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The trump tax cuts have given us 4, 5, 6 % growth and paid for themselves

jpn said:
Trump ran for president in 2015 and 2016, telling the nation that the economy was horrible and he'd make it vastly better.

But annual job growth totals from both 2015 and 2016 were better than any year of the Republican's tenure, at least so far.

Trump has now been in office for three full years (36 months), and during that time, the economy has created 6.56 million jobs. In the final full three years of Obama's presidency, the economy created 8.08 million jobs.

Trump inherited a strong economy from Obama, and hasn't screwed it up too much. He's increased the deficit a lot. That's about all you can say.

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Tbird19482 said:
NO not everybody is winning
the cost of living has gone up way more since 1970 then wages have
how much has the cost of living gone up since 1970 - Google Search
as you can see avg. people have not gotten wage increases large enough to keep up with inflation
The only people who are making out are the upper middle class and above people that have money enough to live on and can afford to take money and invest it
the lower wage earners are not making out but going backwards
and there are a lot more people that have to get gov. help now a days then years ago
and if it wasn't for that gov. help they might be out on the streets with out a roof over their heads or food to eat
NO " everyone " is not winning
Have a nice day
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Define cost of living. Food is better, cars are better, houses are better and bigger. Healthcare is better. People are living longer. They have instant communication, computers, access to information and travel. Why would the cost of living, at a much higher standard, stay the same? Wages are tied to value and production. Are people staying competitive?


The average cost of buying a new car in 1999 was $20,686; adjusted for inflation, that price today should be $31,874. However, according to Kelly Blue Book, the average cost of buying a new car in April 2019 was $37,185, 14% higher than the price when accounting for inflation.
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For example, does this mean someone has to buy a new car? Or the average cost car?
 
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jonny5 said:
Right, so more jobs, lower taxes. WINNING
I agree, the deficit is worse. Democrat House, Republican Senate, and Trump need to stop signing increased spending and do something about entitlements.
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Try doing it while reducing the deficit, like Obama did in all but one year.

I'd love to see Republicans have the guts to actually run on "doing something about entitlements." Run on cutting Social Security and cutting Medicare. Go ahead. :popcorn2:
 
jonny5 said:
People are living longer.
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No they aren't. Life expectancy is actually declining in the US for middle and lower income Americans. It continues to increase for the wealthy. Life expectancy in the US is about 4 years less than in France.
 
jonny5 said:
Define cost of living. Food is better, cars are better, houses are better and bigger. Healthcare is better. People are living longer. They have instant communication, computers, access to information and travel. Why would the cost of living, at a much higher standard, stay the same? Wages are tied to value and production. Are people staying competitive?




For example, does this mean someone has to buy a new car? Or the average cost car?
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This may be true but if you had bothered to read some of the articles I posted you would have known that inflation alone has gone up a lot more then wages have and the avg. person doesn't have the buying power today as they had 20 or so years ago
as one article said inflation alone has gone up 1.36 per hour and wages have only gone up a dollar an hour
That for a lot of people is not getting ahead but dropping behind.
Have a nice day
 
Tbird19482 said:
This may be true but if you had bothered to read some of the articles I posted you would have known that inflation alone has gone up a lot more then wages have and the avg. person doesn't have the buying power today as they had 20 or so years ago
as one article said inflation alone has gone up 1.36 per hour and wages have only gone up a dollar an hour
That for a lot of people is not getting ahead but dropping behind.
Have a nice day
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Why is it that people like you who claim to be so smart haven't started your own businesses to pay the employees what you think they should be paid? You like far too many have no understanding of context and the difference between the Obama economy built on the public sector and gov't spending vs. the Trump economy built on Private sector growth and no massive gov't spending stimulus. you can manipulate the GDP number with massive stimulus spending which happened in 2009-2010 yet that gov't spending never created the full time jobs promised thus new taxpayers
 
Conservative said:
Why is it that people like you who claim to be so smart haven't started your own businesses to pay the employees what you think they should be paid? You like far too many have no understanding of context and the difference between the Obama economy built on the public sector and gov't spending vs. the Trump economy built on Private sector growth and no massive gov't spending stimulus. you can manipulate the GDP number with massive stimulus spending which happened in 2009-2010 yet that gov't spending never created the full time jobs promised thus new taxpayers
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So you now know what I have done over my lifetime?
and you think you know more about my life then I do. Thanks for letting us all know
Thanks for telling me what I have done and haven't done.
You know nothing about me and what I have done so don't go making a fool of yourself telling people what YOU think they have or haven't done
Have a nice day
 
Tbird19482 said:
So you now know what I have done over my lifetime?
and you think you know more about my life then I do. Thanks for letting us all know
Thanks for telling me what I have done and haven't done.
You know nothing about me and what I have done so don't go making a fool of yourself telling people what YOU think they have or haven't done
Have a nice day
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I know what you have done here since December 2018, show complete and total ignorance to the budget, the GDP, and the Obama results, a true radical liberal who cannot celebrate any success and cheerleads those who promote class envy, jealousy and politics of personal destruction
 
jpn said:
Try doing it while reducing the deficit, like Obama did in all but one year.

I'd love to see Republicans have the guts to actually run on "doing something about entitlements." Run on cutting Social Security and cutting Medicare. Go ahead. :popcorn2:
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Obama didnt do it, but im all for repeating what the Republicans forced on him in 2013, sequestration. Unfortunately Democrats took back the house in 2014 and started the push to raise the budget caps.

I too would like to see ANYONE run on cutting medicare.
 
Tbird19482 said:
This may be true but if you had bothered to read some of the articles I posted you would have known that inflation alone has gone up a lot more then wages have and the avg. person doesn't have the buying power today as they had 20 or so years ago
as one article said inflation alone has gone up 1.36 per hour and wages have only gone up a dollar an hour
That for a lot of people is not getting ahead but dropping behind.
Have a nice day
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Im not here to read articles. Just quote the relevant part that supports an argument you make. Thats how debate works. Inflation going up doesnt really matter. What you can buy with your buying power gets you so much more with globalization, mass production, and increases in quality. Which is why the STANDARD of living is so much higher. Not to mention access to credit has extended buying power. Point being, one stat averaged out doesnt tell a story about an individual. Individuals are better off than 50 years ago.
 
jonny5 said:
Unfortunately Democrats took back the house in 2014 and started the push to raise the budget caps.
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The Dem's lost the House in 2010 and didn't regain it until 2018.
 
SouthernDemocrat said:
A tax cut will increase economic growth when taxes are high enough that they are impairing economic growth. If current tax rates are not high enough to impair economic growth, then cutting taxes doesn't lead to a sustained increase in GDP growth. This stuff isn't complicated.

The fact is, fiscal policy has very little to do with economic growth at the national level (or the state level for that matter). No one wakes up in the morning and thinks "My top marginal effective tax rate dropped 2 percentage points, I am going to hire 100 new workers.", or "I got a 1% tax increase on my top marginal rate, I am not buying that bass boat now." That just doesn't happen. Monetary policy has an impact, but you would be hard pressed to ever correlate any fiscal policy changes to economic growth.
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Bingo. I have worked in startups since the mid-80s. At no time did any of us or our founders make decisions based upon our taxable income should we all become rich. It never came up. What did come up was the love of the work and the desire to change the world and ourselves at the same time.
 
jonny5 said:
Im not here to read articles. Just quote the relevant part that supports an argument you make. Thats how debate works. Inflation going up doesnt really matter. What you can buy with your buying power gets you so much more with globalization, mass production, and increases in quality. Which is why the STANDARD of living is so much higher. Not to mention access to credit has extended buying power. Point being, one stat averaged out doesnt tell a story about an individual. Individuals are better off than 50 years ago.
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Sorry I won't bother to educate with facts ever again
You have your mind closed and nobody is ever going to change it with ffacts
Have a nice night
 
jpn said:
Notice the part of the graph at the end? In 2014 it was 78.84. Then started dropping. 2017 78.53.

It's even more stark by income groups. Life expectancy for the lowest income group is about 10 years lower than life expectancy for the wealthiest in the US.
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Irrelevent. The time span you used was 1970.

Pew Research Center estimates that since 1970, the share of the nation’s income earned by families in the middle class has fallen from almost two-thirds to around 40 percent.
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The point Im making is the nations income has significantly increased since then along with the standard of living.
 
Tbird19482 said:
Sorry I won't bother to educate with facts ever again
You have your mind closed and nobody is ever going to change it with ffacts
Have a nice night
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Still waiting for you to post any facts that support your liberal ideology as there is nothing independent in anything you post. Liberalism is a feel good ideology where spending in the name of compassion is what matters, not actual results. You see making someone dependent on the federal taxpayers is the result of all that spending and there is no compassion in that. Dependence isn't compassion as it destroys incentive. I am sure you really appreciated what someone else gave you a lot more than when you earned it yourself.
 
Conservative said:
Still waiting for you to post any facts that support your liberal ideology as there is nothing independent in anything you post. Liberalism is a feel good ideology where spending in the name of compassion is what matters, not actual results. You see making someone dependent on the federal taxpayers is the result of all that spending and there is no compassion in that. Dependence isn't compassion as it destroys incentive. I am sure you really appreciated what someone else gave you a lot more than when you earned it yourself.
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Oh so now a person who post a lot less facts and backs them up ( once in awhile ) is saying I don't LOL.
The guy that wants everybody to pay FIT then says he wants people to keep more of what they earn.
again you should be saying is I want the upper middle class, the rich and corps to keep more of what they earn and the people who can least afford it not keep as much as they earn now
it doesn't matter to you that these people are working two jobs , a lot of them at min.. wage and have to get help from the Gov. just to keep a roof over their heads and food on their tables
Yes the guy that wants to take money away from the poor and working lower class and lower middle class and give it to the upper middle class / rich and large Corps.
Have a nice day
 
Conservative said:
Still waiting for you to post any facts that support your liberal ideology as there is nothing independent in anything you post. Liberalism is a feel good ideology where spending in the name of compassion is what matters, not actual results. You see making someone dependent on the federal taxpayers is the result of all that spending and there is no compassion in that. Dependence isn't compassion as it destroys incentive. I am sure you really appreciated what someone else gave you a lot more than when you earned it yourself.
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and one more thing YOU have no Idea what I earned or paid in taxes over my life time,
You are back to thinking you know everything about me when you know nothing
and it is fact under Trumps " tax cut " I have to pay more FIT then I did before it and I pay taxes on my SS benefits , but I still do very well thank you
Have a nice day
 
Tbird19482 said:
Oh so now a person who post a lot less facts and backs them up ( once in awhile ) is saying I don't LOL.
The guy that wants everybody to pay FIT then says he wants people to keep more of what they earn.
again you should be saying is I want the upper middle class, the rich and corps to keep more of what they earn and the people who can least afford it not keep as much as they earn now
it doesn't matter to you that these people are working two jobs , a lot of them at min.. wage and have to get help from the Gov. just to keep a roof over their heads and food on their tables
Yes the guy that wants to take money away from the poor and working lower class and lower middle class and give it to the upper middle class / rich and large Corps.
Have a nice day
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I keep reading your posts and see a lot of words claiming you post facts but sure haven't seen any. Please point out the facts in this post of yours?
 
Tbird19482 said:
and one more thing YOU have no Idea what I earned or paid in taxes over my life time,
You are back to thinking you know everything about me when you know nothing
and it is fact under Trumps " tax cut " I have to pay more FIT then I did before it and I pay taxes on my SS benefits , but I still do very well thank you
Have a nice day
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No and like most Conservatives I really don't care, it is people like you who focus on what someone else earns and pays in taxes and then uses your own standards of judging others. You claim that low income earning Americans cannot pay something to live in the greatest country on the face of the earth which is pure rhetoric and naivety on your part as to you it is all about compassion and giving people something free. there is no such thing as a free lunch in this country as someone has to pay for it.

Now you want an entity that doesn't cost the country a dime(corporations) who employ people, corporations that wouldn't earn a dime without people to pay taxes. Haven't see any corporation in a grocery store but have seen a lot of people who WORK for corporations in grocery stores.

You are indeed paying more in FIT because you can no longer deduct the full cost of liberalism in your state as your complete selfishness is on full display. why should the Federal taxpayers subsidize the high cost of liberal programs in your state. As for paying taxes on SS benefits, when did that start as I assure you it has nothing to do with Trump or Republicans
 
jonny5 said:
Irrelevent. The time span you used was 1970.
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You want to use a time span that begins later? You can't because people haven't had a chance to die yet!

jonny5 said:
The point Im making is the nations income has significantly increased since then along with the standard of living.
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That may be the point you're trying to make. The point you're actually making is that you're still learning. Which is okay, we all start somewhere. At least you're interested, which is more than many Americans. I just wish you'd use mainstream sources so you get the accepted data serious people use to make decisions. There's a great deal of misinformation out there, and it takes some sophistication to separate the wheat from the chaff.

Life expectancy for less wealthy Americans is declining. They live on average 10 fewer years than an upper income person. So slashing taxes for the wealthy while trying to repeal health care for poorer Americans is just sick. Here's what it looks like by region:

LifeExpectancy.jpg
 
Kushinator said:
Government revenue would have been $250 billion higher sans the Trump tax cuts.
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Cool so people were able to keep 250 b of their own money and spend it back into the economy than giving it to the government
where they get 0 benefit from.

250 b dollars went to hire more people, pay more wages and increase the prosperity of working americans in which they were also
able to buy more things or invest a bit more into their future.

vs giving to the all consuming government were the 250 billion dollars would have gone to someone special interest pocket.

Federal Income Taxes and Federal Spending Both Set Records in FY19 | CNSNews

the federal government ended up collecting 1.7 trillion more dollars than it did in 2018.
that is a huge sum of money on individual tax returns were the government earns the majority
of it's money.

We do not have a revenue issue the government has a spending problem.
 
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Conservative said:
No and like most Conservatives I really don't care, it is people like you who focus on what someone else earns and pays in taxes and then uses your own standards of judging others. You claim that low income earning Americans cannot pay something to live in the greatest country on the face of the earth which is pure rhetoric and naivety on your part as to you it is all about compassion and giving people something free. there is no such thing as a free lunch in this country as someone has to pay for it.

Now you want an entity that doesn't cost the country a dime(corporations) who employ people, corporations that wouldn't earn a dime without people to pay taxes. Haven't see any corporation in a grocery store but have seen a lot of people who WORK for corporations in grocery stores.

You are indeed paying more in FIT because you can no longer deduct the full cost of liberalism in your state as your complete selfishness is on full display. why should the Federal taxpayers subsidize the high cost of liberal programs in your state. As for paying taxes on SS benefits, when did that start as I assure you it has nothing to do with Trump or Republicans
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LOL
it was I who showed you that the people that run the " Debt clock " used info from the US treasury to correct their clock several times a week
I have posted a lot more facts then you have and I am the one that backed them up showing you where I got my info
It is you that doesn't hardly back up what you post
Now you say paying taxes on SS benefits had nothing to do with Trump OR the REPUBLICANS
well I never said it had anything to do with TRUMP
Your just trying to change what I said AGAIN.
but as for the Republicans having nothing to do with it that is a lie.
well it was started under REAGAN , wasn't he a Republican?
and here is where you can read the facts about it
WildTangent Games for HP - Top Games
and again I show you where I got my info , like I do most of the time and YOU don't
Have a nice day
 
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