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Sickness or Society?

Renae said:
Sorry, that's what I said basically. I was desperate for another path and would have taken it. I'm at the point now I want to see this through.
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Oh gods, yes. If you have gone this far, even if the availability was suddenly here today, it would be best to finish this path than try to backtrack. I was only pointing out that there are many trans, even the ones here on DP, who, if there was (hypothetically) a choice of conforming body to brain or brain to body, both having equal success with no additional damage, it would probably be just as common to chose to conform the brain as it would be to chose to conform the body.
 
calamity said:
I read her response--"I spent 20 years trying to take a different approach" --to be saying just that.
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True enough. But that was 20 years of there being nothing else that worked. I believe you, me, even CC all agree that there is a possibility even a probability (with no implication of a time frame), that such a successful conforming of the brain to match the body. And with it it will allow trans people to have a choice as to which way they can go. Right now all they have is a single choice that will work, albeit one where there are different lengths needed for specific individuals to alieve the dysphoria.
 
maquiscat said:
Oh gods, yes. If you have gone this far, even if the availability was suddenly here today, it would be best to finish this path than try to backtrack. I was only pointing out that there are many trans, even the ones here on DP, who, if there was (hypothetically) a choice of conforming body to brain or brain to body, both having equal success with no additional damage, it would probably be just as common to chose to conform the brain as it would be to chose to conform the body.
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Yep, but you'd have to erase memories, alter my body drastically back... I love all these things going on in my life. I didn't buy all those shoes just to trade them in for loafers and sneakers!
 
Henrin said:
They can not, which is why I said it wasn't the only factor. It is however true that their brain scans come back with low activity in the orbital cortex due to underdevelopment.
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Are you saying that 100% of psychopaths (per the example) will have these brain scan of lowered activity, while not 100% of those with such lowered activity will be psychopaths?
 
maquiscat said:
True enough. But that was 20 years of there being nothing else that worked. I believe you, me, even CC all agree that there is a possibility even a probability (with no implication of a time frame), that such a successful conforming of the brain to match the body. And with it it will allow trans people to have a choice as to which way they can go. Right now all they have is a single choice that will work, albeit one where there are different lengths needed for specific individuals to alieve the dysphoria.
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From what I am reading about the brain structure of the trans brain? No. I do not believe it will ever be corrected after it's already happened. How do you change the stria terminalis once it's been formed?

No. IMO, the only "hope" for correcting this is prenatal treatments. Going there is probably where we are heading given current technology. Of course, we would first have to crush the idiots who insist that prenatal care is a waste of taxpayer money before we can implement anything universal along those lines.
 
Henrin said:
When I did say that? Please quote me saying anything like that. I remember saying the exact opposite hundreds of times, so please, find a post of mine that supports your accusation.
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So, you agree it's a biological condition, but you still insist that there are no medical tests being performed and that SRS is not a workable treatment? Please explain all these contradictions, if that is true.
 
calamity said:
So, you agree it's a biological condition, but you still insist that there are no medical tests being performed and that SRS is not a workable treatment? Please explain all these contradictions, if that is true.
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There is no contradiction.
 
Henrin said:
Nope, there isn't one.
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The biggest problem with your position is:
You admit there isn't a viable treatment that fixes the brain, yet you have no alternative to the suffering Trans people have, "Sorry it sucks you got this problem, but transitioning isn't the right best solution, you'll just have to wait for science to figure it out."
 
calamity said:
From what I am reading about the brain structure of the trans brain? No. I do not believe it will ever be corrected after it's already happened. How do you change the stria terminalis once it's been formed?

No. IMO, the only "hope" for correcting this is prenatal treatments. Going there is probably where we are heading given current technology. Of course, we would first have to crush the idiots who insist that prenatal care is a waste of taxpayer money before we can implement anything universal along those lines.
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How many technologies and how much knowledge do we have today, that in times past we would say or be saying, "how would you even do that?" One of the great things I love about the future, and am sad that much of it I will never see, is that what we don't know how to do today or even have an inkling at, we will figure out later. Do I expect this in my lifetime? Doubtful, but it wouldn't surprise me. The big thing will not be can we do it, but can we apply it ethically? There are those among us who don't feel what we do currently is ethical, so no doubt when we do learn how to do these things they will claim it unethical.
 
maquiscat said:
How many technologies and how much knowledge do we have today, that in times past we would say or be saying, "how would you even do that?" One of the great things I love about the future, and am sad that much of it I will never see, is that what we don't know how to do today or even have an inkling at, we will figure out later. Do I expect this in my lifetime? Doubtful, but it wouldn't surprise me. The big thing will not be can we do it, but can we apply it ethically? There are those among us who don't feel what we do currently is ethical, so no doubt when we do learn how to do these things they will claim it unethical.
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Since the mid-80's, I've gone from believing in a future much like we saw in the Jetsons to one we see in Mad Maxx. I've since stepped back some. I not believe we'll probably have one more like Idiocracy.
 
maquiscat said:
1.)Ok so exactly how is this provable as to it is or is not an insult, when the concept is opinion based and subjective? I can call one woman a b***h and she will feel insulted. I can call another woman the same thing, and she will feel complimented. I could have meant the use of the word with the opposite intent each woman took it. The same woman can take the use of the word directed at her from on person as a compliment and from another as an insult. How do you factually determine whether something is an insult or not? At best the only thing you can factually prove is how a majority feels towards whether said thing is insulting or not.
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well thats VERY easy to prove actually, basic common sense and how English and definitions work

1.) i never insulted "HIM"
I said the lie he posted was stupid, if that makes him FEEL insults him oh well thats still not "ME INSULTING HIM"

HUGE difference

I could say that football team X sucks and that may make a person feel insulted but since I didnt say that person sucks I ONLY insulted the football team, not the person. The person is free to FEEL however I wannt but i still never insulted them.

SO actually at best I just proved I never insulted HIM one single time, hence his inability to even qoute me insulting him, he cant because it never happened. It was just another retarded lie that he posted. :)
 
William Rea said:
I believe that the whole problem with changing external appearance is that it is visible which makes people uncomfortable with it, including the people themselves affected. I once heard myself saying, 'I wish I had lost a leg or something like that because then people would be able to physically see my problem and perhaps might understand it...'. By the way, this was not related to an issue about being transgender before the bandwagon starts and, I apologise to transgendered people for feeling like I needed to explain that!

I'm sure that everyone would like an invisible switch in the brain that was able to resolve this BUT, I fear that anything like this might actually also change the underlying personality of the person undergoing the treatment and turn them into someone unrecognisable from who they are.

I don't want to get all hippy about this but, wouldn't it be great if we learnt something about ourselves from understanding the perspective of someone who has developed within two different genders. A woman who has had an insight into the male world and a man who has had an insight into the female world.
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This, actually, exemplifies another issue that I see a lot of. I get a lot of clients with mental health issues who "wish" they had some sort of physical disability. If one is in a wheelchair, for example, they get sympathy and concern, because it is SEEN. Those with mental illnesses are often dismissed because, since we can't "see" it, it often is not taken seriously.
 
Henrin said:
Not many of them actually. Most of the stuff you see them diagnosing actually requires medical tests to be run. Of course, they don't run any medical tests.
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That is completely untrue.
 
Henrin said:
Yes. For example, psychopaths have a disorder where their brain didn't fully develop in the orbital cortex that plays a critical role in regulating imposes and emotions. Due to this brain scans of psychopaths will show decreased activity in the orbital cortex. Of course, that is not the entire picture as genetics plays a role in the disorder as well.
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Yet, not all people with that brain structure will become psychopaths. As usual, the issue is quite complex.
 
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