Deficits are exploding – and neither party seems to care

[LibDave]

Deficits are exploding – and neither party seems to care | Fox News



It has been obvious to me that it’s going to be a mess trying to bring down the debt. The best place to start is to shut down some government agencies. The only other way is to inflate our way out if it. Other than that, gutting entitlements is the last resort to save the USA.

FYI:
U.S. National Debt Clock : Real Time

There is one teeny, tiny, bright spot. The trade deficit with China is falling. That is about all.

"Inflate our way out of it." This is a nonsensical statement and indicates a lack of understanding of Basic Economics. You cannot inflate your way out of the debt.

 

[Kushinator]

You cannot inflate your way out of the debt.

You can, but only insofar as the inflation rate is higher than the yield on total debt. This can happen after a period of low interest rates and mounting debt, as an overwhelming majority of debt is locked in at cheaper rates. Future inflation surges will necessarily inflate away a significant portion of debt given the right conditions.

 

[Conservative]

If you want people to ignore your lies, hypocrisy, and partisan double standards... why even post? That's all you have to offer.





I haven't lied about Trump. Nothing you can quote from me is a lie regarding Trump. You can't and you wont.





The results generated are inconsistently judged based on who is in power and absolutely nothing else.





Nothing you've predicted has come to pass. You even wrote Trump off in the Presidential race prior to the end of election night.





Only in your mind.

My lies?? You have yet to name one regarding the data I post, my opinions of you may be called a lie but that doesn't make it a lie, that is my opinion

 

[Conservative]

If you want people to ignore your lies, hypocrisy, and partisan double standards... why even post? That's all you have to offer.





I haven't lied about Trump. Nothing you can quote from me is a lie regarding Trump. You can't and you wont.





The results generated are inconsistently judged based on who is in power and absolutely nothing else.





Nothing you've predicted has come to pass. You even wrote Trump off in the Presidential race prior to the end of election night.





Only in your mind.

So tell me is anything that you disagree with automatically a lie? I post the official data and add context which of course you want to ignore, context. Claiming that I lie without proof is what the left does, not someone who claims to be an independent. If you want to call me a liar, prove it! Giving Obama credit for Trump's results is revisionist history and total ignorance of what drives the private sector. Giving Obama credit for bringing us out of recession is also revisionist history and ignores the calendar and recovery.org

The so called upward trajectory of the economy ignores the downward trajectory of GDP dollar growth and the high number of part time for economic reasons, 1.6% GDP growth, and the reported worst recovery from a recession in modern history. Obama inherited a Democratic Congress, NO budget, TARP, and had his stimulus passed almost day one yet NOT one year did he exceed 3% GDP growth whereas Reagan who inherited a worse recession has many exceeding 3% and although the 3% isn't truly a target it does indicate the failure of Obama's policies coming off what you call the worst recession since the Great Depression

So the reality remains, we are a private sector economy that is booming now, not because of Obama but because the private sector isn't being punished by punitive taxes and regulations with a pro growth President.

If you want to offer an alternative to Trump, an alternative economic policy different than Trump I anxiously await that information doubting it will ever come. Neither Party seems to care about the deficit but that doesn't change the fact that Trump submitted a budget with actual cuts and has pissed off both sides of the establishment. I voted for Trump and will do so again as the alternative to me is a lot, lot worse.

 

[LibDave]

You can, but only insofar as the inflation rate is higher than the yield on total debt. This can happen after a period of low interest rates and mounting debt, as an overwhelming majority of debt is locked in at cheaper rates. Future inflation surges will necessarily inflate away a significant portion of debt given the right conditions.

An overwhelming majority of debt is not locked in at cheaper rates. Beginning with W Bush long term bonds began to be replaced with shorter term bonds to save money. Obama continued this trend on steroids (out of necessity) as the yields on long term bonds became more problematic due to the sharp rise in Debt:GDP ratio. Most of the debt is short term now so any attempt to inflate the debt away would only result in a dramatic rise in rates making the problem worse. Investors in bonds aren't stupid. As the Debt:GDP ratio rises they are more and more reluctant to invest in long term bonds due to that risk. There is no such thing as a free lunch. What the government borrows the markets insure it is repaid in equal value plus interest. It has been some time since I looked, but I'm sure Trump hasn't changed the situation much.

 

[Conservative]

Who cares? That's not the debate.

The question here is: Why do you want tax poor people FIT... when by taxing them.. and taking away their earned money.. they have to go on welfare or expand their welfare benefits? Especially when doing so.. makes the rest of us have to pay MORE in FIT.

Please explain your logic.. which causes everyone to have to pay more in taxes.. and expands welfare.

Here's the problem with you revenue argument, first of all, FIT funds the line items in the budget and FIT revenue and Corporate taxes are enough to fund the FIT line items but not the current debt service and Entitlement growth, entitlement shortfall created by bureaucrats "borrowing" from the trust fund for decades then only paying current liabilities but never paying back the "borrowed liabilities" Now you want the top 1% to have their taxes increased to fund that shortfall while allowing 44% of income earners not to pay anything claiming t would hurt them too much and force them into welfare programs where many of them reside now. The federal gov't has never let revenue get in the way of social engineering and increasing the deficit as spending has never been a problem. Now all of a sudden it is a problem and the way out is taxing the rich more? That is Bull****, get the 44% that aren't paying something in FIT to get some skin in the game and they would stop supporting massive gov't spending since it now is going to cost them something.

 

[Kushinator]

My lies?? You have yet to name one regarding the data I post

You constantly cite gross interest expense as the line item for the budget, even after it has been proven time after time to be false. Your response: "tell the Treasury their data is wrong."

my opinions of you may be called a lie but that doesn't make it a lie, that is my opinion

Your opinions of me are irrelevant.

 

[Kushinator]

So tell me is anything that you disagree with automatically a lie?

Another example of dishonesty. Can you provide a link to anytime in our exchanges where i attribute disagreement as a lie? You won't because you can't....

I post the official data and add context which of course you want to ignore, context.

This is another instance of dishonesty.

Claiming that I lie without proof

The interest expense was 523 MILLION billion dollars, that is reality and a fact JACK according to Treasury, you have a problem with it, I gave you the contact information

This is a lie.

The so called upward trajectory of the economy ignores the downward trajectory of GDP dollar growth and the high number of part time for economic reasons, 1.6% GDP growth, and the reported worst recovery from a recession in modern history. Obama inherited a Democratic Congress, NO budget, TARP, and had his stimulus passed almost day one yet NOT one year did he exceed 3% GDP growth whereas Reagan who inherited a worse recession has many exceeding 3% and although the 3% isn't truly a target it does indicate the failure of Obama's policies coming off what you call the worst recession since the Great Depression

WTF are you even talking about? Nobody is discussing the Obama economy. You want to turn every single thread into an Obama/Democrat bash-fest.

we are a private sector economy that is booming now

It's such a booming economy that the fiscal deficit continues to mount, and government revenue continues to come in lower than both spending and GDP growth. These are the results, and you give Trump a pass when you chastised the Obama administration under the guise of cherry picked nominal growth (after your prediction of 3%rGDP growth never materialized).

:lol:

 

[Conservative]

Another example of dishonesty. Can you provide a link to anytime in our exchanges where i attribute disagreement as a lie? You won't because you can't....



This is another instance of dishonesty.





This is a lie.


WTF are you even talking about? Nobody is discussing the Obama economy. You want to turn every single thread into an Obama/Democrat bash-fest.



It's such a booming economy that the fiscal deficit continues to mount, and government revenue continues to come in lower than both spending and GDP growth. These are the results, and you give Trump a pass when you chastised the Obama administration under the guise of cherry picked nominal growth (after your prediction of 3%rGDP growth never materialized).

:lol:

My so called lies are backed by official links which you want to ignore. What is it about liberalism that creates your kind of loyalty? You ever admit that you are wrong on any subject? Did FIT fund the discretionary budget submitted by Trump and create a surplus?

Government - Interest Expense on the Debt Outstanding

 

[Kushinator]

My so called lies are backed by official links which you want to ignore. What is it about liberalism that creates your kind of loyalty? You ever admit that you are wrong on any subject? Did FIT fund the discretionary budget submitted by Trump and create a surplus?

Government - Interest Expense on the Debt Outstanding

Again, learn the data you cite:

 

[Conservative]

Again, learn the data you cite:

You called me a liar the data posted comes from Treasury call them the liar

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[Conservative]

Again, learn the data you cite:

I never knew that CBO Data Trumps Treasury data, when did that happen? Do we pay debt service on CBO or Treasury Data? AS for the deficit has Federal Income Taxes and Corporate taxes been enough to pay for the line items FIT was supposed to pay for? Seems that when refuted you ignore the question.

 

[Conservative]

Who cares? That's not the debate.

The question here is: Why do you want tax poor people FIT... when by taxing them.. and taking away their earned money.. they have to go on welfare or expand their welfare benefits? Especially when doing so.. makes the rest of us have to pay MORE in FIT.

Please explain your logic.. which causes everyone to have to pay more in taxes.. and expands welfare.

Maybe all people need to learn out to prioritize their spending and focus on what they need vs. what they want. You seem to always focus on your perception of the poor as you judge them by your own standards ignoring their own financial situation and profit demand. costs a lot less to live in TX or more Red states than blue states so adopting federal guidelines for poverty ignores the reality of cost of living in states as well. Do you believe you know the financial demands of the poor that would prevent them from paying SOMETHING in FIT? Expanding welfare is going to happen regardless of the taxes collected as some people never learned personal responsibility.

 

[Kushinator]

You called me a liar

You've been educated on the subject more times than is necessary to retain such knowledge. There simply isn't any excuse for such blatant disregard for facts.

the data posted comes from Treasury call them the liar

The data doesn't say what you think it does nor do you represent the Treasury.

 

[Kushinator]

I never knew that CBO Data Trumps Treasury data, when did that happen? Do we pay debt service on CBO or Treasury Data?

Ingest is paid on debt, not CBO vs. Treasury data. Your point is so ridiculous it doesn't warrant wanting other than ridicule.

It should be noted the PDF comes directly from the White House budget data.

There is no excuse for this level of ignorance.

AS for the deficit has Federal Income Taxes and Corporate taxes been enough to pay for the line items FIT was supposed to pay for? Seems that when refuted you ignore the question.

Your opinions carry no value.

 

[Conservative]

Ingest is paid on debt, not CBO vs. Treasury data. Your point is so ridiculous it doesn't warrant wanting other than ridicule.

It should be noted the PDF comes directly from the White House budget data.

There is no excuse for this level of ignorance.



Your opinions carry no value.

i got the information from Treasury, tell them their data is wrong

 

[Kushinator]

i got the information from Treasury, tell them their data is wrong

You're claiming this data applies to the budget... it doesn't. It is the type of blanket dishonesty we've come to expect.

 

[Conservative]

You're claiming this data applies to the budget... it doesn't. It is the type of blanket dishonesty we've come to expect.

You are making the claim that deficits are exploding and ignoring that FIT revenue and corporate revenue are more than enough to pay the expenses they were created to pay for. The interest expense on the debt as reported by Treasury and rising interest rates and entitlement spending is causing and that is what the bureaucrats aren't willing to address.

 

[Kushinator]

You are making the claim that deficits are exploding

I am making the claim that deficit growth has presided over what you refer to as the greatest two economic years to begin a Presidential term. That you and the conservative base have abandoned your sentiments regarding the severity of deficits and debt accumulation is a sign of sheer hypocrisy. In order to stave off a most embarrassing election defeat, the GOP has continued to push the same policies it revolted against just a few years ago. Crisis mode.

ignoring that FIT revenue and corporate revenue are more than enough to pay the expenses they were created to pay for.

Your opinion of expenses and receipts is of no value on it's own.

The interest expense on the debt as reported by Treasury and rising interest rates and entitlement spending is causing and that is what the bureaucrats aren't willing to address.

Why are you unwilling to admit such a blatant error?

 

[Conservative]

I am making the claim that deficit growth has presided over what you refer to as the greatest two economic years to begin a Presidential term. That you and the conservative base have abandoned your sentiments regarding the severity of deficits and debt accumulation is a sign of sheer hypocrisy. In order to stave off a most embarrassing election defeat, the GOP has continued to push the same policies it revolted against just a few years ago. Crisis mode.



Your opinion of expenses and receipts is of no value on it's own.



Why are you unwilling to admit such a blatant error?

No error Trump discretionary spending didn't cause the deficit but that reality escapes you

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[Kushinator]

No error

It's come to the point where you are now blatantly lying. You give an exagerated figure to deflect from the GOP's (which Trump is it's leader) fiscal record.

Trump discretionary spending didn't cause the deficit but that reality escapes you

When did i claim Trump discretionary spending caused the deficit? Never. Try addressing what you quote.

Fact:

The interest expense was 523 MILLION billion dollars, that is reality and a fact JACK according to Treasury, you have a problem with it, I gave you the contact information

is a lie. You are well aware of the truth but still choose to operate from a different reality. Your posting history is a testament to dishonesty.

 

[Conservative]

It's come to the point where you are now blatantly lying. You give an exagerated figure to deflect from the GOP's (which Trump is it's leader) fiscal record.



When did i claim Trump discretionary spending caused the deficit? Never. Try addressing what you quote.

Fact: is a lie. You are well aware of the truth but still choose to operate from a different reality. Your posting history is a testament to dishonesty.

No reason to continue this discussion with you. I posted Treasury data sorry it doesn't support your rhetoric as apparently they lie

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[Kushinator]

No reason to continue this discussion with you.

I expect nothing less.

I posted Treasury data sorry it doesn't support your rhetoric as apparently they lie

You posted the incorrect Treasury data, and instead of accepting your error, you double down. And we all know why you'd do such a thing. You're so desperate to deflect from the Trump record, you've resorted to (continually) posting a lie.

 

[Conservative]

You continue to divert from the thread topic and ignore actual results as if the amount of debt matters as the debt service still is the reason for the deficit growth and is the 4th largest budget item.

Like it or not FICA funds SS and Medicare which along with debt service created the deficit in 2018 yet you blame Trump showing intellectual dishonesty

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[Conservative]

I am making the claim that deficit growth has presided over what you refer to as the greatest two economic years to begin a Presidential term. That you and the conservative base have abandoned your sentiments regarding the severity of deficits and debt accumulation is a sign of sheer hypocrisy. In order to stave off a most embarrassing election defeat, the GOP has continued to push the same policies it revolted against just a few years ago. Crisis mode.



Your opinion of expenses and receipts is of no value on it's own.



Why are you unwilling to admit such a blatant error?

Why are you calling for FIT increases to pay for SS, Medicare abuses by Bureaucrats? FICA funds both and raising FIT doesn't solve SS and Medicare problems but does let bureaucrats off the hook

Claims the deficits are exploding ignores why and has nothing to do with FIT cuts

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