Pence: Abortion will end in U.S. 'in our time'

[Lursa]

Actually... it is a little bit sad that the government incarcerates fathers. It's not the first time that the government has abused fathers by determining whether or not mothers should receive welfare on the basis of a father's unrelated behavior.

It incarcerates women too if they dont pay their child support.

Huh, so inconveniently equal...sorry!

 

[soylentgreen]

I really don't understand what you're missing here. A woman can put a child up for adoption without a man's permission. A man cannot put a child up for adoption unless he has permission from the mother. I am asking for equality, and I am not the same as a pregnant woman.

So what you are saying here is that it is not a woman's choice but instead the man must have the right to decide.

Which is it: Her choice, or my actions? I cannot be held responsible for her choice, because it's neither my action, nor my choice what a woman does with her body. He should be able to walk away from what she did. Just like she can walk away from what he did.

No, she cannot walk away. She is left in the position of having to make a choice. neither can he walk away because he is reponsible for his own actions regardless of what the woman decides.

If there is some part of the male body which is responsible for the fusion of male and female gametes, please mention it now. Otherwise I am confident that this action takes place in the uterus, inside a woman's body. All of the following actions and choices responsible for making a healthy child out of a pregnancy are done by a woman, not a man. Besides scheduling an ultrasound or something like that, which a man can technically still do.

So are you saying you have never heard of sperm? You think women get pregnant via immaculate conception?

 

[Celebrity]

So what you are saying here is that it is not a woman's choice but instead the man must have the right to decide.

Let a woman decide for herself and a man decide for himself what she or he must do. It's not hard to understand. Women should not be sending men to jail for being poor. Men don't send women to jail for having an abortion.

No, she cannot walk away. She is left in the position of having to make a choice. neither can he walk away because he is reponsible for his own actions regardless of what the woman decides.

She is left in the position of having to make a choice... so why shouldn't he also be allowed to have a choice? The point is having a choice. Women have a choice that men do not.

So are you saying you have never heard of sperm? You think women get pregnant via immaculate conception?

My statement was:

If there is some part of the male body which is responsible for the fusion of male and female gametes, please mention it now.

So you think that sperm is responsible for the fusion of male and female gametes? No, it is only one gamete. Sperm does not fuse the two. It is one of the two components in the fusion.

If anything is responsible, it is probably the cilia lining the Fallopian tubes and/or the uterus, the location of the gestation.

 

[soylentgreen]

Let a woman decide for herself and a man decide for himself what she or he must do. It's not hard to understand. Women should not be sending men to jail for being poor. Men don't send women to jail for having an abortion.

So again i state that you do not buy into the idea that it is a woman's choice. But instead that she has the right to choose if and only if the man has the right to decide. If the man goes to jail then that is his decision. He has decided that he need take no responsibility for his actions and so condemns himself.

She is left in the position of having to make a choice... so why shouldn't he also be allowed to have a choice? The point is having a choice. Women have a choice that men do not.

Men have a choice. They can choose right at the start to exercise responsibility to ensure they do not get a woman pregnant. If they choose not to and lose their gamble then that is on them.

My statement was:


So you think that sperm is responsible for the fusion of male and female gametes? No, it is only one gamete. Sperm does not fuse the two. It is one of the two components in the fusion.

If anything is responsible, it is probably the cilia lining the Fallopian tubes and/or the uterus, the location of the gestation.

This is probably one of the more ridiculous arguments given for an attempt to evade responsibility. Now your blaming the woman for getting herself pregnant and pretending the man has absolutely nothing to do with it,

 

[Fearandloathing]

All right, so you've brought up a specific number of generations. What happened 3 generations ago, and about how many years is that?

I am getting 25.5 years per female generation and 34.5 years per male generation. On average, women have children in their 20's and men have children in their 30's.

So 3 generations back puts us in the 1920's to 1930's. We came a long way since then, and if the adage is true, what did we not learn about our history?

I don't understand the rest of the post. Trump wants the death penalty for drug dealers and thinks he can prevent mass killings by putting guns in schools. Republican ideals are very much authoritarian at this point.

Sorry,

But, one, America's obsession of belaboring dead issues does not interest me.

I really don't give a rats about your views or anyone else's in America that issue which we resolved everywhere is in the world last century.

My comment had more to do with that issue since I got bored hearing the **** 20 years ago. America is never going to grow up, so what't the point.

Have a good day.

 

[OscarLevant]

With Gorsuch in place, perhaps one more SCOTUS opening and abortion can very well end.

The foundation for such a right is shaky as hell anyways since it was poofed out of the ninth amendment.

Would've helped the pro-choice cause if they had enumerated the right in an amendment rather than rely on a temporary favorable court.

Of course, abortions will never go away in the literal sense. Never mind the politics, just look at the economics, when there is a demand for something someone is sure to supply it outside of something unrealistic.

Roe V Wade is the law of the land.

What many who are against abortion don't remember, what it was like before Roe V Wade. Women used coat hangers, went to mexico and got butchered, etc. Now, conservatives will argue, well, they shouldn't do that, it's on them. yes, teenagers die, and that's okay with them. I don't agree, I'm a pragmatist, I'm not okay with female teenagers and adult women dying, I'm for the law the works for women. I view Roe V Wade as a necessary evil.

I hear republicans call abortion murder. People who murder deserve to go to jail for a long time, so it begs the question:

Are you willing put a woman who has an abortion in jail for a long time, along with other murderers?

If it is murder, there is only one answer, yes. You tell me.

 

[AustralianuS]

Women of the USA: why do you insist on entertaining the fantasy that forced motherhood is bad but forced fatherhood is good?

The Vice President of the United States is calling to take away rights which allow you to choose what to do with your body. This autonomy on a physical level is part of what makes us human. But it is also a choice of how to behave in society, and whether or not we should be parents.

It seems quite clear to me that men and women should both be allowed to have sex with one another without risking a prison sentence, if the other chooses to enforce non-custodial support.

Why do you suppose that women still want to financially abuse men in this way? Are women really so vindictive that they are willing to risk it all just to snub men? Or are they too meek and mild mannered to stand up for themselves?

I know how that feels. I once tried to present evidence in court of the unconstitutionality of forced fatherhood. The judge refused to admit it. It really hurts to go to a place where one expects to find honor, civility, respect, wisdom and justice, and find ignorance and obstinate discrimination in its place. But I feel my situation is slightly different. Whereas I presently am incapable of rightly exercising autonomy, woman can and do disavow motherhood. Therefore, advocacy I do is not in defense of an existing legal protection of men. Unfortunately, I believe women have grown smug and self righteous. They do not understand that their rights are at risk because of their egotistical complacency. If women stood up for what was right for all people, and not just all women, they could speak to a much wider audience.

Pence: Abortion will end in U.S. 'in our time' | TheHill

A man of faithful that is hopefully abortion will end in our time....shockley threadworthy.

RIP DP

 

[AustralianuS]

Never understood why democrats are actively against personal accountability.

 

[year2late]

Never understood why democrats are actively against personal accountability.

Accountability is based on your point of view.

 

[Nap]

Roe V Wade is the law of the land.

What many who are against abortion don't remember, what it was like before Roe V Wade. Women used coat hangers, went to mexico and got butchered, etc. Now, conservatives will argue, well, they shouldn't do that, it's on them. yes, teenagers die, and that's okay with them. I don't agree, I'm a pragmatist, I'm not okay with female teenagers and adult women dying, I'm for the law the works for women. I view Roe V Wade as a necessary evil.

I hear republicans call abortion murder. People who murder deserve to go to jail for a long time, so it begs the question:

Are you willing put a woman who has an abortion in jail for a long time, along with other murderers?

If it is murder, there is only one answer, yes. You tell me.

Yes

Like you said, if you believe Abortion to be murder then obviously the answer is yes.

 

[Nap]

So again i state that you do not buy into the idea that it is a woman's choice. But instead that she has the right to choose if and only if the man has the right to decide. If the man goes to jail then that is his decision. He has decided that he need take no responsibility for his actions and so condemns himself.


Men have a choice. They can choose right at the start to exercise responsibility to ensure they do not get a woman pregnant. If they choose not to and lose their gamble then that is on them.




This is probably one of the more ridiculous arguments given for an attempt to evade responsibility. Now your blaming the woman for getting herself pregnant and pretending the man has absolutely nothing to do with it,

Then shouldn't women be held to that same standard and not be be allowed to kill the fetus due to their lack of responsibility?

 

[OscarLevant]

Never understood why democrats are actively against personal accountability.

Care to give some specific examples that could rightfully and justly be extrapolated to apply to all democrats?

I never understood why some republicans say stupid things.

 

[FutureIncoming]

I never understood why some republicans say stupid things.

SIMPLE. Political conservatives are often Stupidly Prejudiced and Greedy. That means no matter how smart they are, their Stupid Prejudice and Greed interferes with them making good choices regarding other people.

 

[soylentgreen]

Then shouldn't women be held to that same standard and not be be allowed to kill the fetus due to their lack of responsibility?

What is it about it being a woman's choice that you do not understand?

Women are being held to that same standard. if they choose to go through and keep the child then they are held responsible for that child. Unlike men who can opt to do nothing more than pay a sum out of their wages.

 

[Lursa]

Then shouldn't women be held to that same standard and not be be allowed to kill the fetus due to their lack of responsibility?

Of course not...why are you valuing the life and future and bodily sovereignty of the unborn above the same things for women? The unborn and born are not equal.

 

[Celebrity]

So again i state that you do not buy into the idea that it is a woman's choice. But instead that she has the right to choose if and only if the man has the right to decide. If the man goes to jail then that is his decision. He has decided that he need take no responsibility for his actions and so condemns himself.

It is not a woman's choice what a man does with his own life, just as much as it is not a man's choice what a woman does with her own life. When women are able to make a medical choice which determines the course of a man's life for 18 years, there is something wrong with the law. I am not a medical concern of a woman. I am a human being. So let her make her own choices for herself, and not for me.

Men have a choice. They can choose right at the start to exercise responsibility to ensure they do not get a woman pregnant. If they choose not to and lose their gamble then that is on them.

I think it's implied here that you do not buy into the idea that it is a woman's choice. You seem convinced that this choice is one that men and women have. It is obviously not a choice made on equal terms. Therefore it is discrimination against men to allow women extra privilege which men do not have. Either we should remove the extra privilege, or extend the privilege to both men and women equally. This inequality is at the root of your ignorance, and you are choosing not to acknowledge inequality where it is inconvenient for your privileged world view.

Also, pretty unfortunate that you call a choice a 'gamble.' Is a medical abortion also a gamble, or can we provide quality healthcare services to women such that their chances of serious injury diminish to almost nothing?

This is probably one of the more ridiculous arguments given for an attempt to evade responsibility. Now your blaming the woman for getting herself pregnant and pretending the man has absolutely nothing to do with it,

I'm not blaming women for getting pregnant. I'm simply asserting that only women make the choice to remain pregnant. If women choose to remain pregnant and give birth, then women choose on their own to become parents. Men should have the same choice, or else men have no choice in becoming a parent. Thus men are forced to be parents, not on their own terms, sometimes against their will.

 

[Celebrity]

SIMPLE. Political conservatives are often Stupidly Prejudiced and Greedy. That means no matter how smart they are, their Stupid Prejudice and Greed interferes with them making good choices regarding other people.

This is unfortunate. So why are so many women on this board closet conservatives? They can't bear the thought of ending poverty.

If child support is what's best for one child, what's best for a different child? The oversimplification, according to your post, is that greed dictates whether or not one child should receive support, and how much. The children of wealthy parents remain wealthy. As for the children of parents who aren't wealthy? Well they might die later... Could be something 'unrelated' like crime, or malnutrition. Who knows what the causes of crime and malnutrition might be? It could be poverty, or something else. Maybe it could be childhood poverty. Maybe it's linked to a father not being present, or a father living in poverty. So why does the poverty of the biological father imply the poverty of a child?

 

[Celebrity]

It incarcerates women too if they dont pay their child support.

Huh, so inconveniently equal...sorry!

Women who are incarcerated for not paying child support are incarcerated less often, and for shorter periods of time. But the bottom line is that incarcerating parents is not helping the situation. As you put it, incarceration is inconvenient.

But it's not equal, and the root of the problem is the difference between men's rights and women's rights.

You see, women who don't want to pay child support can have an abortion. They can put a child up for adoption without notifying the father of the child. Men cannot do either of those things without permission from the mother of the child. I believe I've already explained this to you.

So you know that women who are incarcerated chose to have sex, not abort the child, and not put the child up for adoption. In other words, those women who are incarcerated made a series of choices which directly led to a social bond between a mother and her child.

On the contrary, men do not make this bond when they have sex with a woman. They do not even come close. Women may not choose to be incarcerated voluntarily, but those women who are incarcerated are far less responsible in their decision making than a man who has a one night stand. These decisions take months if not years. It's not a decision made in the spur of the moment.

It is not equal.

 

[FutureIncoming]

This is unfortunate. So why are so many women on this board closet conservatives?

COMPETITION AMONG WOMEN IS A KNOWN THING. If you can do something like oppose abortion and thus drag down other women (who now have to deal with unwanted children), you can consider yourself superior.

They can't bear the thought of ending poverty.

THAT CERTAINLY ISN'T GOING TO HAPPEN BY FORCING UNWANTED MOUTHS-TO-FEED TO GET BORN. Anyway, the greedy are only interested in helping themselves, remember?

If child support is what's best for one child, what's best for a different child?

THEY ALL NEED SUPPORT. The only differences relate to the answer to this question: "Where does the support come from?"

The oversimplification, according to your post, is that greed dictates whether or not one child should receive support, and how much.

WRONG. Greed dictates helping self instead of others. So, by not spending government money on welfare for children, government money can be spent on other things, like those thousand-dollar hammers you might be selling.

 

[soylentgreen]

It is not a woman's choice what a man does with his own life, just as much as it is not a man's choice what a woman does with her own life. When women are able to make a medical choice which determines the course of a man's life for 18 years, there is something wrong with the law. I am not a medical concern of a woman. I am a human being. So let her make her own choices for herself, and not for me.

No, the man made his choice when he decided to have unprotected sex and a pregnancy was the result. He is responsible for his decisions and his choosing. You are asking that he can be excused from an act he committed.

I think it's implied here that you do not buy into the idea that it is a woman's choice. You seem convinced that this choice is one that men and women have. It is obviously not a choice made on equal terms. Therefore it is discrimination against men to allow women extra privilege which men do not have. Either we should remove the extra privilege, or extend the privilege to both men and women equally. This inequality is at the root of your ignorance, and you are choosing not to acknowledge inequality where it is inconvenient for your privileged world view.

No, they are not made on equal terms because it is not equal we have here. Men do not become pregnant. So they do not have to make the equal or same choice as a woman.
The foolishness of this particular argument is that men are not seeking equality here they are seeking to have everything the same. They want the same choice as a woman gets to make without having the inconvenience of having to go through an equal consequence.

Also, pretty unfortunate that you call a choice a 'gamble.' Is a medical abortion also a gamble, or can we provide quality healthcare services to women such that their chances of serious injury diminish to almost nothing?

That is a choice that woman make. Men also make that choice. They gamble that unprotected sex will not result in pregnancy. If they are right then good for them. If they are wrong then they should face the consequence and stop whinging that they are the only ones to suffer.

I'm not blaming women for getting pregnant. I'm simply asserting that only women make the choice to remain pregnant. If women choose to remain pregnant and give birth, then women choose on their own to become parents. Men should have the same choice, or else men have no choice in becoming a parent. Thus men are forced to be parents, not on their own terms, sometimes against their will.

Men are not stupid no matter how badly you argue that they have a right to be. If they are silly enough not to understand what the consequences of their gamble is then that is their own fault.

And again no one is asking men to become parents in this situation. No law is made that forces a man to become a parent. Either you do not understand that a parent actually helps raise a child by nurturing it or you are so badly informed about parenting that you think it merely a matter of handing out money with each pay and nothing more. Which is the only legal responsibility the male has.
The other alternative of course is that this is just another male trying for an insipid sympathy vote by falsely claiming to be forced to be a parent.

 

[soylentgreen]

Then shouldn't women be held to that same standard and not be be allowed to kill the fetus due to their lack of responsibility?

No, because woman have a right to autonomy over their own bodies. That is why it is their choice and not those who think only in terms of killing a fetus.

There are no guarantees when a male and female have sex. Even protected sex can rarely but sometimes result in an unwanted pregnancy. That is the gamble any person takes. And when it goes wrong both must face the consequences.

 

[Hawkeye10]

No, because woman have a right to autonomy over their own bodies. That is why it is their choice and not those who think only in terms of killing a fetus.

There are no guarantees when a male and female have sex. Even protected sex can rarely but sometimes result in an unwanted pregnancy. That is the gamble any person takes. And when it goes wrong both must face the consequences.

Maybe they should not after they choose to breed.

Actions have consequences.

 

[One]

Zero Abortion exists as Mike Pence did wanted he just have the right and pleasure and missed nothing about this policy.

 

[One]

Mike Pence is my favorite in GOP then MAGA then Carson as next President after election '20 or in DJ triumph are max 4 year as presidency but I wants Mike Pence or Carson in next term if goes to court with DJ in late 2018's.

 

[Lursa]

Women who are incarcerated for not paying child support are incarcerated less often, and for shorter periods of time. But the bottom line is that incarcerating parents is not helping the situation. As you put it, incarceration is inconvenient.

Women are incarcerated less because women are the non-custodial parent less. Please feel free to show it's for shorter periods of time.

If men dont want the inconvenience of prison, they can pay or they can decide before they have sex that it's too big a risk and not sleep with that woman. 100% preventable, men's choice.

But it's not equal, and the root of the problem is the difference between men's rights and women's rights.

It's as equal as it can be with the biological differences. The law cant make it equal. Unless you think it would be ok to have a law that says if the woman dies in childbirth, the father is killed too? That's how ridiculous your whiny claims about 'equal' sound. If there's a pregnancy, a man's consequences dont lead to death and health damage...ALL of a woman's consequences can. Every one of them.

And you are whining about equal? it's not equal, not even close.

You see, women who don't want to pay child support can have an abortion. They can put a child up for adoption without notifying the father of the child. Men cannot do either of those things without permission from the mother of the child. I believe I've already explained this to you.

What part of that isnt a man aware of? The child adoption thing is wrong and that law is being changed. Aside from that, If a man doesnt want a woman 'to have control over him'...which if you'd be honest, that's exactly what you are complaining about...then the man is stupid to put himself in that position...isnt he? Why are you absolving men of all responsibility. Are you saying men are incapable of controlling themselves? Why are you portraying men as stupid and weak? I dont think that.

So you know that women who are incarcerated chose to have sex, not abort the child, and not put the child up for adoption. In other words, those women who are incarcerated made a series of choices which directly led to a social bond between a mother and her child.

Yup and obviously they suffered the consequences. :doh

On the contrary, men do not make this bond when they have sex with a woman. They do not even come close. Women may not choose to be incarcerated voluntarily, but those women who are incarcerated are far less responsible in their decision making than a man who has a one night stand. These decisions take months if not years. It's not a decision made in the spur of the moment.

This makes no sense to me but again...men know their choices when they have sex and if they decide to to risk leaving the control up to the women (which is exactly what it comes down to) then they have chosen to accept the consequences.

It is not equal.

Nope, it's not and biology nor the law can make it so.

Stop whining, you are making all men look bad.