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Praying in Jesus' name angers democrat lawmakers

trouble13 said:
So provided the state allows everyone to pray freely why wouldnt that also fall into the same protected area like jewelery does? Are they not both expressions of ones beliefs?

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You can voluntarily pray, outside of government meetings and other actions that are part of the government function and paid for by taxpayer dollars. Do you want to be forced to take part in the religious rituals of other religions when at a government meeting or function? Maybe forced to bow toward Mecca or a Satanist ritual before city council or school board meeting..............

Shall I also remind you of Matthew 6:6-7 or is that also a violation of your religious rights?
 
Quag said:
Would you be OK if someone started with a prayer to Allah or Vishnu or Satan or FSM?
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No, because America was founded on Christian principles and not whatever the hell those other nonsense things are principles.
 
marke said:
It depends on how you look at it. With Hitler, his version of his Christianity and atheism were identical.
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Again, patently untrue. The idea of there not being a god does not work with the idea of there being one.
 
EMNofSeattle said:
No, because America was founded on Christian principles and not whatever the hell those other nonsense things are principles.
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Lying is a sin.

John Adams and Tom Jefferson said that it wasn't.
The government of the United States is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion.”

—John Adams
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The day will come when the mystical generation of Jesus by the Supreme Being in the womb of a virgin, will be classed with the fable of the generation of Minerva in the brain of Jupiter. ... But we may hope that the dawn of reason and freedom of thought in these United States will do away with all this artificial scaffolding....
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Thomas Jefferson

Jefferson's statute for religious freedom in Virginia was “meant to comprehend, within the mantle of its protection, the Jew and the Gentile, the Christian and the Mohammeden, the Hindoo and Infidel of every denomination.”
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Whenever we read the obscene stories, the voluptuous debaucheries, the cruel and tortuous executions, the unrelenting vindictiveness with which more than half the Bible is filled, it would be more consistent that we call it the word of a demon than the word of God. It is a history of wickedness that has served to corrupt and brutalize mankind; and, for my part, I sincerely detest it, as I detest everything that is cruel.
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Thomas Paine.

One good schoolmaster is of more use than a hundred priests. Thomas Paine
Read more at 66 Thomas Paine Quotes - Inspirational Quotes at BrainyQuote
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Lisa said:
Lying is a sin.

John Adams and Tom Jefferson said that it wasn't.
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John Adams never said that. That comes from a single line in a treaty that never became law.

Thomas Paine was not a founding father, he was a total whack a doodle who latched himself on to the American Revolution and was totally disowned by Americans after going to France to support a tyrannical atheistic regime.

He was hated when he died and he should not be regarded as a hero in any sense.





Thomas Jefferson





Thomas Paine.[/QUOTE]
 
EMNofSeattle said:
John Adams never said that. That comes from a single line in a treaty that never became law.
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Lying is a sin.
The treaty of Tripoli was signed and became law in 1797.
It was signed in Tripoli on November 4, 1796, and at Algiers (for a third-party witness) on January 3, 1797. It was ratified by the United States Senate unanimously without debate on June 7, 1797, taking effect June 10, 1797, with the signature of President John Adams.
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“This would be the best of all possible worlds, if there were no religion in it.”
– John Adams
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“But how has it happened that millions of fables, tales, legends have been blended with both Jewish and Christian revelation that have made them the most bloody religion that ever existed?”

– John Adams, letter to FA Van der Kamp, December 27, 1816.
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You are wrong again. Thomas Paine was influential in the revolution and the declaration of independence.

Thomas Paine published Common Sense in January 1776 support of the Patriot cause. Using clear, plain language, Paine rallied the colonists to support the break from Britain. ... Congress approved the Declaration of Independence months later, and Common Sense is believed to have greatly influenced support for the cause.
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Lisa said:
Lying is a sin.
The treaty of Tripoli was signed and became law in 1797.
You are wrong again. ThomasPaine was influential in the revolution and the declaration of independence.
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Actually, you are totally in the wrong on this debate. Matter of fact, you are exactly opposite the truth.

I will give you once chance to withdraw your suppositions that America was not a Christian nation/founded by men of faith.

Otherwise, be prepared to get obliterated.
 
Lisa said:
You can voluntarily pray, outside of government meetings and other actions that are part of the government function and paid for by taxpayer dollars. Do you want to be forced to take part in the religious rituals of other religions when at a government meeting or function? Maybe forced to bow toward Mecca or a Satanist ritual before city council or school board meeting..............

Shall I also remind you of Matthew 6:6-7 or is that also a violation of your religious rights?
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Nobody is forcing anyone to pray. What is required is for people to exercise tolerance for religious rituals different than their own. Theres a problem when we start calling something as harmless as a prayer, which is an important ritual for the pious and nothing greater than an inconvenience to the rest.
While i agree with the doctrine of seperation of church and state i also believe part of that doctrine is a tolerance toward all religions. Otherwise the gov in essence is persecuting people based on their religious beliefs. Imagine if the gov told Omar she could not wear her hijab in the halls of congress because some people find it offensive. That would be no less wrong then restricting a persons right to prayer.

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Lisa said:
Religious rights are not levied out by the number of people who believe. They are absolutely equal, whether it is 12 million or just one person who believe in that manner. This is why the seperation of church and state is critical for the protection of religious and secular rights for all people equally. Your idea would permit the majority to trample on the rights of the minority in a tyranny of the majority. The Bill of Rights was written to prevent just that very act from ever occurring.

Do you think that you are fooling anyone by not addressing how Matthew 6:6-7 applies? We all see you tapdancing around it and trying to ignore that it exists. Does the word hypocrite mean anything to you? How can you claim to be a Christian and a follower of Jesus Christ when you willfully ignore his teachings?
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The number of people who support one interpretation of the Constitution becomes insignificant if the number of people who support a different interpretation of the Constitution is larger, except where the smaller number of people find a federal judge who will force the smaller interpretation into universal acceptance regardless of what the larger number of people think.
 
Logician Man said:
People who once professed pot would/should never be legalized, or homosexuals would never be allowed to marry, and rightfully enjoy all the the freedoms non-homosexuals enjoy, were also once a minority. Times change, and minorities become majorities. ( fact )
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Savage barbarian hedonism does get a boost from perverted buckaroo activist judges who rule that the Constitution endorses and protects immoral barbarian beliefs, behaviors, values and laws.
 
Tigerace117 said:
Again, patently untrue. The idea of there not being a god does not work with the idea of there being one.
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it is an undeniable fact of life that people come up with some strange ideas about God, none of which they can prove.
 
Fishking said:
Hey everyone, I found the person who hasn't read anything the founders and early politicians wrote or what they did and supported. Did you know there was actually a specific congressionally approved Bible? That's just the tip of the iceberg.
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I referenced the Constitution they "wrote" and "supported". It's still with us if you would like to read it.
 
EMNofSeattle said:
No, because America was founded on Christian principles and not whatever the hell those other nonsense things are principles.
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Thanks for actually answering but as the USA was founded on religious tolerance then either all or none should be allowed, I tend towards none
 
marke said:
Savage barbarian hedonism does get a boost from perverted buckaroo activist judges who rule that the Constitution endorses and protects immoral barbarian beliefs, behaviors, values and laws.
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*yawn*
 
Mashmont said:
A country is either a theocracy or an atheocracy. It's one or the other. There is nothing in between. I'll take the theocracy. Atheists governments tend to yield deadly results for their populations. Ask North Korea. Ask the USSR. Ask Cuba
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That is completely but not surprisingly dishonest of you, and very kin to an asinine suggestion that there is only absolute capitalism or absolute socialism.

Any sense of freedom means being opposite Theocracy, as in autonomy.

Theocracy, history and current times proven, is just another form of Authoritarianism and in practice is no different than other forms of Authoritarianism like Communism, Dictatorships, Totalitarianism, what have you.

The only difference is source, but it is all oppression... including your precious Theocracy.

If you are curious about an example then shuffle yourself over to Saudi Arabia, or Iran, or what is left of Syria. Cuba and North Korea just took another path to the same destination of Authoritarianism.
 
Night_Ranger said:
Actually, you are totally in the wrong on this debate. Matter of fact, you are exactly opposite the truth.

I will give you once chance to withdraw your suppositions that America was not a Christian nation/founded by men of faith.

Otherwise, be prepared to get obliterated.
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It appears lisa has resolved this point
 
OrphanSlug said:
That is completely but not surprisingly dishonest of you, and very kin to an asinine suggestion that there is only absolute capitalism or absolute socialism.

Any sense of freedom means being opposite Theocracy, as in autonomy.

Theocracy, history and current times proven, is just another form of Authoritarianism and in practice is no different than other forms of Authoritarianism like Communism, Dictatorships, Totalitarianism, what have you.

The only difference is source, but it is all oppression... including your precious Theocracy.

If you are curious about an example then shuffle yourself over to Saudi Arabia, or Iran, or what is left of Syria. Cuba and North Korea just took another path to the same destination of Authoritarianism.
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And notice you have to go to Islam as the 'religion' which, as I have noted, is indistinguishable from atheism. Both have the same goals; the destruction of Christianity, Israel, capitalism, and the US using violence of necessary. Both are the complete opposite of peaceful loving Christianity.
 
TheGoverness said:
Taking over the world, duh. But I'm gonna drop the gay bomb before Islam can get a foothold, so I can turn the whole Middle East 100% gay.
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Just curious what goes into a gay bomb, unicorns and rainbows?
 
TheGoverness said:
Taking over the world, duh. But I'm gonna drop the gay bomb before Islam can get a foothold, so I can turn the whole Middle East 100% gay.
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OH NO!!! Not the dreaded gay bomb, TG! That's just cruel and unusual punishment for every one it 'doesn't' affect. :peace
 
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