US troops met with 'overwhelming force' in Niger ambush, official says [W:14]

[Rogue Valley]

US troops met with 'overwhelming force' in Niger ambush, official says

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Confusion over what happened during an ambush of U.S. Special Forces in Niger earlier this month apparently sparked a full Pentagon probe of the incident announced Thursday, which some officials say could have had even worse casualties than four American soldiers killed from the small, "out-matched" team. Officials have described a harrowing burst of violence in or near a village close to Niger's border with Mali on Oct. 4, which led to the first U.S. combat deaths in the small African nation battling Islamist extremists. The gunfight may have split the team of a dozen or fewer American commandos in half, according to one counterterrorism official. It was so chaotic that one soldier remained missing for up to 36 hours before his remains were recovered. "They met an overwhelming force,” the counter-terrorism official who was familiar with the mission and its aftermath, told ABC News. “They were out-gunned and out-matched. The enemy had relative superiority in numbers and fully enveloped and out-flanked the team. I think they got cut in half with suppressive fire.” Four U.S. special operations soldiers were killed in action, along with 1 Nigerien soldier killed and two Americans wounded.

Another U.S. official said that the Defense Intelligence Agency has assessed it "highly likely" that the group of 50 or more attackers behind the ambush in Niger were from ISIS in the Greater Sahara, referred to as ISGS. But the counterterrorism official said the attackers may have included current or former members of al-Qaeda-affiliated Islamist extremist group Ansar Dine from neighboring Mali. In one version of events provided by a U.S. official, the Green Beret-led team had driven to a village near the border with Mali and were walking to or from the meeting when they were ambushed by about 50 fighters from an ISIS group. But two different officials said that it appears only some of the American soldiers went into the village to meet with elders and that's when they were attacked, meaning the Americans were separated at the outset of the gunfight.

This mission seemingly went bad for [possibly] a number of different reasons and it's vital to determine the chronology here and why this played out as it did.

 

[Crovax]

US troops met with 'overwhelming force' in Niger ambush, official says

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This mission seemingly went bad for [possibly] a number of different reasons and it's vital to determine the chronology here and why this played out as it did.

At this point what difference does it make? :mrgreen:

 

[ecofarm]

At this point what difference does it make? :mrgreen:

Pathetic and stupid political hackery. No better than "mission accomplished". You're removing context and it's a deplorable ploy.

 

[Crovax]

Pathetic and stupid political hackery. No better than "mission accomplished". You're removing context and it's a deplorable ploy.

The context is similar, Hillary thought that looking at the causes after the fact were unimportant.

 

[RetiredUSN]

Pathetic and stupid political hackery. No better than "mission accomplished". You're removing context and it's a deplorable ploy.

I'm still waiting on the day for "Eco" to call out his liberal friends on here when they do the same ****.

Hackery?

 

[ecofarm]

The context is similar, Hillary thought that looking at the causes after the fact were unimportant.

You really believe that, don't you? That's pathetic. The conversation was about improving security and learning from the mistakes, the impetus was in that context unimportant. Your crap is no better than a hack lib with "mission accomplished". I'd expect only children to go for such stupid political BS.

 

[ecofarm]

I'm still waiting on the day for "Eco" to call out his liberal friends on here when they do the same ****.

Hackery?

Do I have to find links to me going after "mission accomplished" lib hacks? I can also find links of me defending Trump against gross hackery.

Your false personal attack shows character. You are the partisan, not me; ask anyone.

 

[Northern Light]

What are we doing in Africa? *face palm*

They can call anyone ISIS now and invade.

 

[RetiredUSN]

Do I have to find links to me going after "mission accomplished" lib hacks?

Your false personal attack shows character.

You pass over thousands of threads of political hackery by liberals on here and have added many likes as well.

Character? I find that to be somewhat questionable when you call out others doing the exact same thing you do as well.

 

[ecofarm]

You pass over thousands of threads of political hackery by liberals on here and have added many likes as well.

Character? I find that to be somewhat questionable when you call out others doing the exact same thing you do as well.

You're lying in attempt to save face. I've gone after political hacks against Bush and Trump. I'm independent and have attacked liberal hackery the same. You supposedly not noticing is irrelevant. You're a partisan, not me.

Take your false personal attacks and pathetic allegiance to political party elsewhere.

 

[RetiredUSN]

You're lying in attempt to save face. You're a partisan, not me. I'm independent and have attacked liberal hackery the same. You supposedly not noticing is irrelevant.

Take your false personal attacks and pathetic allegiance to political party elsewhere.

I have no party. I called you out for your own pathetic allegiance and and obvious personal attacks on another forum member.

I'd expect only children to go for such stupid political BS.

You're removing context and it's a deplorable ploy.

Get my drift? You attack, and then cry butt hurt when you get it right back at you.

 

[ecofarm]

I have no party. I called you out for your own pathetic allegiance and and obvious personal attack personal attack on another forum member.

I'd expect only children to go for such stupid political BS.

You're removing context and it's a deplorable ploy.

Get my drift? You attack, and then cry butt hurt when you get it right back at you.

Triggered? Go cry somewhere else. Your attack on my political independence is pathetic and shows a lack of character. You can't counter my point, so you choose to lie about me personally. That's scumbag behavior. You should be ashamed.

You're probably upset because you were duped, like a moron, by the 'what does it matter' meme. Well, boo hoo, wise up.

 

[Rogue Valley]

WTF? Four American Special Ops troops die in Africa and three of you decide to muck this tragedy up with partisan BS?

Unbelievable.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Moderator's Warning:

CEASE the personal crap and get back to the topic.

 

[cpwill]

Nothing went good on this day. Those of you hoping (or worried) for partisan advantage out of the investigation will likely be disappointed.

But let it play out. They'll release what happened, and then we'll have it.

Sent from my XT1526 using Tapatalk

 

[braindrain]

What are we doing in Africa? *face palm*

They can call anyone ISIS now and invade.

We were requested to be there by the government of that country to help them deal with the branch of ISIS that was killing their citizens.
Do you have an issue with us helping to stop the killing of innocent civilians

And why exactly should we not call an organization with close ties to ISIS what they are.

 

[apdst]

US troops met with 'overwhelming force' in Niger ambush, official says

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This mission seemingly went bad for [possibly] a number of different reasons and it's vital to determine the chronology here and why this played out as it did.

The enemy got a heads up that the team was going to be in the area.

They set up an ambush, with overwhelming force.

Investigation pretty much complete.

Was there a spy in the team's midst? Was there a break down in signals security? Did the team excercise a routine that gave them away? Did the enemy just get lucky? Who knows. Should these questions be answered? Of course, but any attempt to blame someone will be a waste of time. Of course, the AT's will claim it's President Trump's fault.

 

[Rogue Valley]

The enemy got a heads up that the team was going to be in the area.

They set up an ambush, with overwhelming force.

Investigation pretty much complete.

Was there a spy in the team's midst? Was there a break down in signals security? Did the team excercise a routine that gave them away? Did the enemy just get lucky? Who knows. Should these questions be answered? Of course, but any attempt to blame someone will be a waste of time. Of course, the AT's will claim it's President Trump's fault.

Plz stop with the partisanship. This isn't the proper place for that crappola. Some of you are just as bad as the Westboro Baptist Church.

Why no drone recon coverage? No fixed/rotary air assets at all nearby? No QRF on standby? This really went down bad. I'd like to know why.

 

[Rogue Valley]

Everything we know about the Niger attack that left 4 U.S. soldiers dead

 

[apdst]

Plz stop with the partisanship. This isn't the proper place for that crappola. Some of you are just as bad as the Westboro Baptist Church.

Why no drone recon coverage? No fixed/rotary air assets at all nearby? No QRF on standby? This really went down bad. I'd like to know why.

You are the last person to whine about partisaship.

SF missions don't have those assets. That's why an SF team is sent in vice an infantry division. That being said, there were French gunships involved.

 

[braindrain]

Plz stop with the partisanship. This isn't the proper place for that crappola. Some of you are just as bad as the Westboro Baptist Church.

Why no drone recon coverage? No fixed/rotary air assets at all nearby? No QRF on standby? This really went down bad. I'd like to know why.

Do you know there was no drones overhead before hand. What exactly do think drones show.
Do you know where the nearest air assets were. Do you know if the team on the ground could establish comms with the air because if not air is pretty useless in a ambush.
Do you know that there was no QRF. Do you know how far from the nearest US base the SF team was working.

I am sorry but seeing amateurs try and play Monday morning quarterback to the folks who do this for a living always amuses me. Especially when they do it with out knowing virtually any of the actual details of the operation.

It shows a certain type of arrogance to try and pretend that you know more about conducting operations like this then the folks who have years of training and experience doing this while you don’t have 5 minutes doing this type of work.

 

[MSgt]

The context is similar, Hillary thought that looking at the causes after the fact were unimportant.

So...your reaction to what you didn't like about Hillary is to be like Hillary? I just don't understand where people are anymore.

 

[Crovax]

So...your reaction to what you didn't like about Hillary is to be like Hillary? I just don't understand where people are anymore.

Yes it's very clear that you don't understand sarcasm

 

[MSgt]

Yes it's very clear that you don't understand sarcasm

Did that sarcasm do something for you? It seems that such sarcasm could only come from a bitter place. Dead troops should never be an occasion for sarcasm. Then again, we live in a different America these days, don't we?

 

[Rogue Valley]

Do you know there was no drones overhead before hand. What exactly do think drones show.
Do you know where the nearest air assets were. Do you know if the team on the ground could establish comms with the air because if not air is pretty useless in a ambush.
Do you know that there was no QRF. Do you know how far from the nearest US base the SF team was working.

I am sorry but seeing amateurs try and play Monday morning quarterback to the folks who do this for a living always amuses me. Especially when they do it with out knowing virtually any of the actual details of the operation.

It shows a certain type of arrogance to try and pretend that you know more about conducting operations like this then the folks who have years of training and experience doing this while you don’t have 5 minutes doing this type of work.

It seems SecDef (Gen) James Mattis is also an 'arrogant amateur' for asking questions and seeking answers...

Thu October 19, 2017
Three senior US officials told CNN on Wednesday that Mattis wants answers regarding the ambush in Niger two weeks ago. Mattis is dismayed at the lack of detailed information he has received about about the attack, but there is no indication he is trying to unduly hurry the investigation being carried out by US Africa Command, according to all three officials -- all of whom are in a position to have knowledge of how Mattis views the situation. The investigation will be an effort "to get all the facts correct," an administration official familiar with the review has told CNN. Details related to the deadly military breakdown remain murky two weeks after the incident in Niger as investigators work to determine precisely what happened, a US official has told CNN.
Experts working for Africa Command are trying to establish an hour-by-hour timeline of what happened as part of a comprehensive investigation that includes all the military branches and elements of US intelligence agencies that were involved in the mission. Officials who have spoken to CNN have cautioned that as the investigation continues new information is likely to emerge and their understanding of what happened could change.

Intel rated it "unlikely" US team would face opposition: One official has told CNN that the military's intelligence said it was "unlikely" that the team would run into enemy forces. "This was not expected," US Africa Command spokesman Army Col. Mark Cheadle said. "Had we anticipated this sort of attack we would have absolutely devoted more resources to it to reduce the risk and that's something we are looking at right now," he added.

Private contractor conducted evacuations: A US private aviation contractor conducted evacuations of US and Nigerien troops after they were ambushed, according to US Africa Command spokesperson Robyn Mack. Mack said that US private contractor Berry Aviation was "on alert during the incident and conducted casualty evacuation and transport for US and partner forces." US officials previously told CNN that French military Super Puma helicopters also evacuated the wounded Americans along with those killed in action while also providing covering fire. The wounded were first flown to the capital Niamey and later to Landstuhl Regional Medical Center in Germany.

There is also the issue that Trump allowed US troops to be in a country that does not allow offensive air operations. While French Mirage jets arrived overhead within 30 minutes of the firefight to fly low passes in an attempt to disperse the attackers, the aircraft did not have permission to drop bombs, multiple US officials told CNN. The failure to anticipate an attack and the fact there were no US rescue and recover assets close by meant nearly an hour went by before the evacuation of the two wounded and three dead US troops by French helicopters could be completed.

What we know and don't know about the deadly Niger attack