Socialist Zohran Mamdani wins NYC primary

[johnwk]

Us having this conversation via the internet is thanks to democratic socialistic practices in the US

If tax payer money didn’t fund the infrastructure and technology - there would be no internet.

I’m not a socialist. But I do see the value in democratic socialist practices and think the US needs MORE of it because unfettered capitalism ALWAYS screws the little guy.

“Under a just and equal Government, every individual is entitled to protection in the enjoyment of the whole product of his labor, except such portion of it as is necessary to enable Government to protect the rest; this is given only in consideration of the protection offered. In every bounty, exclusive right, or monopoly, Government violates the stipulation on her part; for, by such a regulation, the product of one man’s labor is transferred to the use and enjoyment of another. The exercise of such a right on the part of Government can be justified on no other principle, than that the whole product of the labor or every individual is the real property of Government, and may be distributed among the several parts of the community by government discretion; such a supposition would directly involve the idea, that every individual in the community is merely a slave and bondsman to Government, who, although he may labor, is not to expect protection in the product of his labor. An authority given to any Government to exercise such a principle, would lead to a complete system of tyranny.” Representative Giles, speaking before Congress on February 3rd, 1792


Your love affair with socialism does not protect the property each has in their own labor. Instead, it takes from the most productive and redistributes it to the politically well connected.

 

[CLAX1911]

They dont die of starvation lol they would have a higher infant mortality rate if that were the case.

In China in the 1960s on socialist government 78 million people died.

About 80% of the patients come from Latin America and the Caribbean, but the facility has attracted patients from as far away as Japan and Finland.

Yeah so most of it's from countries that are worse.

The embargo makes it difficult for Americans to use this option.

Why would they. List the world-renowned cardiothoracic surgeons in Cuba.

 

[CLAX1911]

You don't need to pledge allegiance to any ideology.
You're already benefiting from the Capitalist ideology by living in this country and enjoying the fruits of capitalism in the greatest capitalist country in the world.
Keep in mind: The business of America is business.
You asked:" Do you think NYC voters at every income bracket don't know they already pay massive taxes?"

The people in the lower tax brackets are the one who are counting on a Muslim Socialist who wants to give away free shit in order to get elected mayor. Those who pay higher taxes want to keep Adams as mayor.

In Ancient Rome, the slaves also benefited from bread and circuses. It is fruitless to try and compare ancient Roman citizens to American citizens who volunteer to serve in the armed forces. There is no basis for comparison other than Roman citizens could volunteer to become a legionnaire and make it a career.

I would say living in any other place that calls itself socialist and you're not starving to death that's thanks to capitalism.

 

[Slartibartfast]

“Under a just and equal Government, every individual is entitled to protection in the enjoyment of the whole product of his labor, except such portion of it as is necessary to enable Government to protect the rest; this is given only in consideration of the protection offered. In every bounty, exclusive right, or monopoly, Government violates the stipulation on her part; for, by such a regulation, the product of one man’s labor is transferred to the use and enjoyment of another. The exercise of such a right on the part of Government can be justified on no other principle, than that the whole product of the labor or every individual is the real property of Government, and may be distributed among the several parts of the community by government discretion; such a supposition would directly involve the idea, that every individual in the community is merely a slave and bondsman to Government, who, although he may labor, is not to expect protection in the product of his labor. An authority given to any Government to exercise such a principle, would lead to a complete system of tyranny.” Representative Giles, speaking before Congress on February 3rd, 1792

Why should we care what a dead person thinks?

 

[jaypatriot]

No, let's not. But it's cute that you think "American" and "capitalist" are synonyms.

America is synonymous with Capitalism.
We are the biggest and greatest capitalist nation in the world.
How can you separate the two terms unless, of course, you voted for Mamdani who wants New York City to embrace Socialism and bring NYC down further?

 

[jaypatriot]

I would say living in any other place that calls itself socialist and you're not starving to death that's thanks to capitalism.

Let's hear it for Cuban Socialism.

 

[Slartibartfast]

America is synonymous with Capitalism.
We are the biggest and greatest capitalist nation in the world.
How can you separate the two terms unless, of course, you voted for Mamdani who wants New York City to embrace Socialism and bring NYC down further?

America is a certain bit of land and is not synonymous with anything beyond that. What matters is the people in it and there are a lot of cultures in this country.

 

[CLAX1911]

America is synonymous with Capitalism.
We are the biggest and greatest capitalist nation in the world.
How can you separate the two terms unless, of course, you voted for Mamdani who wants New York City to embrace Socialism and bring NYC down further?

But if we just listen to the people that got 120 million people killed last century things will be better right?

I'd like to promoting naziers we just need to kill all the Jews because that will make life better it doesn't you're wrong it's proven.

 

[CLAX1911]

Let's hear it for Cuban Socialism.

But they have more trained doctors you know if I need heart surgery I'm going to go to Cuba. Forget Scott and White or the Houston medical center those aren't bastions of healthcare I'm going to go to the cigar place.

 

[BirdinHand]

The people in the lower tax brackets are the one who are counting on a Muslim Socialist who wants to give away free shit in order to get elected mayor. Those who pay higher taxes want to keep Adams as mayor

I think you’d me surprised at how many decently wealthy NYC individuals support Mamdani.

If you’re paying a lot of taxes already, you want to see a return in your community.

My town is always voting to approval budget referendums that slightly increase our local taxes - but benefit everyone. There is a tax freeze on seniors here in NJ under a certain income level, so we aren’t driving Granny on SS out of the house she’d lived in for 50 years by doing so.

Pretty sure NYC has similar programs.

 

[jaypatriot]

America is a certain bit of land and is not synonymous with anything beyond that. What matters is the people in it and there are a lot of cultures in this country.

And the smart people in this country have learned how to assimilate into the general culture and not do stupid things like wrap oneself in a Mexican flag while protesting against the government and country they were desperate to sneak into.

 

[bomberfox]

Absolutely not it thanks to capitalism this isn't a government website.

So money collected strictly from private Enterprise.

Socialist Democrat or democrat socialist or potato salad store bacon and cheese socialist it's all the same thing.

So let's look at the 20th century you had the USSR you had china you had Germany when you had Italy and then you had the United States.

Which one were immigrants pouring into? Was it the one that had the socialist dictator the one that had the other socialist dictator the one that had the other socialist dictator or was it the United States?

Unfettered capitalism is so bad why is everyone breaking their neck to get here still?

We were in the process of reforming capitalism back then. Unfettered capitalism leads to Esau scrip and your boss taking out losses out of your paycheck while fixing the prices in the company store he owns to rob you further of the value of your paycheck.

Again the 100 million number is a lie even according to the black book’s other authors.

 

[Slartibartfast]

And the smart people in this country have learned how to assimilate into the general culture and not do stupid things like wrap oneself in a Mexican flag while protesting against the government and country they were desperate to sneak into.

"The general culture" is a conservative myth. It doesn't exist in real life. In reality, the US is a huge number of competing subcultures.

 

[CLAX1911]

We were in the process of reforming capitalism back then. Unfettered capitalism leads to Esau scrip and your boss taking out losses out of your paycheck

No it doesn't. If my boss did that to me one time I'd leave he wouldn't be my boss anymore. That's not an option you haven't socialism so what you're talking about comes from socialism

while fixing the prices in the company store he owns to rob you further of the value of your paycheck.

You can't fix prices in capitalism. That's corporatism that's a step closer to socialism.

 

[BirdinHand]

” Representative Giles, speaking before Congress on February 3rd, 1792

Giles was an anti-federalist.

He would have no opinion on what NYC did/didn’t do - as he was from Virginia.



I don’t think you have a grasp on how little interference in the politics, business, taxation, etc the anti-federalists had with other states.

Someone from Virginia would hear of Mamdani’s proposals and simply hope the folks in VA never got the snooty attitude that THEY wanted, rent control, for example.

 

[johnwk]

Why should we care what a dead person thinks?

Seems to me you are all in with "From each according to their ability to each according to their needs". Is Karl Marx sill alive?

 

[bomberfox]

“Under a just and equal Government, every individual is entitled to protection in the enjoyment of the whole product of his labor, except such portion of it as is necessary to enable Government to protect the rest; this is given only in consideration of the protection offered. In every bounty, exclusive right, or monopoly, Government violates the stipulation on her part; for, by such a regulation, the product of one man’s labor is transferred to the use and enjoyment of another. The exercise of such a right on the part of Government can be justified on no other principle, than that the whole product of the labor or every individual is the real property of Government, and may be distributed among the several parts of the community by government discretion; such a supposition would directly involve the idea, that every individual in the community is merely a slave and bondsman to Government, who, although he may labor, is not to expect protection in the product of his labor. An authority given to any Government to exercise such a principle, would lead to a complete system of tyranny.” Representative Giles, speaking before Congress on February 3rd, 1792


Your love affair with socialism does not protect the property each has in their own labor. Instead, it takes from the most productive and redistributes it to the politically well connected.

Umm no. It actually doesnt lol. Personal property is allowed under socialism and 100% taxation wasnt really a thing. This was Marx’s critique of Proudhon.
The founders certainly didnt care about the property rights of black people.
You just dont get to own a factory all to yourself

 

[johnwk]

Giles was an anti-federalist.

He would have no opinion on what NYC did/didn’t do - as he was from Virginia.



I don’t think you have a grasp on how little interference in the politics, business, taxation, etc the anti-federalists had with other states.

Someone from Virginia would hear of Mamdani’s proposals and simply hope the folks in VA never got the snooty attitude that THEY wanted, rent control, for example.

Your deflection from what Giles stated is noted.. Now, how about addressing what he stated?

“Under a just and equal Government, every individual is entitled to protection in the enjoyment of the whole product of his labor, except such portion of it as is necessary to enable Government to protect the rest; this is given only in consideration of the protection offered. In every bounty, exclusive right, or monopoly, Government violates the stipulation on her part; for, by such a regulation, the product of one man’s labor is transferred to the use and enjoyment of another. The exercise of such a right on the part of Government can be justified on no other principle, than that the whole product of the labor or every individual is the real property of Government, and may be distributed among the several parts of the community by government discretion; such a supposition would directly involve the idea, that every individual in the community is merely a slave and bondsman to Government, who, although he may labor, is not to expect protection in the product of his labor. An authority given to any Government to exercise such a principle, would lead to a complete system of tyranny.” Representative Giles, speaking before Congress on February 3rd, 1792


Your love affair with socialism does not protect the property each has in their own labor. Instead, it takes from the most productive and redistributes it to the politically well connected.

 

[BirdinHand]

America is synonymous with Capitalism.
We are the biggest and greatest capitalist nation in the world.
How can you separate the two terms unless, of course, you voted for Mamdani who wants New York City to embrace Socialism and bring NYC down further?

NYC metropolitan area ranks as one of the top 10 economies in the WORLD.

Right behind places like Italy, India, France.

It has a higher gross economy than Canada.

Mamdani wants to enact policies that will benefit residents in NYC.

 

[bomberfox]

Let's hear it for Cuban Socialism.

Is that why people are still not starving to death despite the embargo?

 

[BirdinHand]

Your deflection from what Giles stated is noted.. Now, how about addressing what he stated?

I did address what he stated.

Giles was addressing the FEDERAL CONGRESS.

He was an anti-federalist.

Do you understand what an anti-federalist is?


Do you understand the difference between federal government and Mamdani running for a mayor?

 

[johnwk]

I did address what he stated.

No. You deflected from the content of his speech. He stated:

“Under a just and equal Government, every individual is entitled to protection in the enjoyment of the whole product of his labor, except such portion of it as is necessary to enable Government to protect the rest; this is given only in consideration of the protection offered. In every bounty, exclusive right, or monopoly, Government violates the stipulation on her part; for, by such a regulation, the product of one man’s labor is transferred to the use and enjoyment of another. The exercise of such a right on the part of Government can be justified on no other principle, than that the whole product of the labor or every individual is the real property of Government, and may be distributed among the several parts of the community by government discretion; such a supposition would directly involve the idea, that every individual in the community is merely a slave and bondsman to Government, who, although he may labor, is not to expect protection in the product of his labor. An authority given to any Government to exercise such a principle, would lead to a complete system of tyranny.” Representative Giles, speaking before Congress on February 3rd, 1792


Your love affair with socialism does not protect the property each has in their own labor. Instead, it takes from the most productive and redistributes it to the politically well connected.

 

[BirdinHand]

Let's hear it for Cuban Socialism.

Poor people in Cuba are incredibly financially poor - but they have guaranteed access to healthcare, education (Cuba for example - has better literacy rates than the US), etc.

If the US didn’t embargo Cuba, they’d be much better off financially and Americans would have yet another neighbor who has a higher quality of life for many people

How much longer can the divide between the rich and poor keep growing in the US? How much wider do you think it can get?

 

[Slartibartfast]

Seems to me you are all in with "From each according to their ability to each according to their needs". Is Karl Marx sill alive?

Or I am somewhere in between the two extremes you just identified, like 99% of people.

 

[BirdinHand]

You deflected from the content of his speech

You are ignoring the audience and pretending his opinion given to a FEDERAL Congress would be the same as a speech and opinion given to a local or state legislative authority.

He believed that the levy and utilization of taxes should be as close to the person as possible. He was a proponent of local and state funding for roads, canals, schools, etc.

He would have argued that how NYC wanted to tax individuals and what they utilized those taxes for was NYCs business.