Iraqi TV Reports Strike Kills Powerful Iranian Revolutionary Guard Commander

[holbritter]

Oh, sure. NOW our intelligence agencies know what they are talking about. How convenient. I think that, unless Trump got this info from Putin, he would most likely would have ignored it from OUR intelligence agencies.

But then again, it IS election season. Even Trump knows a good ol' war will help his chances to win. He said it himself in 2011. ""@BarackObama will attack Iran in the not too distant future because it will help him win the election," Trump tweeted on Nov. 14, 2011."

He wasn't good at predicting the future, was he!?

 

[Dans La Lune]

Felis I consider you to be a pretty reasonable dude and I have a fair amount of internet respect for you, but do you understand why we went into that deal in the first place?

Felis has trouble with math. He thinks that 10 is less than 0. Iran was 0 years away from a nuclear weapon, after the deal they were 10. They poured cement in their nuclear reactors.

 

[Jredbaron96]

There's obviously a calculation to be made regarding a targeted killing and whether or not the target is worth to be killed.
The US killing Putin is obviously not worth the blowback. Suleimani certainly was.

Are you sure about this? Less than 24 hours have passed.

 

[Jredbaron96]

He was plotting to kill Americans.

So are a lot of people.

Killing him isn't the problem, the repercussions are.

 

[oneworld2]

excuse us for not wanting a nuclear equipped terrorist nation.

You already have them but have been conditioned to see your own state terrorism as " counter terrorism/humanitarian intervention/democracy promotion/anti communism war "............ the brain washing goes something like when they do it ( insert any national enemy state/group ) it is terrorism when we do it it is, because we are always the good guys ,counter terrorism

In fact the rapaciousness of the American empire makes for any nation that wants to tread itsown independent path in the world all the more likely to want to acquire them.

Recall it was the US that scuppered the Iran Nuclear Deal and followed up with economic terrorism in the form of sanctions that have had a devastating effect on the ordinary folk of Iran ( sanctions always do )

 

[holbritter]

So are a lot of people.

Killing him isn't the problem, the repercussions are.

So you just keep letting him do it? That's the solution?

 

[Jredbaron96]

So you just keep letting him do it? That's the solution?

Let me put it like this:

Putin is a bad guy; he is directly responsible for the deaths of thousands of Ukrainians, but Kiev isn't trying to assassinate him, because the consequences are even worse.

 

[oneworld2]

How successful has that been for the US?

You should be asking him what right does the US have to go around the world bombing people into backwardness so it can decide who should rule over them........it's a crime under international law without UN sanction. Not that the UN can be taken all that seriously when it comes to application

 

[Felis Leo]

Felis I consider you to be a pretty reasonable dude and I have a fair amount of internet respect for you, but do you understand why we went into that deal in the first place?

Certainly, Jredbaron96. The reason we entered into the deal is (1) because the Iranians were, by all indicators, close to developing enough fissile material for a nuclear weapon; (2) the Obama Administration was adamantly opposed to any military action against Iran and its nuclear facilities to enforce non-proliferation, to the point that his administration leaked Israeli contingency plans to strike those facilities; and (3) several variegated economic interests (most notably in Europe) were champing at the bit to begin trading with Iran, and thus were backing an accommodation to lift sanctions so they could dive into Iranian markets.

When you undertake to remove all other options for yourself from the table except appeasement and solicitous accommodation, then appeasement and solicitous accommodation are indeed the only avenues forward.

 

[holbritter]

Let me put it like this:

Putin is a bad guy; he is directly responsible for the deaths of thousands of Ukrainians, but Kiev isn't trying to assassinate him, because the consequences are even worse.

That's because they're ******s.

 

[Dans La Lune]

We’re living in an era where The Onion is a reliable news source.

John Bolton: ‘An Attack On Two Saudi Oil Tankers Is An Attack On All Americans’

 

[oneworld2]

Nothing, thats why we should kill them. They only understand brute force. Peace through strength works...inboring terrorists does not.

Nope, you have been told that because it is your own nation that on so many occasions is the one that resorts to brute force in contravention of laws they are , in truly hypocritical fashion , often citing themselves

 

[Evilroddy]

Re: Iraqi TV Reports Strike Kills Powerful Iranian Revolutionary Guard Commander immediately

Thank you for proving once and for all that your hate for the US is the single overwhelming motivation you have. The well being of the citizens of iraq matter not at all to you.
But then this is something I have known about you for quite a while.

Braindrain:

In one week the military of the United States attacked three sovereign states without any legitimate reason. You are legally at war with none of these three states. In case you haven't figured it out yet, in this region at this time, you are the baddies. You are the aggressor state, attacking any and all you choose to with seeming impunity. You are also the domestic enemies of the American people as you continue to squander their lives by the thousands and their treasure (tax revenue) by the trillions in a continuing series of wars of adventure which your people don't need or want. With all due respect (and that's a pretty low threshold IMO), your own militarists are a far greater threat to the real interests of your own citizens and your republic than any of these three states which you have unilaterally attacked since 2003. In my opinion it is the domestic enemies who should be arrested, charged, tried and, if convicted, locked up for decades in places like Guantanemo Bay.

How would the US have reacted if a foreign power's military had assassinated George Patton, Omar Bradley, Dwight D. Eisenhower, Colin Powell or Norman Schwartkopf while they were legally visiting a foreign country? There would have been hell to pay. So what makes you think that you can get away with doing this to others? You can't and there must be hell to pay. Your military should be expelled from Iraq, Syria, and the greater Middle East by legal means and if you refuse to comply legally with such expulsions then you should be driven out by armed insurrection, asymmetrical warfare and terrorism abroad and at home, until your sons and daughters are dead, maimed or broken and your government is bankrupted. You want forever-war with the world, okay, but then the world should bring that forever-war home to you until your leaders learn that such wars have a greater cost than any benefit your elites might derive from them.

Despite the spin and the public relations, you are as bad as those whom you are attacking qualitatively and you are worse quantitatively. You militarists are a growing burden on and lethal threat to your fellow citizens and the health of your republic. You militarists are a cancer which needs to be carefully cut out of the American body politic for the good of the republic and in order to make America a more perfect union. I don't hate America. I love it second only to my own country. I hate you and other militarists like you, who men like James Madison saw lurking just beyond the horizon and who feared would come to militarise America and turn her into an equally grotesque leviathan as the British Empire which they had just fought to free themselves from. You are the enemy of America, not Iran, not Syria, not Iraq, just you and your war-loving ilk.

No cheers for you, you enemy of the republic.
Evilroddy.

 

[oneworld2]

That's because they're ******s.

No because they are rational. It's okay you calling people names from the safety of being out of range yourself :roll:

 

[Jredbaron96]

When you undertake to remove all other options for yourself from table except appeasement and solicitous accommodation, then appeasement and solicitous accommodation is indeed the only acceptable avenue forward.

We did so because despite decades of targeted assassinations and economic sanctions Iran was within a year of producing a nuclear weapon, which would completely destabilize the balance of power and remove a significant trump card the United States and its allies have over Iran. Furthermore, it was the recognition that attempts at isolating Iran had failed, and that the best way to move forward was to avoid the possibility of a conflict with Iran all together. Iran is not like the Arab states, ruled by corrupt and inefficient governments that are more of a threat to themselves than anyone else, it is a capable regime ruled by competent people that cannot be bullied into submission.

 

[AlphaOmega]

So are a lot of people.

Killing him isn't the problem, the repercussions are.

What repercussions? Like 911, like the marathon bombing? People will want to kill us either way. Historically, terrorists only respond to force. If they want to strike back...our next strike will make this one look like a picnic.

 

[Jredbaron96]

That's because they're ******s.

…

No, it's because they're not ****ing morons.

 

[Jredbaron96]

What repercussions?

Probably the bread and butter of Iranian covert ops, targeted killings and bombings, against American civilians and soldiers.

 

[ElChupacabra]

You should be asking him what right does the US have to go around the world bombing people into backwardness so it can decide who should rule over them........it's a crime under international law without UN sanction. Not that the UN can be taken all that seriously when it comes to application

Well, for some "might makes right" is a sound policy. The question for powerful nations is always one of what it costs to maintain the hegemony which allows them to thrive, and of course the blowback from that kind of control. Former colonial powers have to deal with the instability in the regions they once ruled but still rely on economically. For the US, it's the contradiction of being a country which cherishes self determination only for itself and it imposes its choices on others.

 

[holbritter]

No because they are rational. It's okay you calling people names from the safety of being out of range yourself :roll:

It's not rational to continue allowing someone to attack and kill your fellow countrymen.

 

[Vadinho]

I am not sure I understand the grammar of your question, Jredbaron96. This was the equivalent of Operation Anthropoid, and Suleimani Iran's equivalent of Reinhard Heydrich. He was not a diplomat or regular government official or even a member of the regular Iranian military. He was the head an oppressive paramilitary terrorist organization responsible for the deaths of our soldiers. Killing him was one of the best things our government has done.

Targeting people like this only begs retaliation at the same level. We outlawed covert assassinations by the CIA in the 70s. This is no different. Trump is selling it as a defensive move to avoid making it appear like a hit. But to the Iranians, it is a hit on their most senior General. Whether or not he deserved it is immaterial to the risk of having this become the new norm for us and our foes. At this point, Iran can justify killing an American General anywhere in the world using the exact same logic.

 

[Dans La Lune]

Re: Iraqi TV Reports Strike Kills Powerful Iranian Revolutionary Guard Commander immediately

Braindrain:

In one week the military of the United States attacked three sovereign states without any legitimate reason. You are legally at war with none of these three states. In case you haven't figured it out yet, in this region at this time, you are the baddies. You are the aggressor state, attacking any and all you choose to with seeming impunity. You are also the domestic enemies of the American people as you continue to squander their lives by the thousands and their treasure (tax revenue) by the trillions in a continuing series of wars of adventure which your people don't need or want. With all due respect (and that's a pretty low threshold IMO), your own militarists are a far greater threat to the real interests of your own citizens and your republic than any of these three states which you have unilaterally attacked since 2003. In my opinion it is the domestic enemies who should be arrested, charged, tried and, if convicted, locked up for decades in places like Guantanemo Bay.

How would the US have reacted if a foreign power's military had assassinated George Patton, Omar Bradley, Dwight D. Eisenhower, Colin Powell or Norman Schwartkopf while they were legally visiting a foreign country? There would have been hell to pay. So what makes you think that you can get away with doing this to others? You can't and there must be hell to pay. Your military should be expelled from Iraq, Syria, and the greater Middle East by legal means and if you refuse to comply legally with such expulsions then you should be driven out by armed insurrection, asymmetrical warfare and terrorism abroad and at home, until your sons and daughters are dead, maimed or broken and your government is bankrupted. You want forever-war with the world, okay, but then the world should bring that forever-war home to you until your leaders learn that such wars have a greater cost than any benefit your elites might derive from them.

Despite the spin and the public relations, you are as bad as those whom you are attacking qualitatively and you are worse quantitatively. You militarists are a growing burden on and lethal threat to your fellow citizens and the health of your republic. You militarists are a cancer which needs to be carefully cut out of the American body politic for the good of the republic and in order to make America a more perfect union. I don't hate America. I love it second only to my own country. I hate you and other militarists like you, who men like James Madison saw lurking just beyond the horizon and who feared would come to militarise America and turn her into an equally grotesque leviathan as the British Empire which they had just fought to free themselves from. You are the enemy of America, not Iran, not Syria, not Iraq, just you and your war-loving ilk.

No cheers for you, you enemy of the republic.
Evilroddy.

This. Close the thread, we have a winner. I can’t like this post enough.

 

[holbritter]

Probably the bread and butter of Iranian covert ops, targeted killings and bombings, against American civilians and soldiers.

That's exactly what Suleimani was doing and planning to do again! I guess it didn't really matter if we took him out or not, amirite?

 

[Jredbaron96]

That's exactly what Suleimani was doing and planning to do again! I guess it didn't really matter if we took him out or not, amirite?

It absolutely does, for the same reason as shooting down an American drone and killing and American soldier carries different repercussions. There are scales to this thing,

 

[oneworld2]

Seriously, get the **** out of the Middle East. It's not America's playground. America came to Iran's backyard, not the other way around.

Correct but due to the proficiency of the propaganda system not readliy thought of in such a way.

Israel will be glad they are there and will hope they remain there for many decades to come