far more a portion of the budget.

 

[jonny5]

Latest CBO report shows it will only get worse. Thats if nothing else happens like another crisis for govt to spend twice as much, or democrats spending EVEN MORE on healthcare as Biden proposed in his latest budget.

The Long-Term Budget Outlook: 2024 to 2054

The federal budget deficit increases significantly in relation to gross domestic product over the next 30 years, in CBO’s projections, pushing federal debt held by the public far beyond any previously recorded level.

www.cbo.gov

Debt held by the public, boosted by the large deficits, reaches its highest level ever in 2029 (measured as a percentage of GDP) and then continues to grow, reaching 166 percent of GDP in 2054 and remaining on track to increase thereafter. That mounting debt would slow economic growth, push up interest payments to foreign holders of U.S. debt, and pose significant risks to the fiscal and economic outlook; it could also cause lawmakers to feel more constrained in their policy choices.

 

[Mycroft]

There isn't any new spending and the old spending is far more a portion of the budget.

Inflation Reduction Act. Infrastructure. That was in the space of two years. Last year, thanks to the Republicans, new spending stopped.

 

[jonny5]

Inflation Reduction Act. Infrastructure. That was in the space of two years. Last year, thanks to the Republicans, new spending stopped.

Well technically spending is up, but mostly mandatory and discretionary they are just continuing what Dems put in without adding to it yet. Bank bailouts and interest mainly.

"Outlays during the first five months of fiscal year 2024 were $2.7 trillion, CBO estimates, $228 billion more than during the same period last year."

 

[MSgt]

So, let me get this straight:

- With the Republican's Trickle-Down tax-cut scam, we saw the creation of the 1% and mass debt. Clinton dealt with that Republican debt and handed off to Bush.

- With the Republicans starting two mismanaged wars, while obscenely cutting taxes, they created mass debt and created a 1% within the 1%, as we headed blindly into economic disaster by the end of Bush's eight years. ...and handed off to Obama.

- With Obama also cutting taxes and adding to the debt, we manage to finally get the economy growing again. Obama passed off to Trump.

- With the Republican's 2017 Tax Cut and Jobs Act, which horribly perverted the tax-code and gave obscene permanent tax-cuts to the wealthy (along with mismanaging Covid), Trump increased debt by $8T, with ano0ther $1.9T by 2025.

And as Republicans continue prove that they exist largely only to cut ever more taxes for the wealthy, as the country's social programs, ongoing needs for infrastructure, and Defense continues to need maintaining, those same Republicans will turn around and tell people that their largely-made debt....is because of "spending." The lack of common sense with this subject is actually painful.

 

[Bugsy]

Brandon is spending billions on wiping student debt. This is going on while the SCOTUS has told him he can't.
The Democrats are spending the economy into the toilet.
Let's go Brandon.

 

[ttwtt78640]

This is not sustainable.

The debt load of the U.S. is growing at a quicker clip[url] in recent months, increasing about $1 trillion nearly every 100 days.... U.S. debt, which is the amount of money the federal government borrows to cover operating expenses, now stands at nearly $34.4 billion, as of Wednesday. Bank of America investment strategist Michael Hartnett believes the 100-day pattern will remain intact with the move from $34 trillion to $35 trillion....​

​

Moody’s Investors Service lowered its ratings outlook on the U.S. government to negative from stable in November due to the rising risks of the country’s fiscal strength. “In the context of higher interest rates, without effective fiscal policy measures to reduce government spending or increase revenues,” the agency said. “Moody’s expects that the US’ fiscal deficits will remain very large, significantly weakening debt affordability.”​

For those who think "Just Raise Taxes" is the solution:

View attachment 67495908

We have had tax rates a lot higher - and didn't collect anywhere close to the % of GDP we need.

The (lack of) federal revenue problem isn’t related to the top marginal federal income tax (bracket) rate; it’s caused by the ‘adjustment’ (reduction) of gross income (from all sources) to taxable income based largely on how and upon who that income was later spent and the ‘special’ treatment of (long term) capital gains income.

As long as borrow (print?) and spend federal “budgeting” gets congress critters re-elected at a rate of over 90%, it’s foolish to expect them to change such a politically successful “budgeting” policy.

 

[jonny5]

Brandon is spending billions on wiping student debt. This is going on while the SCOTUS has told him he can't.
The Democrats are spending the economy into the toilet.
Let's go Brandon.

True that accounts for higher spending as well. And since all the revenue is already spent, hes just borrowing to do it. Debt is clearly a national security problem. When will it all come due, both the record personal debt, and the public debt? We are wasting nearly a trillion just in interest. Which goes to banks, wealthy people, foreign countries. You would think liberals wouldnt want to pay interest to rich people and corporations.

 

[Bugsy]

True that accounts for higher spending as well. And since all the revenue is already spent, hes just borrowing to do it. Debt is clearly a national security problem. When will it all come due, both the record personal debt, and the public debt? We are wasting nearly a trillion just in interest. Which goes to banks, wealthy people, foreign countries. You would think liberals wouldnt want to pay interest to rich people and corporations.

Liberals would walk off a cliff if their leadership told them it would hurt Trump. They've been massaged into such a hatred that they'd cut off an arm, if they were told to. Look at what's going on in NYC. What do you think the consequences of this stupidity will be? Investment is already drying up. The city is a meca for criminals. It's all destroying America. But...Orangemanbad must be destroyed at any cost. After all...he's a NAZI.

The blind stupidity is monumental.

 

[jonny5]

Liberals would walk off a cliff if their leadership told them it would hurt Trump. They've been massaged into such a hatred that they'd cut off an arm, if they were told to. Look at what's going on in NYC. What do you think the consequences of this stupidity will be? Investment is already drying up. The city is a meca for criminals. It's all destroying America. But...Orangemanbad must be destroyed at any cost. After all...he's a NAZI.

The blind stupidity is monumental.

I dont think its that extreme, but I guess we'll see. Dont underestimate liberals ability to shift blame.

 

[cpwill]

The (lack of) federal revenue problem isn’t related to the top marginal federal income tax (bracket) rate; it’s caused by the ‘adjustment’ (reduction) of gross income (from all sources) to taxable income based largely on how and upon who that income was later spent and the ‘special’ treatment of (long term) capital gains income.

As long as borrow (print?) and spend federal “budgeting” gets congress critters re-elected at a rate of over 90%, it’s foolish to expect them to change such a politically successful “budgeting” policy.

Eh. Revenues are higher than ever before. The problem is that our spending is far outstripping even our growing income.

 

[cpwill]

True that accounts for higher spending as well. And since all the revenue is already spent, hes just borrowing to do it. Debt is clearly a national security problem. When will it all come due, both the record personal debt, and the public debt? We are wasting nearly a trillion just in interest. Which goes to banks, wealthy people, foreign countries. You would think liberals wouldnt want to pay interest to rich people and corporations.

Which is why some of them will eventually blame "the wealthy" for the cost of servicing the debt we've run up under both parties, and call for bondholders to take a haircut, with little appreciation for what that means.

 

[ksu_aviator]

This can't be happening. Joe cut the deficit!?

Lol and libs believed his lie. They are so damn gullible.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Eh. Revenues are higher than ever before.

Not based on % of GDP.

The problem is that our spending is far outstripping even our growing income.

Exactly.

 

[L88]

So, let me get this straight:

- With the Republican's Trickle-Down tax-cut scam, we saw the creation of the 1% and mass debt. Clinton dealt with that Republican debt and handed off to Bush.

- With the Republicans starting two mismanaged wars, while obscenely cutting taxes, they created mass debt and created a 1% within the 1%, as we headed blindly into economic disaster by the end of Bush's eight years. ...and handed off to Obama.

- With Obama also cutting taxes and adding to the debt, we manage to finally get the economy growing again. Obama passed off to Trump.

- With the Republican's 2017 Tax Cut and Jobs Act, which horribly perverted the tax-code and gave obscene permanent tax-cuts to the wealthy (along with mismanaging Covid), Trump increased debt by $8T, with ano0ther $1.9T by 2025.

And as Republicans continue prove that they exist largely only to cut ever more taxes for the wealthy, as the country's social programs, ongoing needs for infrastructure, and Defense continues to need maintaining, those same Republicans will turn around and tell people that their largely-made debt....is because of "spending." The lack of common sense with this subject is actually painful.

Interesting revisionism here.
Assuming you mean supply-side economics this has never occurred in its purest form. In addition Democrats haven't been afraid to assist on the supply side. Obama with the Auto industry is a prime example.

Regarding the balanced budget during the Clinton Presidency, that was written and passed by Republicans and signed in to law by Clinton when he lost power in the first Mid year election.

Regarding the Tax Cut and Jobs Act,
1) Tax Revenues have continued to increase every year.
2) The QBI has been a huge boom for the small business owner
3) Why are Democrats attempting to eliminate the SALT Deduction if they are not interested in assisting the wealthy?

Now, I am not defending Republicans because only during a very short period did they do anything about the deficit and Trump was the worst regardless of his promises until Biden came along.

 

[SMTA]

Before you can even THINK about filling in a hole (reduce the debt), you first have to stop digging the hole deeper (increasing spending).

That means, NO NEW SPENDING!!

After we've established that, then we can think about whether to increase taxes or use another means to fill in the hole.

No additional spending
Cancel all tax cuts
Zero based budgeting

 

[PeacefulWarrior]

The conservative movement is building in the GOP but it's a long way from having control in the party.

Actually its the trumptard "movement" that has taken over the GOP.

And its a bowel movement. The idea that Crooked donnie trump is "conservative" is laughable.

 

[Lutherf]

Actually its the trumptard "movement" that has taken over the GOP.

And its a bowel movement. The idea that Crooked donnie trump is "conservative" is laughable.

That's pretty cool! You define "reality" for someone else in your own terms, deride it and then wander away thinking your a genius! Must be nice to be that awesome.