Will Donald Trump Destroy the Presidency?

[JacksinPA]

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazin...l-donald-trump-destroy-the-presidency/537921/

Donald trump is testing the institution of the presidency unlike any of his 43 predecessors. We have never had a president so ill-informed about the nature of his office, so openly mendacious, so self-destructive, or so brazen in his abusive attacks on the courts, the press, Congress (including members of his own party), and even senior officials within his own administration. Trump is a Frankenstein’s monster of past presidents’ worst attributes: Andrew Jackson’s rage; Millard Fillmore’s bigotry; James Buchanan’s incompetence and spite; Theodore Roosevelt’s self-aggrandizement; Richard Nixon’s paranoia, insecurity, and indifference to law; and Bill Clinton’s lack of self-control and reflexive dishonesty.
===================================================
I am curious as to where this country will be 2020 & hopeful at the same time.

 

[Xelor]

Will Donald Trump Destroy the Presidency?

I cannot predict the future. I doubt he thinks he will and I suspect he doesn't actually want to do so. I suspect too that left in the Presidency for a second term, yes, it'll be "destroyed" vis-a-vis what it's supposed to be and what he makes it become. He'll do so because whereas all POTUSes to some degree attempt to draw unto the Presidency more power and authority, unlike others in recent history, Trump is extremely covetous of power, unprincipled, vengeful, and principally authoritarian in deploying power.

 

[cuban smokes]

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazin...l-donald-trump-destroy-the-presidency/537921/

Donald trump is testing the institution of the presidency unlike any of his 43 predecessors. We have never had a president so ill-informed about the nature of his office, so openly mendacious, so self-destructive, or so brazen in his abusive attacks on the courts, the press, Congress (including members of his own party), and even senior officials within his own administration. Trump is a Frankenstein’s monster of past presidents’ worst attributes: Andrew Jackson’s rage; Millard Fillmore’s bigotry; James Buchanan’s incompetence and spite; Theodore Roosevelt’s self-aggrandizement; Richard Nixon’s paranoia, insecurity, and indifference to law; and Bill Clinton’s lack of self-control and reflexive dishonesty.
===================================================
I am curious as to where this country will be 2020 & hopeful at the same time.

Yes, he will. Trump will also destroy America. He has a great start.

Trump has all of the worst attributes of Hitler & Abe Lincoln, all rolled up in one fat ball of me, me, me, me, me. It's all about Donald.

It certainly isn't about America ...........

 

[WCH]

If this means destroying the status quo, party on!

 

[jnug]

No, destroying the country does not mean destroying the status quo. They are not the same thing. But I seriously doubt the people that have carried STUPID banner forward know the difference.

 

[Mycroft]

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazin...l-donald-trump-destroy-the-presidency/537921/

Donald trump is testing the institution of the presidency unlike any of his 43 predecessors. We have never had a president so ill-informed about the nature of his office, so openly mendacious, so self-destructive, or so brazen in his abusive attacks on the courts, the press, Congress (including members of his own party), and even senior officials within his own administration. Trump is a Frankenstein’s monster of past presidents’ worst attributes: Andrew Jackson’s rage; Millard Fillmore’s bigotry; James Buchanan’s incompetence and spite; Theodore Roosevelt’s self-aggrandizement; Richard Nixon’s paranoia, insecurity, and indifference to law; and Bill Clinton’s lack of self-control and reflexive dishonesty.
===================================================
I am curious as to where this country will be 2020 & hopeful at the same time.

If you are going to post over-the-top nonsense from rabid Trump haters, you should at least find something up to date. I mean, this article is nine freaking months old. For example, the writer railed on about Trump's travel ban. Guess what...that issue is settled in Trump's favor. Maybe that writer has written a screed that is current? Something in which he rails, instead, against the Supreme Court?

 

[calamity]

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazin...l-donald-trump-destroy-the-presidency/537921/

Donald trump is testing the institution of the presidency unlike any of his 43 predecessors. We have never had a president so ill-informed about the nature of his office, so openly mendacious, so self-destructive, or so brazen in his abusive attacks on the courts, the press, Congress (including members of his own party), and even senior officials within his own administration. Trump is a Frankenstein’s monster of past presidents’ worst attributes: Andrew Jackson’s rage; Millard Fillmore’s bigotry; James Buchanan’s incompetence and spite; Theodore Roosevelt’s self-aggrandizement; Richard Nixon’s paranoia, insecurity, and indifference to law; and Bill Clinton’s lack of self-control and reflexive dishonesty.
===================================================
I am curious as to where this country will be 2020 & hopeful at the same time.

with a feckless congress, the answer is yes.

 

[Harshaw]

If he causes Congress to step up to its proper role and ends the 150-year gradual ascent of the Presidency to a level of power it was never supposed to have, then I will be pleased. In many ways, the Presidency NEEDS to be "destroyed."

A lot of people complain about the "imperial Presidency" when they don't like who's holding office, and the reins. I'm on that beat no matter who's there.

 

[jnug]

There is every possibility that Trump will destroy any credibility lodged in the office of the Presidency which would amount to destroying the Presidency. That Singapore meeting was pure theater. I called it pure theater before it happened, while it happened and after it happened. No the evidence is coming in supporting that. I said the sanctions coalition would collapse as a consequence of KJU's play and it was collapsing from the moment Trump sent those SK diplomats out onto the driveway of the WH to announce that he had accepted the offer of a meeting with KJU.

You can determine for yourselves what the actual threat of a KJU first strike against the US was. Whatever it was on June 11 was no different on June 13 and is no different today. All the MSM can do is whimper that this is better than the rhetoric of before. I never believed the rhetoric was more than two school yard bullies pissing at each other. However, it should be obvious by now that Trump the deal maker was engaging in theater and that in fact, even in a theatrical presentation, he ended up getting his head handed to him. He was badly out maneuvered because of his own insistence on making some sort of effort to look presidential. What a joke.

 

[DaveFagan]

Trump believes thet "the business of the USA is business," and that makes Corporate his constituency. Not the people. His business has been "money flow" and that is what seems to direct his policies. His first move putting 10% more money into the MIC guarantees him lots of money for his 2020 reelection campaign and unwavering Corporate support. Now, all he has to do is convince the average citizen that he is doing them a big favor by cutting as many social benefits as possible. Corporate needs those monies to maintain the OLIGARCHY. His stupidity a/k/a Tariffs and Trade Wars might be his downfall. The EU might choose to ally with Russia because they are land connected and the EU is not acutally threatened by Russia. Russia is threatened by NATO and responds. Brexit moves Britain away from the EU and our financial entrapment with Britain forces the USA to support Britain to our detriment. The wonderful thing about Trump is that he projects the lying persona of the typical USA politician without attempting to camoflauge the mendacity that is the norm. The Dems took careful aim in 2018 and shot themselves in the foot. Perhaps they'll aim at the other foot in 2020. That'll certainly cure the problem, eh?
/

 

[Perotista]

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazin...l-donald-trump-destroy-the-presidency/537921/

Donald trump is testing the institution of the presidency unlike any of his 43 predecessors. We have never had a president so ill-informed about the nature of his office, so openly mendacious, so self-destructive, or so brazen in his abusive attacks on the courts, the press, Congress (including members of his own party), and even senior officials within his own administration. Trump is a Frankenstein’s monster of past presidents’ worst attributes: Andrew Jackson’s rage; Millard Fillmore’s bigotry; James Buchanan’s incompetence and spite; Theodore Roosevelt’s self-aggrandizement; Richard Nixon’s paranoia, insecurity, and indifference to law; and Bill Clinton’s lack of self-control and reflexive dishonesty.
===================================================
I am curious as to where this country will be 2020 & hopeful at the same time.

Personally, I think polarization and hyper ultra partisanship is destroying or at least trying to destroy not only the office of the presidency, but the country. There is no cooperation between the two major parties, they have become set in stone that there will be no compromise. Each views the other party as this nation's number one or worst enemy and it's the other party that is out to destroy this nation. More than Russia, Iran, North Korea, the debt, immigration, any issue or country you can think of.

Each party thinks it has to keep the other party out of power at any cost, the ends justify the means. My candidate lost, so we must destroy the winning candidate. Both parties make up stuff, use fear tactics, fill us with political BS propaganda of lies and half truths trying to either remain in power or regain power.

It isn't Trump, Trump is a symptom, a result of all above. I have little hope anymore. We are destroying ourselves from within and both major parties are at the forefront of that destruction.

 

[gdgyva]

TDS thread # 68963 and counting

the amount of dread is overwhelming

 

[HowardBThiname]

https://www.theatlantic.com/magazin...l-donald-trump-destroy-the-presidency/537921/

Donald trump is testing the institution of the presidency unlike any of his 43 predecessors. We have never had a president so ill-informed about the nature of his office, so openly mendacious, so self-destructive, or so brazen in his abusive attacks on the courts, the press, Congress (including members of his own party), and even senior officials within his own administration. Trump is a Frankenstein’s monster of past presidents’ worst attributes: Andrew Jackson’s rage; Millard Fillmore’s bigotry; James Buchanan’s incompetence and spite; Theodore Roosevelt’s self-aggrandizement; Richard Nixon’s paranoia, insecurity, and indifference to law; and Bill Clinton’s lack of self-control and reflexive dishonesty.
===================================================
I am curious as to where this country will be 2020 & hopeful at the same time.

That's an old article from 2017 and interestingly enough, it was just recently proven wrong in the sense that the writer drew a parallel between Trump's travel ban and a seeming disregard for law because SCOTUS just upheld the ban.

It's an emotional and unsubstantiated piece, yet it had some interesting things here and there.

 

[Ikari]

If this means destroying the status quo, party on!

Trump is very much part of the Corporate-State. So he won't so much destythe status quo as proliferate it.

 

[Praxas]

Yes, he will. Trump will also destroy America. He has a great start.

Trump has all of the worst attributes of Hitler & Abe Lincoln, all rolled up in one fat ball of me, me, me, me, me. It's all about Donald.

It certainly isn't about America ...........

Trump won't destroy America, however, he has done damage to our country and our reputation Globally that will take decades to undo.

 

[cuban smokes]

Trump won't destroy America, however, he has done damage to our country and our reputation Globally that will take decades to undo.

if you don't believe that Trump has already succeeded in destroying America then I don't know what to tell you

have you seen the discourse in this nation? are you paying attention?

our reputation globally will never be reversed; Trump has also destroyed that .............

 

[jonny5]

Trump believes thet "the business of the USA is business," and that makes Corporate his constituency. Not the people. His business has been "money flow" and that is what seems to direct his policies. His first move putting 10% more money into the MIC guarantees him lots of money for his 2020 reelection campaign and unwavering Corporate support. Now, all he has to do is convince the average citizen that he is doing them a big favor by cutting as many social benefits as possible. Corporate needs those monies to maintain the OLIGARCHY. His stupidity a/k/a Tariffs and Trade Wars might be his downfall. The EU might choose to ally with Russia because they are land connected and the EU is not acutally threatened by Russia. Russia is threatened by NATO and responds. Brexit moves Britain away from the EU and our financial entrapment with Britain forces the USA to support Britain to our detriment. The wonderful thing about Trump is that he projects the lying persona of the typical USA politician without attempting to camoflauge the mendacity that is the norm. The Dems took careful aim in 2018 and shot themselves in the foot. Perhaps they'll aim at the other foot in 2020. That'll certainly cure the problem, eh?
/

Where are you differentiating "corporate" from the millions of people who own them, invest in them, or rely on them for their standard of living? Where do you think the money for all these social benefits comes from? The people?

 

[nota bene]

if you don't believe that Trump has already succeeded in destroying America then I don't know what to tell you

have you seen the discourse in this nation? are you paying attention?

our reputation globally will never be reversed; Trump has also destroyed that .............

I'm not chicken little, so I don't think the sky is falling. Put another way, what does being a nattering nabob of negativity gain anybody?

I do agree with Perotista's post above, though.

 

[jnug]

Personally, I think polarization and hyper ultra partisanship is destroying or at least trying to destroy not only the office of the presidency, but the country. There is no cooperation between the two major parties, they have become set in stone that there will be no compromise. Each views the other party as this nation's number one or worst enemy and it's the other party that is out to destroy this nation. More than Russia, Iran, North Korea, the debt, immigration, any issue or country you can think of.

Each party thinks it has to keep the other party out of power at any cost, the ends justify the means. My candidate lost, so we must destroy the winning candidate. Both parties make up stuff, use fear tactics, fill us with political BS propaganda of lies and half truths trying to either remain in power or regain power.

It isn't Trump, Trump is a symptom, a result of all above. I have little hope anymore. We are destroying ourselves from within and both major parties are at the forefront of that destruction.

Yes the country has problems. But a President can divide or unite. This President has chosen to divide and in ways that are not subtle. There is no texture to his efforts to divide.

For example, where do we want to come down on the government family reunification effort? Do we want to claim that Trump's administration is so incompetent that it simply cannot get it done or that they never planned on reuniting families anyway which makes Trump's back and forth (currently claiming he is for reunification) just another Trump farce.

Trump allows himself to be exposed within days of the garbage he spews. The KJU, Singapore meeting was no different. It was exposed within days for the farce it was.

So in truth as many of us have been saying for a long time now, Trump simply does not care. The only reason MSM does not adopt in its journalistic posture what is plainly obvious is because no matter what side of the political perspective they come at it from if they admit that Donald simply does not care, 50% of their phony baloney jobs go off the cliff edge that very minute. Evangelists...Trump does not care about you either, Republicans....nope.....Right to lifers.....nope, the military....nope, nationalists....nope. The whole bunch of you are simply a means to an end.

 

[cuban smokes]

I'm not chicken little, so I don't think the sky is falling. Put another way, what does being a nattering nabob of negativity gain anybody?

I do agree with Perotista's post above, though.

in case you, or anyone else have not noticed, America is experiencing extreme paralysis

our nation is beyond dis-functional

we are $21 trillion in debt on a federal level, many states are financially ****ed, we have excessive drug addiction that is rampant, people shooting kids in schools, people that are rich beyond imagination, poor living under bridges like trolls, most adults behave no better than two year olds while families that can least afford children keep pumping out more & more children that will never contribute positively to society, we command greed as our most prized goal, our military & law enforcement are our unaccountable force field, and you have hope for America when we have all three branches of the federal government that function like a junkie.

haha .............. that is thinking positive ............. I have to hand it 2 U .............

but don't worry ............. it will get worse ..............

 

[nota bene]

in case you, or anyone else have not noticed, America is experiencing extreme paralysis

our nation is beyond dis-functional

we are $21 trillion in debt on a federal level, many states are financially ****ed, we have excessive drug addiction that is rampant, people shooting kids in schools, people that are rich beyond imagination, poor living under bridges like trolls, most adults behave no better than two year olds while families that can least afford children keep pumping out more & more children that will never contribute positively to society, we command greed as our most prized goal, our military & law enforcement are our unaccountable force field, and you have hope for America when we have all three branches of the federal government that function like a junkie.

haha .............. that is thinking positive ............. I have to hand it 2 U .............

but don't worry ............. it will get worse ..............

You seem hopeful about this. How very sad.

 

[cuban smokes]

You seem hopeful about this. How very sad.

you misunderstand but that's fine; the reality is, we as a nation are digging our own hole.

 

[Perotista]

Yes the country has problems. But a President can divide or unite. This President has chosen to divide and in ways that are not subtle. There is no texture to his efforts to divide.

For example, where do we want to come down on the government family reunification effort? Do we want to claim that Trump's administration is so incompetent that it simply cannot get it done or that they never planned on reuniting families anyway which makes Trump's back and forth (currently claiming he is for reunification) just another Trump farce.

Trump allows himself to be exposed within days of the garbage he spews. The KJU, Singapore meeting was no different. It was exposed within days for the farce it was.

So in truth as many of us have been saying for a long time now, Trump simply does not care. The only reason MSM does not adopt in its journalistic posture what is plainly obvious is because no matter what side of the political perspective they come at it from if they admit that Donald simply does not care, 50% of their phony baloney jobs go off the cliff edge that very minute. Evangelists...Trump does not care about you either, Republicans....nope.....Right to lifers.....nope, the military....nope, nationalists....nope. The whole bunch of you are simply a means to an end.

whichever party that doesn't hold the presidency sees the nation as more divided than united. This was taken on 21 November 2016 but it shows what I mean.

Under G.W. Bush 76% of Democrats viewed him as a divider, 94% of Republicans as a uniter.
Under Obama just the opposite, 86% of republicans viewed him as a divider, 92% of Democrats as a uniter.

Roughly the same percentages of the party who doesn't hold the White House seeing the president of the opposite party as a divider, while the party who has the White House views him as a uniter.

You can also see that during Bill Clinton between 63-66% of all Americans viewed this country as deeply divided. With the exception of the couple of years after 9-11, between 65-66% of all Americans viewed this country as divided under G.W. Bush. Under Obama it was 66% to 77% of all Americans viewing this country as deeply divided.

So division has been there a long time before Trump. For Trump you can go to Question 21 in the poll below.

https://poll.qu.edu/national/release-detail?ReleaseID=2482

Trump all adults 31% uniter 62% divider
Democrats 4% uniter, 95% divider
Republicans 68% uniter, 20% divider
Independents 29% uniter, 64% divider.

Pretty much average since 1994. The point being is the party out of power seems to always look at the president of the other party as a divider. The party in power always looks at the president as a uniter. At least it has been that way since 1994.

As an aside, being a member of the tiny reform party and disliking both major parties as I look upon them as the reason this country is so divided as each puts the good of the party over the good of the country. Question 20 stands out for me. Look at how independents answered the question: 20. In the Presidential election of 2016, if Hillary Clinton had become President instead of Donald Trump, do you think that the nation would be better off than it is today or worse off than it is today?

Independents only: Better off 44%, worst off 41%. Basically evenly split. Independents may not like Trump and view him as an obnoxious, egotistical oaf of a president, but they also think Hillary Clinton wouldn't have been any better.

 

[jnug]

whichever party that doesn't hold the presidency sees the nation as more divided than united. This was taken on 21 November 2016 but it shows what I mean.

Under G.W. Bush 76% of Democrats viewed him as a divider, 94% of Republicans as a uniter.
Under Obama just the opposite, 86% of republicans viewed him as a divider, 92% of Democrats as a uniter.

Roughly the same percentages of the party who doesn't hold the White House seeing the president of the opposite party as a divider, while the party who has the White House views him as a uniter.

You can also see that during Bill Clinton between 63-66% of all Americans viewed this country as deeply divided. With the exception of the couple of years after 9-11, between 65-66% of all Americans viewed this country as divided under G.W. Bush. Under Obama it was 66% to 77% of all Americans viewing this country as deeply divided.

So division has been there a long time before Trump. For Trump you can go to Question 21 in the poll below.

https://poll.qu.edu/national/release-detail?ReleaseID=2482

Trump all adults 31% uniter 62% divider
Democrats 4% uniter, 95% divider
Republicans 68% uniter, 20% divider
Independents 29% uniter, 64% divider.

Pretty much average since 1994. The point being is the party out of power seems to always look at the president of the other party as a divider. The party in power always looks at the president as a uniter. At least it has been that way since 1994.

As an aside, being a member of the tiny reform party and disliking both major parties as I look upon them as the reason this country is so divided as each puts the good of the party over the good of the country. Question 20 stands out for me. Look at how independents answered the question: 20. In the Presidential election of 2016, if Hillary Clinton had become President instead of Donald Trump, do you think that the nation would be better off than it is today or worse off than it is today?

Independents only: Better off 44%, worst off 41%. Basically evenly split. Independents may not like Trump and view him as an obnoxious, egotistical oaf of a president, but they also think Hillary Clinton wouldn't have been any better.

Who cares what people think of the dif between Hillary and Donald. They were without question the worst major party candidates fielded in history. The only part of your posted polling data that is noteworthy is the Independent take on uniter v divider. That is a big number considering the natural tendency of Independents in polling. That said, you really cannot pick out specific poll questions to make a case of any sort. Polls need to be viewed as they were taken. Each poll question must be viewed within the context of the series of poll questions that were asked. In that sense I commend you for posting up the link to the complete poll. However I have made this point before in this forum. Picking poll questions out of a series of poll questions simply does not work, does not add any light to a subject and if anything tends to increase the heat.

 

[WCH]

Trump is very much part of the Corporate-State. So he won't so much destythe status quo as proliferate it.

But that's not what is happening.