Should incest be illegal?

[AGENT J]

With current child sex abuse laws and statutory rape, it sounds like incest laws are obsolete. (In America, at least.)

i dont know about obsolete . .but defintily over kill
i have no issues with laws that take on extra punishment for harsher crimes (thats how the system works) but the verbiage should definitely involve consenting adults theres just no rational legal justification for it.

am i gonna fight against the laws in general? no but i would fight against any single case i thought was outrageous . . . again like trying to give consenting adult cousins 5 year felony charges
and if people want to fight to change them, as long as its the consenting adult part, i most certainly wont fight against it

the laws as written are just stupid, it remains me of something i saw here or another board when a DA was going to charge a teenage COUPLE with child porn because they had pic and video of eachother . . . just plain idiotic

 

[Divine_Wind]

Agreed. When it comes to establishing whether something should be illegal, rather than examining my own sense of revulsion at the topic, I try to look at it from a perspective of: "What business do I have dictating to another person that I have the authority to limit their behavior by force?"

This thread is a great example of how people see laws as a limitless opportunity to reshape the world according to what they want it to be, rather than solely as a last resort to protect the basic human rights of everyone.

Agreed. They scream about their rights until they find someone doing something they don't like, then they want to ban it. It's hypocritical.

 

[Dragonfly]

normalizing incest is probably a bad idea.

I have not read every post in this thread, but to my knowledge I haven't seen anyone here suggesting we "normalize" incest.

I don't think anyone thinks it should be socially acceptable.

It's rather gross to think about in many ways. So is the whole golden shower thing too.
Gross is a subjective term isn't it? Two guys making out is gross. Two girls is hot. Obese people having sex is gross.
Who determines what's "gross" enough to make something illegal?

The OP question was about it being illegal.

I could easily get behind the idea of incestuous procreation being illegal.
The price the offspring would pay is absolutely criminal. IMHO

But the OP was far too open-ended a question.

I don't view it as a simple black & white issue.

Not all sexual relationships are built around child bearing, and some sexual relationships can't even possibly result in pregnancy.

So again, if a sexual encounter can't possibly end up with a pregnancy, and the adults engaging in it are fully consenting, why should anyone anywhere give a rat's ass what their biological relationship is with each other?

Not something I'd ever consider engaging in ever, but I see no reason in that scenario to care what others do.
I absolutely see no need to make it illegal under those circumstances.

Just to restate though - if pregnancy is possible, even remotely - I'm supportive of laws against that.

 

[OlNate]

He asked you a question first, so you should answer the question first before asking a question of your own.

Are you pro choice? If so, does this make you pro abortion?

Do you believe in freedom of speech? Does this make you pro white supremacy?

I have not read every post in this thread, but to my knowledge I haven't seen anyone here suggesting we "normalize" incest.

I don't think anyone thinks it should be socially acceptable.

It's rather gross to think about in many ways. So is the whole golden shower thing too.
Gross is a subjective term isn't it? Two guys making out is gross. Two girls is hot. Obese people having sex is gross.
Who determines what's "gross" enough to make something illegal?

The OP question was about it being illegal.

I could easily get behind the idea of incestuous procreation being illegal.
The price the offspring would pay is absolutely criminal. IMHO

But the OP was far too open-ended a question.

I don't view it as a simple black & white issue.

Not all sexual relationships are built around child bearing, and some sexual relationships can't even possibly result in pregnancy.

So again, if a sexual encounter can't possibly end up with a pregnancy, and the adults engaging in it are fully consenting, why should anyone anywhere give a rat's ass what their biological relationship is with each other?

Not something I'd ever consider engaging in ever, but I see no reason in that scenario to care what others do.
I absolutely see no need to make it illegal under those circumstances.

Just to restate though - if pregnancy is possible, even remotely - I'm supportive of laws against that.

Welp...I guess I need to come out and own my prejudice and bigotry towards incest. I know I do a pretty good job of convincing everyone of the opposite, but nobody's perfect, not even me...

I see the sense of what you're saying, I apply the same logic to dealing with things that I find solely "gross" (counter to my own tastes and inclinations would be the way I'd refer to it, but ok, we'll go with "gross"...hehe). And yet I cannot get past the giant "Nope" - again, the same giant "Nope", right or wrong, that I'd have when faced with other utterly socially unacceptable behavior. Adding the risk of pregnancy and the complications of family power dynamics, I have no problem saying that people before me made these rules, and I see nothing about incest that inspires me to want to change them.

Societal norms are decided by society, and the laws, in most cases, form the infrastructure that supports that consensus. If society deems that incest is acceptable, then I will be in the minority, and the law will change. I'm ok with that...having an opinion doesn't necessarily equate to having a sense of entitlement to impose that opinion on others, in such a way as to offset the direction of the majority. I just know where I stand on it. :shrug: In my opinion there are far more negative consequences associated with incest than there are romantic GOT scenarios...this is something that, at least for now, is better left in the realm of extreme social unacceptability, and to have that status supported by law.

I get that I might be called an asshole for that at some point down the line. Hopefully by then they'll have better ways to sort out the bad stuff associated with it.

 

[Deuce]

Ok...………………………………..fair enough.



Well, I think "unpalatable" is a very generous term you're using there. But, no, my personal preference or disgust has nothing to do with this. Incest is a societal taboo, almost universally and throughout time, on the same level that murder and rape are societal taboos. Actually, more so - on the level of bestiality and necrophilia.

As I write this, I realize that I'm ill equipped to explain this - to be honest, I've never given it much thought, I never expected to be in a debate regarding the validity of incest. You could win this through shock value alone. I could talk about psychological impacts, rape statistics, the dynamics of power within a family structure, the risks presented by opening this up...there is a pile of stuff I could throw at it, but honestly, for me, it's knowing it's wrong in the same way that knowing murder or rape or bestiality or necrophilia is wrong. It's an instinctual reaction, and one that is inherent in the vast majority of people, irrespective of any other factor or variable.

Honestly, I wish I hadn't entered this thread, due to the number of times I've written, deleted, and rewritten in this response alone. The best I can do is say that I wouldn't go out of my way to make it illegal if it were legal...but I wouldn't support moving it from an illegal to legal status in the slightest.

But you didn't. You didn't bring up any of that. You spat out some bull**** about genetic disorders.

This is America. "Most people think it's wrong" is not enough to make something a crime. You keep saying it's not about personal disgust yet just about everything you say on the subject reflects exactly that, and only that. Lots of people agreeing with your personal disgust doesn't turn personal disgust into objective, fact-based argument.

 

[OlNate]

But you didn't. You didn't bring up any of that. You spat out some bull**** about genetic disorders.

This is America. "Most people think it's wrong" is not enough to make something a crime. You keep saying it's not about personal disgust yet just about everything you say on the subject reflects exactly that, and only that. Lots of people agreeing with your personal disgust doesn't turn personal disgust into objective, fact-based argument.

Don't care... :shrug: It is what it is.

Anyway...you were never included in the serious part of this discussion. Later.

 

[joko104]

To short answer is YES, incest should be criminally illegal as a matter of social policy.

 

[AliHajiSheik]

Forgive me, but I'm still scratching my head wondering why there's even a thread on incest.

Someone wants it, their sister doesn't, and we are here to help try to convince them one way or the other. I could be wrong, but that is my interpretation of this thread.

 

[Deuce]

To short answer is YES, incest should be criminally illegal as a matter of social policy.

"I don't approve" really isn't good enough for pro-freedom types like myself.

 

[maquiscat]

I like you too much to include you in the pro-incest crowd. Say it ain't so.

You don't have to be for something to point logical inconsistencies of the arguments given, to to champion for others' right to engage in it. For example, you don't have to be pro abortion to be pro choice.

Sent from my Z982 using Tapatalk

 

[CLAX1911]

Hello. This thread is inspired by Dixon01767's exchange with certain posters in the gay marriage thread here.

I believe that in some jurisdictions, incest is illegal. My questions to you, are 1. should incest be illegal and 2. are laws that forbid incest discriminatory?

Let's share our thoughts.

Yes incest should absolutely be illegal. Incest is sexual activity between members of a family. It not only should be illegal between members that are related by sanguinity but also affinity.

Yes it discriminates against incestuous couples as it should. incest if continued through several generations causes horrible maladies.

This isn't even closely comparable to same-sex marriage because same-sex marriage it's two people who are not related committing to one another. Incest involves simply sex between two people who are related.

 

[CLAX1911]

Sexual contact between consenting adults is no one's business but the people directly affected.

Everybody is going to be directly affected when the child is born.

 

[Wan]

This isn't even closely comparable to same-sex marriage because same-sex marriage it's two people who are not related committing to one another.

I do not say, and nor do I imply, that same-sex marriage is the same as incest. I was just inspired by what Dixon's had been talking about with some posters in that other thread.

 

[CLAX1911]

I do not say, and nor do I imply, that same-sex marriage is the same as incest.

Good because it's clearly not. An Uncle or father raping a niece or daughter has no connection to same sex marriage.

I was just inspired by what Dixon's had been talking about with some posters in that other thread.

You didn't think it through did you?

 

[Wan]

Good because it's clearly not. An Uncle or father raping a niece or daughter has no connection to same sex marriage.

This is correct.

You didn't think it through did you?

There is no need to insult me. Also, I really think you are being overly sensitive. I made an innocuous comment and now you are all triggered.

 

[CLAX1911]

"I don't approve" really isn't good enough for pro-freedom types like myself.

It's not just that there's disapproval. Incestuous relationships couldn often do involve coercion, end child abuse. if you have two consenting people of legal age that are related it leads to genetic anomalies in the children that aren't present in none incestuous relationships.

 

[CLAX1911]

This is correct.

There is no need to insult me.

no insult was intended.

Also, I really think you are being overly sensitive.

I think you need to take your crystal ball in for servicing.

I made an innocuous comment and now you are all triggered.

no you started a thread asking a question you should have known the answer to, with just the most cursory amount of research you would have known what I told you. It's ironic that you say I'm triggered, I called you out for making a ridiculous thread. if you just wanted to comment on it there was already a thread going that way.

I don't fault people for making boneheaded posts and threads I've done it. But to accuse me of being overly sensitive and triggered because you didn't think it through is asinine.

 

[Wan]

no insult was intended. I think you need to take your crystal ball in for servicing.

no you started a thread asking a question you should have known the answer to, with just the most cursory amount of research you would have known what I told you. It's ironic that you say I'm triggered, I called you out for making a ridiculous thread. if you just wanted to comment on it there was already a thread going that way.

I don't fault people for making boneheaded posts and threads I've done it. But to accuse me of being overly sensitive and triggered because you didn't think it through is asinine.

I am not in the mood for getting one of those long-winded, back-and-forth exchanges with you. So I will say this again: I do not state, nor do I imply, that SSM is the same as incest.

 

[CLAX1911]

I am not in the mood for getting one of those long-winded, back-and-forth exchanges with you. So I will say this again: I do not state, nor do I imply, that SSM is the same as incest.

To the point of your opening post was what exactly?

 

[Wan]

To the point of your opening post was what exactly?

Uhm...I wanted to talk about incest?

 

[Logician Man]

no insult was intended. I think you need to take your crystal ball in for servicing.

no you started a thread asking a question you should have known the answer to, with just the most cursory amount of research you would have known what I told you. It's ironic that you say I'm triggered, I called you out for making a ridiculous thread. if you just wanted to comment on it there was already a thread going that way.

I don't fault people for making boneheaded posts and threads I've done it. But to accuse me of being overly sensitive and triggered because you didn't think it through is asinine.

//// I think you need to take your crystal ball in for servicing //// :lol:

 

[CLAX1911]

Uhm...I wanted to talk about incest?

So I'm talking about it with you.

 

[Wan]

So I'm talking about it with you.

I thank you for participating in my thread.

 

[Apocalypse]

It's not just that there's disapproval. Incestuous relationships couldn often do involve coercion, end child abuse. if you have two consenting people of legal age that are related it leads to genetic anomalies in the children that aren't present in none incestuous relationships.

So what about gay incest? What about incest between two consenting adults who can't bring children anyway? Should your utopian government get themselves involved in their bedroom too or just in the bedroom of two related people who can bring children together?

And there are people with genetic disorders that can pass that disorder to their baby, too. Should the government be included in their bedroom as well?

 

[lwf]

Everybody is going to be directly affected when the child is born.

How do you feel about sexual contact between two adults with Down Syndrome? Or dwarfism? Should that be illegal?