Military May Relax Recruiting Standards for Fitness and Pot Use

[Gathomas88]

The military may relax recruiting standards for fitness and pot use

Defense Secretary Ash Carter has launched a sweeping review of the military's recruiting standards, saying current rules for screening new entrants may be “overly restrictive” and preventing America's most talented young people from joining the ranks.

Among the benchmarks that will get new scrutiny: fitness standards, marijuana use, tattoo regulations and the military’s longtime reluctance to allow single parents to start military careers.

Grrrreeeaaaattt... Women in the infantry, and the rest of our ranks filled out with fat pot heads. Brilliant!

They're just not going to be happy until the entire force is a bad joke, will they? :roll:

Incidentally, anyone on the "they won't lower standards" bandwagon can go ahead and eat their hats now.

 

[ttwtt78640]

It takes a special kind of force to fight wars for multiple decades to achieve a draw.

 

[Henrin]

I think its safe to say that Carter already made the military a joke with prior loosing of the rules. All this does is further enforce what he has already started during his tenure.

 

[cpwill]

There are some solid goods that can come out of this.

1. The tat restrictions are idiotic.
2. The weight standards are similarly idiotic - I had a Marine who was a competition body builder. Girl had a resting 6-pack. The Marine Corps told her she was "obese". :roll: Physical standards should be capability based, not how-thick-is-your-neck-and-how-tall-are-you based.

 

[Gathomas88]

There are some solid goods that can come out of this.

1. The tat restrictions are idiotic.
2. The weight standards are similarly idiotic - I had a Marine who was a competition body builder. Girl had a resting 6-pack. The Marine Corps told her she was "obese". :roll: Physical standards should be capability based, not how-thick-is-your-neck-and-how-tall-are-you based.

Agreed on the tattoo restrictions, and I can even see easing up on pot a little bit, so long as the person isn't actively engaging in it.

However, with regard to weight, this strikes me as being an excuse to get fat kids into basic training more than anything else.

Incidentally, does the USMC not use tape for precision BMI measurements? Even if a person is "obese" on paper, it's generally not an issue with the Army if they can still pass their PT test, and the tale-of-tape is that their body fat percentage is within acceptable limits.

 

[cpwill]

Agreed on the tattoo restrictions, and I can even see easing up on pot a little bit, so long as the person isn't actively engaging in it.

However, with regard to weight, this strikes me as being an excuse to get fat kids into basic training more than anything else.

Incidentally, does the USMC not use tape for precision BMI measurements? Even if a person is "obese" on paper, it's generally not an issue with the Army if they can still pass their PT test, and the tale-of-tape is that their body fat percentage is within acceptable limits.

They use tape. It's an amazingly stupid system that will tell you that the act of running three miles causes you to gain 2% body-fat, but that's what they chose.

If a person is "obese" in the Marine Corps, regardless of PFT, they were out. Though they are trying to shift that now, with the new standards (which include more crunches and pull ups for max.)

Sent from my XT1526 using Tapatalk

 

[Casper]

The military may relax recruiting standards for fitness and pot use



Grrrreeeaaaattt... Women in the infantry, and the rest of our ranks filled out with fat pot heads. Brilliant!

They're just not going to be happy until the entire force is a bad joke, will they? :roll:

Incidentally, anyone on the "they won't lower standards" bandwagon can go ahead and eat their hats now.

Ummm, I did not see anything about women in the infantry. The Army has a way of dealing with obesity and pot use has always been and always will be common among late teen and twenty something young men an women, in or out of uniform. Just saying........

 

[Hawkeye10]

I am not a fan of Carter at all. His big idea is to end or massively cut back on the practice of "up or out", he says because "hey, we can still use these guys" which is not the point at all. The point for those who need reminding is to have the most effective military and I say the dog eat dog competition for the right to do a 20-30 year career is critical to making sure that we have the best people. I do not want substandard people sticking around because a job that they are capable of doing can be found.

A controversial proposal that aims to end the military's "up-or-out" rules for officer promotions remains a source of debate and disagreement among the Pentagon’s top leaders.

The proposal to reform the federal laws that regulate officer careers was central to Defense Secretary Ash Carter’s slate of personnel reforms — he called it "Force of the Future" — outlined last year. But the military’s top four-star officers balked and the matter remains under review.

“It is still in the deliberative process. Let me just say it’s been a fulsome debate,” Deputy Defense Secretary Robert Work told Military Times in a recent interview.

up-or-out-military-promotions-joint-chiefs-of-staff-disagreement-pentagon-ash-carter

 

[apdst]

They use tape. It's an amazingly stupid system that will tell you that the act of running three miles causes you to gain 2% body-fat, but that's what they chose.

If a person is "obese" in the Marine Corps, regardless of PFT, they were out. Though they are trying to shift that now, with the new standards (which include more crunches and pull ups for max.)

Sent from my XT1526 using Tapatalk

I hated that stupid ****. I saw some damn good soldiers get chaptered out because they were, "overweight". This one dude scored a 280 on a bad day, but because the, "fat boy system", said he was overweight, he got a pink slip.

 

[apdst]

Ummm, I did not see anything about women in the infantry. The Army has a way of dealing with obesity and pot use has always been and always will be common among late teen and twenty something young men an women, in or out of uniform. Just saying........

Drug use among those in uniform is less than those out of uniform.

 

[Casper]

Drug use among those in uniform is less than those out of uniform.

Only slightly.

 

[Hawkeye10]

I hated that stupid ****. I saw some damn good soldiers get chaptered out because they were, "overweight". This one dude scored a 280 on a bad day, but because the, "fat boy system", said he was overweight, he got a pink slip.

After decades of bad buying choices and systems, and as well years of budget cutting and Obama, the military is highly stressed and judging by the tale of how Iran got hostages and 1000 other stories that are out there it is performing poorly. I get the idea that if Ash Carter were running a failing McD's he would be going on and and about the need to repaint the parking lot. THe military must have a 100 problems that are more acute than the promotion system.

But this is what he picks as his signature initiative.

 

[Brewdog]

I think every infantryman dreams of the day when he can spend his time in a small dirt hole with a women on her period. That's going to smell great and do wonders for his attitude!

 

[Skeptic Bob]

I'm in general ok with this. The military can certainly forbid its members from using pot but with all the places it is legal now previous, even recent, use shouldn't ban someone from enlisting. The tattoo rule is stupid.

Physical requirements is complicated. When I was in, and I THINK still now, fitness requirements was based on sex and age. That is ridiculous to me. It should be based on job specialty and, perhaps, rank.

A dental hygienist in the Army doesn't need to be as strong as a combat soldier. A Command Sergeant Major or General officer, regardless of age, isn't going to be engaging in the same amount of manual labor that a Private or Lieutenant will.

We recognized these things long ago when it came to intellectual aptitude. Some jobs in the military require higher intellectual aptitude scores than others. The same should be true for physical ability.

 

[apdst]

Only slightly.

Link?

 

[Casper]

Link?

Go look for one if you feel the need, my opinion is based on my real life experience and that of those I know that have also served and still are serving.

 

[Thoreau72]

It takes a special kind of force to fight wars for multiple decades to achieve a draw.

Good humor, but also a comment on the illegitimacy of our recent "engagements". War brought under fraud deserve to be lost, or tied. The only winners are war profiteers.

 

[VanceMack]

Agreed on the tattoo restrictions, and I can even see easing up on pot a little bit, so long as the person isn't actively engaging in it.

However, with regard to weight, this strikes me as being an excuse to get fat kids into basic training more than anything else.

Incidentally, does the USMC not use tape for precision BMI measurements? Even if a person is "obese" on paper, it's generally not an issue with the Army if they can still pass their PT test, and the tale-of-tape is that their body fat percentage is within acceptable limits.

As long as they arent easing fitness standards, weight really shouldnt matter. I joined the military at 235. I played college football as an outside linebacker. I benched 350 and could throw up 225 10x. My 40 time was pretty pedestrian at 5.4 but I could run 5 miles easy. I was told going in I was fine due to BMI, but sure enough...I had to be down below 211 to get out of basic. Throughout my career in the Air Force it was always the skinny cuties that looked like the AF Poster boys that won AotQ boards but it was always guys like me that were deploying, loading jets, doing the job. Weight is a lousy metric when it comes to fitness.

 

[Brewdog]

Weight is a lousy metric when it comes to fitness.

It seems the army agrees. Because they have a lot of fatties.

 

[VanceMack]

There are some solid goods that can come out of this.

1. The tat restrictions are idiotic.
2. The weight standards are similarly idiotic - I had a Marine who was a competition body builder. Girl had a resting 6-pack. The Marine Corps told her she was "obese". :roll: Physical standards should be capability based, not how-thick-is-your-neck-and-how-tall-are-you based.

When they started cracking down on tats I laughed. 'Tattoos do not present a professional military image." Really? In what world is that true? I grew up around old navy chiefs. Who DIDNT have a tattoo? Combat Soldiers...I mean...thats like a standard-Skulls and dagger tattoos and inserting "**** you" at least 4 times into every spoken paragraph.

 

[VanceMack]

It seems the army agrees. Because they have a lot of fatties.

Can those fatties carry a ruck? Can they do the job? Can they carry a wounded buddy to safety?

Can you think of anything that matters more than that?

 

[Brewdog]

Can those fatties carry a ruck? Can they do the job? Can they carry a wounded buddy to safety?

Can you think of anything that matters more than that?

Looking like a professional warrior instead of like a huge lardass? I see army all day around here and they look like sh1t. They're not carrying an alice pack and deuce gear. They're sitting at a desk and eating buffets every day. It's despicable.

 

[VanceMack]

Looking like a professional warrior instead of like a huge lardass? I see army all day around here and they look like sh1t. They're not carrying an alice pack and deuce gear. They're sitting at a desk and eating buffets every day. It's despicable.

I think we are having a disconnect here. I asked if they are fit. If they arent fit, then their weight is relevant...but only relevant because they arent fit.

This was one of our pilots in the 92nd.



He used to get **** all the time because of his weight. But he was a good pilot. He also went on to win 3 Super Bowl rings.

Weight is irrelevant and a lousy metric when it comes to fitness. If you are wounded who do you want running up to drag your ass to safety...a 240 pound badass or a 163 pound cutie that looks 'professional' but needs help lifting their wallet?

 

[soot]

...and the rest of our ranks filled out with fat pot heads. Brilliant!

I know you're being rhetorical but it should probably be said that there's no necessary correlation between a guy being a pot head and him being fat.

Further, I don't think there's any necessary correlation between a guy being a pot head and his value as a Soldier (or a member of any of the lesser services).

As an Infantry SPC in Germany in the early 1990s I smoked plenty of hash with all kinds of guys, many were PT studs, Expert riflemen, and Distinguished Bradly crew members.

One went Green to Gold and recently retired as an MI LTC, another is still serving as a CW4 in Korea, and another medically retired (due to wounds sustained in combat in Mosul) several years ago as a 1SG with a Silver Star.

Now, of course none of them are still smoking pot (though they drink like fish) but they did back in the day and they've been solid guys all along.

Personally I averaged a regular 280 PFT score and broke 300 a couple of times, shot Expert regularly, was a member of three Distinguished Bradley crews as both a driver and gunner, earned my EIB, and generally performed pretty well in every respect, except I'd get high every once in a while.

The way I see it, if drugs are a problems then they're a problem, just like when alcohol is a problems its a problem.

The fact that a guy hits a joint shouldn't be a career killer, much less a bar to enlistment.

 

[apdst]

Go look for one if you feel the need, my opinion is based on my real life experience and that of those I know that have also served and still are serving.

I knew you didn't know what you were talking about.