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Cops Shoot Up A Minivan Full Of Kids & Crazy Mom. New Mexico

Ikari said:
So hyperbole and ad hom is all you got then.
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You need to look up the definition of ad hom. I did not address you. Accusing someone of ad homs is baiting/flaming. You're not a mod and shouldn't pretend you are. Feel free to report my posts, but spare me your sub-par analysis of statements.

I suppose if your goal is dishonest argument, mission accomplished.
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Says the guy who falsely portrays the incident in effort to demonize cops.
 
Jerry said:
Van, not car, and it wasn't shot up as it wasn't even hit.
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If you aren't going to take language seriously then there is nothing to talk about as you have already given up...

If I'm running from the police then I'm in a different state of mind then I am right now, so of course I would feel differently. Stupid question.
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Or a stupid interpretation of a valid question...
 
CRUE CAB said:
From what I saw and have heard, the officer didn't run a foul of dept policy.
So it looks like the law is on their side.
I am sure you would love to see all police officers hanged, but its the scumbags that are the problem. Not the police.
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The cop was fired "Friday, following an internal investigation and a disciplinary hearing", so obviously they do not agree with you.
 
Excon said:
The cop was fired "Friday, following an internal investigation and a disciplinary hearing", so obviously they do not agree with you.
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Of course he was and I said he very well may, thats the nature of the biz. Damned if you do, damned if you dont.
 
CRUE CAB said:
Of course he was ...
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?
Of course he was? That flies in the face of everything you said in support of his actions.
You advocated it was a good shoot, yet his dismissal says otherwise.
Showing that your arguments where nothing but emotional tripe.
 
Excon said:
?
Of course he was? That flies in the face of everything you said in support of his actions.
You advocated it was a good shoot, yet his dismissal says otherwise.
Showing that your arguments where nothing but emotional tripe.
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Obviously it was bad shooting since he missed.
 
Excon said:
?
Of course he was? That flies in the face of everything you said in support of his actions.
You advocated it was a good shoot, yet his dismissal says otherwise.
Showing that your arguments where nothing but emotional tripe.
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Public "outcry" wins the day. I also said that. Now that he has been fired, she will more than likely walk from all charges.
Never mind that she started it all, endangered her kids, endangered LE, endangered others on the road.
We also don't know this officers previous personel record.
I an most right thinking adults have no issue with what he did, but the cop haters of the world have to be placated.
 
CRUE CAB said:
Public "outcry" wins the day. I also said that. Now that he has been fired, she will more than likely walk from all charges. Never mind that she started it all, endangered her kids, endangered LE, endangered others on the road. We also don't know this officers previous personel record. I an most right thinking adults have no issue with what he did, but the cop haters of the world have to be placated.
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I have helped train 100's of LEO, Reserve and full time. I am not a 'cop hater'. The rules for the use of deadly force are very simple. That threshold was not met when the Officer drew and fired at a minivan full of kids. Nothing the women did warranted the use of deadly force.

IF the Officer can keep his Commission and just lost his job he can sign on to another cop shop. (That happens a lot more than you might want to believe)

There comes a pivot point in the "she started it all, endangering LE, kids and others" justification and the actions taken to stop the suspect. Shooting at the minivan has little if any real 'shot' at stopping the fleeing woman, a great deal of chance in hurting/killing the children, and only ramped up the fear and flight response.

I'm sure at one point or another in this Officer's training he was taught that. He wasn't charged with reckless endangerment, assault or anything so he should be thankful it was just a job and not his Commission and or freedom.
 
CRUE CAB said:
Public "outcry" wins the day. I also said that. Now that he has been fired, she will more than likely walk from all charges.
Never mind that she started it all, endangered her kids, endangered LE, endangered others on the road.
We also don't know this officers previous personel record.
I an most right thinking adults have no issue with what he did, but the cop haters of the world have to be placated.
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Him being fired has nothing to do with whether she should be prosecuted.
Most THINKING adults don't agree with you.
 
joko104 said:
Him being fired has nothing to do with whether she should be prosecuted.
Most THINKING adults don't agree with you.
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His actions at the scene will be taken into consideration. Money says charges will be dropped to at least all misdemeanors. She will sue, win big and LE will find themselves strapped further in doing their job.
 
CRUE CAB said:
His actions at the scene will be taken into consideration. Money says charges will be dropped to at least all misdemeanors. She will sue, win big and LE will find themselves strapped further in doing their job.
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Possibly dropped to misdemeanors, maybe not, and likely would not win if she sued since there was no injury. I think the charges against the son will be dropped, but also think they should be dropped. A lot of teenage boys would be more defensive of their mother than you apparently would.
 
CRUE CAB said:
His actions at the scene will be taken into consideration. Money says charges will be dropped to at least all misdemeanors. She will sue, win big and LE will find themselves strapped further in doing their job.
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Awwww.....you mean government is restricted in their actions and can't just do whatever they want whenever they want to? Poor government.
 
CRUE CAB said:
Public "outcry" wins the day. I also said that. Now that he has been fired, she will more than likely walk from all charges.
Never mind that she started it all, endangered her kids, endangered LE, endangered others on the road.
We also don't know this officers previous personel record.
I an most right thinking adults have no issue with what he did, but the cop haters of the world have to be placated.
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He should be charged with reckless endangerment too. And any other charge any citizen would get for shooting at a van full of kids.
 
Ikari said:
Awwww.....you mean government is restricted in their actions and can't just do whatever they want whenever they want to? Poor government.
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No, I mean a criminal will go free because of a situation she caused.
 
CRUE CAB said:
Whaaa whaaaa.
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Just saying. Cops are not above the law, but they think they are. When they break the law, they should be held to AT LEAST the same levels of punishment as the average citizen. More is warranted since they are government, and government abuse must be swiftly and severely punished.

That is, if one's goal is a free Republic and not fascist 1984
 
CRUE CAB said:
No, I mean a criminal will go free because of a situation she caused.
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Our system errs on the side of the Citizen and restricts the actions of government. Get over it.
 
CRUE CAB said:
New Mexico Officer Fired in Van Shooting to Appeal - ABC News
Seems he has plenty of supporters and is appealing. It guess not "everyone" as you suggest is fine with this.
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He got a lawyer....I thought you hated those guys.

Well he's free to appeal of course, but it doesn't matter if everyone is fine or not with it. Government is restricted in its actions. Police cannot just start shooting at vans full of kids. I mean, obviously they can because that's why we're here, but we need to make sure they don't.
 
CRUE CAB said:
Public "outcry" wins the day. I also said that.
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Which matters not to your claims.
You advocated it was a good shoot, yet his dismissal says otherwise.
And you continue to support his actions even though they are wrong.



CRUE CAB said:
I an most right thinking adults have no issue with what he did, but the cop haters of the world have to be placated.
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Wrong on both counts.
Some do think like you, but their thinking is not right, just as yours is not.
If any type of right, it is an ideologically extreme right, which makes it wrong as well.


And he can appeal all he wants.
He was still wrong.

From your link.
Gov. Susana Martinez said Monday she supported the decision by New Mexico State Police Chief Pete Kassetas to fire Montoya.

"You don't use deadly force against someone who is not threatening you with deadly force," said Martinez, a former district attorney whose husband is a retired law enforcement officer.​
 
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