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What Is A True Conservative Anyway?

The fact that Trump's personal lawyer created a shell company where corporations poured money and porn stars were paid to keep quiet doesn't concern you? That doesn't seem a little crooked to you?

Of course, Trump will deny he ever knew Michael Cohen and you'll believe him.

Has Trump denied knowing Cohen? I must have missed it if he did. But back to the posted article, it has nothing to do with Trump taking cash. In their desperation, some people will grasp at anything.
 
The only people who appear to be at risk from reading that are Cohen and whoever released the confidential SAR from First Republic Bank. At least you're off the Chinese nonsense.
It's just more evidence that Trump is a crook. And, of course, a real conservative would not ignore it.
 
“True Conservative” simply means someone who wins an election. In the simple minds of the right, conservatism cannot fail, it can only be failed. Ergo, a Republican who loses must have simply not been “conservative” enough.

Of course, the definition of “conservative” is fungible depending on what contradictory beliefs said “conservative” is attempting to rationalize.

This perfectly sums it up. I remember in 2012 when Romney became the GOP nominee, he went from being a "RINO" to "Reaganesque". Then when he lost, he went back to being a "RINO".

I'd also argue that Republican voters label any GOP politician they are embarrassed by a "RINO". Bush Jr. is a perfect example. They defended him for 8 years, but then when his party lost in 2008, and he left office with a historically low approval rating, Republican voters suddenly started calling him a "RINO", and pretended that they never voted for him.

In today's GOP, a "true conservative" in their minds is anyone who worships Donald Trump. If you oppose Trump, you are deemed a "RINO". Just ask Ted Cruz who was called a "RINO" in 2016 by Republican voters who were pissed off that he didn't endorse Trump at the GOP convention. Then when Cruz endorsed him a few months later, he suddenly went back to being a "True conservative".
 
It's rather difficult to do anything about immigration, for example, when one party has absolutely no interest in fixing it. The evidence for that is that anyone wanting to do it is called a racist or hater by the left. So, the topic is derailed off into one about the supposed moral failings of those wanting to secure the border. That is completely intentional. As for the hateful and ignorant, most of them inhabit the left and always have. They have a virulent hate for most conservatives with special venom reserved for white men and conservative Christians. They also loathe any blacks with the temerity to be conservatives. Conservatives aren't against progress. They just have a far different definition of it than liberals.

lol.

BOTH parties have absolutely no interest in fixing it. The GOP, being the supposed "business friendly party" certainly has no interest in fixing it, as they know businesses benefit immensely from the cheap labor illegals provided. The GOP just pretends to "care" by pandering to their base come election time, and then doing the complete opposite when in power, and then blaming everything on the Dems. And why not? That strategy has been working for them for years.

As for the rest of your drivel, your victim complex isn't even worth addressing.
 
This perfectly sums it up. I remember in 2012 when Romney became the GOP nominee, he went from being a "RINO" to "Reaganesque". Then when he lost, he went back to being a "RINO".

I'd also argue that Republican voters label any GOP politician they are embarrassed by a "RINO". Bush Jr. is a perfect example. They defended him for 8 years, but then when his party lost in 2008, and he left office with a historically low approval rating, Republican voters suddenly started calling him a "RINO", and pretended that they never voted for him.

In today's GOP, a "true conservative" in their minds is anyone who worships Donald Trump. If you oppose Trump, you are deemed a "RINO". Just ask Ted Cruz who was called a "RINO" in 2016 by Republican voters who were pissed off that he didn't endorse Trump at the GOP convention. Then when Cruz endorsed him a few months later, he suddenly went back to being a "True conservative".

In short, the Republican party, and conservatives in general, are completely devoid of principles.
 
In short, the Republican party, and conservatives in general, are completely devoid of principles.

Oh, no doubt. The election of a piece of excrement like Donald Trump is irrefutable proof of that.
 
can you tell me what currently elected politician is a true conservative?

Not really.
Conservatism isn't a political ideology, it's a framework of doing things and a way of thinking, and it is rather difficult to tell if someone makes decisions that fall within that framework because they are Conservatives, or if they have other reasons for doing so. Most people who call themselves Conservatives have never read Conservative thinkers. To them it is merely a convenient label, whether intended to take a stance against their Liberal neighbour, or emptying their customers' pockets. Nor can someone be "very" Conservative or "slightly" Conservative. You either think this way or you do not, there is no "very" or "slightly" about it.

So I can't tell you which politicians are Conservatives or not.
What I can tell you, is that Conservatism rejects utopianism and absolutism.
What this means, is that while socialism has a recipe for creating the utopian society, and will follow that recipe whether the target society is an eskimo village or a mining town in Pennsylvania, Conservatism may take routes to improve society that differ wildly from one setting to another. Conservatism looks at the ingredients before selecting a recipe.

Conservatism is neither individualistic or collectivist, and neither authoritarian or anarchic.
It demands that people work together, not because working together is a goal in itself, but always for a reason and always limited to that. For Conservatives, the tale of Cincinattus is a heroic story, while the story of Caesar is a tale of caution. Conservatives will applaud individual freedom but may yet demand military conscription. "If it's stupid but it works, it ain't stupid" might be one Conservative catchphrase, but equally so is "If it's brilliant, but can never work, it ain't all that brilliant".

Conservatives are wary of dogmatism.
In Conservatism, good hierachies run by bad people are a recipe for disaster; bad hierarchies run by good people improve over time if allowed to do so. In the long run, people are always more important than method.
Thus Conservatism will sometimes support monarchies and sometimes oppose them. Sometimes it will support religion and sometimes oppose it.

Conservatism is belief with cynicism.
Some people have called Conservatism "Liberalism with quality control", for historically it is a branch of Classical Liberalism. Conservatism is so named because it's purpose is to safeguard the rewards that Liberalism won us. It became so because mainstream Liberalism tended to end in bloodbaths since it was way too easy to forge into despotism. Conservatives believe in the betterment of humankind, but roll their eyes at anyone who claims to offer it.

Conservatism has many parents.
Burke and Hume are the two who are most often mentioned as fathers of Conservatism, but it is inspired by thousands; from Hammurabi to George Washington.
Conservatives do not have a chief ideologist or any political manifest. It wouldn't make much sense when the whole point is to recognize and deal with human diversity and imperfections.

And finally, Conservatism demands you be smart enough to know, that the question asked is not always the question asked. Same applies to answers given.
 
Not really.
Conservatism isn't a political ideology, it's a framework of doing things and a way of thinking, and it is rather difficult to tell if someone makes decisions that fall within that framework because they are Conservatives, or if they have other reasons for doing so. Most people who call themselves Conservatives have never read Conservative thinkers. To them it is merely a convenient label, whether intended to take a stance against their Liberal neighbour, or emptying their customers' pockets. Nor can someone be "very" Conservative or "slightly" Conservative. You either think this way or you do not, there is no "very" or "slightly" about it.

So I can't tell you which politicians are Conservatives or not.
What I can tell you, is that Conservatism rejects utopianism and absolutism.
What this means, is that while socialism has a recipe for creating the utopian society, and will follow that recipe whether the target society is an eskimo village or a mining town in Pennsylvania, Conservatism may take routes to improve society that differ wildly from one setting to another. Conservatism looks at the ingredients before selecting a recipe.

Conservatism is neither individualistic or collectivist, and neither authoritarian or anarchic.
It demands that people work together, not because working together is a goal in itself, but always for a reason and always limited to that. For Conservatives, the tale of Cincinattus is a heroic story, while the story of Caesar is a tale of caution. Conservatives will applaud individual freedom but may yet demand military conscription. "If it's stupid but it works, it ain't stupid" might be one Conservative catchphrase, but equally so is "If it's brilliant, but can never work, it ain't all that brilliant".

Conservatives are wary of dogmatism.
In Conservatism, good hierachies run by bad people are a recipe for disaster; bad hierarchies run by good people improve over time if allowed to do so. In the long run, people are always more important than method.
Thus Conservatism will sometimes support monarchies and sometimes oppose them. Sometimes it will support religion and sometimes oppose it.

Conservatism is belief with cynicism.
Some people have called Conservatism "Liberalism with quality control", for historically it is a branch of Classical Liberalism. Conservatism is so named because it's purpose is to safeguard the rewards that Liberalism won us. It became so because mainstream Liberalism tended to end in bloodbaths since it was way too easy to forge into despotism. Conservatives believe in the betterment of humankind, but roll their eyes at anyone who claims to offer it.

Conservatism has many parents.
Burke and Hume are the two who are most often mentioned as fathers of Conservatism, but it is inspired by thousands; from Hammurabi to George Washington.
Conservatives do not have a chief ideologist or any political manifest. It wouldn't make much sense when the whole point is to recognize and deal with human diversity and imperfections.

And finally, Conservatism demands you be smart enough to know, that the question asked is not always the question asked. Same applies to answers given.

Perhaps in theory. Certainly not in practice.
 
So are our elite business schools for the most part.

https://newrepublic.com/article/148368/ideology-business-school

And let's talk about that Democratic party that decided that coronating the corrupt incompetent Hillary was a swell idea.....

“Elite business schools” essentially provide the polish to the newest batch of Repiblicans.

Oh, and Hillary Clinton’s (there she is again, like clockwork) “corruption” and “incompetence” pales in comparison to virtually any prominent Republican’s. Fact.
 
Or perhaps not stealing from the SS trust fund to pay for other stuff. Seems government can't help itself.

Here's an enlightening article about Hoover and his policies at the time.

https://www.wsj.com/articles/SB122576077569495545

Yawns......and some people think the Civil War wasn't over slavery --revisionism is fun like that... in other words, if you have to revisionist history your way around the fact that letting markets do whatever they want will and has always failed -- feel free..

As for SS trust funds being stolen -- that is a usual conservative trope to justify doing away with SS -- which is silly and also is very misleading since that is not how the trust fund works. Here are a few more debunked myths you can deflect from:

https://www.fool.com/retirement/2017/07/24/5-social-security-myths-debunked.aspx
 
RE: stimulus spending in the last recession:
It was an unavoidable necessity that McCain would have done as well if he'd won. You can't have the biggest banks in the country go under simultaneously, which is what would have happened. On that score, people should be very much concerned with the enormous backlog of school debt in this country. This has the potential to explode just like the housing mess in 2008.

Obama was one of the most frugal presidents in modern history. Really. Especially if you take away the deficit he added for the stimulus spending.

www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2012...ld-you-believe-its-barack-obama/#38cb7d9625cf

So: Obama was a small government spender, and was very conservative in his foreign intervention. Sounds like you must have been a big supporter!
 
It's just more evidence that Trump is a crook. And, of course, a real conservative would not ignore it.

It's not evidence of any such thing. I hate to break it to you but Mueller's merry charade is just about over. It's dead in the water. The political coup attempt has failed miserably.
 
lol.

BOTH parties have absolutely no interest in fixing it. The GOP, being the supposed "business friendly party" certainly has no interest in fixing it, as they know businesses benefit immensely from the cheap labor illegals provided. The GOP just pretends to "care" by pandering to their base come election time, and then doing the complete opposite when in power, and then blaming everything on the Dems. And why not? That strategy has been working for them for years.

As for the rest of your drivel, your victim complex isn't even worth addressing.

Let's just say that the Democrats have much less interest than the Republicans. They see future voters and voters equal power. That's the name of the game. I have no victim complex. I simply tell the truth about liberals. They consider people opposed to illegal immigration as "haters" and somehow immoral. That's laughable BS. It's about LAW, not whether you think immigrants can contribute something. I'm all for them coming here legally.
 
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Yawns......and some people think the Civil War wasn't over slavery --revisionism is fun like that... in other words, if you have to revisionist history your way around the fact that letting markets do whatever they want will and has always failed -- feel free..

As for SS trust funds being stolen -- that is a usual conservative trope to justify doing away with SS -- which is silly and also is very misleading since that is not how the trust fund works. Here are a few more debunked myths you can deflect from:

https://www.fool.com/retirement/2017/07/24/5-social-security-myths-debunked.aspx

You claimed that Hoover was some free marketeer and/or practicing laissez faire. You're wrong, period. I make no claims about how markets work best. My point was to debunk your Hoover claims because they are inaccurate. I also never once said a word about doing away with SS. Like most of your buddies in here, you imagine stuff and then respond to what you imagined.
 
It's not evidence of any such thing. I hate to break it to you but Mueller's merry charade is just about over. It's dead in the water. The political coup attempt has failed miserably.

I hate to break it to ya, but you are not a true conservative.
 
I hate to break it to ya, but you are not a true conservative.

Right, because true conservatives should be on board with the liberal plan to remove Trump by any means possible, regardless of whether there are grounds to do it. Uh huh....
 
Right, because true conservatives should be on board with the liberal plan to remove Trump by any means possible, regardless of whether there are grounds to do it. Uh huh....

Trump is a radical. So, no true conservative would ever support him.
 
Let's just say that the Democrats have much less interest than the Republicans. They see future voters and voters equal power. That's the name of the game. I have no victim complex. I simply tell the truth about liberals. They consider people opposed to illegal immigration as "haters" and somehow immoral. That's laughable BS. It's about LAW, not whether you think immigrants can contribute something. I'm all for them coming here legally.

And that's where you're wrong. The GOP if anything has less interest in fixing it for the reasons I stated.

As for your so called "truth", repeating talking points given to you by your Republican political masters hardly constitutes as "the truth".
 
Trump is a radical. So, no true conservative would ever support him.

Hillary, who represented the so called "status quo" was by definition the "conservative" running in 2016.

Trump, who represented "radical change" in Washington was by definition NOT the "conservative" running in 2016.
 
And that's where you're wrong. The GOP if anything has less interest in fixing it for the reasons I stated.

As for your so called "truth", repeating talking points given to you by your Republican political masters hardly constitutes as "the truth".

Political power will always outweigh cheap labor. The Dems see hordes of new voters. That means winning elections which means gaining and maintaining power. That's what it's all about. One hardly needs to be given talking points to figure this out.
 
Political power will always outweigh cheap labor. The Dems see hordes of new voters. That means winning elections which means gaining and maintaining power. That's what it's all about. One hardly needs to be given talking points to figure this out.

No, because it makes an assumption that one particular group will always vote one particular way. George W. Bush, while a lousy president, made strong gains with "hispanics". then your party went berserk when a half black got elected, and well the result is a race baiter named Donald Trump as your new leader. At this point now you guys are even starting to lose support with Cubans.
 
No, because it makes an assumption that one particular group will always vote one particular way. George W. Bush, while a lousy president, made strong gains with "hispanics". then your party went berserk when a half black got elected, and well the result is a race baiter named Donald Trump as your new leader. At this point now you guys are even starting to lose support with Cubans.

Blacks and Hispanics will always vote heavily Democrat despite any gains the GOP might make. The Cubans who had firsthand experience of communism will always support the GOP. However, those people are dying out and their kids and grandkids who have been born here are taking over. They are much more susceptible to liberal "logic".
 
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