Why didn't the dems do "medicare for all" when they had the power to do so?

[Checkerboard Strangler]

Pfft ... for several months dems had super majority. They didn't have to pass Obamacare, they could have easily passed Medicare for all ... but they never had a plan for Medicare for all ... :lol:

Now I know you aren't paying attention.
During that several months for most of the time Congress was not in session.
You're just making excuses. They did not have the support needed to pass Medicare For All, they only barely mustered support for the ACA.
No need to answer, as I am not even interested in debating with someone that prefers their own manufactured version of history.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Sure it came from individuals and the states... Which they gave back to individuals and states.. Hmmm are you going to claim that tax rates went through the roof for americans during that time?

And it does decentralize when you give people back their own money.. to then purchase healthcare insurance of their choice..

it certainly takes a big step away.. from single payer.

Then when you reimburse doctors so that individuals can determine their own end of life issues..

And start local coops.. and exchanges so that individuals have a easier time purchasing insurance...

Yeah it certainly is more free market.

Obama and the then almost super majority Congress timed the ACA carefully so that the worst would not kick in until Obama was safely out of office and they could distance themselves by at least one election if not two or three.

But there were significant taxes involved. ". . .The Affordable Care Act (ACA) has changed the healthcare insurance landscape. Some of the most important changes stemming from Obamacare center around taxes. Under the ACA, the total amount of new taxes on individuals and businesses will climb to $500 billion by 2023.

Altogether, there are 21 new taxes linked to the ACA. . ."
https://www.investopedia.com/articl...20714/new-taxes-under-affordable-care-act.asp

That after he lied that there would be no new taxes to sell it to the general public before the vote, and then changed the tune when the Supreme Court threatened to rule the ACA unconstitutional. All of a sudden his attorneys argued that Congress and the President had Constitutional authority to impose new TAXES and they got it past the high court on that basis.

And that was a fraction of the total cost to we the taxpayers most of whom would have less coverage for more money, much higher copays, much larger deductibles.

 

[FreeWits]

They spent every nickel of political capital on barrycare...which we were told was a "big ****ing deal", remember? Instead of doing what they're now saying would "really fix our medical system", which is medicare for all.

Why didn't they do that then?

By the way, lefties keep telling us how barrycare is awesome, but out of the other side of their mouths still barking about how bad it is. Weird. Really ****ing weird.

The liberal Democrats are against it either based on economic or choice/rationing reasons, while progressive Democrats are for it, so even when the Progressives get in power, the liberal Democrats can team up with the Republicans to stop it.

 

[AlbqOwl]

Do you mind if I ask you if you, your family (your nuclear family) or your loved ones have any serious ongoing medical issues?
You don't have to answer. I won't even feel offended if you tell me to **** off, but I ask for a reason.

For the record, I'll show you mine.

I'm a diabetic, with failing vision and hearing (which is why I am semi-retired from the film business at this point) failing knees and ankles, my wife is a 100% service connected disabled Navy vet born with one kidney (which is now in trouble) who has multiple sclerosis and who was exposed to ionizing radiation while she was serving, and my son was born with five major heart defects which are directly traceable to her radiation exposure.
He is looking at a heart transplant, probably before he hits 28 years old, or even possibly twenty-five. He's 22 right now.
Thankfully my daughter is relatively healthy, her worst problem is she has a trick knee which is exacerbated by her being 75 pounds overweight.
Other than that she is healthy, but she works on her feet all day long.

We have our issues yes, and that is why it was so painful to lose our beloved and trusted primary care physician due to the ACA, and my hubby lost a trusted cancer doctor as a result of the ACA. Our higher copays and deductibles mean that we do without some procedures our current doctor(s) would like us to have and the higher premium costs mean we have less to spend on personal enjoyment these days. Obama's slow economic recovery inspired us to mothball our business and retire earlier than we had planned to. But we aren't penniless or destitute or deprived of basic necessities either. It could be worse. (I am pretty sure it would have been much worse if President Trump had not been elected.)

And prayers to you and your family. That's a tough load to bear.

 

[AlbqOwl]

"This bill repeals the first amendment to the US Constitution."

"No public official shall engage in, promote, or facilitate an act of treason against the United States of America."

Your preference, you're saying, is for the first, eh?

Have a nice day. (A friendly mod won't allow me to say why I choose not to respond to this.)

 

[Deuce]

Have a nice day. (A friendly mod won't allow me to say why I choose not to respond to this.)

Hey, you're the one who brought word count in as a metric. I'm glad you now get the point.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

We have our issues yes, and that is why it was so painful to lose our beloved and trusted primary care physician due to the ACA, and my hubby lost a trusted cancer doctor as a result of the ACA. Our higher copays and deductibles mean that we do without some procedures our current doctor(s) would like us to have and the higher premium costs mean we have less to spend on personal enjoyment these days. Obama's slow economic recovery inspired us to mothball our business and retire earlier than we had planned to. But we aren't penniless or destitute or deprived of basic necessities either. It could be worse. (I am pretty sure it would have been much worse if President Trump had not been elected.)

And prayers to you and your family. That's a tough load to bear.

Sorry you had to get another doctor and have restrictions on the procedures you can access.
Here is what we are face to face with:

Son is going to be uninsurable at any cost, which is what he was prior to the ACA. The moment he turned eighteen, we tried and failed, to find an insurer who would issue him a policy. Simply put, if he loses his coverage and there is every reason to think he will, that's it, the end.
No transplant and no chance of one.

When your hero finally realizes his dream of privatizing the VA, my wife will be handed a worthless voucher, a kick in the teeth and a great big phony "Thank you for your service!", and of course I too will be to piss off as well. We spent many years dealing with the outside medical world. She couldn't even get a simple diagnosis of what was wrong with her, she wasn't even able to afford a wheelchair. She borrowed the one her dead father used, rusty and barely working. The VA has saved her life outright eight times since she got in. Thoughts and prayers...those don't help sick people.

Enjoy your paradise, and if you see me on the news after I have to bury my wife and son, just know that I will no longer give a **** what happens to me, or you, or anyone else.

Perspective. What you think is a failure to reform healthcare was the only chance we ever had at having health care, and if that wasn't bad enough, your heroes can't wait to create a cash cow made up of disabled veterans for their rich criminal friends to rip off.

No one thinks the ACA is perfect, not even people who use it and need it but it's better than what we will have now that it's circling the drain (read: BEING KILLED OFF)

 

[jaeger19]

Obama and the then almost super majority Congress timed the ACA carefully so that the worst would not kick in until Obama was safely out of office and they could distance themselves by at least one election if not two or three.
.

okay.. i'll bite.. Please detail exactly what provision in the ACA.. "the worst".. kicked in this year.. the year Obama is out of office. I am really curious.. since well the ACA hasn;t been repealed and is still the law of the land.

Altogether, there are 21 new taxes linked to the ACA. . ."

okay.. you need to read your own article.

The federal government estimates that 85% of all Americans who already have health insurance won’t face any, or at least any significant, changes to their taxes.

85% of americans.. no change. okay.

Uncle Sam also estimates that of the remaining 15%, the tax changes revolve around three key pillars to the ACA - the individual mandate, the employer mandate and tax credits linked to healthcare exchange plan premium costs for individual Americans, families and small business owners.

Oh wait.. taxes.. Wait.. TAX CREDITS.. in which taxes will be decreased for those that are purchasing insurance on the exchanges (if they qualify).. and SMALL BUSINESS CREDITS.. to help purchase healthcare.

Hmmm so 85% of americans not affected.. of the 15% of those affected by taxes will be.. HELPED from a tax credit.

Okay.. the other group is the individual mandate.. which ONLY KICKS IN.. if you decide to NOT go get healthcare insurance.. (in other words are irresponsible)
s
And yep.. there are increased taxes on those making over 200,000 and some tax changes to those with HSA's that have new limits..

Wishkibble.. seems to be making a mountain out of a molehill here on this.

And that was a fraction of the total cost to we the taxpayers most of whom would have less coverage for more money, much higher copays, much larger deductibles.

Actually the ACA limited your deductibles and actually dictated that your insurance policy had more coverage. In fact it forced insurance companies to provider more basic coverage.

As far as more money.. yep.. it was not able to stem healthcare insurance increases.. which were going on WELL Before obamacare....

those are the facts. I know.. it doesn't jive with the rhetoric thats been spewed by the republican party... But.. there is a reason that the republicans.. with all the repeal and replace rhetoric.. could not replace it.. nor repeal it.. and thats because a major portion of the ACA makes sense.

 

[itsforthekids]

Same reason they didn't do anything about gun control they don't care about these issues.

It’s really weird how they support something until being against it is politically expedient.

 

[vegas giants]

Sorry you had to get another doctor and have restrictions on the procedures you can access.
Here is what we are face to face with:

Son is going to be uninsurable at any cost, which is what he was prior to the ACA. The moment he turned eighteen, we tried and failed, to find an insurer who would issue him a policy. Simply put, if he loses his coverage and there is every reason to think he will, that's it, the end.
No transplant and no chance of one.

When your hero finally realizes his dream of privatizing the VA, my wife will be handed a worthless voucher, a kick in the teeth and a great big phony "Thank you for your service!", and of course I too will be to piss off as well. We spent many years dealing with the outside medical world. She couldn't even get a simple diagnosis of what was wrong with her, she wasn't even able to afford a wheelchair. She borrowed the one her dead father used, rusty and barely working. The VA has saved her life outright eight times since she got in. Thoughts and prayers...those don't help sick people.

Enjoy your paradise, and if you see me on the news after I have to bury my wife and son, just know that I will no longer give a **** what happens to me, or you, or anyone else.

Perspective. What you think is a failure to reform healthcare was the only chance we ever had at having health care, and if that wasn't bad enough, your heroes can't wait to create a cash cow made up of disabled veterans for their rich criminal friends to rip off.

No one thinks the ACA is perfect, not even people who use it and need it but it's better than what we will have now that it's circling the drain (read: BEING KILLED OFF)

Best wishes to your wife and son. It is criminal how sick people are treated in this country

 

[AlbqOwl]

Sorry you had to get another doctor and have restrictions on the procedures you can access.
Here is what we are face to face with:

Son is going to be uninsurable at any cost, which is what he was prior to the ACA. The moment he turned eighteen, we tried and failed, to find an insurer who would issue him a policy. Simply put, if he loses his coverage and there is every reason to think he will, that's it, the end.
No transplant and no chance of one.

When your hero finally realizes his dream of privatizing the VA, my wife will be handed a worthless voucher, a kick in the teeth and a great big phony "Thank you for your service!", and of course I too will be to piss off as well. We spent many years dealing with the outside medical world. She couldn't even get a simple diagnosis of what was wrong with her, she wasn't even able to afford a wheelchair. She borrowed the one her dead father used, rusty and barely working. The VA has saved her life outright eight times since she got in. Thoughts and prayers...those don't help sick people.

Enjoy your paradise, and if you see me on the news after I have to bury my wife and son, just know that I will no longer give a **** what happens to me, or you, or anyone else.

Perspective. What you think is a failure to reform healthcare was the only chance we ever had at having health care, and if that wasn't bad enough, your heroes can't wait to create a cash cow made up of disabled veterans for their rich criminal friends to rip off.

No one thinks the ACA is perfect, not even people who use it and need it but it's better than what we will have now that it's circling the drain (read: BEING KILLED OFF)

You are anticipating a terrible scenario that hasn't happened. Believe me the GOP in Washington don't want to lose their jobs. Don't think they don't know what is at stake. I hope for your sake that you are wrong. I have seen nothing in the works to suggest that people will be thrown under the bus. And there is no move to privatize the VA, but only to make it easier for people to access medical care who have veteran's coverage but live long distances from a VA facility.

 

[AlbqOwl]

okay.. i'll bite.. Please detail exactly what provision in the ACA.. "the worst".. kicked in this year.. the year Obama is out of office. I am really curious.. since well the ACA hasn;t been repealed and is still the law of the land.



okay.. you need to read your own article.



85% of americans.. no change. okay.



Oh wait.. taxes.. Wait.. TAX CREDITS.. in which taxes will be decreased for those that are purchasing insurance on the exchanges (if they qualify).. and SMALL BUSINESS CREDITS.. to help purchase healthcare.

Hmmm so 85% of americans not affected.. of the 15% of those affected by taxes will be.. HELPED from a tax credit.

Okay.. the other group is the individual mandate.. which ONLY KICKS IN.. if you decide to NOT go get healthcare insurance.. (in other words are irresponsible)
s
And yep.. there are increased taxes on those making over 200,000 and some tax changes to those with HSA's that have new limits..

Wishkibble.. seems to be making a mountain out of a molehill here on this.



Actually the ACA limited your deductibles and actually dictated that your insurance policy had more coverage. In fact it forced insurance companies to provider more basic coverage.

As far as more money.. yep.. it was not able to stem healthcare insurance increases.. which were going on WELL Before obamacare....

those are the facts. I know.. it doesn't jive with the rhetoric thats been spewed by the republican party... But.. there is a reason that the republicans.. with all the repeal and replace rhetoric.. could not replace it.. nor repeal it.. and thats because a major portion of the ACA makes sense.

15% of Americans is many million people. And what the feds told us during that period didn't pan out to be true any more than what the President told us to sell the deal.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

You are anticipating a terrible scenario that hasn't happened. Believe me the GOP in Washington don't want to lose their jobs. Don't think they don't know what is at stake. I hope for your sake that you are wrong. I have seen nothing in the works to suggest that people will be thrown under the bus. And there is no move to privatize the VA, but only to make it easier for people to access medical care who have veteran's coverage but live long distances from a VA facility.

That is what a husband and father who loves their wife and family is supposed to do, anticipate and try to prepare.
Hasn't happened? It has happened. The pre-existing condition nonsense is back, there is no dispute on that, it's a FACT.
My son has a list of "pre-existing conditions" a mile long, starting with "being conceived in a womb that was exposed to ionizing radiation and going from there to Kingdom Come. My son will be UNINSURABLE the day his current policy is expired.
FACT.

"Don't think they don't know what's at stake?"
That's a big laugh. Not only do they know, they know and don't care because even if they lose their jobs in Congress, which is unlikely since incumbents almost always get reelected, but even if they do, the revolving door will land them in a nice cushy consulting job, or they can become a lobbyist for their pet industry or cause, or they get a career writing books or appearing as a talking head, the list is endless.
You cannot name one senator or congressman who ever went destitute after being booted.

You "haven't seen anything to suggest that people will be thrown under the bus" because you're not in the vulnerability gap we are in.
And please, don't suggest there is "no move to privatize the VA" because "Concerned Veterans for America" is pretty much the ONLY veterans group with a direct line to the Trump White House.
All others have to take a number and wait because they are opposed to the CVfA's policies and platform.
CVfA is fully funded by the Koch Brothers if you look them up, you will learn quickly that privatization, partial or FULL, IS their goal.
Don't argue, don't sugar coat, just go look it up for yourself.
All you have to do is read what is being written by people at Iraq-Afghanistan Veterans of America (IAVA) VoteVets, DAV, Paralyzed Veterans of America (wife is a 20 year member) and every other veterans advocacy organization in existence.

I know the difference between bridging the gap for vets who are too far away or who live near poorly performing facilities and full privatization.
My wife and I work with disabled vets all the time, we are eyes and ears to the ground on this.
Bridging the gap is something we both support but apparently you are unaware of the other platform, and all you have to do is read and see for yourself. It starts with the overwhelming pitch about how "the VA cannot be fixed, how the government can never do anything right, and how privatization would be the better approach", all stated openly by CVfA and EVERY SINGLE VA advocate that Trump and his team have ever listened to, all of which happen to be funded and represented by private medical people who stand to gain financially from privatization.

So, you're just not informed on that issue, and we are informed. We just happen to know things you don't know, that's something you might not like to believe, what with me and my wife being such despicable commie libtards and all.
But it's a fact, and not even exaggerated one iota.
The Trump team DESPISES the VA and they listen to people who want that agency GONE.

I know how this is going to play out already.
I'll present reams of facts and links, and put out secrets known only to people who read The Congressional Record, and you will eventually just tell me to "have a blessed day" or something to that effect.
Or, you could just consider the possibility that I am not lying, and that my wife and I are who and what we say we are, and that we're being honest.

PS: Wifey just received a CUT in her VA disability pension. Ain't THAT nice...love the soldiers, hate the veterans.
And by the way, this isn't about liberals at all, because one of the BEST VA Secretaries was a Republican picked by Bush43, Anthony J. Principi.
I'm not being partisan about this, I'm being blunt and frank about what's right in front of me.

This administration has utter contempt for the VA, and I can prove it, and I HAVE proven it numerous times right here on DP.
I enjoy proving it time after time.

 

[AlbqOwl]

That is what a husband and father who loves their wife and family is supposed to do, anticipate and try to prepare.
Hasn't happened? It has happened. The pre-existing condition nonsense is back, there is no dispute on that, it's a FACT.
My son has a list of "pre-existing conditions" a mile long, starting with "being conceived in a womb that was exposed to ionizing radiation and going from there to Kingdom Come. My son will be UNINSURABLE the day his current policy is expired.
FACT.

"Don't think they don't know what's at stake?"
That's a big laugh. Not only do they know, they know and don't care because even if they lose their jobs in Congress, which is unlikely since incumbents almost always get reelected, but even if they do, the revolving door will land them in a nice cushy consulting job, or they can become a lobbyist for their pet industry or cause, or they get a career writing books or appearing as a talking head, the list is endless.
You cannot name one senator or congressman who ever went destitute after being booted.

You "haven't seen anything to suggest that people will be thrown under the bus" because you're not in the vulnerability gap we are in.
And please, don't suggest there is "no move to privatize the VA" because "Concerned Veterans for America" is pretty much the ONLY veterans group with a direct line to the Trump White House.
All others have to take a number and wait because they are opposed to the CVfA's policies and platform.
CVfA is fully funded by the Koch Brothers if you look them up, you will learn quickly that privatization, partial or FULL, IS their goal.
Don't argue, don't sugar coat, just go look it up for yourself.
All you have to do is read what is being written by people at Iraq-Afghanistan Veterans of America (IAVA) VoteVets, DAV, Paralyzed Veterans of America (wife is a 20 year member) and every other veterans advocacy organization in existence.

I know the difference between bridging the gap for vets who are too far away or who live near poorly performing facilities and full privatization.
My wife and I work with disabled vets all the time, we are eyes and ears to the ground on this.
Bridging the gap is something we both support but apparently you are unaware of the other platform, and all you have to do is read and see for yourself. It starts with the overwhelming pitch about how "the VA cannot be fixed, how the government can never do anything right, and how privatization would be the better approach", all stated openly by CVfA and EVERY SINGLE VA advocate that Trump and his team have ever listened to, all of which happen to be funded and represented by private medical people who stand to gain financially from privatization.

So, you're just not informed on that issue, and we are informed. We just happen to know things you don't know, that's something you might not like to believe, what with me and my wife being such despicable commie libtards and all.
But it's a fact, and not even exaggerated one iota.
The Trump team DESPISES the VA and they listen to people who want that agency GONE.

I know how this is going to play out already.
I'll present reams of facts and links, and put out secrets known only to people who read The Congressional Record, and you will eventually just tell me to "have a blessed day" or something to that effect.
Or, you could just consider the possibility that I am not lying, and that my wife and I are who and what we say we are, and that we're being honest.

PS: Wifey just received a CUT in her VA disability pension. Ain't THAT nice...love the soldiers, hate the veterans.
And by the way, this isn't about liberals at all, because one of the BEST VA Secretaries was a Republican picked by Bush43, Anthony J. Principi.
I'm not being partisan about this, I'm being blunt and frank about what's right in front of me.

This administration has utter contempt for the VA, and I can prove it, and I HAVE proven it numerous times right here on DP.
I enjoy proving it time after time.

I won't agree with your perspective but I will certainly allow you to have it without criticism because you are there and I am not just as you can't know what we deal with here. I am from a military family with some still in active duty and a lot of veterans still living, so I am not completely out of the loop or coming from an uninformed perspective. I will pray for you and your family.

 

[jaeger19]

15% of Americans is many million people. And what the feds told us during that period didn't pan out to be true any more than what the President told us to sell the deal.

15% of americans is nowhere near a majority of americans.

AND of that 15% of americans.. the vast majority.. had DECREASED taxes in the form of tax credits.. which you seemed to miss. Yes.. it accounts as a "new tax" or "tax change".. but It was a CREDIT.. that allowed them to either purchase healthcare or it was a credit to small businesses.

Just presenting the facts.