Tribalism on DP/in real life

[AGENT J]

A lot of the analysts keep saying Tribal politics is ruining america, or tribalism is worse than it's ever been. After the election Tuesday, which actually felt like a national election, I would tend to agree, especially on the internet.

I have seen more extreme comments than ever before online and underneath all of the hate and all of the rhetoric politics in America has boiled down to, "Na Na Na Na." or "I was right." There is no more discussion about issues. If there ever were and if you do talk about certain hot button topics. EX: Gun Control, Abortion, Global Warming and go in with a different point of view, people don't debate your view. They just call you an idiot.

So the question is, has it always been this bad on DP? In your life?

*Yes I realize I do this too.

I don't see it in real life at all, in real life most things are better than they have ever been among NORMAL people right, left and center

its the nutters that are out of control and get the attention.

 

[NeverTrump]

To an extent though I think the stormfront interruption flooded discussion sites with rather polarizing people as well.

Ah you may be onto something there

 

[Grand Mal]

That's the way identity politics is designed to work. The whole purpose of identity politics is to divide people who would otherwise seek common ground, isolate them and encourage them to insulate themselves from everyone that isn't the party. It's the exact same method that cult leaders use to break off people from society and keep them cloistered. The idea is to crush the very concept of free will and replace it with reliance on the ruling body. The perpetrators of such schemes ALWAYS see themselves as saviors rather than oppressors. Jim Jones, Kim Jong Un, Charles Manson....all cut from the same cloth.

Think about what you're saying. You don't like the idea of "tribal politics" but you guys on the left are the ones targeting racial divides, gender divides, ethnicity divides, economic divides, etc. You guys THRIVE on that stuff and rail against the rest of us when we oppose it. It is anti-liberty ideas that create, manipulate and perpetuate these divides.

Uh, did you just divide society into 'us' (the good ones) and 'them' (the guilty ones)? In the name of deploring 'identity politics'?
Jesus.

 

[KerouacJack]

If political "tribalism" didn't exist then we wouldn't be having this conversation. The OP even suggests that it's a problem in society. My recognition of the problem and discussion of the causes of the problem does not create or extend the problem. Your choice to ridicule the discussion instead of engage in substantive consideration of the issues is merely a symptom of your choice to embrace the ideology of division.

Do you or do you not believe that "political tribalism" is a growing problem in this country? Do you believe that it even exists?

I'm not doing any of that... I just don't understand how you can say you deslike identity politics in one paragraph and then blame a group for the problem by using identity politics yourself....

Yes identity politics is a problem and by telling everyone on the "left" it's their fault because they have a different opinion then you on racial, gender, and economic issues.... is making it worse. Who on the left? Every on of them is all the same? They all have the same opinion about everything... just like everyone on the "right"....Your using identity politics here; right vs left.

The only way your post makes sense to me, is if it was meant as satire.

I'm not trying upset you it's just the second paragraph isn't logically consistent with the first.

 

[Helix]

Tribalism on DP/in real life

tribalism / ingroup / outgroup is the fatal flaw in an artificially limited binary political choice. we're still too primitive to handle a system that's set up that way. we still have a lot of evolving to do. i have the same hard wiring, so i'm not above it, either.

 

[eohrnberger]

That's the way identity politics is designed to work. The whole purpose of identity politics is to divide people who would otherwise seek common ground, isolate them and encourage them to insulate themselves from everyone that isn't the party. It's the exact same method that cult leaders use to break off people from society and keep them cloistered. The idea is to crush the very concept of free will and replace it with reliance on the ruling body. The perpetrators of such schemes ALWAYS see themselves as saviors rather than oppressors. Jim Jones, Kim Jong Un, Charles Manson....all cut from the same cloth.

Think about what you're saying. You don't like the idea of "tribal politics" but you guys on the left are the ones targeting racial divides, gender divides, ethnicity divides, economic divides, etc. You guys THRIVE on that stuff and rail against the rest of us when we oppose it. It is anti-liberty ideas that create, manipulate and perpetuate these divides.

Soon to add to that list is sex and sexual relations.

 

[eohrnberger]

The bad old days have returned - its even worse than the Nixon years when we last had such tribal divisions. And we owe it all to Trumplethinskin.

DP is just a reflection of that.

Without Hillary running, I doubt that we'd have Trump.

 

[Bucky]

Only because you do not see how horrible Trump is.

What reality are you living in? Ever since Trump became president the economy has been booming.

 

[haymarket]

Without Hillary running, I doubt that we'd have Trump.

Well I know without a mechanism left over from the 1700's to thwart the will of the people we would not have Trump as president. That is a certainty.

 

[eohrnberger]

Well I know without a mechanism left over from the 1700's to thwart the will of the people we would not have Trump as president. That is a certainty.

Without that "mechanism left over from the 1700's" I don't think the country would have lasted as long as it has, and if it had, it wouldn't be the land of liberty and freedom that it is now. I think it would have ended up far worse, and possibly not even have survived as a nation.

 

[Lutherf]

You just said you hated identity politics but then lumped a bunch of people together you consider the "left" and basically compared them to a cult destroying freedom and dividing the country..

WTF..?

"Left wing" isn't an identity. It's a spectrum of political ideology. Identity is picking out a specific demographic such as Blacks or Homosexuals or Rural Americans. It's identifying a group based on a given characteristic.

 

[calamity]

What reality are you living in? Ever since Trump became president the economy has been booming.

Lol...it was booming before Trump became president, cuz

 

[KerouacJack]

"Left wing" isn't an identity. It's a spectrum of political ideology. Identity is picking out a specific demographic such as Blacks or Homosexuals or Rural Americans. It's identifying a group based on a given characteristic.

I beleive "Left Wing" is an identity... it's the original identity politic.

https://english.stackexchange.com/q...used-to-indicate-socialist-liberals-and-right.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left–right_politics#History_of_the_terms

I understand what your saying though.

But French Nobles were blaming "left wingers" long before Fox started.

 

[Bucky]

Lol...it was booming before Trump became president, cuz

Not true.

 

[Mach]

I suspect it's always been this way, it's just being magnified by the internet, social media, and much more sophisticated messaging. I've been on DP some 11 years, and I was pretty freaked out with 9/11 and Bush Jr., Rummy, Cheney, and Wolfowitz. Scary times. I always thought all the Obama attacks were absurd, I really didn't understand just how many people believed that nonsense, I thought it was the vocal extremist phenomenon maybe. Or maybe I just can't remember.

But people are not waking up and suddenly acting crazy, they are being fed a steady diet of crazy via the media, and it spreads faster and has a greater impact because that gets mirrored on facebook, twitter, etc., posted, commented, reddit, bounced around.

Imagine a long ago when a leader spouted rhetoric from atop a large boulder.
Then they used a crude megaphone to be heard by even larger crowds.
Then they spread that message with print.
Then Radio.
Then TV.
Then online sites.
Then social media.

Couple that with the sophisticated statistics and technological magic that can be worked to pick the right message at the right time for the right audience, all coordinated and blasted...in this case coordinated between major news networks like Fox and the White House simultaneously, and I think that results in what we have today. They are using the same propaganda, it's just being delivered basically straight to everyone's veins instead of in some diluted, hard to administer form, so to speak. Propaganda works, marketing works. They are powerful tools, and we have few limits on them.

They float messages in test areas, see which ones resonate, then distribute them, etc., it's really quite something.

Up to us if we let this go on. Given our past, we like to let things run and see where they lead.

 

[calamity]

Not true.

Very true.

 

[Bucky]

Very true.

If you look at the stock market this year, it has been one of the greatest bull runs ever. It was basically a big sigh of relief for businesses once Trump was elected.

 

[Northern Light]

The polarization of America into hyperpartisanship was intentional. We have always been a divided nation but the kind of language coming out of the media after 9/11 was just so obviously the beginning of a whole new level. It has been slipping more and more off the cliff ever since.

 

[Bucky]

Very true.

The Obama administration may be out of office, but Gold and Silver Pawn Shop owner Rick Harrison said right now business in the U.S. is “literally a nightmare.”


“The effect of the eight years of Obama is finally showing up,” Harrison told the FOX Business Network. “We had .7 GDP [growth]…in the last quarter and if you figure GDP the way we did four years ago, that would be negative growth. Four years ago…they decided all R&D [suddenly] goes into the plus column instead of the expense column and…it was a way the administration actually boosted up GDP,” he said, adding that President Trump should make it easier to do business in the country.

Obama Created a Nightmare for Business, says 'Pawn Star' Rick Harrison | Fox Business

Mr. Harrison isn't the only business owner.

 

[Lutherf]

I beleive "Left Wing" is an identity... it's the original identity politic.

https://english.stackexchange.com/q...used-to-indicate-socialist-liberals-and-right.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Left–right_politics#History_of_the_terms

I understand what your saying though.

But French Nobles were blaming "left wingers" long before Fox started.

"Left wing" really can't be an identity because it's a relative term. Whether or not a political ideology is "left wing" is wholly dependent on where all the other political ideologies lie on the spectrum. Democrat, for example, is an identity that likely includes some left wing ideologues. "Democrat" defines the identity and "left wing" describes the likely ideology held by the identified group.

 

[Perotista]

A lot of the analysts keep saying Tribal politics is ruining america, or tribalism is worse than it's ever been. After the election Tuesday, which actually felt like a national election, I would tend to agree, especially on the internet.

I have seen more extreme comments than ever before online and underneath all of the hate and all of the rhetoric politics in America has boiled down to, "Na Na Na Na." or "I was right." There is no more discussion about issues. If there ever were and if you do talk about certain hot button topics. EX: Gun Control, Abortion, Global Warming and go in with a different point of view, people don't debate your view. They just call you an idiot.

So the question is, has it always been this bad on DP? In your life?

*Yes I realize I do this too.

On DP it might depend on whom you have a conversation with. I've had many interesting discussions. In the past, elections were more about issues and stances, policy and visions then they have been recently or should I say the last 20 years or so. The personal attack along with opposition research certainly has lessen the substance of elections. Abortion and gun control has always been hot issues. Each side think they're 100% right on those issues and usually there isn't any compromise available that could be had. It's an all or nothing.

I talk a ton of politics on this site, but outside of DP's forum, hardly none at all. I am more of a live and let live kind of guy and have lived my life pretty much accordingly. Politics is interesting, understanding why and how elections turn out the way they do is where my energy is put forth. It doesn't bother me if one is pro choice or pro life, a candidates stance on that issue is irrelevant to me. As for folks as a whole, that's their decision. As long as no one tries to force their views on me, let them do as they please.

 

[calamity]

Obama Created a Nightmare for Business, says 'Pawn Star' Rick Harrison | Fox Business

Mr. Harrison isn't the only business owner.

:lamo

 

[haymarket]

Without that "mechanism left over from the 1700's" I don't think the country would have lasted as long as it has, and if it had, it wouldn't be the land of liberty and freedom that it is now. I think it would have ended up far worse, and possibly not even have survived as a nation.

Completely disagree and your comment is 100% speculation based on nothing other than your support for a system that provides your party with a perceived political advantage. And that is what the arguments in favor of the EC always come down to in the end.

 

[eohrnberger]

Completely disagree and your comment is 100% speculation based on nothing other than your support for a system that provides your party with a perceived political advantage. And that is what the arguments in favor of the EC always come down to in the end.

I'm sure you disagree. A Republic, not a direct democracy.

Sent from my HTC6515LVW using Tapatalk

 

[haymarket]

I'm sure you disagree. A Republic, not a direct democracy.

Sent from my HTC6515LVW using Tapatalk

You cannot have a direct democracy in a nation of over 300 million people due to real world practical considerations of time and space which would not make it practical nor even possible.