Republicans issue 123-page defense of Trump ahead of Democrats’ impeachment report

[Slyfox696]

He wouldn't, now please show me a single piece of EVIDENCE, showing that is what he asked.

Sure, no problem. :shrug:

I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike....

...The other thing, there’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it

Read White House Summary of Trump'''s Ukraine Call | Time


I mean, did you REALLY just say that? Trump himself asked Ukraine to "look into" the thing "about Biden's son". The White House put out that call summary.

God, I swear Trump defenders say the stupidest things.


So let's get back to my question:

Please address that. If Trump has a long distrust and a "deep-seated" distrust of Ukraine due to "pervasive corruption", why would the President of the United States want them to investigate a United States citizen?

Please answer that question. Or run away, which is what I suspect you will do.

this is laughable. who DOESN'T Believe that the ukraine has dealt in a lot of corruption in the recent past? I don't think EITHER side denies that fact.

Then why would the President of the United States ask a country known for corruption to investigate an American citizen living in America?

Please answer the question that sjmay clearly doesn't want to answer.

 

[Nalu]

Republicans saw the same evidence that the Dems did. The Republicans have reached their opinion of that evidence. Nothing wrong with that.

Republicans haven't even seen the committee's report yet. They're not trying to correct the record or dispute a conclusion. They're trying to undermine the congressional process and control the narrative. They're allowed to do that obviously. I just think it's sad that they continue to try to delegitimitize the process every day while they bitch about the process every day.

 

[RAMOSS]

YOu mean facts that you refuse to acknowledge which have been posted to you time and time again.
you see that is the problem with leftist. all they have is denial fallacies.
even when given all of the information and what is exactly said they still hand wave and deny.

The only partisan talking points are from leftist. Their own witnesses blew their up their accusations.
no one had any evidence of quid pro quo, bribery or extortion.

it was pretty obvious when they testified to it.
so why do you ignore facts?

This is what is known as 'Deny'. The typical Republican talking point is 'Deny, deflect, and discredit. One key word that shows this to be the case is the rhetoric of the term 'ledtist'. This strongly indicates partisan hackery , rather than responding to the actual evidence.

 

[sjmay]

Sure, no problem. :shrug:


Read White House Summary of Trump'''s Ukraine Call | Time


I mean, did you REALLY just say that? Trump himself asked Ukraine to "look into" the thing "about Biden's son". The White House put out that call summary.

God, I swear Trump defenders say the stupidest things.


So let's get back to my question:

Please address that. If Trump has a long distrust and a "deep-seated" distrust of Ukraine due to "pervasive corruption", why would the President of the United States want them to investigate a United States citizen?

Please answer that question. Or run away, which is what I suspect you will do.



Then why would the President of the United States ask a country known for corruption to investigate an American citizen living in America?

Please answer the question that sjmay clearly doesn't want to answer.

Why is it that you put so much emphasis on the word FAVOR...and none whatsoever on the phrase, whatever you can do?

Is it only that certain words matter?

And there you go again with your idiotic questions.....

But since you put it out there, Biden's son....US citizen...ok, where was he living during the time that Trump asked Zelenksy to look into him? (hint...it wasn't the U.S.)

 

[Nalu]

This is pure TWILIGHT ZONE alternate reality that only the GOP dwell in and seem quite happy there. They have betrayed America, the American people and our Constitution.

I'm reading the Republican report now and something struck me. There's a theme that normal bureaucrats are uncomfortable with Trump's style and that the Zelensky call made them uncomfortable. The report mocks their discomfort promoting Trump's abnormal style. So I just wondered: Since most Trump supporters usually can't stomach anything that's not normal (sex, food, fashion, etc.), why do they celebrate what's not normal about Trump? Just commenting on the counterintuitiveness there.

 

[OpportunityCost]

I mean, it's not hard to find it...

https://republicans-oversight.house...t-Inquiry-in-the-House-of-Representatives.pdf

It also contains this absolute gem: "The evidence shows that President Trump holds a deep-seated, genuine, and reasonable skepticism of Ukraine due to its history of pervasive corruption."

C'mon, that is just absolutely laughable. If the President of the United States genuinely thought Ukraine was corrupt, why would he ask them to investigate a United States citizen? How unbelievably stupid is that logic and how unbelievably stupid does one have to be to actually believe that?


The Republican defense of Trump in this document is intended for idiots and true believers. It's not intended to be taken seriously by anyone with a modicum of independent intelligence.



It's all they have. They have no real exculpatory evidence. Everyone knows what happened, everyone knows why it happened, but Republicans are simply giving Republican voters (and more importantly Republican Congressmen) cover to ignore all of that to play team politics.

At this point, Republicans are literally putting the good of their party over what is right for the country because they care more about power (whether it is individual power as Congressmen or team power as Republicans matters not) than they do about doing what is right for the country.

If we believe they are corrupt why are we giving them money to begin with? Why was a Presidential candidates son perfectly comfortable working there if its so corrupt?

That sword cuts both ways.

 

[sjmay]

I'm reading the Republican report now and something struck me. There's a theme that normal bureaucrats are uncomfortable with Trump's style and that the Zelensky call made them uncomfortable. The report mocks their discomfort promoting Trump's abnormal style. So I just wondered: Since most Trump supporters usually can't stomach anything that's not normal (sex, food, fashion, etc.), why do they celebrate what's not normal about Trump? Just commenting on the counterintuitiveness there.

I read the same report, yet am not seeing the bold, have anything specific you can point out?

 

[OpportunityCost]

Like Bill Barr did with the Mueller report?

Bill Barr was following the statute regarding the SC. Would you rather he didn't?

 

[OpportunityCost]

Everything in this report we already heard in the open hearings and all the media coverage since this all began. The GOP has no real defense of the facts. So they make stuff up and keep pushing conspiracy theories. Given their track record, no one needs to read the GOP report. They have nothing exculpatory. Attack the process, attack the witnesses. End of story. Trump got caught and is guilty as sin.

If that were true there wouldn't be Democrats wavering on the vote.

 

[Slyfox696]

Why is it that you put so much emphasis on the word FAVOR...and none whatsoever on the phrase, whatever you can do?

I didn't place emphasis on anything. You asked for where Trump asked Ukraine to investigate and I provided it to you.

Why are you posting so many obvious lies?

But since you put it out there, Biden's son....US citizen...ok, where was he living during the time that Trump asked Zelenksy to look into him? (hint...it wasn't the U.S.)

You didn't answer my question. I'll provide it again, so you can run away from it again:

Please address that. If Trump has a long distrust and a "deep-seated" distrust of Ukraine due to "pervasive corruption", why would the President of the United States want them to investigate a United States citizen?

Please answer that question. Or run away, which is what I suspect you will do.


It's so funny how you run away everytime you can't answer for facts.

If we believe they are corrupt why are we giving them money to begin with?

Because they are an ally, if not officially, then by necessity and common interests.

If they are corrupt, why would the American President want them investigating an American citizen?


That's my point. The Republican defense of Trump is simply laughable to anyone who is not an idiot or a true believer. You're smart enough to know this latest defense is beyond stupid. Will you acknowledge it as being beyond stupid?

 

[Nalu]

[Disclaimer. I have not yet read the Republican's document.]

President of the United States of America Donald Trump faces at least three specific possibilities of wrongdoing in any future articles of impeachment. There is the 'un-indicted co-conspirator' reference in a court case that has seen the other party sentenced to jail, the 10 or so citations in Part 2 of the Mueller report and the possible misuse of office for personal gain with the government of Ukraine.

There is evidence for each of these. Much of it is already before the public.

The Republican document, I would hope, will provide reasoned discussion of the evidence in each area and show why it is not correct. In short, it will, ideally, be an appeal to reason based upon fact.

Wouldn't that have been nice? In one place, the report says, "Ukraine felt good about its relationship with the United States." This is the Republicans' report to themselves to rebut a congressional committee report that hasn't been released. There is not a splinter of light between it and the Fox News narrative. It's sad that the congressional staffers who wrote the report think that's what their job is supposed to be and that they think that it meets the standards of a real congressional report.

 

[trixare4kids]

This part of the Republican's report sums it up perfectly... Their opinions do not "trump" the potus's foreign policy but go ahead, Democrats, keeping tossing crap at the wall to see if it sticks. At the end of the day, the Democrats got nuttin'.

“The Democrats’ impeachment inquiry paints a picture of unelected bureaucrats within the foreign policy and national security apparatus who fundamentally disagreed with President Trump’s style, world view, and decisions. Their disagreements with President Trump’s policies and their discomfort with President Trump’s actions set in motion the anonymous, secondhand whistleblower complaint,” the report concludes. “Democrats seized on the whistleblower complaint to fulfill their years-old obsession with removing President Trump from office.”

 

[Nalu]

So you're just going to claim your own nonsense and attempt to make just another regressive circle jerk thread?

I don't see you offering any actual responses to what is being proposed, apart from the same tired derision that we've been getting from your side all this whole time.

Do you wake up in that mood or do you turn it on as soon as you open your eyes? Good lord. See a pharmacist, man.

What is being "proposed" that you want me to "actually respond" to? The Republicans released a fake report before a real report to get ahead of a story. I think they suck for that. Did you get it this time?

 

[Nalu]

Strange, tell me. What part about it happens to be disinformation?

All of it. Read it.

 

[Nalu]

Democrats condemn defense of Trump. They would rather just string him up by mob rule and be done with him, no trial needed.

I'm not going to speak for Democrats, but I don't condemn defense of Trump. I condemn dishonesty. If the defense of Trump wasn't thoroughly, completely soaked with dishonesty, I wouldn't condemn it.

 

[Nalu]

I read the same report, yet am not seeing the bold, have anything specific you can point out?

Really? Start with the third paragraph of the executive summary.

 

[Nalu]

I have no issue with Republicans issuing a defense, but we should all be concerned over how they present "evidence" that are really just talking points.

Not much effort was made to directly combat the testimony of key witnesses, and in some respects Republicans dance around several false narratives that benefit Russia. Just suggesting this is all a plot by Democrats to nullify the 2016 election results seems more desperation than anything else.

That appears to be exactly and entirely their argument.

"The Democrats' impeachment inquiry . . . is merely the outgrowth of their obsession with re-litigating the results of the 2016 presidential election."

 

[Nalu]

You should read more than just the bullet points.....

Like what? Specifically what are your big takeaways?

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

The "PLAY" you're referring to is distinctly Soviet, and Americans are utterly ill-equipped to deal with such phenomena.
We've now arrived in the age of the American "Vremya".

View attachment 67269242

"Don't pay attention to Western report of nuclear accident, authorities have everything under control in minor mishap."

---And in a stunning punch to the gut, as if to highlight our new malaise, the Newseum is about to close its doors forever.
Who needs a Newseum when TrumpCo is giving us our very own orwellian Ministry of Truth?

 

[Unitedwestand13]

---And in a stunning punch to the gut, as if to highlight our new malaise, the Newseum is about to close its doors forever.
Who needs a Newseum when TrumpCo is giving us our very own orwellian Ministry of Truth?

Wait the newseum is closing?! Why!?

 

[sjmay]

Really? Start with the third paragraph of the executive summary.

You mean this one?

"The Democrats’ impeachment inquiry is not the organic outgrowth of serious
misconduct; it is an orchestrated campaign to upend our political system. The Democrats are
trying to impeach a duly elected President based on the accusations and assumptions of unelected
bureaucrats who disagreed with President Trump’s policy initiatives and processes. They are
trying to impeach President Trump because some unelected bureaucrats were discomforted by an
elected President’s telephone call with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky. They are
trying to impeach President Trump because some unelected bureaucrats chafed at an elected
President’s “outside the beltway” approach to diplomacy"

You read that as mocking? Seriously??

 

[What if...?]

They've got a formidable amount of discipline. What their story lacks in consistency from day to day it matches in being told consistently by Trump's surrogates at any given moment.

Even when it's the opposite of what they were told the day before.

It's kind of amazing.

I came here to talk about the persuasion sciences.

But I never really thought it was possible to hold people in thrall like the purveyors of conservative media are able to.

 

[sjmay]

Like what? Specifically what are your big takeaways?

They postulate their positions, then support it with witness testimony and or previous statements from Trump....

Feel free to pick a topic in the report and check it out.

 

[Nalu]

The "PLAY" you're referring to is distinctly Soviet, and Americans are utterly ill-equipped to deal with such phenomena.
We've now arrived in the age of the American "Vremya".

View attachment 67269242

"Don't pay attention to Western report of nuclear accident, authorities have everything under control in minor mishap."

Misinformation campaigns are common all over the world, but I don't think it's ever been quite this focused nor quite this openly coordinated for and by the White House.

 

[What if...?]

It is disingenuous that none of you have read what has been drafted but already know its bad in whatever way. You are being led around and being told what to think about it before its available to the public.

Like Barr with the Mueller "summary"?

And evidently in regards to the IG report as well?