Ok, so that Clint Eastwood thing didn't work out very well...

[j-mac]

J, is this your way of saying you can't prove Obama said or thinks this? Com'on, the standard has to be reasonable here. I don't hold Romney to this standard. I only hold him to what he has said.

Has Obama denounced the ad with Joe Soptic? Has he denounced Cutter's remark calling Romney a felon?

 

[nota bene]

Oh please....You can not be this naive....Cutter works for the campaign, and speaks on behalf of the Obama campaign. Bill Burton was in the administration, and if you don't think they are in contact, your being as dishonest as they are.

It really is disingenuous to suggest that Cutter's a rogue solo voice. I mean, really.

 

[Boo Radley]

Has Obama denounced the ad with Joe Soptic? Has he denounced Cutter's remark calling Romney a felon?

I don't know. I haven't looked. But I can. and it appears Fox says Obama tells the truth that the ad was misleading (in Fox fasion).

Obama Campaign Resorts to 'Truth-telling' in Romney Ad Uproar - Joe Soptic - Fox Nation

Now, I have Romney's actual words in this thread, and nothing where he corrects his own misleading. Which standard should I go by?

 

[j-mac]

It really is disingenuous to suggest that Cutter's a rogue solo voice. I mean, really.

This seems to be the standard that the Obama campaign, and their supporters want. To sit there and say with a straight face that a spokesperson for the Obama campaign is speaking on her own when she makes these slanderous claims, and that Obama didn't say it himself so he's not responsible for it is mind numbingly stupid if you ask me. They are treating Americans as if they don't have two brain cells to rub together.

 

[j-mac]

I don't know. I haven't looked. But I can. and it appears Fox says Obama tells the truth that the ad was misleading (in Fox fasion).

That is not at all what the article says. It says that the Obama campaign was busted lying, and then when they got busted they did a short presser to turnaround their official statements that they had nothing to do with it, all the while playing semantic word games....That's who you support Joe...Game players, and word twisters.

Now, I have Romney's actual words in this thread, and nothing where he corrects his own misleading. Which standard should I go by?

You should address your own party's lies, before using the slimy tactics of trying to turn it on your opponent. Your argument is reminding me of the 3rd grader that gets into a fight, and the principle pulls in both kids, and asks what happened? Kid 1 says kid 2 started it by throwing a punch, and kid 2 argues that kid 1's face swung at his fist....Why are you kid 2 Joe?

 

[Boo Radley]

That is not at all what the article says. It says that the Obama campaign was busted lying, and then when they got busted they did a short presser to turnaround their official statements that they had nothing to do with it, all the while playing semantic word games....That's who you support Joe...Game players, and word twisters.

I said in Fox fashion. And you support Romney who himself lied straight up. I know you think that is better, but try to understand some others may not.

You should address your own party's lies, before using the slimy tactics of trying to turn it on your opponent. Your argument is reminding me of the 3rd grader that gets into a fight, and the principle pulls in both kids, and asks what happened? Kid 1 says kid 2 started it by throwing a punch, and kid 2 argues that kid 1's face swung at his fist....Why are you kid 2 Joe?

Here's the difference between us j, I don't defend a lie. You do.

 

[danarhea]

As the liberals would find it hard to admit Obama isn't all that separated from an empty seat when it came to leadership during this administration...

Actually, the way I see it, is when Romney came out of his own nominating convention upstaged by an old man arguing with an empty chair, he was in trouble. LOL.

 

[zimmer]

Having read pages of posts... it is clear the Dems realize Clint did a masterful job of smacking Obama as an empty suit who has failed...

... and it is time for this failure to go.

The takeaway line that resonates... You don't keep failures, you fire them.

It was beautiful, unique and memorable... And that really pisses the Lefties off.

LOL... Turn out the lights, this socialists party is over. (and my how Obama and his clan of communists has screwed the Democrat party).

Good riddance to the anti-Americans. You've tried changing America... you failed... now go back to wherever you came from.

 

[upsideguy]

So what you're saying is... Obama's leadership style and heavily liberal policies are completely ineffective? Glad we are on the same page with that...

The situation you described calls for a much more broad based collaborative and inclusive leadership style, built on bringing people together, and getting the job done... much like Romney has done throughout his career...

Also like Paul Ryan did when he stepped up and made the statement that both sides are to blame for the reckless spending which has put us in the situation we are in, and both sides are going to need to come together to address the serious changes that we need to solve the problems we currently face...

Thank you for yet again arguing another point which favors the Romney/Ryan ticket over Obama/Biden administration...

I have said no such thing. Thanks again for hearing only what you want to hear. Thanks for taking a break from Fox to have this short monologue with me.

 

[LiberalAvenger]

Having read pages of posts... it is clear the Dems realize Clint did a masterful job of smacking Obama as an empty suit who has failed...

... and it is time for this failure to go.

The takeaway line that resonates... You don't keep failures, you fire them.

It was beautiful, unique and memorable... And that really pisses the Lefties off.

:spin:

Your post is a good example of george orwell's "newspeak, ie, "slavery is freedom. Your spin made me dizzy.

 

[zimmer]

Having read pages of posts... it is clear the Dems realize Clint did a masterful job of smacking Obama as an empty suit who has failed...

... and it is time for this failure to go.

The takeaway line that resonates... You don't keep failures, you fire them.

It was beautiful, unique and memorable... And that really pisses the Lefties off.

:spin:

Your post is a good example of george orwell's "newspeak, ie, "slavery is freedom. Your spin made me dizzy.

Newspeak? Where is the contradiction of terms? Obama has failed, by his own standards too. What he has "accomplished" nobody wanted, and they let him know it too. That is why Dead Kennedy's seat went to Scott Brown, and why the Right kicked serious ass in the midterms. ObamaKare was the work of dilettantes using parliamentary tricks to shove through socialist legislation.

Clint Eastwood nailed Obama...

1. As an empty suit.
2. As the insolent prick he is.
3. As the incompetent he has proven to be.

4. He masterfully noted that you fire incompetents... even if you might like them on some level.

That was a great 10-minutes, and memorable too.

That's why Lefties hate it and try to say Clint is demented.

How about an example of Newspeak for the record... you made the claim buckeroo... now back it up; (this pretzel twisting ought to be good).

 

[IndepCentristMA]

I have said no such thing. Thanks again for hearing only what you want to hear. Thanks for taking a break from Fox to have this short monologue with me.

I don't have FOX News... In fact, I don't even watch my local Fox affiliate anymore because of the worthless greedy scandalous Republicans during the Bush years, who came up with a way to "help the poor" from that awful travesty of the digital TV gap... So they made those selfish and discriminatory broadcast television stations update to digital transmission ony... So that instead of getting free analog tv, we had to pay for digital coverter boxes, and those broadcast companies raised their rates to cover the conversion, and then the satellite and cable providers raised their rates to cover the raised fees from the broadcast companies... So now, I can't afford cable/satellite... and I had to pay for a digital converter box... which moved my local FOX25 from being 3-4 channels away from CBS, ABC, and NBC to being like 17-20 channels up, after sorting through HD digital broadcasts of infomercials on spanish language networks...


You're right... you didn't say that... in as many words... That's the reaction and impression that one naturally comes to when they say that Obama is only effective when he has complete control of Congress... and you make the excuse that he didn't have COMPLETE control per se, because he was 1 vote shy of being filibuster proof...

Originally Posted by IndepCentristMA
"That doesn't mean they didn't have control of both houses, by wide majorities... that even predated Obama going back to 2007... so from 2007-2011, when the financial collapse and it's empty recovery took place, they were in control of both houses and for half that time in control of the presidency as well...

I wasn't even speaking about the filibuster proof majority that they had... that makes the point even further that he had 20 weeks of filibuster proof majority, in which to usher in anything he wanted to... and still, he wants to blame Republicans for his inability to solve the problems he wanted to....

That's called weak and pathetic leadership..."

Your response:
"Sorry, but in the current era, you do not have control of the Senate unless you have 60 votes. Unfortunately, the minority has learned to abuse the power of the filibuster rendering the Senate almost completely ineffective. All you get with less than 60 votes is committee control."


So... again... If Obama couldn't get stuff done with a Senate that was 59-41 (1 vote shy of "complete control")... How would he get stuff done with a split evenly divided Senate?


Obama lacks the ability to get stuff done, because the stuff he has pushed has far less broad based appeal than any president I could think of...

It's all 1-sided politics with Obama... everything is "The Republicans in Congress" fault... never taking responsibility himself...

He points the finger, and throws Dan Marino like hissy fits... It was my recievers... I don't have a running game... I don't have a good enough Defense... wah wah wah...


We need a real leader... One who reaches across the aisle... brings both sides together... brings in outside resources... and come up with the collaborative approaches that lead to cooperation, unity, and results...


That's what Mitt Romney has done in his time as a Governor... working with an 85% opposition party legislature...

Obama has a majority and still can't do it...

Mitt Romney is the more effective leader, and the right guy for the job given all the divisiveness that's been created during the last 3 administrations...

 

[LiberalAvenger]

Having read pages of posts... it is clear the Dems realize Clint did a masterful job of smacking Obama as an empty suit who has failed...

... and it is time for this failure to go.

The takeaway line that resonates... You don't keep failures, you fire them.

It was beautiful, unique and memorable... And that really pisses the Lefties off.
Newspeak? Where is the contradiction of terms? Obama has failed, by his own standards too. What he has "accomplished" nobody wanted, and they let him know it too. That is why Dead Kennedy's seat went to Scott Brown, and why the Right kicked serious ass in the midterms. ObamaKare was the work of dilettantes using parliamentary tricks to shove through socialist legislation.

Clint Eastwood nailed Obama...

1. As an empty suit.
2. As the insolent prick he is.
3. As the incompetent he has proven to be.

4. He masterfully noted that you fire incompetents... even if you might like them on some level.

That was a great 10-minutes, and memorable too.

That's why Lefties hate it and try to say Clint is demented.

How about an example of Newspeak for the record... you made the claim buckeroo... now back it up; (this pretzel twisting ought to be good).

You forgot to add imo to your post. You offered no back up at all. I did offer an example of newspeak "slavery is freedom. Read Orwell's "1984" and then you will learn about newspeak.

You were offering an opinion as if it were fact. It was only as you perceived it. Everyone does not think like you.

Don't call me buckeroo.

 

[Zyphlin]

Moderator's Warning:

Get the baiting in check and stick to topical content in posts

 

[Wiggen]

Chris Rock had the best line about the Clint Eastwood debacle.

"Clint Eastwood debated a chair at the Republican convention and the chair won."

 

[j-mac]

Chris Rock had the best line about the Clint Eastwood debacle.

"Clint Eastwood debated a chair at the Republican convention and the chair won."

No, Not Chris Rock? THE Chris Rock? Say it ain't so....With such intellectual heavyweights like the cerebral Mr. Rock quipping smack, we are in trouble....What ever shall we do?

 

[Wiggen]

Clint Eastwood makes Chris Rock look like a Rhodes frickin' scholar. And that was true even before Clint was affected so tragically with senility. But I understand how conservatives don't think much of those 'uppity' types.

 

[Dickieboy]

Clint Eastwood makes Chris Rock look like a Rhodes frickin' scholar. And that was true even before Clint was affected so tragically with senility. But I understand how conservatives don't think much of those 'uppity' types.

Let's see...Eastwood graduated HS and joined the Army during the Korean war. Rock is a HS dropout, working general labor and 'burger flipping' jobs. Yeah 'Rhodes frickin' scholar' indeed...

 

[Voltaire X]

Clint Eastwood's speech was pretty good for what it was, a comedy act. This guy is an actor, what the hell did people expect him to do?

The crowd loved it. The only reason several media outlets have been bashing it is because Obama looks better if Eastwood gave a terrible speech as opposed to a good one.


And this is coming from someone who is voting for Obama.

 

[j-mac]

Clint Eastwood makes Chris Rock look like a Rhodes frickin' scholar. And that was true even before Clint was affected so tragically with senility. But I understand how conservatives don't think much of those 'uppity' types.

Booooooo....Thumbs down on that one Wig....Eastwood is not senile, just released a new movie that he produced, and starred in...So you don't have a clue what you are talking about. The only reason you want to tear him down is because his appearance was effective, and as a result, you in such typical fashion resort to Alinsky tactics that are old, tired, and nonsensical.

 

[Jetboogieman]

you want to tear him down is because his appearance was effective

Look... J-mac, I agree people shouldn't be calling him senile, it's bang out of order.

But why do we have to keep on pretending that his speech was some great success that it wasn't?

It was a disaster, plain and simple, it's nothing against him or what he believes, sometimes you hit and sometimes you miss and this time it was a miss.

you in such typical fashion resort to Alinsky tactics that are old, tired, and nonsensical.

Honestly?

How the hell did Alinsky get into this conversation...

Did he go around calling celebrities senile or am I missing something?

 

[j-mac]

Look... J-mac, I agree people shouldn't be calling him senile, it's bang out of order.

Good, we agree....Oh wait, there's more...

But why do we have to keep on pretending that his speech was some great success that it wasn't?

Oh for Christ's sake....The guy is in his 80s. I hope to be as vital as he at that age...The man went out there on stage with not one written word in a speech, and I think was speaking from the heart...IMHO, it isn't the totality of the speech, but rather take away lines, such as when Clint told America it's ok to let Obama go.

It was a disaster, plain and simple, it's nothing against him or what he believes, sometimes you hit and sometimes you miss and this time it was a miss.

The night of, I might have agreed, but after reflection, and review, I disagree.

Honestly?

How the hell did Alinsky get into this conversation...

Did he go around calling celebrities senile or am I missing something?

Because it is the "go to" for many progressives today, and it is transparent...

Actually two were used in that reply...

RULE 5: “Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating....

and

RULE 12: Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” Cut off the support network and isolate the target from sympathy. Go after people and not institutions; people hurt faster than institutions.

It is a despicable, and dishonest approach to debate, and should be seen as a fail every time these tactics are used.

 

[Somerville]

Rather - Alinsky is the "go to" for righties when they have no other justification for their attacks on progressives


from Townhall.com - 12 Ways To Use Saul Alinsky's Rules For Radicals Against Liberals


some random blogger - Obama and Alinsky: A Conservative’s Training Manual


and Melinda Henneberger of the Washington Post pointing out that conservatives refer more to Alinsky than progressives

Saul Alinsky would be so disappointed: Obama breaks ‘Rules for Radicals’

Newt Gingrich is only the latest in a long line of conservatives who have accused President Obama of being a “Saul Alinsky radical.” And Alinsky, who died when the president was 11, would delight in all the free PR. But he also would be the first to say Obama does not much resemble that remark.

In fact, if Alinsky were alive today, he’d surely be camped out in front of the White House, using every trick in his book, “Rules for Radicals,” to point out the many ways in which the president is not an infiltrator of the dreaded establishment, but the personification of it.

 

[Jetboogieman]

Oh for Christ's sake....The guy is in his 80s. I hope to be as vital as he at that age...The man went out there on stage with not one written word in a speech, and I think was speaking from the heart...IMHO, it isn't the totality of the speech, but rather take away lines, such as when Clint told America it's ok to let Obama go.

The speech was a failure j-mac, you can try and twist it all you want but regardless of his age there's two major things wrong with it.

1. It was incoherent, as a fellow actor I can say simply he dropped the ball.

2. It took attention away from Romneys speech.

These two things make his speech a failure.

Because it is the "go to" for many progressives today, and it is transparent...

Actually two were used in that reply...

RULE 5: “Ridicule is man’s most potent weapon.” There is no defense. It’s irrational. It’s infuriating....

and

RULE 12: Pick the target, freeze it, personalize it, and polarize it.” Cut off the support network and isolate the target from sympathy. Go after people and not institutions; people hurt faster than institutions.

It is a despicable, and dishonest approach to debate, and should be seen as a fail every time these tactics are used.

Your over sensetivity and hyperbole is making you look foolish here.

Not everything you dislike hearing has anything to do with socialism or Saul Alinsky.

 

[Crosscheck]

Booooooo....Thumbs down on that one Wig....Eastwood is not senile, just released a new movie that he produced, and starred in...So you don't have a clue what you are talking about. The only reason you want to tear him down is because his appearance was effective, and as a result, you in such typical fashion resort to Alinsky tactics that are old, tired, and nonsensical.

90% of Eastwood's speech was good for taking a jab at the opponent. The only thing blaring wrong was the use of the sexual suggestive phrase to go F yourself for a national general tv audience.

But I already know the replies to this is that there is vulgarity in all the movies and sitcoms. Why yes there is, isn't that just dandy.