Men not being involved in the abortion debate

[Lursa]

Let's be honest here.

Most people find abortion morally wrong however they justify it because of outside circumstances. The economy, personal finances, crime, quality of life etc..

Most sane women, I am assuming wouldn't have an abortion if they knew they could provide for their child, meaning finances and quality of life were not an issue.

The reason itself thus doesn't justify an abortion. If the issue is the lack of adoptions in this country, the lack of social programs for single mothers, the high cost of housing, that is a COMPLETELY different subject and doesn't justify an abortion.

There's a reason why assisted suicide is illegal. Because it morally wrong. If your depressed spouse was so depressed and told you the only way she can stop the pain is for you to kill her, THAT DOESN'T MAKE IT RIGHT TO KILL HER!!!!

Just as a baby. Just because a mother doesn't think she can provide a quality life for her son/daughter, THAT DOESN'T JUSTIFY AN ABORTION!

The anti-life movement is conflating two separate issues.

All fantasy. Your fantasy.

Abortion can be a very moral and responsible act.

Women are completely sane when making their reproductive choices. Feel free to post medical sources that support otherwise.

It's not up to you to justify what is best for individual women and their lives. It's clear you dont give a damn about us...you place the lives and needs of the unborn above that of women...so dont lie...just admit it.

Assisted suicide has nothing to do with this argument but I respect people enough to enable this if they have thought it through.

 

[Bucky]

a fetus is not a baby!

A saw my daughter born and I can assure you the fetus is a baby.

 

[Lursa]

You cannot even admit to the #1 reason why mothers choose to have an abortion.

It is fairly obvious but you are so entrenched in ideology it prevents you from being objective on the subject.

What's the number 1 reason?

 

[year2late]

Let's be honest here.

Most people find abortion morally wrong however they justify it because of outside circumstances. The economy, personal finances, crime, quality of life etc..

Most sane women, I am assuming wouldn't have an abortion if they knew they could provide for their child, meaning finances and quality of life were not an issue.

The reason itself thus doesn't justify an abortion. If the issue is the lack of adoptions in this country, the lack of social programs for single mothers, the high cost of housing, that is a COMPLETELY different subject and doesn't justify an abortion.

There's a reason why assisted suicide is illegal. Because it morally wrong. If your depressed spouse was so depressed and told you the only way she can stop the pain is for you to kill her, THAT DOESN'T MAKE IT RIGHT TO KILL HER!!!!

Just as a baby. Just because a mother doesn't think she can provide a quality life for her son/daughter, THAT DOESN'T JUSTIFY AN ABORTION!

The anti-life movement is conflating two separate issues.

Stop lying.

Please.

 

[Bucky]

Women are completely sane when making their reproductive choices.

For goodness sakes. They wouldn't have gotten pregnant if they were sane when making their reproductive choices.

Sex and rational behavior rarely go together.

 

[Bucky]

What's the number 1 reason?

I already stated this: Personal inconvenience.

 

[Bucky]

Stop lying.

Please.

I have made a rational argument and you accuse me of lying or what Lursa does, come up with some alternative version of facts.

I am sick of tired of the lack of decorum in this debate. Play by the rules, please!

 

[Lursa]

For goodness sakes. They wouldn't have gotten pregnant if they were sane when making their reproductive choices.

Sex and rational behavior rarely go together.

So all women that have sex and dont want to get pregnant are insane? :doh

I asked you for sources, medical or psychiatric. Not your fantasies.

Your made-up disturbed view of women and our sexuality is meaningless....let's see the proof.

 

[Lursa]

I have made a rational argument and you accuse me of lying or what Lursa does, come up with some alternative version of facts.

I am sick of tired of the lack of decorum in this debate. Play by the rules, please!

We can only believe you are lying because you provide no evidence or sources to prove otherwise.

 

[year2late]

You cannot even admit to the #1 reason why mothers choose to have an abortion.

It is fairly obvious but you are so entrenched in ideology it prevents you from being objective on the subject.

Acknowledging that legally a fetus is not a human being is "entrenched in ideology"?

Calling someone out because they want to use correct terminology is not being objective??

Bucky, dude, part of being truthful is using correct terminology - it is part and parcel to objectivity.

 

[Lursa]

I have made a rational argument

This is irrational...unless you can back it up with sources:

They wouldn't have gotten pregnant if they were sane when making their reproductive choices.

Sex and rational behavior rarely go together.

 

[Lursa]

I already stated this: Personal inconvenience.

And I refuted it several times. It's BS.

I asked you why the unborn is more entitled to that life of personal conveniences more than women...and got no answer.

I mean if that's what women are saving by having abortions...why are the unborn more entitled to a life that you value so little (since you refer to lives as just a string of conveniences.)

 

[year2late]

I have made a rational argument and you accuse me of lying or what Lursa does, come up with some alternative version of facts.

I am sick of tired of the lack of decorum in this debate. Play by the rules, please!

You are calling women insane for making a legal decision about what happens to her body. It seems YOU are the one who lacks decorum.

What is wrong with expecting proper terminology in a debate?

All that I ask is that if you what to present a belief or "what should be" ...stop presenting it as fact and start presenting it properly.

There is nothing wrong with having a debate about the need to change a law or the terminology.

 

[Bucky]

And I refuted it several times. It's BS.

I asked you why the unborn is more entitled to that life of personal conveniences more than women...and got no answer.

I mean if that's what women are saving by having abortions...why are the unborn more entitled to a life that you value so little (since you refer to lives as just a string of conveniences.)

The majority of people born are born unplanned. You act as if people have life maps set and they follow them to a tee.

So accusing me of living in a fantasy land is rich given you think that all abortions are carefully planned and discussed. That is laughable.

 

[calamity]

A saw my daughter born and I can assure you the fetus is a baby.

No. A baby, which is what you saw being born, is a baby. A fetus, which exists inside the body of a woman, is a fetus.

 

[Bucky]

You are calling women insane for making a legal decision about what happens to her body.

I never said that.

I fully support women having the same rights as men. I support their right to vote, having jobs, the same basic freedoms as men. You can call me a true feminist. I just ask we stop killing babies. Is that really asking much???

 

[Bucky]

No. A baby, which is what you saw being born, is a baby. A fetus, which exists inside the body of a woman, is a fetus.

So an ultrasound, is that just a hologram?

That's a unique being inside there. To deny it's individuality is cruel.

 

[Lursa]

The majority of people born are born unplanned. You act as if people have life maps set and they follow them to a tee.

So accusing me of living in a fantasy land is rich given you think that all abortions are carefully planned and discussed. That is laughable.

Please source the bold. Otherwise it's BS.

And what does unplanned pregnancy have to do with calling women insane? What is that connection there?

 

[Lursa]

You are calling women insane for making a legal decision about what happens to her body. It seems YOU are the one who lacks decorum.

I never said that.

Oh sure you did. Stop lying:

They wouldn't have gotten pregnant if they were sane when making their reproductive choices.

 

[Lursa]

So accusing me of living in a fantasy land is rich given you think that all abortions are carefully planned and discussed. That is laughable.

Oh I'm totally laughing at you...how do you think abortions take place? By osmosis? An angel farts and the fetus disappears? Of course they're planned and discussed....they are medical procedures.

 

[calamity]

I never said that.

I fully support women having the same rights as men. I support their right to vote, having jobs, the same basic freedoms as men. You can call me a true feminist. I just ask we stop killing babies. Is that really asking much???

No one is killing babies.

 

[calamity]

So an ultrasound, is that just a hologram?

That's a unique being inside there. To deny it's individuality is cruel.

Key words: "Inside there."

What is it inside, Bucky?

 

[year2late]

Most sane women, I am assuming wouldn't have an abortion if they knew they could provide for their child, meaning finances and quality of life were not an issue.

You are calling women insane for making a legal decision about what happens to her body. It seems YOU are the one who lacks decorum.

I never said that.

So if a woman is not sane....that would make her insane, correct?

So if I have mischaracterized your comments, how so?

 

[FutureIncoming]

So an ultrasound, is that just a hologram?

IT IS WHAT IT IS. A technology that can produce a viewable image. Sometimes it is used on the heart, to see what condition it is in while pumping blood.

That's a unique being inside there.

A STUPID LIE, when the word "being" is so often used as a synonym for "person". An unborn human is a mere-animal entity, just like an average rat is a mere-animal entity. There is absolutely no possibility that it can qualify as a "being", a person.

To deny it's individuality is cruel.

NO SUCH DENIAL IS NEEDED. Plenty of individual entities exist in the world. There are individual worms, individual cockroaches, individual spiders, individual snakes, individual rats, individual poison ivy plants, individual poisonous jellyfish, ... (the list goes on for many thousands of species), and of course individual unborn human animal entities. Whenever such an entity happens to have an owner, none of them is more special or more valuable than the owner arbitrarily declares it to be. It's pretty obvious that when a woman obtains an abortion, the declared special-ness or value of her womb-occupant is zero or even negative. On what basis dare you disagree with her?

 

[FutureIncoming]

I fully support women having the same rights as men. I support their right to vote, having jobs, the same basic freedoms as men. You can call me a true feminist.

A STUPID LIE, so long as you promote the enslavement of unwilling pregnant women.

I just ask we stop killing babies.

LOTS OF FOLKS CAN AGREE WITH THAT. Except when you don't know what you are blathering about, confusing ordinary babies with unborn human animals that act worse than parasites.

Is that really asking much???

IT IS NOT TOO MUCH TO ASK. With respect to unborn human animals that act worse than parasites, it is absolutely too much to insist, and to lie-about, and to promote the illegalization thereof.