Kelly overtaking McSally

[Luther]

Your Dear Leader Trump is BFF with Kim the Dear Leader of these guys who are in heat at their rallies.

Just to let ya know, that was a terrible comeback(LOL)

Especially when I'm not a Trump defender

 

[Luther]

Sounds like a man’s point of view doesn’t match theirs to me.

Post fail

 

[beefheart]

your idiotic and gratuitously dishonest depiction of my support for constitutional rights is really stupid. And I guess you are too biased to understand that Kelly is USING his wife's injury as a campaign prop. Stow your misplaced sanctimony and place it where it belongs-on the campaign

As usual, your only concern in this country is guns. They are your fixation, the fixation has robbed you of any hope to be clear headed about anything else. You are the one that is using Kelly's wife to fit your fixation.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

if you give the government the valid power to ban 100 round magazines (which are no more dangerous than 10 round magazines-and often jam) you have conceded they have a proper power to ban magazines based on round count.,Where do you draw the line?

The purpose of large capacity mags is to allow a shooter to let loose more rounds without having to stop and reload. Preventing that ability is the point of a ban on large capacity magazines. The few seconds that it takes to drop a mag and insert the next can be the difference between life or death for innocents to run to safety or confront/overpower the shooter.

There isn’t sufficient evidence of a probable “slippery slope” to warrant refusing any restriction on large capacity bans either. Sure, over decades since the federal government left it to states to set their own mag limits there have been a handful of states that have passed restriction laws, but not most.

 

[ecofarm]

The purpose of large capacity mags is to allow a shooter to let loose more rounds without having to stop and reload. Preventing that ability is the point of a ban on large capacity magazines. The few seconds that it takes to drop a mag and insert the next can be the difference between life or death for innocents to run to safety or confront/overpower the shooter.

Not really. High capacity mags facilitate auto fire which is neither available nor efficient in inflicting casualties. The Batman movie shooter's drum jammed, saving lives and rendering the rifle useless.

I'd never trust anything over thirty (prefer less) and a hundred drum is just stupid (it will jam).

Getting the bad guy while he switches magazines is not really a thing. There's no benefit to high capacity mags in a semiauto; only jams. Let them be stupid and jam their weapons.

 

[tres borrachos]

what is dishonest? claiming Kelly, like Brady-uses a crippled spouse for publicity for their political aspirations? Someone is trying to infringe on our rights, all is fair

Who said anything about dishonest?

Were you one of those people who accused Sarah Palin of using her special needs child as publicity for her political aspirations?

Kelly has a reason to want gun control. His wife was shot in the head by a nut who never should have had access to a gun. You do know that most everyone has a "bias" about something based on their personal experiences, yes? Your personal experience with guns has been fine. Not everyone else can say that. You want your personal experiences to override someone else's. Life doesn't work that way.

 

[Tangmo]

Just to let ya know, that was a terrible comeback(LOL)

Especially when I'm not a Trump defender

Au contraire I know it was an excellent comeback. How do I know? Cause I'm watching you wipe the pie cream off your smiling face.

And hey, I myself am not a Trump defender yet you're the guy wiping off the pie cream. So you might consider rethinking your whole rightwing scam you're confident you got going. :duel

Here, have another napkin btw.

 

[TurtleDude]

Who said anything about dishonest?

Were you one of those people who accused Sarah Palin of using her special needs child as publicity for her political aspirations?

Kelly has a reason to want gun control. His wife was shot in the head by a nut who never should have had access to a gun. You do know that most everyone has a "bias" about something based on their personal experiences, yes? Your personal experience with guns has been fine. Not everyone else can say that. You want your personal experiences to override someone else's. Life doesn't work that way.

what gun law-if in place-would have stopped the shooter-when he was facing the death penalty for doing what he did? People seem to forget that he KILLED people including a well respected conservative Republican Judge and that was both a state and federal capital crime.

 

[TurtleDude]

The purpose of large capacity mags is to allow a shooter to let loose more rounds without having to stop and reload. Preventing that ability is the point of a ban on large capacity magazines. The few seconds that it takes to drop a mag and insert the next can be the difference between life or death for innocents to run to safety or confront/overpower the shooter.

There isn’t sufficient evidence of a probable “slippery slope” to warrant refusing any restriction on large capacity bans either. Sure, over decades since the federal government left it to states to set their own mag limits there have been a handful of states that have passed restriction laws, but not most.

Dem gun schemes are designed to help criminals-who disobey magazine bans (and gun bans since felons are already prohibited from possessing any firearm)-because criminals usually plan when they rob or attack someone-and harm defending citizens, who rarely have time to grab multiple magazines when their home or shop is invaded by violent felons.

 

[TurtleDude]

As usual, your only concern in this country is guns. They are your fixation, the fixation has robbed you of any hope to be clear headed about anything else. You are the one that is using Kelly's wife to fit your fixation.

That is funny coming from a Trump hater: and I never see people like you accusing gay rights activists or abortion rights activists of the same thing. So your criticism is biased hypocrisy. And you cannot deny that he is using his wife's injuries to further his agenda.

 

[beefheart]

That is funny coming from a Trump hater: and I never see people like you accusing gay rights activists or abortion rights activists of the same thing. So your criticism is biased hypocrisy. And you cannot deny that he is using his wife's injuries to further his agenda.

Blah blah blah. Nice attempt to swerve to something else.

I vote for Kelly, you can't. :lamo

 

[TurtleDude]

Blah blah blah. Nice attempt to swerve to something else.

I vote for Kelly, you can't. :lamo

But I can give far more money to Republicans than you can give to Democrats. Bloomberg is the main reason why bannerrhoid Dems won in Va-he spent 20 million or so there.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

Not really. High capacity mags facilitate auto fire which is neither available nor efficient in inflicting casualties.

Untrue. High capacity magazines facilitate greater killing capacity in semi automatic weapons, also. Talk to the folks in OH, TX, CA, VA and numerous other locations. They’ll attest to the efficiency of large capacity magazines in wounding/killing large numbers of innocents.

Getting the bad guy while he switches magazines is not really a thing. There's no benefit to high capacity mags in a semiauto ....

Yeah, it really is a thing.

A few examples -
“Once Wennerstrom could tell that the gunman was reloading he and others escaped through a window.”
California bar shooting: Witnesses describe escaping as gunman reloaded - CBS News

“TUCSON, Ariz. Jan. 9, 2011— -- Patricia Maisch looks like a grandmother, but she is being hailed as a hero today for helping to stop alleged Tucson shooter Jared Loughner by wrestling away a fresh magazine of bullets as he tried to reload.
Woman Wrestled Fresh Ammo Clip From Tucson Shooter as He Tried to Reload - ABC News

“A first-year female school teacher was in the lunch room at the time of the incident and attempted to disarm the killer while he was reloading. Her attempts were unsuccessful, but her actions likely prompted the student to shoot himself in the head, ending the attack.”
Seven Learning Points from the Marysville, Washington School Shooting | Active Response Training

 

[beefheart]

But I can give far more money to Republicans than you can give to Democrats. Bloomberg is the main reason why bannerrhoid Dems won in Va-he spent 20 million or so there.

Guess what? I don't give money to any candidate, so your bragging means nothing to me. I don't belong to any party, its quite liberating.

But, the more you post about this, the more interested I am in donating to Kelly.

 

[ecofarm]

Yeah, it really is a thing.

A few examples -
“Once Wennerstrom could tell that the gunman was reloading he and others escaped through a window.”
California bar shooting: Witnesses describe escaping as gunman reloaded - CBS News

They waited?

A reload takes two seconds. One person getting lucky once is not "a thing". More lives have been saved by jams. That's common. Disarming during reload is a lightning strike chance. Why give up the common live saving event (a jam) for the once in a million ninja move?

Extended mags save lives. They're unreliable.

 

[TurtleDude]

Guess what? I don't give money to any candidate, so your bragging means nothing to me. I don't belong to any party, its quite liberating.

But, the more you post about this, the more interested I am in donating to Kelly.

go for it. put your money where your fingers are :mrgreen:

 

[RaleBulgarian]

Dem gun schemes are designed to help criminals-who disobey magazine bans (and gun bans since felons are already prohibited from possessing any firearm)

A completely asinine assertion.

-because criminals usually plan when they rob or attack someone-and harm defending citizens, who rarely have time to grab multiple magazines when their home or shop is invaded by violent felons.

C’mon, TD, we both know that most criminals are idiots who do not construct master plans in advance of robbing a business or burglarizing a home. A shop owner/clerk or homeowner is well defended against bad guys by having a firearm with a magazine capacity of much, much less than 100 rounds.

 

[beefheart]

go for it. put your money where your fingers are :mrgreen:

At this point I'd rather save for an overseas retirement...

 

[TurtleDude]

They waited?

A reload takes two seconds. One person getting lucky once is not "a thing". More lives have been saved by jams. That's common. Disarming during reload is a lightning strike chance. Why give up the common live saving event (a jam) for the once in a million ninja move?

Extended mags save lives. They're unreliable.

people like him ignore or cannot understand that someone who PREMEDITATES mass murder will not obey a magazine law and even if such a law were to actually make all the magazines that hold more than 10 rounds disappear, murderers will be prepared to do NY reloads.

 

[ecofarm]

people like him ignore or cannot understand that someone who PREMEDITATES mass murder will not obey a magazine law and even if such a law were to actually make all the magazines that hold more than 10 rounds disappear, murderers will be prepared to do NY reloads.

I know if we compared lives saved by ninja moves during reload and lives saved by jams, jams wins by factors of power.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

A reload takes two seconds. One person getting lucky once is not "a thing". More lives have been saved by jams. That's common. Disarming during reload is a lightning strike chance.

You’re being disingenuous. In their undoubtedly adrenaline fueled state, a shooter is entirely likely to take longer than two seconds to reload. Those seconds have saved lives, plural. As for jams being a more common occurrence, I don’t disagree. Still, any measure that could prevent a mass killing, or even reduce the number of potential victims is absolutely worthy of consideration.

Why give up the common live saving event (a jam) for the once in a million ninja move?

Extended mags save lives. They're unreliable.

You’d rather allow for a bad guy to have a semi auto rifle w/100 round mag than the same guy with a 15 round mag shooting at you because you figure that improves your odds of survival?!? That’s some crazy reasoning.

 

[ecofarm]

You’re being disingenuous. In their undoubtedly adrenaline fueled state, a shooter is entirely likely to take longer than two seconds to reload. Those seconds have saved lives, plural. As for jams being a more common occurrence, I don’t disagree. Still, any measure that could prevent a mass killing, or even reduce the number of potential victims is absolutely worthy of consideration.


You’d rather allow for a bad guy to have a semi auto rifle w/100 round mag than the same guy with a 15 round mag shooting at you because you figure that improves your odds of survival?!? That’s some crazy reasoning.

We have two choices, and the decision might seem counter-intuitive.

1. Allowed extended mags and the accompanying jams that save a thousand lives per year (for scale).

2. Reduce mag size and thus increase opportunities for reload disarms, saving ten lives per year (for scale).

You wanna save a thousand or ten?

Fwiw, I'd rather face a drum. Draw a little fire and it will jam, which takes much longer to clear than a reload and could effectively render the weapon inoperable. And it's heavy as ****. Good luck aiming it. One can't effectively aim with that much weight. I'll take hip fire over center mass everyday and twice on Sundays.

A drum adds so many problems. Please, let my adversary employ one.

 

[RaleBulgarian]

We have two choices, and the decision might seem counter-intuitive.

1. Allowed extended mags and the accompanying jams that save a thousand lives per year (for scale).

2. Reduce mag size and thus increase opportunities for reload disarms, saving ten lives per year (for scale).

You wanna save a thousand or ten?

Fwiw, I'd rather face a drum. Draw a little fire and it will jam, which takes much longer to clear than a reload and could effectively render the weapon inoperable. And it's heavy as ****. Good luck aiming it. One can't effectively aim with that much weight. I'll take hip fire over center mass everyday and twice on Sundays.

A drum adds so many problems. Please, let my adversary employ one.

Your logic isn’t. You may be willing to take your chances against a bad guy with a large capacity mag, hoping that it’ll jam, not me.

 

[ecofarm]

Your logic isn’t. You may be willing to take your chances against a bad guy with a large capacity mag, hoping that it’ll jam, not me.

It's not only jam. He can't raise the weapon and hold a sight picture. He must fire from the hip.

 

[tres borrachos]

what gun law-if in place-would have stopped the shooter-when he was facing the death penalty for doing what he did? People seem to forget that he KILLED people including a well respected conservative Republican Judge and that was both a state and federal capital crime.

I have no idea what gun law would have stopped him. I don't argue for or against gun laws, which is why you never see me in the gun forum, and why I'm not debating it in this thread which is about how Kelly is overtaking McSally - not gun laws.