[W: 594] A great question for pro abortion types

[minnie616]

The woman is very important to her family ...present and future .
You have never been more correct.

As a mother of 4 who had two miscarriages I understand hard choices and putting my born children first.
I understand how important my health was to my children when they were little.
I understand how important their well being was to me.
Please, though the roles of mother and father are different, neither is more m important than the other. you know that.

I do think I am more of a realist then you seem to be.

I believe you are incorrect when you write that. I could write the same to you, but like you, I couldn't be sure of that. I haven't suggested that of you, for that very reason

You not only devalue the woman but you devalue the unborn if all you care about is numbers.

As I said , there is proof women have been having abortions since the early Greek days when they were much more dangers and 2 lives
( both the woman and her unborn ) often were both lost instead of just the life of unborn. Since Roe v Wade may choose abortion and yet before the present pregnacy or later in life under different circumstances may choose to become a mother.

That you wish to ignore that fact is why I don’t consider you a realist .

I know for a fact over 60 percent of women who have abortions have at least 1 child they are raising.

The easiest thing for a women who doesn’t care is to do is nothing.

I would have to count on you to provide the numbers of Women who don't care. Once you have assigned a number, then you will have a concept of the numbers I am revulsed by and a large percentage of the unborn who need our help. /COLOR]

Regards,
CP

. There was a greater than five-fold increase in the proportion of babies born with NAS from 2004 to 2014, whenan estimated 32,000 infants were born with NAS/NOWS —equivalent to one baby suffering from opioid withdrawal born approximately every 15 minutes. Newborns with NAS/NOWS are more likely than other babies to also have low birthweight and respiratory complications. Nationally, rates of opioid use disorder at delivery hospitalization more than quadrupled during 1999–2014, to 6.5 per 1000 births in 2014. In 2014, $563M were spent on costs for treatment of NAS/NOWS; the majority of these charges (82%) were paid by state Medicaid programs, reflecting the greater tendency of mothers using opioids during pregnancy to be from lower-income communities. The rising frequency (and costs) of drug withdrawal in newborns points to the need for measures to reduce antenatal exposure to opioids

Dramatic Increases in Maternal Opioid Use and Neonatal Abstinence Syndrome | National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA)

 

[Peter King]

So now, you embrace the notion of prediction as a true and infallible. The truth be told, you can't predict or place a value on the unborn. The mother seeking abortion is an arithmetic figure, potential of the unborn is the variable.
I am, not for the 10 zillionth time, averse to socially medically necessary, or very early pregnancy abortion. Quite the reverse, I accept and can understand the various and ugly circumstance where that would be acceptable, and for the mutual benefit of the Mother and child.
One could make the argument that since I am not ever likely personally to have make the medical choice, I Ought be silent. I reject that simplified notion.
Regards,
CP

I can place a value on a zygote, at least when compared to the rights of the woman. Why is that so difficult for the other side to understand? This is not about intrinsic value but the rights and where they lie. At the first trimester (plus a few more weeks) the rights are 100% with the mother, and none with the ZEF.

 

[Lursa]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Then you should be perfectly onboard with abortion. Who else should be responsible for the unborn?

According to you, no one else should be responsible for the financial raising of the child...so it would just die if the parents couldnt do so, right?

Why would abortion be any different?

Didnt actually "connect the dots" in your responses, eh? Gotta use some logic in there!

Your response does not track with logic, but then I know what your position is.

Where do you get off saying that society, or some stranger off the street should be responsible for the financial raising of the child? It's the birth parents. I CLEARLY connect the dots and they run directly to you. You are responsible, and until you accept that responsibility, you have no position.

Still waiting for a 'logical' response to this:

Of course it does. If you believe that society should be absolved of responsibility for providing financial assistance to children when parents cannot, then where do you think the food and shelter will come from? They will die. Or they will abandon them and they will die (no foster care/adoption $$$ from taxpayers).

If this is incorrect, tell me how?

Have you been sterilized yet? When you get that done, come back and we can talk.

I am past menopause, so I dont need to get sterilized. So here I am :mrgreen:

Now, is there some reason you cannot apply your proposed 'logic' to my post? Your argument has failed?

 

[smallvoice]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Still waiting for a 'logical' response to this:

Of course it does. If you believe that society should be absolved of responsibility for providing financial assistance to children when parents cannot, then where do you think the food and shelter will come from? They will die. Or they will abandon them and they will die (no foster care/adoption $$$ from taxpayers).

If this is incorrect, tell me how?



I am past menopause, so I dont need to get sterilized. So here I am :mrgreen:

Now, is there some reason you cannot apply your proposed 'logic' to my post? Your argument has failed?

Why are you sticking your nose in other women's business, couldn't kill enough when you were aborting them? That is the ONLY solution for you I am interested in hearing.

 

[Scrabaholic]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Why are you sticking your nose in other women's business, couldn't kill enough when you were aborting them? That is the ONLY solution for you I am interested in hearing.

You do realise that Lursa has never had an abortion, right? She has stated that many times in the years I've been here.

 

[minnie616]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Why are you sticking your nose in other women's business, ...

Being Pro choice means not sticking a nose in other women’s business.

Being pro choice means allowing each pregnant woman to make her own choice/ decision regarding her own pregnancy
her faith and her conscience .

I will not support a law or a country that would not allow a pregnant women to choose an early elective abortion.

On the other side of the coin I would not support a Law or a country that would force a women to have an abortion even if the unborn were so malformed that if it did survive birth it would cost the taxpayers millions of dollars in medical costs.

 

[year2late]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

You do realise that Lursa has never had an abortion, right? She has stated that many times in the years I've been here.

Yeah....that one has been aimed at me a few times. The reality was much different. When abortion was offered due several severe complications....I chose to wait to see if I could carry to past viability....at my own peril. Do to the ability to take the months off prior to birth and skilled medical care....I went to term and I had a healthy baby boy.

 

[Lursa]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Why are you sticking your nose in other women's business, couldn't kill enough when you were aborting them? That is the ONLY solution for you I am interested in hearing.

Why do you assume I have had abortions? You are wrong of course, but it seems your deductive skills are very very poor.

Is that why your posts make no sense and you have not been able to answer direct and civil questions to support your 'opinions?'

Why is it that you keep avoiding answering? Has your argument (such as one might try to cobble together) failed?

If not, please refer back to post 1028 to continue a discussion without your dramatic and false conclusions.

 

[jbander]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Just look at the pro life people here, Old white men telling young women what they can do and can't do with their own body's/ What 90% of them belong to a party that is anti abortions but when they are born let them eat ****. They will take all funding they can away from them and give it to the only people who count as far as they are concerned. The Golden few. They are so sickening . They have to be disposed of. We have to get our country out from under these hate driven ugly's

 

[weaver2]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Why are you sticking your nose in other women's business, couldn't kill enough when you were aborting them? That is the ONLY solution for you I am interested in hearing.

Most pro-choice women have never had an abortion. They do however, believe that to be pro-choice means women are free to make private decisions about about sex, contraception, child bearing, abortion and birthing without being controlled by the dictates of some church to which they don't belong. Why are you denying women the right to make private personal decisions?

 

[concernedpuma]

You not only devalue the woman but you devalue the unborn if all you care about is numbers.

As I said , there is proof women have been having abortions since the early Greek days when they were much more dangers and 2 lives
( both the woman and her unborn ) often were both lost instead of just the life of unborn. Since Roe v Wade may choose abortion and yet before the present pregnacy or later in life under different circumstances may choose to become a mother.

That you wish to ignore that fact is why I don’t consider you a realist .

I know for a fact over 60 percent of women who have abortions have at least 1 child they are raising.

The easiest thing for a women who doesn’t care is to do is nothing.


Regards,
CP



Dramatic Increases in Maternal Opioid Use and Neonatal Abstinence Syndrome | National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA)

God bless you and yours. It is my idea that you have been in the trenches. I can't help but wonder how you find yourself on the side of elective abortion, but nonetheless, I am through, finally, with enjoining this thread. I leave with a sour taste for what humanity has become, but am somewhat elevated by conversation with you. You have done all I could hope for.
Good luck; see you down the road on a different topic, my respect for you intact.

Regards,
CP

 

[concernedpuma]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Why do you assume I have had abortions? You are wrong of course, but it seems your deductive skills are very very poor.

Is that why your posts make no sense and you have not been able to answer direct and civil questions to support your 'opinions?'

Why is it that you keep avoiding answering? Has your argument (such as one might try to cobble together) failed?

If not, please refer back to post 1028 to continue a discussion without your dramatic and false conclusions.

I can't speak for Small, but your patented method of correspondence is now being aimed in that direction. Have you, honestly, noticed how many times you write that another writer makes no sense? I have, and it becomes clear that you really don't understand. Okay. We'll grant you don't get it. But please don't take your inability to understand as proof of anything, other than your ability to understand. Quite truthfully, that is the strength of it. It is of no value to anyone other than you, somehow, that you don't get it.

Regards,
CP

 

[Lursa]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

I can't speak for Small, but your patented method of correspondence is now being aimed in that direction. Have you, honestly, noticed how many times you write that another writer makes no sense? I have, and it becomes clear that you really don't understand. Okay. We'll grant you don't get it. But please don't take your inability to understand as proof of anything, other than your ability to understand. Quite truthfully, that is the strength of it. It is of no value to anyone other than you, somehow, that you don't get it.

Regards,
CP

LOL maybe you didnt do your research and actually read the post indicated as a clear demonstration of 'making no sense.' I made an honest attempt to get him to explain the contradiction (which made "no sense") in his posts.

Thoroughness is a smart quality to have when criticizing others, altho I guess a lack of thoroughness is better than poor reading comprehension (which would be indicated if you did not understand the example in post 1028).

 

[concernedpuma]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

LOL maybe you didnt do your research and actually read the post indicated as a clear demonstration of 'making no sense.' I made an honest attempt to get him to explain the contradiction (which made "no sense") in his posts.

Thoroughness is a smart quality to have when criticizing others, altho I guess a lack of thoroughness is better than poor reading comprehension (which would be indicated if you did not understand the example in post 1028).

There, once again, we are endowed with the ultimate wisdom of, well … just, and only you.
Go, live your life as the advocate of abortion of the helpless. If fatiguing and disengaging honest opposition makes you feel somehow better, keep it dear. That is the sum total of your return for your barbaric life view.
Regards,
CP

 

[Lursa]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

There, once again, we are endowed with the ultimate wisdom of, well … just, and only you.
Go, live your life as the advocate of abortion of the helpless. If fatiguing and disengaging honest opposition makes you feel somehow better, keep it dear. That is the sum total of your return for your barbaric life view.
Regards,
CP

I see you are retreating again with no capacity to refute my demonstration that you were once again wrong. You made no arguments in your post to me...only accusations. You say you're done...I'm good with that.

 

[jbander]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

There, once again, we are endowed with the ultimate wisdom of, well … just, and only you.
Go, live your life as the advocate of abortion of the helpless. If fatiguing and disengaging honest opposition makes you feel somehow better, keep it dear. That is the sum total of your return for your barbaric life view.
Regards,
CP

You people have nothing , as long as you support a party that will **** on the newborn the instance that they are born , then you have nothing to say ever.

 

[concernedpuma]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

I see you are retreating again with no capacity to refute my demonstration that you were once again wrong. You made no arguments in your post to me...only accusations. You say you're done...I'm good with that.

Well, I am leaving this thread. Coming back as a courtesy, knowing you would need the last word, thinking it is THE word.. Seems you can't help yourself.
I concede no wrong thinking on my part, only fatigue of arguing with those who are so diametrically opposed to protecting the unborn, most helpless, and likely the betters of all of us.
I neither apologize or concede anything to your point of view, other than perhaps your cult like adherence.
That being written, I will dis-enjoin here.
Bye the bye; neither passive or aggressive.
Regards,
CP

 

[Lursa]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Well, I am leaving this thread. Coming back as a courtesy, knowing you would need the last word, thinking it is THE word.. Seems you can't help yourself.
I concede no wrong thinking on my part, only fatigue of arguing with those who are so diametrically opposed to protecting the unborn, most helpless, and likely the betters of all of us.
I neither apologize or concede anything to your point of view, other than perhaps your cult like adherence.
That being written, I will dis-enjoin here.
Bye the bye; neither passive or aggressive.
Regards,
CP

:applaud :violin:

 

[weaver2]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

I concede no wrong thinking on my part, only fatigue of arguing with those who are so diametrically opposed to protecting the unborn, most helpless, and likely the betters of all of us.

So , you think anti-abortion people care about protecting the unborn. I've got some bad news for you; protecting the unborn doesn't involve any of the things anti-abortion movement does; not one. Let me list the actions that don't protect the unborn
* Weepily testifying to legislatures how traumatized you were about getting an abortion
* Participating in pro-birth marches wearing your red "MAGA" hat.
* Praying outside an abortion clinic
* Screaming, "Jesus hates you" at women going into PP clinics
* Letting David Daleiden post lies about PP on the internet
* Posting gory pictures from Eastern European late abortions, and claiming this is what happens in American abortions
* Luring pregnant women into clinics made to looks like abortion clinics then trapping them into giving birth instead of aborting
* Telling women they should produce a child and give it up for adoption
* Passing laws that make illegal abortions more likely and keep doctors from performing abortion with your cynical hospital privileges bill.
* Lying about abortion statistics and women's feelings after an abortion
* Cutting funding to Medicaid, TANF, WIC, family counseling, food support, Planned Parenthood and child support.
* Cutting family leave after birth
* Passing laws that make it almost impossible to perform late term abortions women and doctors from aborting a malformed or dead fetus.
* Telling lies that abortion causes breast cancer.
* Claiming it's a sin to get an abortion and then getting one yourself when an unplanned and unwanted pregnancy occurs in your own family.
* Blaming the working poor for sucking up your taxes for welfare and then forcing the family to support one more child they can't afford

The undeniable fact is that you don't protect the unborn, you protect your ideology. So spare us your fatigue. It's self serving and brutal at best.

The way to protect the unborn is to make sure that when they are born they are wanted, loved, supported, educated, counseled, fed and nurtured. That takes money, time, financial support and laws. The best way to protect the unborn is to respect and acknowledge women when whey say they and her family cannot support a child, permit her to end a pregnancy and end the potential of creating a life of misery for an unborn child. Protecting the unborn means willingness to support with taxes the facilities the unborn will need when they are born. The way to protect the unborn is to allow the mother to let the unborn never be born when she knows she cannot support a born child.

Forcing birth on unprepared women never ever protected the unborn.

 

[Stealers Wheel]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

But it is in the eyes of God. Ever think of that???

Which God is that?

 

[roguenuke]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

So , you think anti-abortion people care about protecting the unborn. I've got some bad news for you; protecting the unborn doesn't involve any of the things anti-abortion movement does; not one. Let me list the actions that don't protect the unborn
* Weepily testifying to legislatures how traumatized you were about getting an abortion
* Participating in pro-birth marches wearing your red "MAGA" hat.
* Praying outside an abortion clinic
* Screaming, "Jesus hates you" at women going into PP clinics
* Letting David Daleiden post lies about PP on the internet
* Posting gory pictures from Eastern European late abortions, and claiming this is what happens in American abortions
* Luring pregnant women into clinics made to looks like abortion clinics then trapping them into giving birth instead of aborting
* Telling women they should produce a child and give it up for adoption
* Passing laws that make illegal abortions more likely and keep doctors from performing abortion with your cynical hospital privileges bill.
* Lying about abortion statistics and women's feelings after an abortion
* Cutting funding to Medicaid, TANF, WIC, family counseling, food support, Planned Parenthood and child support.
* Cutting family leave after birth
* Passing laws that make it almost impossible to perform late term abortions women and doctors from aborting a malformed or dead fetus.
* Telling lies that abortion causes breast cancer.
* Claiming it's a sin to get an abortion and then getting one yourself when an unplanned and unwanted pregnancy occurs in your own family.
* Blaming the working poor for sucking up your taxes for welfare and then forcing the family to support one more child they can't afford

The undeniable fact is that you don't protect the unborn, you protect your ideology. So spare us your fatigue. It's self serving and brutal at best.

The way to protect the unborn is to make sure that when they are born they are wanted, loved, supported, educated, counseled, fed and nurtured. That takes money, time, financial support and laws. The best way to protect the unborn is to respect and acknowledge women when whey say they and her family cannot support a child, permit her to end a pregnancy and end the potential of creating a life of misery for an unborn child. Protecting the unborn means willingness to support with taxes the facilities the unborn will need when they are born. The way to protect the unborn is to allow the mother to let the unborn never be born when she knows she cannot support a born child.

Forcing birth on unprepared women never ever protected the unborn.

You forgot a few like supporting abstinence only education in schools, making laws that in fact make it illegal for insurance companies to pay for certain types of contraceptives, passing off wrong or incomplete information about Plan B and contraceptives in general to the public.

Sent from my SM-N970U using Tapatalk

 

[weaver2]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Originally Posted by Logical1
But it is in the eyes of God. Ever think of that???

Which God is that?

That would be their anthropomorphic God, dressed in long robes sitting on the judgement throne, a conservative Christian at the right hand of God manipulating the strings. If you squint hard you can just make out the electric prod in the hand of the conservative.

 

[Dayton3]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Just look at the pro life people here, Old white men telling young women what they can do and can't do with their own body's

Why are you bitching about that?

 

[Stealers Wheel]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Yeah....that one has been aimed at me a few times. The reality was much different. When abortion was offered due several severe complications....I chose to wait to see if I could carry to past viability....at my own peril. Do to the ability to take the months off prior to birth and skilled medical care....I went to term and I had a healthy baby boy.

Wait ... you're saying you had a choice? That you would deny others? Am I the only one who sees irony in this?

 

[weaver2]

Re: A great question for pro abortion types

Posted by jbander
Just look at the pro life people here, Old white men telling young women what they can do and can't do with their own body's

Why are you bitching about that?

It's pretty obvious why women would be bitching. The real question is why do you as an old conservative male think you ought to control women's reproductive lives. Do you think you:

are more moral than women?
are smarter than than women?
are more ethical than women?
are more knowledgable than women?
as a Christian, have authority over women?
have a vested interest in all women's fetuses?
have been given the job of overriding women's and doctor's decision
have a right to force any woman to do your bidding?
have a God that put you in charge of deciding the lives of all families
think being old, white, conservative and religious are the only qualifications needed for deciding the fate of American women, children and their families.

Don't drag out your old worn out excuse that you are protecting life. That's been debunked long ago. You're the cohort that empowers Congress to vote against everything that protects, enhances or encourages life.