AntiFa and Freedom of Speech from the Horse's Mouth

[jet57]

I invite you to read the first hand account in the attacked link.

A Beating in Berkeley | The Weekly Standard

That's just a fight, it's not a system of anarchy. Black Bloc's time is short.

 

[jet57]

I have no idea what you're trying to say there.

 

[Common Sense 1]

Looks like Antifi's law breaking days are numbered!


After Bay Area violence, California debates classifying 'antifa' as a street gang

After Bay Area violence, California debates classifying 'antifa' as a street gang - LA Times

Not long after dozens of black-hooded protesters were filmed pummeling people on his city’s streets, Berkeley Mayor Jesse Arreguin made clear his disgust for the self-stylized vigilantes.

“Antifa,” he said, is no different than a street gang, and police should start treating protesters in the anti-fascist movement accordingly.

Later that day, legislators in Sacramento advanced resolutions that would treat violent acts committed by antifa movement’s enemies — white nationalists and neo-Nazis — as terrorist acts under state law.


They behave like a gang. They have defined commitment to violence. They have their own gang dress. — Wes McBride, president of the California Gang Investigators’ Assn.

 

[bubbabgone]

I have no idea what you're trying to say there.

You said ...

Where is there anarchy going on?

And even screwballs like Bill Nye had to laugh when he read that because he assumed you were unaware of multiple instances of Antifa anarchic activity for quite a while now.

Over a year ago DHS "CLASSIFIED THEIR ACTIVITIES AS “DOMESTIC TERRORIST VIOLENCE,” "
Since well before the Aug. 12 rally in Charlottesville, Virginia, turned deadly, DHS has been issuing warnings about the growing likelihood of lethal violence between the left-wing anarchists and right-wing white supremacist and nationalist groups.
Previously unreported documents disclose that by April 2016, authorities believed that “anarchist extremists” were the primary instigators of violence at public rallies against a range of targets.
...
FBI, Homeland Security warn of more ‘antifa’ attacks - POLITICO

 

[jet57]

You said ...



And even screwballs like Bill Nye had to laugh when he read that because he assumed you were unaware of multiple instances of Antifa anarchic activity for quite a while now.

It's "activity", not a system of any sort of anarchy. So that's where my denial of it is going.

 

[ocean515]

That's just a fight, it's not a system of anarchy. Black Bloc's time is short.

And here I actually thought you might read what was presented in the link.

 

[jet57]

And here I actually thought you might read what was presented in the link.

I did; it's about Joey ad his patriots and Tiny, and Berkeley and cancellations in SF: there's not one word in that article that even comes close to saying that Anarchy is going on anywhere inn the US.

So my claim still stands: there is no anarchy in the US.

 

[bubbabgone]

It's "activity", not a system of any sort of anarchy. So that's where my denial of it is going.

Read the link. The DHS disagreed with your denial over a year ago. Still do given there's been a lot more since then.
If you have your own definition of anarchy that's different than anyone else's, that's not a very good foundation for that denial.

 

[graeme104]

there is no anarchy in the US.

So you don't think the crazy white supremacist violence or the insane anti-fa riots are anarchy?

 

[jet57]

Read the link. The DHS disagreed with your denial over a year ago. Still do given there's been a lot more since then.
If you have your own definition of anarchy that's different than anyone else's, that's not a very good foundation for that denial.

I read the article; there is nothing in it that even suggests that anarchy is a going thing anywhere in this country. Antifa / Black Bloc are a definitely a threat to peace and security, as are the racist groups, but that all they are.

 

[jet57]

So you don't think the crazy white supremacist violence or the insane anti-fa riots are anarchy?

No they are not anarchy; they are silly hate groups causing violence.

 

[bubbabgone]

I read the article; there is nothing in it that even suggests that anarchy is a going thing anywhere in this country. Antifa / Black Bloc are a definitely a threat to peace and security, as are the racist groups, but that all they are.

The article calls them "anarchist" 13 times.
Why did you think they did that and how could you explain that it meant something else?

 

[jet57]

The article calls them "anarchist" 13 times.
Why did you think they did that and how could you explain that it meant something else?

(chuckle)

:roll:


They call themselves anarchists too, that however by no means even indicates that there is anarchy at work in the US.

 

[ocean515]

I did; it's about Joey ad his patriots and Tiny, and Berkeley and cancellations in SF: there's not one word in that article that even comes close to saying that Anarchy is going on anywhere inn the US.

So my claim still stands: there is no anarchy in the US.

So fill me in on how the police acted. What did they do when the people Pelosi and Feinstein encouraged started beating on people? What did any other government officials to?

Obviously you've invented your own definitions, so I can see that's going to make it a bit difficult to discuss this.

No problemo.

 

[bubbabgone]

(chuckle)

:roll:


They call themselves anarchists too, that however by no means even indicates that there is anarchy at work in the US.

Yes ... yes it does.

an·ar·chy
[ˈanərkē]
NOUN
a state of disorder due to absence or nonrecognition of authority:
"he must ensure public order in a country threatened with anarchy"
synonyms: lawlessness · nihilism · mobocracy · revolution · insurrection · disorder · chaos · mayhem · tumult · turmoil​

Now ... you tell me why anarchy isn't indicated.

 

[bubbabgone]

So fill me in on how the police acted. What did they do when the people Pelosi and Feinstein encouraged started beating on people? What did any other government officials to?

Obviously you've invented your own definitions, so I can see that's going to make it a bit difficult to discuss this.

No problemo.

Ordinarily I would have jettisoned this character by now but I want to see how he gets out of this.
I mean, once he backed himself into a corner this badly all he's left with is ...

and redefining words.

 

[Ikari]

I dont like it but its free speech and should be allowed. Scratch that.. MUST be allowed.

Oh I agree, and their exercise of that right should not be infringed upon so long as they do not infringe upon the rights of others in the process. But I won't give much weight to what they say so long as their tactics revolve around violence and political intimidation. Plus, I do believe from the article that was posted, their position is that something like the right to free speech doesn't actually exist. So it's even counter to my own political ideology which emphasizes the rights and liberties of the individual.

 

[Ikari]

Fascism used extermination as a technique, so what's your point? The question is "why" does antifa resort to violence?

Like many people who resort to violence. They don't have the numbers to aggregate any actual change within the system, they are largely ignored by mainstream and the People on whole, and they believe they have some righteous cause that must be heard despite the fact no one actually gives a **** about them.

So violence is the "look at me! look at me!" acts of attention getting. But they will no more elicit any change through this violence than they were going to do previously. They don't have the numbers to make a difference and the People on the whole are going to see these acts of violence and be turned off of any message they may have. The machine they fight isn't going to be so easily put off by a few gnats.

This isn't Fight Club, they aren't going to stick it to the man by causing property damage and using violence and political intimidation.

 

[bubbabgone]

Like many people who resort to violence. They don't have the numbers to aggregate any actual change within the system, they are largely ignored by mainstream and the People on whole, and they believe they have some righteous cause that must be heard despite the fact no one actually gives a **** about them.

So violence is the "look at me! look at me!" acts of attention getting. But

they will no more elicit any change through this violence than they were going to do previously.

They don't have the numbers to make a difference and the People on the whole are going to see these acts of violence and be turned off of any message they may have. The machine they fight isn't going to be so easily put off by a few gnats.

This isn't Fight Club, they aren't going to stick it to the man by causing property damage and using violence and political intimidation.

Oh I don't know about that.
They've defeated the 1st Amendment at colleges.

 

[jet57]

Yes ... yes it does.

an·ar·chy
[ˈanərkē]
NOUN
a state of disorder due to absence or nonrecognition of authority:
"he must ensure public order in a country threatened with anarchy"
synonyms: lawlessness · nihilism · mobocracy · revolution · insurrection · disorder · chaos · mayhem · tumult · turmoil​

Now ... you tell me why anarchy isn't indicated.

Show me where any sort of system of anarchy is at work in the US.

 

[jet57]

So fill me in on how the police acted. What did they do when the people Pelosi and Feinstein encouraged started beating on people? What did any other government officials to?

Obviously you've invented your own definitions, so I can see that's going to make it a bit difficult to discuss this.

No problemo.

So anarchy IS NOT going on in the US; you agree.

Good, 'cause it's not happening.

Home land security has labeled Antifa and Black Bloc a terror group, and I'm all for that.

What one idiot politician after another says, I have no interest in either.

As for the cops, that was there call; they didn't want to engage that first night in Berkeley, and they are going with limited engagement now, because they don't want to rush the crowds and cause a bigger riot, but rather handle violent incidences one a ta time. That seems smart to me.

 

[jet57]

Like many people who resort to violence. They don't have the numbers to aggregate any actual change within the system, they are largely ignored by mainstream and the People on whole, and they believe they have some righteous cause that must be heard despite the fact no one actually gives a **** about them.

So violence is the "look at me! look at me!" acts of attention getting. But they will no more elicit any change through this violence than they were going to do previously. They don't have the numbers to make a difference and the People on the whole are going to see these acts of violence and be turned off of any message they may have. The machine they fight isn't going to be so easily put off by a few gnats.

This isn't Fight Club, they aren't going to stick it to the man by causing property damage and using violence and political intimidation.

I can't disagree with you.

 

[Bodi]

With all the discussion around AntiFa and their opposition to "Freedom of Speech", I figured it might be fun to post what AntiFa is saying. This is from their website, which I checked out thanks to one of our Right leaning friends here at DP.

https://itsgoingdown.org/liberal-myth-free-speech/

Now, before this turns into a giant "**** YOU, NATE!!!", I will lead out by saying that I am not specifically condoning, endorsing, or defending anything herein, this was merely to provide context for those interested in knowing where AntiFa stands, so as to avoid talking out one's ass about things they don't really totally know about.

That said, the author makes some pretty damn good points, and it would be interesting to see it debated, if we can avoid this turning into 50 pages of "AntiFa sucks, **** you!!" "No, Nazis suck, **** you!!" "No, the Left sucks, **** you!!" "No, the Right sucks, **** you!!".

I read... saw this, " those who believe in the lie of free speech".. and stopped reading.

The guy is a moron. But free to speak moronically about what they believe.

 

[Bodi]

That's bizarre... I literally checked out the link a few minutes ago. Now when I google "It's going down", the link to the site now circles back to a google search for "It's going down"... Wow...wonder what happened there. Can you get to itsgoingdown.org?

It works for me...

 

[OlNate]

I read... saw this, " those who believe in the lie of free speech".. and stopped reading.

The guy is a moron. But free to speak moronically about what they believe.

Well, up to you...though I would say that the person who wrote this does develop that notion in a way that makes sense throughout the article...but I didn't post this because I agree with everything, merely to put up some info from the group that everyone is so salty about. I tend to like to understand the world around me...I'm a Christian, but I'm interested in what other religions have to say, for example. This was just in the name of knowing, that's all.

It works for me...

Ya, I think the site went wonky for a few minutes immediately after I posted it, it's been good since.