I want a National Single-Payer Healthcare Plan, Do You?

[cuban smokes]

MY government needs to GTF out of the health insurance debate & allow the free market to do what it used to do, without any GOVERNMENT INTERFERENCE .....

I don't need the GD Dems, nor the GD Reps putting their 2 cents into my health care options, period

f*** them BOTH ..............

 

[Verax]

I wish people would stop saying things like "the government pays for it". The government doesn't pay for anything. It feels like one of those debates where everyone wants to raise minimum wage or pass some regulation and then act like they aren't paying for that.

Yes as in the government takes over the process of paying the healthcare bills. We all chip in, we all get coverage, we all can quit pacing around trying to do mental gymnastics to make healthcare fit our little pet ideology yet not destroy people's lives while being affordable while being fair while satisfying Joe the Principled Conservatives 10 most important things he thinks about what it means to be an American and be free.

 

[Quag]

Single payer is dog vomit.

Look at Canada.

You want the best care and lower costs... have health care treated like any business. Or do you think the government would be great at developing computers, cell phones and the like?

I don't understand why people want government, which fails at almost everything (none of the cost predictions for these government schemes/programs have ever come close to predictions), involved with their healthcare.

That 20 Trillion in debt and 65 TRILLION of unfunded liabilities... brought to you by arrogant government morons who obviously didn't know squat. Their "programs" have harmed the nation, and you want to have the state do more???

Facepalm.

Insanity is doing the same BS over and over and expecting a different result.

When will people learn?

Yes look at Canada, a way better system.
Its a no brainer if you have to choose between the US or Canadian systems. The Canadian system isn't perfect but when copared to the total cluster duck the US system is its darn tooting close.
The one advantage the USA has is that it can do as the OP suggested and look at the best practices of other Western single payer plans, while addressing and correcting the ills of such plans is the best medicine for the people of the United States.

 

[Henrin]

Yes as in the government takes over the process of paying the healthcare bills. We all chip in, we all get coverage, we all can quit pacing around trying to do mental gymnastics to make healthcare fit our little pet ideology yet not destroy people's lives while being affordable while being fair while satisfying Joe the Principled Conservatives 10 most important things he thinks about what it means to be an American and be free.

So I have to agree with your ideology to rule over my life because people can't afford a service? No.

And being free means I get to keep my ****, which means my income. You know, my property and the fruits of my labor. It means, that you pay for what you need on your own and leave me the hell alone about it.

 

[Fenton]

Single payer ? No thanks. ObamaCare was bad enough and showed just how much damage the Federal Govt can do in just a short amount of time when given the chance.

It was unprecedented Govt interfernece into our economy and healthcare system and even when it was obvious it was leading to huge cost increases and deductibles and a loss of choice for the American consumer the Democratic party still chose to sing its praises.

The same would happen of we ever went to Single payer. No matter how bad it got, how unsustainable or its how bad its ultimate effects on patients care and rights it would always be hailed as a great achievment, as " progress ". It would actually be the opposite

The consumer/patient would have zero recourse against a huge Federal bueracracy and issues like lack of care, long wait times, even malpractice would ignored

 

[ALiberalModerate]

You mean people agreeing to buy a service that involves polls for payments.

Well, before it was a mandated service anyway.

Just the same, it works by you paying for other people's healthcare.

 

[shrubnose]

I know. You realize I'm against both of those programs, right?



I don't want to pay more for everyone else.



You do realize the money would just come from taxes, right?



I never said a word about that. It honestly doesn't even matter to me how good or bad it is as

I just don't want it.

If you live long enough you'll see it in the USA eventually.

Wait and see.

 

[Verax]

So I have to agree with your ideology to rule over my life because people can't afford a service. No.

Well sorry dude, the whole libertarian thing never happened so I don't know what you think is going to come out of all of this. I don't think clinging to your ideal world that is never ever going to happen is of any value.

 

[Henrin]

Just the same, it works by you paying for other people's healthcare.

Actually it doesn't really work at all. It might work better though if people weren't trying to use for everything. The system was never designed to cover all the things the government mandated it cover.

 

[Vox]

What evidence do you have that is true?

I ask because I have universal health care. I have never paid more in taxes in Canada than I would have in the US. Our governments are actually smaller than yours.

Where do you get these ideas?

You do know that you can afford it because we provide the military might to keep you safe, right?

In fact, America subsidizes all the "free" health care, welfare and free education for those "civilized" countries by providing security for them so they can spend almost nothing on defense needs.

You're welcome.

 

[Henrin]

Well sorry dude, the whole libertarian thing never happened so I don't know what you think is going to come out of all of this. I don't think clinging to your ideal world that is never ever going to happen is of any value.

I'll hold onto my beliefs and continue to work to eliminate yours from the system. Take your ****ty ideology, it's welfare, it's regulation of everything, it's endless expansion, and high taxes to Europe where it belongs.

 

[Fenton]

Yes look at Canada, a way better system.
Its a no brainer if you have to choose between the US or Canadian systems. The Canadian system isn't perfect but when copared to the total cluster duck the US system is its darn tooting close.
The one advantage the USA has is that it can do as the OP suggested and look at the best practices of other Western single payer plans, while addressing and correcting the ills of such plans is the best medicine for the people of the United States.

According to who ? Wait times are up overall 88 percent since 1993 and hope you dont need nerosurgery.

According to the Frazier Survey the average wait time is 47 weeks. Orthapedic surgery is 38 weeks.

https://www.fraserinstitute.org/studies/waiting-your-turn-wait-times-for-health-care-in-canada-2016

 

[Fishking]

No? Liberals have been raising the costs of healthcare ever since they failed to get what they wanted with FDR. Do you think it's just by shear accident that we are talking about a solution they wanted all long because of high healthcare costs?

How have liberals been increasing the costs of the private healthcare market?

 

[TurtleDude]

If he doesn't want to pay for anyone else's healthcare, I don't think he understand's how insurance works.

insurance is based on your risk, not your ability to pay

 

[EMNofSeattle]

You do know that you can afford it because we provide the military might to keep you safe, right?

In fact, America subsidizes all the "free" health care, welfare and free education for those "civilized" countries by providing security for them so they can spend almost nothing on defense needs.

You're welcome.

I don't think Canada has any enemies with the realistic capability to project power against the Canadian mainland

 

[Verax]

I'll hold onto my beliefs and continue to work to eliminate yours from the system. Take your ****ty ideology, it's welfare, it's regulation of everything, it's endless expansion, and high taxes to Europe where it belongs.

Good luck with that. Let me know when libertarians gain any seats in congress or are anything other than a very, very small minority of Americans. If you guys were reasonable and advocated something other than absolute libertarian purism you might get some where but every time you guys make any inroads you get rebuked and dismissed because you demand 100% adherence to your ideology.

 

[Vox]

I don't think Canada has any enemies with the realistic capability to project power against the Canadian mainland

LOL!

America sees to that.

 

[Henrin]

Good luck with that. Let me know when libertarians gain any seats in congress or are anything other than a very, very small minority of Americans. If you guys were reasonable and advocated something other than absolute libertarian purism you might get some where but every time you guys make any inroads you get rebuked and dismissed because you demand 100% adherence to your ideology.

You mean like how liberals advocate for pure modern liberal philosophy? lol Tell me, who's ideology supports single payer again? Oh right, liberal ideology. Funny how that works.

 

[JayDubya]

TFW you realize what a leftwing cesspool you're in.

 

[Lutherf]

Lemme think about this for a minute....

Obamacare knocked my insurance options down to one plan that's more than twice as expensive as what I had with a higher deductible and a higher max out of pocket. Granted, that was a trade off because I'm now covered for prenatal and child birth services which were not part of my coverage before.

The VA is a fine example of how government handles single payer health care. It's so clogged up with drunks and druggies that people who actually might benefit from medical care can't get in. Then again, if you don't have to pay for your medical care then why not be a drunk or a druggie?

Here's the part that REALLY scares me. The folks that will run this system are the same ones that ended up getting us a Hillary v Trump general election.

 

[Verax]

You mean like how liberals advocate for pure modern liberal philosophy? lol Tell me, who's ideology supports single payer again? Oh right, liberal ideology. Funny how that works.

"Modern liberals" haven't exclusively supported universal healthcare ever. Obamacare is a hybrid, what was before that is a hybrid. I don't know what world you are in but it isn't this one.

 

[Henrin]

"Modern liberals" haven't exclusively supported universal healthcare ever. Obamacare is a hybrid, what was before that is a hybrid. I don't know what world you are in but it isn't this one.

They have supported it since well before either of us were born. Why is it that liberals never have to compromise their beliefs but everyone else does?

 

[Harshaw]

Three weeks ago I was amid tests for a high heart rate, when I dropped a knife on my foot. I could not stem the bleeding so called 911. They were there in under five, and within two minutes of arriving determined I had atrial fibrillation and five minutes later I was in emerge being attended to. I was released into my MD's care with $18 worth of meds I had to pay for but will be reimbursed and home in time for dinner.

I have never paid more in taxes than I would in the US, and once while considering a job in Seattle determined that after paying insurance I was actually less better off.

There are no death squads.
No one dies while waiting for care.
What you have heard is 95% lies

You've said twice that you've never paid more in taxes than you would have in the US.

Prove this. Show all of your math.

If you can't, it's you who are spreading lies.

Go.

 

[Harshaw]

Good luck with that. Let me know when libertarians gain any seats in congress or are anything other than a very, very small minority of Americans. If you guys were reasonable and advocated something other than absolute libertarian purism you might get some where but every time you guys make any inroads you get rebuked and dismissed because you demand 100% adherence to your ideology.

^^^^

Says a socialist.

 

[Verax]

They have supported it since well before either of us were born. Why is it that liberals never have to compromise their beliefs but everyone else does?

I'm not going to argue insane things with you. If you think liberals only support single payer forever and have always refused to compromise about it then good for you. :thumbs: