Pope Tells Gay Man: ‘God Made You Like This and Loves You Like This’

[CLAX1911]

Read John 5:28,29 again...he was not talking about Jesus' resurrection nor is Acts 24:15.

you do realize John is a disciple right and he was talking about what was going to happen when Jesus brought the New Covenant. He wasn't talking about your Resurrection he was talking about Christ's Resurrection and the same thing can be said about Acts.

I think your church interpreted that wrong for you.

 

[Daisy]

you do realize John is a disciple right and he was talking about what was going to happen when Jesus brought the New Covenant. He wasn't talking about your Resurrection he was talking about Christ's Resurrection and the same thing can be said about Acts.

I think your church interpreted that wrong for you.

The New Covenant was introduced by Jesus on Nisan 14 33 CE...Luke 22:28-30...later, he showed that this promise extended to all spirit-begotten ‘conquerors'...Rev. 3:21; 1:4-6; 5:9, 10; 20:6...

And if what you say is true, the scriptures I quoted would not mention the righteous and the unrighteous, so you are wrong about it being about Jesus...

 

[maquiscat]

Actually, its nothing but a perfect illusion of free will.

God supposedly knows the beginning and end of all things.

Which means he knows everything everyone will do. He is not time bound.

So he knows who will and won't make the "grade" in the moment of creation.

Or he's not omniscient.

It's one or the other. Can't be both.

That is not quite the paradox you think it is. Let's assume free will is true for the moment. You choose to do an action, and I am there to observe it from a perspective where you were unaware of me. I then jump into my handy dandy time machine, go back in time to observe your choice again from a different position, again without you being aware of me. Did you suddenly lose your free will? Was your decision preordained?

Spoiler alert if you haven't seen Infinity War yet!

Strange looked into the future and saw over 4 million possible futures. He set into motion one of them. Was all the actions of the other heroes after that devoid of free will just because they were what Strange saw?

If we assume God is omniscient, not only does He know what choices we have, but the results of each one. He can try to influence those decisions, but doesn't, according to popular claims, make those decisions for us. When He looks at all of the possible choices we can make, how does that prevent us from still making that choice?

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[maquiscat]

2) It's either God's way or rational free thinking.

There is nothing mutually exclusive about these two ways...at least until you get into certain people's ideas of what God's way is. But that doesn't mean itis God's way.

4) "Logic"man is such a misnomer darling.

Remember that logic can still exist even when started from a false or opinion based premise.

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[CLAX1911]

The New Covenant was introduced by Jesus on Nisan 14 33 CE...Luke 22:28-30...later, he showed that this promise extended to all spirit-begotten ‘conquerors'...Rev. 3:21; 1:4-6; 5:9, 10; 20:6...

dumb statement I didn't say Jesus didn't form the New Covenant and that's not relevant in the least to the discussion.

And if what you say is true, the scriptures I quoted would not mention the righteous and the unrighteous, so you are wrong about it being about Jesus...

you have got to be kidding me you just said the New Covenant was formed by Christ now you're saying it's not make up your mind.

You contradict yourself in your own post. And then you tell me I'm wrong I'm sorry but whatever Church you have been part of has deliberately corrupted your thinking.

 

[maquiscat]

3. Hades will not be a fun place.
4. You don't have a clue.

3) Hades is part of the Greek pantheon, and includes places for both the rewarded and the damned. So indeed some parts of Hades will be a fun place. Which bring us to....

4) pot, kettle achomatic.

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[Daisy]

dumb statement I didn't say Jesus didn't form the New Covenant and that's not relevant in the least to the discussion.

you have got to be kidding me you just said the New Covenant was formed by Christ now you're saying it's not make up your mind.

You contradict yourself in your own post. And then you tell me I'm wrong I'm sorry but whatever Church you have been part of has deliberately corrupted your thinking.

It seems we are not on the same wave length at all....you're not understanding me and I'm certainly not understanding anything you are saying so...

 

[CLAX1911]

It seems we are not on the same wave length at all....you're not understanding me and I'm certainly not understanding anything you are saying so...

I'm on the wave links that makes sense you're on the wavelength of your church said something so therefore it's true and it has to be true because they will disfellowshipped you if you don't accept it. Because of that no one can trust anything you say because you are blackmailed.

 

[Daisy]

I'm on the wave links that makes sense you're on the wavelength of your church said something so therefore it's true and it has to be true because they will disfellowshipped you if you don't accept it. Because of that no one can trust anything you say because you are blackmailed.

Yeah, because I'm so rich...that's the craziest thing I've ever heard...:lamo

 

[CLAX1911]

Yeah, because I'm so rich...that's the craziest thing I've ever heard...:lamo

I didn't say you were rich. Whoever you heard that from was not me.

Let's say I was a member of your church and I decided the elders didn't have it right with regard to say homosexuality and I then took a same-sex spouse what would happen to me? If my parents were part of that church would I be allowed to see them or would they have to shun me or be shunned themselves?

There are more things to Blackmail you with then money.

 

[maquiscat]

No he was resurrected after he died. Resurrection to my understanding was when he ascended into heaven he was the first person to ever do that.

We'll that's wrong because I distinctly remember an OT story of someone else being taken directly to heaven in a chariot. Mind you he didn't die first.

I think you two are talking about different resurrections. Elvira seems to be referring to the resurrection of all people during the Rapture per Revelation. All who are not cast into the firey pit will be given new bodies, but many will live on the new earth, not in Heaven. Yes the resurrection of Christ has occurred, but it is not the only resurrection. After all, Lazarus was resurrected before Christmas died. He will probably be the only one resurrected twice.

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[CLAX1911]

We'll that's wrong because I distinctly remember an OT story of someone else being taken directly to heaven in a chariot. Mind you he didn't die first.

What on earth does that have to do with anything?

I think you two are talking about different resurrections. Elvira seems to be referring to the resurrection of all people during the Rapture per Revelation. All who are not cast into the firey pit will be given new bodies, but many will live on the new earth, not in Heaven. Yes the resurrection of Christ has occurred, but it is not the only resurrection. After all, Lazarus was resurrected before Christmas died. He will probably be the only one resurrected twice.

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There's only one the resurrection of Christ Revelations to my understanding hasn't occurred yet and we don't know if it's literal or not it could just be what happens when you die and that's how I take it.

 

[Daisy]

I didn't say you were rich. Whoever you heard that from was not me.

Let's say I was a member of your church and I decided the elders didn't have it right with regard to say homosexuality and I then took a same-sex spouse what would happen to me? If my parents were part of that church would I be allowed to see them or would they have to shun me or be shunned themselves?

There are more things to Blackmail you with then money.

Oh, so the truth comes out...I'm not gonna get into this with you, after that freaky pm you sent me, I told myself to not speak to you again...I should have listened to myself...see ya...:2wave:

 

[maquiscat]

...your body will rot in the ground forever.

Actually it won't be forever. Eventually it will be completely decomposed, and no further rotting will occur.

That said, will all the old bodies still be there when the new earth is created after Armageddon?

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[CLAX1911]

Oh, so the truth comes out...I'm not gonna get into this with you, after that freaky pm you sent me, I told myself to not speak to you again...I should have listened to myself...see ya...:2wave:

Yes sit on the Pew and close your eyes and hold hands over your ears and go la la la la la like your church teaches you.

I respect you as a poster I do not respect your religion I find it repugnant and Despicable if that's enough for you to despise me or put me on ignore so be it. If the opinions of others hurt your delicate sensibilities maybe this isn't the place for you.

 

[CLAX1911]

Actually it won't be forever. Eventually it will be completely decomposed, and no further rotting will occur.

so the matter that makes you up we'll just vanish?

That said, will all the old bodies still be there when the new earth is created after Armageddon?

guess they don't vanish a war wouldn't make them vanish

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[maquiscat]

What on earth does that have to do with anything?

You said that you believed that Christ was the first to accend to Heaven. I pointed out that it was not true. He was also not the first to be reassured. And no I am not saying you made that claim, just pointing it out before some one else tries to make it.

There's only one the resurrection of Christ Revelations to my understanding hasn't occurred yet and we don't know if it's literal or not it could just be what happens when you die and that's how I take it.

Only one resurrection of Christ himself, yes, but not only one resurrection. First off there was Lazarus who was resurrected. Secondly, Elvira has clearly been referring to the resurrection as a specific event in the future, as outlined in Revelation, much in the same way that the Rapture will be an event. In fact, I'm pretty sure the resurrection is something that occurs within the Rapture.

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[CLAX1911]

You said that you believed that Christ was the first to accend to Heaven.

He was. Infect the concept of Heaven didn't even exist until Jesus's Covenant.

I pointed out that it was not true.

no you didn't you simply misinterpreted scripture happens all the time

was also not the first to be reassured. And no I am not saying you made that claim, just pointing it out before some one else tries to make it.

Okay.

Only one resurrection of Christ himself, yes, but not only one resurrection. First off there was Lazarus who was resurrected.

you're misinterpreting things. Lazarus's body did not rise to heaven.

Secondly, Elvira has clearly been referring to the resurrection as a specific event in the future, as outlined in Revelation, much in the same way that the Rapture will be an event.

Guess The Rapture is when you die and that's an event in your life but you are not ****** Resurrected your body rots in the ground.

In fact, I'm pretty sure the resurrection is something that occurs within the Rapture.

no.

 

[maquiscat]

so the matter that makes you up we'll just vanish?

guess they don't vanish a war wouldn't make them vanish

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Well how far do you want to take it? When parts of a person are then absorbed by the plant life taking nutrients from the soil, are they still part of that person? If so, then sure everyone decays forever and we are all made up of decaying people, animals and plants.

The war itself would.not result in such, but Revelation says that He will make a new heaven and a new earth. So when the new earth is created, will the old bodies still be there? Could we in our new bodies go dig up our old one? That might be interesting actually.....



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[maquiscat]

Don't have time to address the whole post, which I'll do later but wanted to touch on this point quickly

you're misinterpreting things. Lazarus's body did not rise to heaven.

The resurrection and the assencion (probably misspelled) are two separate things.

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[CLAX1911]

Don't have time to address the whole post, which I'll do later but wanted to touch on this point quickly



The resurrection and the assencion (probably misspelled) are two separate things.

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And now you're just splitting hairs

 

[CLAX1911]

Well how far do you want to take it?

until existence ends that's when matter stops existing. If you think this is going too far then you shouldn't have opened the can of worms in the first place.

When parts of a person are then absorbed by the plant life taking nutrients from the soil, are they still part of that person?

I fail to see the relevance of such a distinction.

The war itself would.not result in such, but Revelation says that He will make a new heaven and a new earth.

and that is to be taken absolutely literally if so show me where it says that.

So when the new earth is created, will the old bodies still be there? Could we in our new bodies go dig up our old one? That might be interesting actually.....

see this is the problem with the biblical Fundamentalist you have no concept of spirituality or metaphor. That was Elvira's problem I would say that is Christianity's problem and even Islam's problem.

When a all there is is the word and it must be taken literally you can justify genocide are you happen to have better morals than that.

 

[upsideguy]

That is not what i said...perhaps it is you who has the reading comprehension problem...I know what Galatians says...the life to come has nothing to do with the consequences of our actions in this life...we still have to face them, like it or not...repentance or not...

I know that is not what you said. I was merely telling you how you should have responded.

Please explain the bolded (with Biblical reference) as that seems inconsistent with the Lord I know. Perhaps we saying the same thing, perhaps we are not.

There are a number of "Christians", some of whom are active posters here, that seem to relish in a God of revenge: a God that will punish those that commit the sins they do not like (like homosexuality)... Though the Bible is abundantly clear about homosexuality, it is also clear about greed, gossip, adultery, divorce and many other sins. Sin is sin. There is nothing inherently different about homosexuality. What some Christians do on this subject borders on hate. We all will die with some form of un-repentant sin, even if we are in Christ.

I have serious questions about their understanding of God and Christ as they seem devoid of both love and humility. They perpetuate a false doctrine based on a personal agenda that gives Christians a bad name. To be clear, I am not putting you in the category, but I seen those the fit squarely within.

 

[Daisy]

I know that is not what you said. I was merely telling you how you should have responded.

Please explain the bolded (with Biblical reference) as that seems inconsistent with the Lord I know. Perhaps we saying the same thing, perhaps we are not.

There are a number of "Christians", some of whom are active posters here, that seem to relish in a God of revenge: a God that will punish those that commit the sins they do not like (like homosexuality)... Though the Bible is abundantly clear about homosexuality, it is also clear about greed, gossip, adultery, divorce and many other sins. Sin is sin. There is nothing inherently different about homosexuality. What some Christians do on this subject borders on hate. We all will die with some form of un-repentant sin, even if we are in Christ.

I have serious questions about their understanding of God and Christ as they seem devoid of both love and humility. They perpetuate a false doctrine based on a personal agenda that gives Christians a bad name. To be clear, I am not putting you in the category, but I seen those the fit squarely within.

Well, thanks for telling me how I should have responded...:2razz:

I've already explained what I meant by the bolded statement, if ya don't get it, ya don't get it...I personally don't like to beat dead horses...

As for the rest of your comment, what others do or how others act is not on me...I have enough trouble trying to do what's right/answering for my own shortcomings, to worry about anyone else's...as I am sure is the case with them...

 

[Urethra Franklin]

There is nothing mutually exclusive about these two ways...at least until you get into certain people's ideas of what God's way is. But that doesn't mean itis God's way.

Matter of opinion I think..
I'm personaly very Cartesian. I need reason.
Faith by definition is believeing in somethng for which you have no scientific proof. Fine if you can go for that, but to some of us, that's not rational.

Remember that logic can still exist even when started from a false or opinion based premise.

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Which is evidently the case with Logicman.