Man arrested in 'Call of Duty' 'swatting' hoax that led to fatal police shooting

[Indian Giver]

A lot of times, if you commit a felony and someone dies, you're charged with murder even if you didn't directly kill the person. Getaway car drivers have been charged with murder if someone they drove to rob a house/store gets shot, even though they were just sitting in a car far away.

That's just the way the law works. I'm guessing the swatter in this case goes away for a long time. And hopefully, it will teach other morons who play that game that swatting is for idiots and that if it leads to a death -- the blood will be on their hands.

Charles Manson similarly never killed anyone to my knowledge but he was convicted of murder.

 

[Indian Giver]

I was always under the impression that if you committed a crime and someone died because of said crime you were charged with their death. For example if you robbed a bank and a patron had a heart-attack during the robbery you would be charged with their death. Seems the same here, committed a crime (false report) and someone died due to the crime. I'm not a lawyer though so none of this could be true.

You probably know more than most lawyers, just like lots of law enforcement officers know little about the laws they enforce.

That is why they used to be called peace officers whose primary duty was to keep the peace.

The common law was mostly upheld by citizens living according to an unwritten but agreed upon code of conduct.

Prosecutions used to be private, now they are public. Instead of Doe v. Smith in a criminal action it is People of California v Smith while Doe v Smith appears only in civil litigation.

We have lost our judicial bearings and given too much power to the state.

 

[Indian Giver]

I don't know about that. If you drive drunk and bounce a pedestrian off your hood you should be charged with more than just DUI. This is kind of the same thing. The false report lead to a homicide so he's definitely got some culpability there.

What if you walk home drunk and a sober driver hits you and gets hit by another car and killed while rendering assistance? Should the drunk pedestrian be charged with manslaughter?

 

[Indian Giver]

Really? because of this pranksters actions an innocent victim is dead. You probably also can’t comprehend why shouting fire in a crowded theater where there is none is illegal as well.

What if you shout "fire!" in a home theater when you are alone?

Kind of makes it no longer a speech issue, doesn't it?

 

[Lutherf]

What if you walk home drunk and a sober driver hits you and gets hit by another car and killed while rendering assistance? Should the drunk pedestrian be charged with manslaughter?

Is it a crime to walk home drunk?

If your illegal actions are a proximate cause of injury to someone else then you should be punished.

 

[Chomsky]

Regardless of the caller that initiated the incident, the responsibility for the use of deadly force ultimately resides with the officer firing the shot. He was wrong, and he should pay the price for the blood on his hands, whatever that be determined.

The so-called prankster should get some time out of this, too.

But it's the paid professional's job - the police - to get it right.

 

[Indian Giver]

Is it a crime to walk home drunk?

Depends on whether or not you are in control of your faculties.

If a cop deems that you are not, you will likely be arrested and possibly charged with drunk in public - a misdemeanor.

 

[Indian Giver]

Conspiracy to commit something? He had every intention of putting the recipient in a dangerous situation.

What if you are conspiring to conspire?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6U6MOfuFX-Q

I love Catherine-Zeta Jones's expression of shock in this clip - it alone should have been worth an Oscar.

Then there is a Hispanic gloating about how great it would to "bust" white people - but that isn't racist or anything.

To the black guy's credit he presumes the white woman's innocence.

Then the Hispanic swindles his black partner.

Great but underrated movie.

 

[Kal'Stang]

Ever heard of upholding liberty in a supposedly "free" country?

Maybe you would prefer North Korea.

:roll: Hyperbole much? There is never any reason to shoot at cops unless they are doing something tyrannical consistently and across the nation. Out of 10s of millions of interactions an average of 1500 kills a year, of which the majority is justified, there is no reason to shoot cops. You fight em in the court room if necessary. Not with a gun.

 

[Kal'Stang]

I don’t know why you would be talking about any other types of interactions since the OP is about a no knock entry and I was talking about no knock entries and I specifically said that I support police judgment calls that turn out bad outside of no knock entries. No knock entries are highly dangerous to the citizens and are largely avoidable.

Perhaps you didn't read the whole thread? Missed a couple of posts maybe?

 

[Indian Giver]

:roll: Hyperbole much? There is never any reason to shoot at cops unless they are doing something tyrannical consistently and across the nation. Out of 10s of millions of interactions an average of 1500 kills a year, of which the majority is justified, there is no reason to shoot cops. You fight em in the court room if necessary. Not with a gun.

You assume that you can make it to a courtroom.

Andrew Finch didn't - he is in the morgue, and he didn't even fight.

 

[Lord of Planar]

There is body cam footage of the actual shooting. It's grainy from across the street but you can see how the cop could have perceived the guy going for a gun.

Police release ?swatting? call, video of man shot to death | The Wichita Eagle

This was just a horrible situation created by a horrible person.

No way. That is not justifiable. The police had cover behind cars. The police shot immediately.

You should not be supporting a police officer that is to damn scared, and pees his pants so readily.

He needs to serve time for manslaughter.

 

[PirateMk1]

Really? because of this pranksters actions an innocent victim is dead. You probably also can’t comprehend why shouting fire in a crowded theater where there is none is illegal as well.

If you are in a theatre and someone shouts "Fire!", what the first thing a thinking person would do? I believe the correct answer is to ask themselves and others the question "Where?". After all, we don't want to die in the "fire", do we? The actions of the police were totally and completely within the police departments control. Period.

 

[Crovax]

Perhaps you didn't read the whole thread? Missed a couple of posts maybe?

Maybe you meant to reply to someone else then. You replied to my post which was only talking in the context of no knock situations

 

[PirateMk1]

I disagree. The wasn't just a "report". They went into what they thought a very dangerous situation with other peoples lives in danger. If it was a 'real' incident, they did the right thing.

From the transcript of the 911 call:

.

Police release ?swatting? call, video of man shot to death | The Wichita Eagle

Should they just have strolled up to the door and knocked? And if it was a real hostage situation and the guy kills the people and flames the house, the cops would be criticized for not taking it serious.

You mean to tell me that people don't make up stories to the cops all the time and the cops don't have the skills or wherewithal to make heads or tails of a situation. They cant figure if the phone call is local or not?

 

[Crovax]

Really? because of this pranksters actions an innocent victim is dead. You probably also can’t comprehend why shouting fire in a crowded theater where there is none is illegal as well.

Its actually not illegal, and technically speaking never was

 

[Crovax]

You mean to tell me that people don't make up stories to the cops all the time and the cops don't have the skills or wherewithal to make heads or tails of a situation. They cant figure if the phone call is local or not?

Not when they have a chance to put on the riot gear and play out their favorite rainbow six fantasy

 

[PirateMk1]

You've got to be kidding.

Come on man.... none of this would have happened to begin with if the caller hadn't made what was not only a false report, but a carefully maliciously crafted one intended to cause the police to RUSH to the house and be in a state of high alert and expecting deadly violence.

At an absolute minimum the caller is guilty of manslaughter.

Oh, we are so going to disagree on this one. This one is totally 100% on the police. They ****ed up big time.

 

[Lord of Planar]

You mean to tell me that people don't make up stories to the cops all the time and the cops don't have the skills or wherewithal to make heads or tails of a situation. They cant figure if the phone call is local or not?

I thought that in any possible hostage situation, the first action the police took was a phone call inside.

 

[Lord of Planar]

Oh, we are so going to disagree on this one. This one is totally 100% on the police. They ****ed up big time.

Agreed.

And for those who believe in the constitution:

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

 

[Indian Giver]

All the idiot did, was to make a report. He made NO other action. He has no culpability as to what the police do after he makes it. That is completely and totally on the police and there are more than a few court decisions backing up the claim that the police are under no obligation to provide service, so, therefore, they are the ones who are culpable for the homicide of the poor bastard that was swatted.

He did not report anything - he flat out lied.

That 9-1-1 call sounded like a Hillary campaign ad.

 

[Indian Giver]

Except in that situation the cops would have put themselves in danger. .

What danger? There was no one else in the room.

Brailsford is a trigger happy murderer and I won't cry a bit if someone points a gun at him, makes him crawl, and shoots him.

He deserves nothing less.

 

[Indian Giver]

If armed men in tactical gear are kicking down my door I sure as heck am not thinking of shooting them.

Why not?

 

[Indian Giver]

There has been a drastic increase in cop killings and ambushes, police are human and know that the slightest hesitation could result in them not being able to go home to their families. Simply looking at the issue from one side without accounting for the reasons police might be on edge is rather ignorant of the danger these people face. Changing ones mindset when it could very well mean life or death is a rather tall order.

Also, in this swatting incident it wasn't someone calling about being held hostage. From the police's perspective it was the hostage taker and the phone appearing to originate from that property. There was no way for them to know that it was a prank.

If the choice is me living or the cop going back to his family and one of us has to die, I am going to do everything in my power to ensure that I am the one who survives.

If the cop does not like that then they should not play brinksmanship games.

There lives are not more valuable simply because they wear a badge.

 

[Lord of Planar]

If armed men in tactical gear are kicking down my door I sure as heck am not thinking of shooting them.

I would call 911 and tell them what I see. If they tell me they are legitimate officers, I would query why they are there.

Just the same, it appears the police went straight for the assault setup, and they will pay millions for that mistake if so, and hopefully at least one gets sentenced for manslaughter.

Over-zeolous police need to be held accountable for their actions, and not pull, the trigger because they pee their panties.