Benghazi Lies and The 2012 Presidential Election Cycle[W:185]

[Grant]

Of course Libyan security forces were involved in the defense of the consulate, but never mind.... :roll:

The Libyan Government forces! Where were they? If there is no government there who is accepting the Obama aid?

 

[Somerville]

The Libyan Government forces! Where were they? If there is no government there who is accepting the Obama aid?

Nope - not "Libyan Government forces!" but semi-guerilla units that had formed to fight Qaddafi and have remained united in the turmoil that is Libya today. The US has been supporting some of the more reliable ones - and helping the government in Tripoli.

 

[j-mac]

Of course Libyan security forces were involved in the defense of the consulate, but never mind.... :roll:

Never mind? Oh no Adam, you don't get off that easy....I assume that you hear the same news as the rest of us no?

The U.S. mission in Benghazi, at an "emergency meeting" less than a month before the Sept. 11 attack, drafted a contingency plan to suspend operations as security deteriorated -- and in the near-term, recommended that consulate operations be moved to the CIA annex about a mile away, according to a classified cable reviewed by Fox News.

The State Department's senior representative at the consulate told those at the Aug. 15 meeting that the security situation was "trending negatively" and reported "this daily pattern of violence would be the 'new normal' for the foreseeable future, particularly given the minimal capabilities" of the Libyan security forces.

With no apparent reason to believe conditions would improve, the cable notified the office of Secretary of State Hillary Clinton that the "Emergency Action Committee" was updating "Post's tripwires in light of the deteriorating security situation ... to include a 'suspension of operations' section."

The term "tripwire" refers to lines in the sand which, if crossed, cover personnel levels, security measures, and in this case, the extreme step of suspending operations.

The cable marked "SECRET" also said, of the possibility of moving the consulate operations: "Mission personnel could co-locate to the Annex (CIA outpost) if the security environment degraded suddenly. ... (There was agreement) to formal weekly meetings to discuss the security environment. ... In the longer term, we believe formal collocation with the (Annex) will greatly improve our security situation."

The warnings reflected a grave concern among officials on the ground that the Libyan militia charged with protecting the consulate had been compromised, perhaps even infiltrated by extremists.


Read more: Exclusive: Classified cable shows Benghazi consulate considered suspending operations, moving in with CIA | Fox News

So then one must conclude that you make your statement as an intentional attempt to misdirect, and shill for Obama here....I know you are far smarter than this dude....

So the security situation was bad, getting worse, they held an emergency security meeting that they at the time requested that they move the consulate in with the CIA annex, and were obviously told no. Why? I'll tell you. Because the administration wanted the appearance that things were 'normalized' in Libya. And why would they want that? Well, because they wanted the narrative on the campaign trail that AQ was decimated, and OBL dead.

This is disgusting to me. We have in office right now (Hopefully for only 3 more days) that places his own political narrative over the lives of Americans in a dangerous zone of the world, and will outright lie to keep it so. He want's to get on the trail and speak of trust? Is he kidding? He TURNED HIS BACK on fellow Americans in their time of need, then LIED to our faces about it. Now his surrogates want us to believe that we somehow don't have advanced technology to see through smoke, or in the dark, or that we don't have the units at the ready designed exactly for this type of situation, and train constantly to go into the unknown to rescue Americans? What do we live in the 50's?

Trust?

I wouldn't trust this guy to be dog catcher at this point.

 

[sharon]

The Libyan Government forces! Where were they? If there is no government there who is accepting the Obama aid?

They went in with the first response team.

 

[j-mac]

Nope - not "Libyan Government forces!" but semi-guerilla units that had formed to fight Qaddafi and have remained united in the turmoil that is Libya today. The US has been supporting some of the more reliable ones - and helping the government in Tripoli.

So then the question then turns to a couple of other points.

a. You say we were supporting 'some of the more reliable ones' leading me to believe that you accept the assessment that the 17th Feb Brig. had been infiltrated by our enemies, maybe not the whole brigade, but enough that IMHO as ex military in the 101st that you couldn't trust that they could do the job required. So, why not grant the pleas, and that is what they were pleading for additional security?

Which brings me to

b. Charlene Lamb testified that they were pursuing an appearance of "normalization" on the ground, as if people aren't smart enough to look out their windows and see that PU trucks are tooling around with heavy weapons and flying the AQ flag on a regular basis. So that message wasn't designed for those people in Libya, it was targeted at an electoral base here in the US so that Obama, and Biden could get out on the stump and lie in the election to the people as to the effectiveness of their "lead from behind" doctrine. Face it, it is a LIE! Obama is not more respected around the world, in fact I would say, he is played.

 

[j-mac]

They went in with the first response team.

And melted away soon there after.

The new account of CIA actions, for example, shows that the agency's security officers did not appear to have the heavy weapons they needed to repel the attack, and it shows how deeply the U.S. was relying on Libyan security forces that melted away.

U.S. officials counter criticism in Benghazi attack - Los Angeles Times

Which then takes you once again back to that August emergency meeting that this President didn't do squat to ensure that these brave people had the security they needed.

It was negligent at best, probably closer to criminal.

 

[sharon]

And melted away soon there after.



Which then takes you once again back to that August emergency meeting that this President didn't do squat to ensure that these brave people had the security they needed.

It was negligent at best, probably closer to criminal.

Nope.. they went back to the annex.

Later they helped escort the survivors to the airport.

Excerpt on Lazers....

The military is preparing a timeline from the night of the Benghazi attack and plans to outline what assets were available to commanders in the region, including AFRICOM commander General Carter Ham, who was visiting Washington, DC on September 11 and was in the Pentagon overseeing the operation that night.

Pentagon spokesman George Little says, “On the night of the attack on American personnel and facilities in Benghazi, there were no armed unmanned aerial vehicles over Libya, and there were no AC-130s anywhere close.”

On Thursday, the CIA excluded Fox News from a briefing for a small group of reporters in which they provided a timeline from the night of the attack in which they explain that at 5:15 a.m. (7 hrs and 28 minutes after the attack on the consulate began) five mortars are fired at the annex, three of them striking the roof and killing Woods and Doherty.

The CIA told the Washington Post’s David Ignatius that “the rooftop defenders never ‘laser the mortars’ as has been reported,” a reference to an earlier Fox News report. The CIA added the “defenders have focused their laser sights earlier on several Libyan attackers, as warnings not to fire.”


Read more: What laser capability did Benghazi team have? | Fox News

 

[j-mac]

Nope.. they went back to the annex.

Later they helped escort the survivors to the airport.

Who did? the Libyan's? You'll need a link for this because everything points to them just as the article says, "melting away".... I think you are conflating the actions of Woods and the CIA from the annex after they were ordered twice not to aid, going above and beyond. NOT the Libyan's.

Excerpt on Lazers....

The military is preparing a timeline from the night of the Benghazi attack and plans to outline what assets were available to commanders in the region, including AFRICOM commander General Carter Ham, who was visiting Washington, DC on September 11 and was in the Pentagon overseeing the operation that night.

Great! So we are going to get a CYA document two months after these people were sacrificed for Obama's campaign hopes....Tell me why Gen Ham resigned?

Pentagon spokesman George Little says, “On the night of the attack on American personnel and facilities in Benghazi, there were no armed unmanned aerial vehicles over Libya, and there were no AC-130s anywhere close.”

We know that is a lie. Assets were moved to the Italian island an hour plus away including not one, but 2 c130 specters.....This battle went on for 8 hours....They could have been deployed.

On Thursday, the CIA excluded Fox News from a briefing for a small group of reporters in which they provided a timeline from the night of the attack...

Yeah, and critically thinking, why is that? Fox has been on the forefront in getting to the bottom of this story, while the rest carry the water for the criminal n chief, in covering up this tragedy.

...from the night of the attack in which they explain that at 5:15 a.m. (7 hrs and 28 minutes after the attack on the consulate began) five mortars are fired at the annex, three of them striking the roof and killing Woods and Doherty.

Great, so you'll take the word of the very people that have been lying through their teeth since this happened. But why were mortars fired at the roof? Ever ask yourself that Sharon? The common tactic to gain entry into a compound like the annex wouldn't be to attack the roof of a building, it would be to attack the gates, and walls, and compound itself. It would be the absolute damned dumbest move in the world to, if you were the aggressors to attack positions that you weren't sure defenders were. Even the most elementary trained ground pounder knows this.

The CIA told the Washington Post’s David Ignatius that “the rooftop defenders never ‘laser the mortars’ as has been reported,” a reference to an earlier Fox News report. The CIA added the “defenders have focused their laser sights earlier on several Libyan attackers, as warnings not to fire.”


Read more: What laser capability did Benghazi team have? | Fox News

Well, regardless of David Ignatius says, who is he? Why should I care what his opinion is? Anyway, it certainly looks as if your willing, like so many to just believe what the Obama machine feeds you without question. If you really think that trained SEALs would use laser designators, something which I have already explained in detail why, and how they are used to you, to "scare" proposed attackers, then you don't understand the basics of tactical warfare. This is bull ****!

 

[Somerville]

This quote is totally absurd

two months after these people were sacrificed for Obama's campaign hopes....

How anyone can make such a statement and not see the total absurdity of it is just another fine example of "We HATE Obama" and anything we think is relevant (no matter what the rest of the world thinks) we will use - and when one argument is destroyed by reality, we'll just move on to another.

 

[johnny_rebson]

Libs are now claiming that the ambassador was working with the CIA.

http://www.debatepolitics.com/break...dmits-role-u-s-consolute-attack-benghazi.html

 

[sharon]

The attackers melted away.. Don't you know the difference?

I m tired of posting dozens of links repeatedly. Believe what you want.. and if you think that our military or CIA or Obama were out to do harm.. then screw you.

 

[j-mac]

This quote is totally absurd




How anyone can make such a statement and not see the total absurdity of it is just another fine example of "We HATE Obama" and anything we think is relevant (no matter what the rest of the world thinks) we will use - and when one argument is destroyed by reality, we'll just move on to another.

Feign all the fake outrage you'd like, it matters not one iota to me...The facts are the facts, and the picture they are painting are not boding well for your hero, the criminal.

 

[j-mac]

The attackers melted away.. Don't you know the difference?

I m tired of posting dozens of links repeatedly. Believe what you want.. and if you think that our military or CIA or Obama were out to do harm.. then screw you.

With all due respect sharon, you are exhibiting a real reading comprehension problem here. Let me post it again for you....

it shows how deeply the U.S. was relying on Libyan security forces that melted away.

U.S. officials counter criticism in Benghazi attack - Los Angeles Times

then you tried to come in here and say that they went to the annex to help, and were rebuffed in that, now you shift again to saying that the enemy melted away...This is laughable sharon, you are flailing around searching for a plausible niche to exonerate this President for turning his back on Americans and leaving them to die in order to maintain a campaign meme, it is real sad.

 

[Fisher]

Libyan security forces versus the US military is like a mall rent-a-cop with a flashlight versus a SWAT team. Who would you rather having protecting your loved ones?

 

[haymarket]

We cannot let this thread die.

You have to respect this father. He is telling it like it is.

http://www.thegatewaypundit.com/201...etter-to-die-a-hero-than-live-a-coward-video/

While the right here can keep a thread alive as there are so many of them and they tend to dominate things here, forcing this issue as a cause celebre down the throats of the American people is a different kettle of fish altogether.

When will the right realize that what obsesses them in the current faux scandal of the month means previous little to Americans not worshipping before the same altar and gods as they do?

 

[Misterveritis]

Of course Libyan security forces were involved in the defense of the consulate, but never mind.... :roll:

Really? How did that work out Adam? Where were they?

How did the attackers reach the building on the consulate grounds in minutes if Libyan forces were there defending?

 

[Misterveritis]

Never mind? Oh no Adam, you don't get off that easy....I assume that you hear the same news as the rest of us no?



So then one must conclude that you make your statement as an intentional attempt to misdirect, and shill for Obama here....I know you are far smarter than this dude....

So the security situation was bad, getting worse, they held an emergency security meeting that they at the time requested that they move the consulate in with the CIA annex, and were obviously told no. Why? I'll tell you. Because the administration wanted the appearance that things were 'normalized' in Libya. And why would they want that? Well, because they wanted the narrative on the campaign trail that AQ was decimated, and OBL dead.

This is disgusting to me. We have in office right now (Hopefully for only 3 more days) that places his own political narrative over the lives of Americans in a dangerous zone of the world, and will outright lie to keep it so. He want's to get on the trail and speak of trust? Is he kidding? He TURNED HIS BACK on fellow Americans in their time of need, then LIED to our faces about it. Now his surrogates want us to believe that we somehow don't have advanced technology to see through smoke, or in the dark, or that we don't have the units at the ready designed exactly for this type of situation, and train constantly to go into the unknown to rescue Americans? What do we live in the 50's?

Trust?

I wouldn't trust this guy to be dog catcher at this point.

The president knows that he begins with his 47%, the takers, the4 federal government workers and many in public sector unions. What do a few dead Americans matter to him? They are just bumps in the road...

 

[j-mac]

The president knows that he begins with his 47%, the takers, the4 federal government workers and many in public sector unions. What do a few dead Americans matter to him? They are just bumps in the road...

I remember having a conversation during the Bush administration, in the wake of 9/11 that the liberal I was talking to about preemptive security, and so called torture. It was a long conversation on a different board that no longer exists, so I'll just suffice to say that even in the event that such security measures would save the life of say this posters daughter, he was against it. IOW, he would let his daughter die, and go after the perps of the attack AFTER the attack, rather than waterboard someone with the intel to thwart the attack, and spare his daughters life.

This is the mindset I think we see in this Benghazi affair....they don't consider intel, just want to investigate after the fact, when in fact it could have been a different outcome if they would have listened preemptively. Now, knowing that they screwed up, they cover it up, and lie. But we should 'trust' them.....

 

[Misterveritis]

I remember having a conversation during the Bush administration, in the wake of 9/11 that the liberal I was talking to about preemptive security, and so called torture. It was a long conversation on a different board that no longer exists, so I'll just suffice to say that even in the event that such security measures would save the life of say this posters daughter, he was against it. IOW, he would let his daughter die, and go after the perps of the attack AFTER the attack, rather than waterboard someone with the intel to thwart the attack, and spare his daughters life.

This is the mindset I think we see in this Benghazi affair....they don't consider intel, just want to investigate after the fact, when in fact it could have been a different outcome if they would have listened preemptively. Now, knowing that they screwed up, they cover it up, and lie. But we should 'trust' them.....

President Obama and his media are successfully running out the clock.

I am eager to vote for Romney on Tuesday. And then I am eager to see the results of a full investigation beginning in the half-year before Islamist radicals attacked the consulate in Benghazi and going right up to today.

Bin Laden is dead. Al Qaeda is very much alive.

 

[j-mac]

President Obama and his media are successfully running out the clock.

I am eager to vote for Romney on Tuesday. And then I am eager to see the results of a full investigation beginning in the half-year before Islamist radicals attacked the consulate in Benghazi and going right up to today.

Bin Laden is dead. Al Qaeda is very much alive.

Tru dat....And Iraq is festering once again....We'll be back within 10 years.

 

[Grant]

Tru dat....And Iraq is festering once again....We'll be back within 10 years.

And Afghanistan as well, if there is the will or the strength.

Obama seems to believe that the killing of Osama bin ladin meant the end of terrorism in the world but rather it is remindful of the Treaty of Versailles, where the Allies thought there was peace but it was obviously not accepted by both parties.

The power of the fundamentalist Muslims will continue to increase , encouraged by Obama's early and incredibly foolish speech in Cairo, and the pressures from these groups will continue to grow within the democracies as well. More laws will be passed making any criticism of islam or islamists illegal.

We must keep in mind that this is a president who tries to avoids the term 'terrorist' unless it's used to deflect from the truth. Americans, much like before WWII, must now, as in written in the preamble to the Constitution, invoke "the favor and guidance of Almighty God".

 

[johnny_rebson]

Tru dat....And Iraq is festering once again....We'll be back within 10 years.

Which is why we need the Romney/Ryan team in the White House. We need strong Republican leadership who will have American troops in Iraq.

 

[upsideguy]

Ahhh, from your little perch there in Toronto you 'actually know' what goes on. So tell me when was the last time you were in the middle east? Last time I was in Canada, it felt like Kentucky in the 1950s. Certainly not a place where one 'actually knew' very much first hand.

Interesting that an American would call out a Canadian for lack of understanding of the world. I have travelled quite a bit internationally during my business career, usually to Europe and Canada. I can tell you the average college educated European and Canadian has a superior understanding to world affairs and cultures than that of Americans. Most Americans never leave the country, except maybe to go to Canada or, if they are really adventurous, Mexico or a Caribbean island.

Only 30 Percent of Americans Have Passports: Why It Matters - New York - News - Runnin' Scared
How many Americans own passports? (Phil Gyford’s website)

 

[Maenad]

Interesting that an American would call out a Canadian for lack of understanding of the world. I have travelled quite a bit internationally during my business career, usually to Europe and Canada. I can tell you the average college educated European and Canadian has a superior understanding to world affairs and cultures than that of Americans. Most Americans never leave the country, except maybe to go to Canada or, if they are really adventurous, Mexico or a Caribbean island.

Only 30 Percent of Americans Have Passports: Why It Matters - New York - News - Runnin' Scared
How many Americans own passports? (Phil Gyford’s website)

Well given that there's nothing in Canada, one can hardly blame you for getting out!

But beyond that those statistics are really stupid. One can travel far more miles visiting each state in the US, which would be considered domestic travel, than Europeans would travel visiting othe countries, and consider that 'international' travel. You all have your silly little statistics, but really, they just don't hold water.

 

[johnny_rebson]

Interesting that an American would call out a Canadian for lack of understanding of the world. I have travelled quite a bit internationally during my business career, usually to Europe and Canada. I can tell you the average college educated European and Canadian has a superior understanding to world affairs and cultures than that of Americans. Most Americans never leave the country, except maybe to go to Canada or, if they are really adventurous, Mexico or a Caribbean island.

Only 30 Percent of Americans Have Passports: Why It Matters - New York - News - Runnin' Scared
How many Americans own passports? (Phil Gyford’s website)

You Canadians still don't realize that cowboy diplomacy is the best policy.